Canadian Politics Redux
Comments
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i actually don't mind preston manning - he would have been infinitely better than harper ...
you don't necessarily know what the impact is for middle class/low income earners on marijuana ... my understanding is that legalization will actually decrease the cost - the only difference is that the gov't is gonna get a piece of that pie instead of all of it going to dealers and growers ...
but if all you care about is a flat tax and marijuana is just a sample case - my problem with a flat tax is that it does not take into account the historical consequences that has led us to this mass inequality ... the world favours the rich in every possible way ... tolls, user fees, taxes, etc.. all favour the rich now and that is why we have a growing income disparity ... the rich have profited the most from our current tax schemes and the middle/lower class have suffered the most ...0 -
^^^^
I think you partially get my point.
"the rich have profited the most from our current tax schemes and the middle/lower class have suffered the most ..."
A sin tax on marijuana is exactly that, a tax which will be paid by middle/lower class.
It doesn't matter what the product costs (cheaper/more expensive). It is just another revenue stream for the government to waste money.
Trudeau isn't doing anything differently. It is exactly the same.0 -
the government pays for a lot of things ... is there waste? ... of course there is but fundamentally - it is the most efficient way of delivering services ... if we privatize everything - we will ultimately all have to pay more ...
our economy and budgets were all doing fine when gst was at 7% here ... since then, it's gone to shits ...0 -
Fundamentally, it is the most inefficient way of delivering services.
And who said anything about privatizing everything?
I'm not opposed to sales tax, although it's a slippery slope.0 -
Interesting article about the Paris climate change talks. Everyone walks away feeling really good about themselves, yet nothing is ever accomplished.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-debate/the-climatecrats-and-their-credibility-gap/article27727849/0 -
Nice, it's amazing how secretive and non-transparent all levels of government can be.
City council in Calgary has a 30 million dollar surplus (tax payers money).
Instead of saving it and lowering taxes or investing it to hopefully lower taxes (since everyone looks up to Norway), they are going to blow it however possible. It is just so infuriating. When does this foolishness end?
Nenshi is a crook.
http://www.calgarysun.com/2015/12/14/calgary-city-council-earmarks-half-of-30-million-surplus-to-soften-impact-of-tough-economy
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you may not like what he's doing with the money ... but how is he a crook?1ThoughtKnown said:Nice, it's amazing how secretive and non-transparent all levels of government can be.
City council in Calgary has a 30 million dollar surplus (tax payers money).
Instead of saving it and lowering taxes or investing it to hopefully lower taxes (since everyone looks up to Norway), they are going to blow it however possible. It is just so infuriating. When does this foolishness end?
Nenshi is a crook.
http://www.calgarysun.com/2015/12/14/calgary-city-council-earmarks-half-of-30-million-surplus-to-soften-impact-of-tough-economy
also ... in alberta - you pay no PST ... and Calgary is on the low end of property taxes in the country ... how can anyone complain about taxes in Calgary? ... it's mind blowing that people still think we are like so heavily taxed - it's absurd ...
so, instead of celebrating a municipality that actually derived a surplus ... you let your partisanship drive your criticism ...0 -
take any major public service ... whether it be health care, education, policing ... and show me some data that says a privatized model is better than a public model ...1ThoughtKnown said:Fundamentally, it is the most inefficient way of delivering services.
And who said anything about privatizing everything?
I'm not opposed to sales tax, although it's a slippery slope.0 -
polaris_x said:
you may not like what he's doing with the money ... but how is he a crook?1ThoughtKnown said:Nice, it's amazing how secretive and non-transparent all levels of government can be.
City council in Calgary has a 30 million dollar surplus (tax payers money).
Instead of saving it and lowering taxes or investing it to hopefully lower taxes (since everyone looks up to Norway), they are going to blow it however possible. It is just so infuriating. When does this foolishness end?
Nenshi is a crook.
http://www.calgarysun.com/2015/12/14/calgary-city-council-earmarks-half-of-30-million-surplus-to-soften-impact-of-tough-economy
also ... in alberta - you pay no PST ... and Calgary is on the low end of property taxes in the country ... how can anyone complain about taxes in Calgary? ... it's mind blowing that people still think we are like so heavily taxed - it's absurd ...
so, instead of celebrating a municipality that actually derived a surplus ... you let your partisanship drive your criticism ...
If the budgeting was done properly, there would be no surplus. Raising property taxes 3 to 5 percent per year when it is obviously not needed is thievery.polaris_x said:
you may not like what he's doing with the money ... but how is he a crook?1ThoughtKnown said:Nice, it's amazing how secretive and non-transparent all levels of government can be.
City council in Calgary has a 30 million dollar surplus (tax payers money).
Instead of saving it and lowering taxes or investing it to hopefully lower taxes (since everyone looks up to Norway), they are going to blow it however possible. It is just so infuriating. When does this foolishness end?
Nenshi is a crook.
http://www.calgarysun.com/2015/12/14/calgary-city-council-earmarks-half-of-30-million-surplus-to-soften-impact-of-tough-economy
also ... in alberta - you pay no PST ... and Calgary is on the low end of property taxes in the country ... how can anyone complain about taxes in Calgary? ... it's mind blowing that people still think we are like so heavily taxed - it's absurd ...
so, instead of celebrating a municipality that actually derived a surplus ... you let your partisanship drive your criticism ...
If they needed low income housing (and I'm not opposed) it should have been in the original budget.
I am tired of government agencies running around at the end of the fiscal year to blow our tax dollars, just to be sure they get the same allocation of funds the next year.
They treat it like it is THEIR money when it is OURS.
How is this anything but stealing?
I know Calgary has reasonable property taxes in comparison to Vancity or Torana, but it is the principle. Invest it, pay down debt, something constructive.
I'm pretty sick of this, and it happens at all levels of government. Nenshi is a liar as he ran originally on the premise he was a fiscally conservative mayor.
Now tax dollars will go to help billionaires diols an arena for professional athletes. Didn't agree with it in Edmonton, don't agree with it here.
Politicians and civic officials and their feeling of entitlement remind me of rich brats like Paris Hilton.0 -
When did I say it should be privatized? So I am not going to "show you any data" because it has nothing to do with what I am saying. You are arguing now for the sake of arguing. Because I live on the slight right side of the fence you assume I am for privatization. (Proves my point of how we know everything there is to know about the left, but it is not true vice versa).polaris_x said:
take any major public service ... whether it be health care, education, policing ... and show me some data that says a privatized model is better than a public model ...1ThoughtKnown said:Fundamentally, it is the most inefficient way of delivering services.
And who said anything about privatizing everything?
I'm not opposed to sales tax, although it's a slippery slope.
All I mentioned was Norway's negative income tax model. (Experimented in Manitoba in the 70s).
Read what Norway is doing for those in need (unemployment is skyrocketing in Norway). I applaud them for trying something different.
Some economists have suggested it would save Canada 140 Billion dollars a year.
We don't have a tax problem in Canada, we have a spending problem. If you really like a nanny state, check out Norway. Everyone gets 1100 a month in the hope it will encourage people to go make MORE. unlike EI in Canada, you won't get punished financially if you make more.
It's really progressive thinking.
When I say government waste I am talking of the bloated beaurocracy. Does not mean I want to privatize everything (and I'm still scratching my head trying to figure it out, except you are trying to paint all conservatives as "boogeymen" who are trying to destroy government services).
I do believe if you want privatized health care, and can afford it, you should have that option. This is a free country right? Lol0 -
dude ... the provincial conservatives ran surpluses all the time ... i can't believe someone actually is complaining about a surplus ... no one can budget an entity with expenditures and revenues in the billions to be spot on ...1ThoughtKnown said:polaris_x said:
you may not like what he's doing with the money ... but how is he a crook?1ThoughtKnown said:Nice, it's amazing how secretive and non-transparent all levels of government can be.
City council in Calgary has a 30 million dollar surplus (tax payers money).
Instead of saving it and lowering taxes or investing it to hopefully lower taxes (since everyone looks up to Norway), they are going to blow it however possible. It is just so infuriating. When does this foolishness end?
Nenshi is a crook.
http://www.calgarysun.com/2015/12/14/calgary-city-council-earmarks-half-of-30-million-surplus-to-soften-impact-of-tough-economy
also ... in alberta - you pay no PST ... and Calgary is on the low end of property taxes in the country ... how can anyone complain about taxes in Calgary? ... it's mind blowing that people still think we are like so heavily taxed - it's absurd ...
so, instead of celebrating a municipality that actually derived a surplus ... you let your partisanship drive your criticism ...
If the budgeting was done properly, there would be no surplus. Raising property taxes 3 to 5 percent per year when it is obviously not needed is thievery.polaris_x said:
you may not like what he's doing with the money ... but how is he a crook?1ThoughtKnown said:Nice, it's amazing how secretive and non-transparent all levels of government can be.
City council in Calgary has a 30 million dollar surplus (tax payers money).
Instead of saving it and lowering taxes or investing it to hopefully lower taxes (since everyone looks up to Norway), they are going to blow it however possible. It is just so infuriating. When does this foolishness end?
Nenshi is a crook.
http://www.calgarysun.com/2015/12/14/calgary-city-council-earmarks-half-of-30-million-surplus-to-soften-impact-of-tough-economy
also ... in alberta - you pay no PST ... and Calgary is on the low end of property taxes in the country ... how can anyone complain about taxes in Calgary? ... it's mind blowing that people still think we are like so heavily taxed - it's absurd ...
so, instead of celebrating a municipality that actually derived a surplus ... you let your partisanship drive your criticism ...
If they needed low income housing (and I'm not opposed) it should have been in the original budget.
I am tired of government agencies running around at the end of the fiscal year to blow our tax dollars, just to be sure they get the same allocation of funds the next year.
They treat it like it is THEIR money when it is OURS.
How is this anything but stealing?
I know Calgary has reasonable property taxes in comparison to Vancity or Torana, but it is the principle. Invest it, pay down debt, something constructive.
I'm pretty sick of this, and it happens at all levels of government. Nenshi is a liar as he ran originally on the premise he was a fiscally conservative mayor.
Now tax dollars will go to help billionaires diols an arena for professional athletes. Didn't agree with it in Edmonton, don't agree with it here.
Politicians and civic officials and their feeling of entitlement remind me of rich brats like Paris Hilton.
and your argument about governments spending money year end to gain allocation for next year is just plain absurd ... this is not the accounting department at some company making sure they don't get their budget cut ... municipal revenues are predicated on a variety of streams that isn't going to change whether they spend the money or not at the end of the year ...
seriously, if you don't like how the money is spent ... argue that ... but your points are simply not valid re: taxation and end of year spending ...0 -
ok ... if you don't want to your money going to gov't because you think they waste money ... then how is the gov't supposed to pay for services that you say you don't want privatized? ... also, if you say they are fundamentally inefficient at delivering services - then you must believe there is a more efficient model ... if it's not via gov't ... who is it by?1ThoughtKnown said:
When did I say it should be privatized? So I am not going to "show you any data" because it has nothing to do with what I am saying. You are arguing now for the sake of arguing. Because I live on the slight right side of the fence you assume I am for privatization. (Proves my point of how we know everything there is to know about the left, but it is not true vice versa).polaris_x said:
take any major public service ... whether it be health care, education, policing ... and show me some data that says a privatized model is better than a public model ...1ThoughtKnown said:Fundamentally, it is the most inefficient way of delivering services.
And who said anything about privatizing everything?
I'm not opposed to sales tax, although it's a slippery slope.
All I mentioned was Norway's negative income tax model. (Experimented in Manitoba in the 70s).
Read what Norway is doing for those in need (unemployment is skyrocketing in Norway). I applaud them for trying something different.
Some economists have suggested it would save Canada 140 Billion dollars a year.
We don't have a tax problem in Canada, we have a spending problem. If you really like a nanny state, check out Norway. Everyone gets 1100 a month in the hope it will encourage people to go make MORE. unlike EI in Canada, you won't get punished financially if you make more.
It's really progressive thinking.
When I say government waste I am talking of the bloated beaurocracy. Does not mean I want to privatize everything (and I'm still scratching my head trying to figure it out, except you are trying to paint all conservatives as "boogeymen" who are trying to destroy government services).
I do believe if you want privatized health care, and can afford it, you should have that option. This is a free country right? Lol0 -
Privatization just leads to massive inequities.With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata0
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The evidence is in the decision making. They had a 30 million surplus, they are blowing it as soon as they can.polaris_x said:
dude ... the provincial conservatives ran surpluses all the time ... i can't believe someone actually is complaining about a surplus ... no one can budget an entity with expenditures and revenues in the billions to be spot on ...1ThoughtKnown said:polaris_x said:
you may not like what he's doing with the money ... but how is he a crook?1ThoughtKnown said:Nice, it's amazing how secretive and non-transparent all levels of government can be.
City council in Calgary has a 30 million dollar surplus (tax payers money).
Instead of saving it and lowering taxes or investing it to hopefully lower taxes (since everyone looks up to Norway), they are going to blow it however possible. It is just so infuriating. When does this foolishness end?
Nenshi is a crook.
http://www.calgarysun.com/2015/12/14/calgary-city-council-earmarks-half-of-30-million-surplus-to-soften-impact-of-tough-economy
also ... in alberta - you pay no PST ... and Calgary is on the low end of property taxes in the country ... how can anyone complain about taxes in Calgary? ... it's mind blowing that people still think we are like so heavily taxed - it's absurd ...
so, instead of celebrating a municipality that actually derived a surplus ... you let your partisanship drive your criticism ...
If the budgeting was done properly, there would be no surplus. Raising property taxes 3 to 5 percent per year when it is obviously not needed is thievery.polaris_x said:
you may not like what he's doing with the money ... but how is he a crook?1ThoughtKnown said:Nice, it's amazing how secretive and non-transparent all levels of government can be.
City council in Calgary has a 30 million dollar surplus (tax payers money).
Instead of saving it and lowering taxes or investing it to hopefully lower taxes (since everyone looks up to Norway), they are going to blow it however possible. It is just so infuriating. When does this foolishness end?
Nenshi is a crook.
http://www.calgarysun.com/2015/12/14/calgary-city-council-earmarks-half-of-30-million-surplus-to-soften-impact-of-tough-economy
also ... in alberta - you pay no PST ... and Calgary is on the low end of property taxes in the country ... how can anyone complain about taxes in Calgary? ... it's mind blowing that people still think we are like so heavily taxed - it's absurd ...
so, instead of celebrating a municipality that actually derived a surplus ... you let your partisanship drive your criticism ...
If they needed low income housing (and I'm not opposed) it should have been in the original budget.
I am tired of government agencies running around at the end of the fiscal year to blow our tax dollars, just to be sure they get the same allocation of funds the next year.
They treat it like it is THEIR money when it is OURS.
How is this anything but stealing?
I know Calgary has reasonable property taxes in comparison to Vancity or Torana, but it is the principle. Invest it, pay down debt, something constructive.
I'm pretty sick of this, and it happens at all levels of government. Nenshi is a liar as he ran originally on the premise he was a fiscally conservative mayor.
Now tax dollars will go to help billionaires diols an arena for professional athletes. Didn't agree with it in Edmonton, don't agree with it here.
Politicians and civic officials and their feeling of entitlement remind me of rich brats like Paris Hilton.
and your argument about governments spending money year end to gain allocation for next year is just plain absurd ... this is not the accounting department at some company making sure they don't get their budget cut ... municipal revenues are predicated on a variety of streams that isn't going to change whether they spend the money or not at the end of the year ...
seriously, if you don't like how the money is spent ... argue that ... but your points are simply not valid re: taxation and end of year spending ...
And if you don't think government agencies do this, you sir, are very naive.
Has nothing to do with which government did it, I voted for the WildRose Alliance since the end of the Klein years because the provincial PC's blew money like drunken sailors.
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Wow... Your blind socialism just won't allow you to read what I write will it.polaris_x said:
ok ... if you don't want to your money going to gov't because you think they waste money ... then how is the gov't supposed to pay for services that you say you don't want privatized? ... also, if you say they are fundamentally inefficient at delivering services - then you must believe there is a more efficient model ... if it's not via gov't ... who is it by?1ThoughtKnown said:
When did I say it should be privatized? So I am not going to "show you any data" because it has nothing to do with what I am saying. You are arguing now for the sake of arguing. Because I live on the slight right side of the fence you assume I am for privatization. (Proves my point of how we know everything there is to know about the left, but it is not true vice versa).polaris_x said:
take any major public service ... whether it be health care, education, policing ... and show me some data that says a privatized model is better than a public model ...1ThoughtKnown said:Fundamentally, it is the most inefficient way of delivering services.
And who said anything about privatizing everything?
I'm not opposed to sales tax, although it's a slippery slope.
All I mentioned was Norway's negative income tax model. (Experimented in Manitoba in the 70s).
Read what Norway is doing for those in need (unemployment is skyrocketing in Norway). I applaud them for trying something different.
Some economists have suggested it would save Canada 140 Billion dollars a year.
We don't have a tax problem in Canada, we have a spending problem. If you really like a nanny state, check out Norway. Everyone gets 1100 a month in the hope it will encourage people to go make MORE. unlike EI in Canada, you won't get punished financially if you make more.
It's really progressive thinking.
When I say government waste I am talking of the bloated beaurocracy. Does not mean I want to privatize everything (and I'm still scratching my head trying to figure it out, except you are trying to paint all conservatives as "boogeymen" who are trying to destroy government services).
I do believe if you want privatized health care, and can afford it, you should have that option. This is a free country right? Lol
I want you to research (for the fifth time I will mention it) what Norway is doing in regards to negative income tax. It is something to really look at.
Every adult receives 1100 a month, no questions asked. No EI, welfare, affordable housing, etc.
If you make more money, you don't lose the 1100.
It encourages people to work, to find a career. They won't take away the 1100 until you reach a certain level of income, unlike EI or welfare.
The bonus! The 140 Billion WASTED in administering those programs, eaten away by government beaurocrats , is saved!. Taxes could be reduced and the negative connotations of social services are gone. No begging the government for EI benefits, welfare, or low income housing.
NOW, I hope you two can finally realize I said NOTHING about privatization. I'm starting to wonder if I am talking a foreign language to you. Oh right, I'm talking slight right ideology, makes no sense because you were never taught it, and never attempt to learn.
So to answer all of your questions, I want the government to administer the services more efficiently, I believe this may be an example of an efficient model.
I never said I wanted anything privatized *sigh*. You ASSUMED that's what I meant simply because I'm "conservative". See how prejudiced that is? I mentioned the Norwegian model five times but instead of researching what I was talking about, you jump all over it. Norway is about as socialist as it gets and yet, you still have to argue. It's mind boggling.
Post edited by 1ThoughtKnown on0 -
let me know when you got something specific you want to rail about? ... arguing they had a surplus is absurd, arguing they are spending that surplus is absurd ... all governments all over the world would love a surplus ... and when you happen to live in Alberta now where the oil and gas industry has tanked - it is wise to spend some of that surplus ...1ThoughtKnown said:
The evidence is in the decision making. They had a 30 million surplus, they are blowing it as soon as they can.polaris_x said:
dude ... the provincial conservatives ran surpluses all the time ... i can't believe someone actually is complaining about a surplus ... no one can budget an entity with expenditures and revenues in the billions to be spot on ...1ThoughtKnown said:polaris_x said:
you may not like what he's doing with the money ... but how is he a crook?1ThoughtKnown said:Nice, it's amazing how secretive and non-transparent all levels of government can be.
City council in Calgary has a 30 million dollar surplus (tax payers money).
Instead of saving it and lowering taxes or investing it to hopefully lower taxes (since everyone looks up to Norway), they are going to blow it however possible. It is just so infuriating. When does this foolishness end?
Nenshi is a crook.
http://www.calgarysun.com/2015/12/14/calgary-city-council-earmarks-half-of-30-million-surplus-to-soften-impact-of-tough-economy
also ... in alberta - you pay no PST ... and Calgary is on the low end of property taxes in the country ... how can anyone complain about taxes in Calgary? ... it's mind blowing that people still think we are like so heavily taxed - it's absurd ...
so, instead of celebrating a municipality that actually derived a surplus ... you let your partisanship drive your criticism ...
If the budgeting was done properly, there would be no surplus. Raising property taxes 3 to 5 percent per year when it is obviously not needed is thievery.polaris_x said:
you may not like what he's doing with the money ... but how is he a crook?1ThoughtKnown said:Nice, it's amazing how secretive and non-transparent all levels of government can be.
City council in Calgary has a 30 million dollar surplus (tax payers money).
Instead of saving it and lowering taxes or investing it to hopefully lower taxes (since everyone looks up to Norway), they are going to blow it however possible. It is just so infuriating. When does this foolishness end?
Nenshi is a crook.
http://www.calgarysun.com/2015/12/14/calgary-city-council-earmarks-half-of-30-million-surplus-to-soften-impact-of-tough-economy
also ... in alberta - you pay no PST ... and Calgary is on the low end of property taxes in the country ... how can anyone complain about taxes in Calgary? ... it's mind blowing that people still think we are like so heavily taxed - it's absurd ...
so, instead of celebrating a municipality that actually derived a surplus ... you let your partisanship drive your criticism ...
If they needed low income housing (and I'm not opposed) it should have been in the original budget.
I am tired of government agencies running around at the end of the fiscal year to blow our tax dollars, just to be sure they get the same allocation of funds the next year.
They treat it like it is THEIR money when it is OURS.
How is this anything but stealing?
I know Calgary has reasonable property taxes in comparison to Vancity or Torana, but it is the principle. Invest it, pay down debt, something constructive.
I'm pretty sick of this, and it happens at all levels of government. Nenshi is a liar as he ran originally on the premise he was a fiscally conservative mayor.
Now tax dollars will go to help billionaires diols an arena for professional athletes. Didn't agree with it in Edmonton, don't agree with it here.
Politicians and civic officials and their feeling of entitlement remind me of rich brats like Paris Hilton.
and your argument about governments spending money year end to gain allocation for next year is just plain absurd ... this is not the accounting department at some company making sure they don't get their budget cut ... municipal revenues are predicated on a variety of streams that isn't going to change whether they spend the money or not at the end of the year ...
seriously, if you don't like how the money is spent ... argue that ... but your points are simply not valid re: taxation and end of year spending ...
And if you don't think government agencies do this, you sir, are very naive.
Has nothing to do with which government did it, I voted for the WildRose Alliance since the end of the Klein years because the provincial PC's blew money like drunken sailors.
again - feel free to argue about where the actual dollars are being spent ... but railing on the fact they had a surplus and want to spend it to ease the impacts of the fall of oil just seems totally ideologically driven ... i mean - you call nenshi a crook but what has he done that's deserving of that objectively?0 -
dude ... seriously ... i've not once mentioned right or left, conservatism or socialism ... you are griping about partisan ideologies when there are in fact none being placed ... stop using this as a crutch from the discussion ...1ThoughtKnown said:
When did I say it should be privatized? So I am not going to "show you any data" because it has nothing to do with what I am saying. You are arguing now for the sake of arguing. Because I live on the slight right side of the fence you assume I am for privatization. (Proves my point of how we know everything there is to know about the left, but it is not true vice versa).polaris_x said:
take any major public service ... whether it be health care, education, policing ... and show me some data that says a privatized model is better than a public model ...1ThoughtKnown said:Fundamentally, it is the most inefficient way of delivering services.
And who said anything about privatizing everything?
I'm not opposed to sales tax, although it's a slippery slope.
All I mentioned was Norway's negative income tax model. (Experimented in Manitoba in the 70s).
Read what Norway is doing for those in need (unemployment is skyrocketing in Norway). I applaud them for trying something different.
Some economists have suggested it would save Canada 140 Billion dollars a year.
We don't have a tax problem in Canada, we have a spending problem. If you really like a nanny state, check out Norway. Everyone gets 1100 a month in the hope it will encourage people to go make MORE. unlike EI in Canada, you won't get punished financially if you make more.
It's really progressive thinking.
When I say government waste I am talking of the bloated beaurocracy. Does not mean I want to privatize everything (and I'm still scratching my head trying to figure it out, except you are trying to paint all conservatives as "boogeymen" who are trying to destroy government services).
I do believe if you want privatized health care, and can afford it, you should have that option. This is a free country right? Lol
first of all - go back to this discussion ... you said that governments are FUNDAMENTALLY the least efficient way of delivering services ... so, if you say you don't support privatization ... I asked if you don't want to give the gov't your money and you don't think they deliver services then your contradicting yourself somewhat by saying you want gov'ts to deliver efficient services ...
we all want gov'ts to deliver efficient services but yet you rail on taxation daily ... you constantly spew myths like we are over-taxed ... when in fact we aren't ... especially if you live in alberta ...
nothing you say is presented in a sound argument ...
as for norway - i honestly can't believe you are using Norway as an example because it is arguably one of the most socialist countries in the world ... our taxation levels don't even come close to what they are in Norway and plus they nationalized their oil there ... basically all the profits that we let oil companies make go to the people of Norway ... so, really, any program they can put forth is affordable because they have the money ...0 -
Absurd it isn't, because that money belongs to taxpayerspolaris_x said:
let me know when you got something specific you want to rail about? ... arguing they had a surplus is absurd, arguing they are spending that surplus is absurd ... all governments all over the world would love a surplus ... and when you happen to live in Alberta now where the oil and gas industry has tanked - it is wise to spend some of that surplus ...1ThoughtKnown said:
The evidence is in the decision making. They had a 30 million surplus, they are blowing it as soon as they can.polaris_x said:
dude ... the provincial conservatives ran surpluses all the time ... i can't believe someone actually is complaining about a surplus ... no one can budget an entity with expenditures and revenues in the billions to be spot on ...1ThoughtKnown said:polaris_x said:
you may not like what he's doing with the money ... but how is he a crook?1ThoughtKnown said:Nice, it's amazing how secretive and non-transparent all levels of government can be.
City council in Calgary has a 30 million dollar surplus (tax payers money).
Instead of saving it and lowering taxes or investing it to hopefully lower taxes (since everyone looks up to Norway), they are going to blow it however possible. It is just so infuriating. When does this foolishness end?
Nenshi is a crook.
http://www.calgarysun.com/2015/12/14/calgary-city-council-earmarks-half-of-30-million-surplus-to-soften-impact-of-tough-economy
also ... in alberta - you pay no PST ... and Calgary is on the low end of property taxes in the country ... how can anyone complain about taxes in Calgary? ... it's mind blowing that people still think we are like so heavily taxed - it's absurd ...
so, instead of celebrating a municipality that actually derived a surplus ... you let your partisanship drive your criticism ...
If the budgeting was done properly, there would be no surplus. Raising property taxes 3 to 5 percent per year when it is obviously not needed is thievery.polaris_x said:
you may not like what he's doing with the money ... but how is he a crook?1ThoughtKnown said:Nice, it's amazing how secretive and non-transparent all levels of government can be.
City council in Calgary has a 30 million dollar surplus (tax payers money).
Instead of saving it and lowering taxes or investing it to hopefully lower taxes (since everyone looks up to Norway), they are going to blow it however possible. It is just so infuriating. When does this foolishness end?
Nenshi is a crook.
http://www.calgarysun.com/2015/12/14/calgary-city-council-earmarks-half-of-30-million-surplus-to-soften-impact-of-tough-economy
also ... in alberta - you pay no PST ... and Calgary is on the low end of property taxes in the country ... how can anyone complain about taxes in Calgary? ... it's mind blowing that people still think we are like so heavily taxed - it's absurd ...
so, instead of celebrating a municipality that actually derived a surplus ... you let your partisanship drive your criticism ...
If they needed low income housing (and I'm not opposed) it should have been in the original budget.
I am tired of government agencies running around at the end of the fiscal year to blow our tax dollars, just to be sure they get the same allocation of funds the next year.
They treat it like it is THEIR money when it is OURS.
How is this anything but stealing?
I know Calgary has reasonable property taxes in comparison to Vancity or Torana, but it is the principle. Invest it, pay down debt, something constructive.
I'm pretty sick of this, and it happens at all levels of government. Nenshi is a liar as he ran originally on the premise he was a fiscally conservative mayor.
Now tax dollars will go to help billionaires diols an arena for professional athletes. Didn't agree with it in Edmonton, don't agree with it here.
Politicians and civic officials and their feeling of entitlement remind me of rich brats like Paris Hilton.
and your argument about governments spending money year end to gain allocation for next year is just plain absurd ... this is not the accounting department at some company making sure they don't get their budget cut ... municipal revenues are predicated on a variety of streams that isn't going to change whether they spend the money or not at the end of the year ...
seriously, if you don't like how the money is spent ... argue that ... but your points are simply not valid re: taxation and end of year spending ...
And if you don't think government agencies do this, you sir, are very naive.
Has nothing to do with which government did it, I voted for the WildRose Alliance since the end of the Klein years because the provincial PC's blew money like drunken sailors.
again - feel free to argue about where the actual dollars are being spent ... but railing on the fact they had a surplus and want to spend it to ease the impacts of the fall of oil just seems totally ideologically driven ... i mean - you call nenshi a crook but what has he done that's deserving of that objectively?
Of course they "love a surplus" because they can blow all your hard earned tax dollars.
Wise to spend the surplus or invest it in our and the next generations futures by paying down debt?
The government should only spend what they have budgeted for, it is not their money. They are in place to serve us, the citizens. They work for us. If they get a surplus that money should go back to the citizens, through debt reduction or important infrastructure.
If 15 million dollars was needed for low income housing, put it in the budget. Don't make a rash decision to thrown 15 million into low income housing! You budget for it.
It amazes me that this is such a foreign concept to people. No one cares how much of our tax dollars go to just paying the interest on debt.
I0 -
- not a crutch, a fact.polaris_x said:
dude ... seriously ... i've not once mentioned right or left, conservatism or socialism ... you are griping about partisan ideologies when there are in fact none being placed ... stop using this as a crutch from the discussion ...1ThoughtKnown said:
When did I say it should be privatized? So I am not going to "show you any data" because it has nothing to do with what I am saying. You are arguing now for the sake of arguing. Because I live on the slight right side of the fence you assume I am for privatization. (Proves my point of how we know everything there is to know about the left, but it is not true vice versa).polaris_x said:
take any major public service ... whether it be health care, education, policing ... and show me some data that says a privatized model is better than a public model ...1ThoughtKnown said:Fundamentally, it is the most inefficient way of delivering services.
And who said anything about privatizing everything?
I'm not opposed to sales tax, although it's a slippery slope.
All I mentioned was Norway's negative income tax model. (Experimented in Manitoba in the 70s).
Read what Norway is doing for those in need (unemployment is skyrocketing in Norway). I applaud them for trying something different.
Some economists have suggested it would save Canada 140 Billion dollars a year.
We don't have a tax problem in Canada, we have a spending problem. If you really like a nanny state, check out Norway. Everyone gets 1100 a month in the hope it will encourage people to go make MORE. unlike EI in Canada, you won't get punished financially if you make more.
It's really progressive thinking.
When I say government waste I am talking of the bloated beaurocracy. Does not mean I want to privatize everything (and I'm still scratching my head trying to figure it out, except you are trying to paint all conservatives as "boogeymen" who are trying to destroy government services).
I do believe if you want privatized health care, and can afford it, you should have that option. This is a free country right? Lol
first of all - go back to this discussion ... you said that governments are FUNDAMENTALLY the least efficient way of delivering services ... so, if you say you don't support privatization ... I asked if you don't want to give the gov't your money and you don't think they deliver services then your contradicting yourself somewhat by saying you want gov'ts to deliver efficient services ...
we all want gov'ts to deliver efficient services but yet you rail on taxation daily ... you constantly spew myths like we are over-taxed ... when in fact we aren't ... especially if you live in alberta ...
nothing you say is presented in a sound argument ...
as for norway - i honestly can't believe you are using Norway as an example because it is arguably one of the most socialist countries in the world ... our taxation levels don't even come close to what they are in Norway and plus they nationalized their oil there ... basically all the profits that we let oil companies make go to the people of Norway ... so, really, any program they can put forth is affordable because they have the money ...
- governments as they are currently run are inefficient at delivering services
- I never said I didn't want to give the government my money, :lol. There you are again making stuff up. I want the government to deliver services more efficiently. This can be done. We need government, but not one with a sense of entitlement to my hard earned money.
- I rail on OVER-Taxation. And we are over taxed, period. We have over 60 kinds of taxes and fees off the top of my head, plus income tax. If you don't think we are over-taxed that is your opinion, one I (and the Canadian Taxpayers Federation who represents our interests) do not share.
- my argument is sound, you continue to misconstrue my statements and continually assume I want privatization or "no government" which is absurd. You have yet to find a way to convince me the government must be run the way it is.
- "I can't believe you used Norway as an example" is exactly the kind of politically prejudiced comment I expected. You have not read or looked into what they are doing. Nor have you considered the economic implications of their plan. It has NOTHING. To do with nationalized oil taxation levels, or the like. This is affordable to any country. The numbers are available if you just look for yourself, but instead you argue against something you clearly know nothing about. 0 -
http://www.bloomberg.com/bw/articles/2013-08-08/its-time-for-a-negative-income-tax
Here, read a little. Educate yourself. Then when you want to argue about why I think this can work in Canada and actually reduce government spending and thus reduce taxes, I'll,have an intelligent discussion.
Or don't. I have made my point.
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