Blinken urges Israel to engage with region on postwar plans that include path to Palestinian state
By MATTHEW LEE, NAJIB JOBAIN and SAMY MAGDY
3 mins ago
TEL AVIV, Israel (AP) — U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken on Tuesday called on Israel to work with moderate Palestinians and neighboring countries on plans for postwar Gaza, saying they were willing to help rebuild and govern the territory but only if there is a “pathway to a Palestinian state.”
The U.S. and Israel are united in the war against Hamas but sharply divided over Gaza's future, with Washington and its Arab allies hoping to revive the long-moribund peace process, an idea that Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and his coalition partners sharply oppose.
The war in Gaza is still raging, with no end in sight, and fueling a humanitarian catastrophe in the tiny coastal enclave. The fighting has also stoked escalating violence between Israel and Lebanon's Hezbollah militants that has raised fears of a wider conflict.
Speaking at a news conference after meeting with top Israeli leaders, Blinken said Israel “must stop taking steps that undercut the Palestinians' ability to govern themselves effectively.”
Israel, he added “must be a partner of the Palestinian leaders who are willing to lead their people” and live "side by side in peace with Israel.” Settler violence, settlement expansion, home demolitions and evictions “all make it harder, not easier, for Israel to achieve lasting peace and security."
U.S. officials have called for the Palestinian Authority, which currently administers parts of the Israeli-occupied West Bank, to take the reins in Gaza. Israeli leaders have rejected that idea but have not put forward a concrete plan beyond saying they will maintain open-ended military control over the territory.
Blinken has said that Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Qatar, the United Arab Emirates and Turkey agreed to begin planning for the reconstruction and governance of Gaza once the war ends. The leaders of Jordan, Egypt and the Palestinian Authority are set to meet Wednesday in Jordan’s southern Red Sea city of Aqaba.
HEAVY FIGHTING IN GAZA
The United States, which has provided crucial military and diplomatic support for Israel's offensive, has pressed it to shift to more precise operations targeting Hamas. But the pace of death and destruction has remained largely the same, with hundreds killed in recent days.
Israel has vowed to keep going until it destroys Hamas, which triggered the war with its Oct. 7 attack into southern Israel. Palestinian militants killed some 1,200 people, mainly civilians, and abducted around 250 others, nearly half of whom were released during a weeklong cease-fire in November.
The Israeli military says it has dismantled Hamas infrastructure in northern Gaza — where entire neighborhoods have been demolished — but is still battling small groups of militants. The offensive’s focus has shifted to the southern city of Khan Younis and built-up refugee camps in central Gaza.
“The fighting will continue throughout 2024,” said Rear Adm. Daniel Hagari, a military spokesman.
Since the war began, Israel’s assault in Gaza has killed more than 23,200 Palestinians, roughly 1% of the territory’s population, and more than 58,000 people have been wounded, according to the Health Ministry in Hamas-run Gaza. About two-thirds of the dead are women and children. The death toll does not distinguish between combatants and civilians.
A strike late Monday hit a house in the central town of Deir al-Balah, killing the mother, three daughters and three small grandchildren of Jamal Naeim, a well-known dentist in Gaza. Outside the hospital, Naeim cradled a small bundle of white cloth containing all that remained of one of his adult daughters, Shaimaa, who was also a dentist.
“This is what we found of her, just the skin of her head and her hair,” he said, breaking into sobs. Naeim is the brother of Bassem Naeim, a political figure in Hamas, but is not a member of the group himself, residents said.
At least eight people were killed when a strike hit a five-story residential building in Rafah in southern Gaza on Tuesday, Palestinian Health officials said. Six of the bodies were taken to nearby Kuwati hospital and were counted by an Associated Press journalist. Two other corpses were transported to Youssef al-Najjar Hospital, also in Rafah, according to Dr. Sohaib al-Hams, who works at al-Kuwati Hospital.
Monday was one of the deadliest days yet for Israeli troops in Gaza, with nine killed, according to the military. Six of them died in an accidental blast when forces were preparing a controlled demolition of a weapons production site in central Gaza, the military said.
It says 185 soldiers have been killed since the ground offensive began in late October.
A HUMANITARIAN CRISIS
Nearly 85% of Gaza’s population of 2.3 million have been driven from their homes by the fighting, and a quarter of its residents face starvation, with only a trickle of food, water, medicine and other supplies entering through an Israeli siege.
The U.N. humanitarian office, known as OCHA, warned that the fighting was severely hampering aid deliveries. Several warehouses, distribution centers, health facilities and shelters have been affected by the military’s evacuation orders, it said.
The situation is even more dire in northern Gaza, which Israeli forces cut off from the rest of the territory in late October. Tens of thousands of people who remain there face shortages of food and water.
The World Health Organization has been unable to deliver supplies to the north for two weeks. OCHA said the military rejected five planned aid convoys to the north over that period, including deliveries of medical supplies and fuel for water and sanitation facilities.
Blinken said more food, water, medicine and other aid needs to enter and be distributed effectively. He called on Israel to “do everything it can to remove any obstacles from crossings to other parts of Gaza."
FEARS OF A WIDER CONFLICT
The war in Gaza has threatened to trigger a wider conflict, with Israel and Lebanon's Hezbollah trading escalating strikes following the killing of Hamas' deputy political leader in Beirut last week.
On Tuesday, Hezbollah said its exploding drones targeted the Israeli army's northern command in the town of Safed — deeper into Israel than previous fire by the group. The Israeli military said a drone fell at a base in the north without causing damage, suggesting it had been intercepted. Military officials did not identify the base.
Israeli strikes in southern Lebanon meanwhile killed at least four Hezbollah members, including one who was killed in the village where a funeral was held for a Hezbollah commander killed the day before.
Israel claimed the man killed ahead of the funeral, Ali Hussein Barji, was in charge of Hezbollah's drones in the south, but a Hezbollah official, speaking on condition of anonymity in accordance with the group’s regulations, said he was only a fighter.
___
Jobain reported reported from Rafah, Gaza Strip, and Magdy from Cairo. Associated Press writers Tia Goldenberg in Jerusalem and Bassem Mroue in Beirut contributed to this report.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Some would like you to believe that Israel was the non-aggressor toward Gaza. Others have a different take. Notice the dates of the tally, 23 years prior to the events of 10/07 and 6 years prior to Hamas being elected. Pages 16-18:
Between 29 September 2000 and 7 October 2023, approximately 7,569 Palestinians,102
including 1,699 children,103 were killed, including in those “four highly asymmetrical wars”, as well as
other smaller military assaults, with tens of thousands of others injured. A further 214 Palestinians, including 46 children were killed during the ‘Great March of Return’,104 a large-scale peaceful protest
along the separation fence between Gaza and Israel, in which thousands of Palestinians participated
every Friday for over 18 months, demanding that “the blockade imposed on Gaza be lifted and the
return of Palestinian refugees” to their homes and villages in Israel.105 On one particularly lethal day
alone, Israel killed 60 Palestinian protesters.106 As determined by the Independent Commission of
Inquiry on the protests in the occupied Palestinian territory (‘Commission’):
“[D]uring these weekly demonstrations, the Israeli Security Forces (ISF) killed and gravely
injured civilians who were neither participating directly in hostilities nor posing an imminent
threat to life. Among those shot were children, paramedics, journalists, and persons with
disabilities.”107
28. Those killed by Israeli soldiers, firing from behind the separation fence, included three medics
and two journalists. A total of over 36,100 Palestinians, including nearly 8,800 children,108 were injured
by Israel, including 4,903 people who were shot in the lower limbs, “many while standing hundreds of
metres away from the snipers, unarmed”.109 156 of them had to have at least one limb amputated,110 and
over 1,200 required specialised limb reconstruction treatment.111 The Commission found that the
maiming was not accidental: the rules of engagement adopted by Israel permitted snipers to shoot at the
legs of the “major inciters”.112 One Israeli soldier admitted that he shot “42 knees in one day”.113
29. The Commission found that there were reasonable grounds to believe that Israeli snipers
“intentionally shot” children, knowing them to be children,114 and they also “intentionally shot” health
workers and journalists “despite seeing that they were clearly marked as such”.115 It further found
“reasonable grounds to believe” that Israeli snipers shot disabled demonstrators “intentionally, despite
seeing that they had visible disabilities” and despite them not presenting an imminent threat.116
Other reports by United Nations bodies and mandates have repeatedly found Israel to have acted
in serious violation of international law in its previous military attacks on Gaza. By way of example:
— Report of the human rights inquiry commission established pursuant to Commission
resolution S-5/1 of 19 October 2000 (16 March 2001):
117
“50. . . . [T]he IDF apparently on grounds of military necessity, has destroyed homes and
laid to waste a significant amount of agricultural land, especially in Gaza, which is
already land starved. Statistics show that 94 homes have been demolished and 7,024
dunums of agricultural land bulldozed in Gaza. Damage to private houses is put at US$
9.5 million and damage to agricultural land at about US$ 27 million. . . . Houses situated
on this land had been destroyed and families compelled to live in tents. Water wells in
the vicinity had also been completely destroyed. The Commission found it difficult to
believe that such destruction, generally carried out in the middle of the night and without
advance warning, was justified on grounds of military necessity. To the Commission it
seemed that such destruction of property had been carried out in an intimidatory manner
unrelated to security, disrespectful of civilian well-being and going well beyond the
needs of military necessity. The evidence suggests that destruction of property and
demolition of houses have been replicated elsewhere in the West Bank and Gaza.
Palestinians, like other people, are deeply attached to their homes and agricultural land.
The demolition of homes and the destruction of olive and citrus trees, nurtured by farmers
over many years, has caused untold human suffering to persons unconnected with the
present violence . . .
51. The Commission concludes that the IDF has engaged in the excessive use of force at
the expense of life and property in Palestine.”
And for those claiming the West Bank is peacefully Palestinian, where Palestinians are "free," yea, right. And tell me again about violations of "treaties." And "who" started it? Pages 25-28:
The Oslo Accords divided administrative competences over three areas of the West Bank
(Areas A, B, and C — not including East Jerusalem) between the Palestinian Authority and Israel, the
Occupying Power. Area A, comprising 18 per cent of the West Bank is stated to be under the full
administrative control of the Palestinian Authority; Area B, comprising 22 per cent of the West Bank
is under the administrative control of the Palestinian Authority and the security control of Israel; and
Area C, comprising 60 per cent of the West Bank, is under full Israeli administrative and security
control.132 In 1967, Israel purportedly annexed occupied East Jerusalem to its territory, and in 1980, it
incorporated a provision into its Basic Law claiming Jerusalem ‘united’ as the capital of Israel, a move
censured by the United Nations Security Council as “null and void” and to “be rescinded forthwith”.133
Since 1967, Israel has constructed 279 ‘settlements’ for Israeli civilians across the West Bank —
including 14 settlements in East Jerusalem — appropriating 750,000 dunums (185,329 acres) of
Palestinian land.134 The United Nations Security Council has repeatedly declared that the establishment
of such settlements by Israel has “no legal validity and constitutes a flagrant violation under
international law and a major obstacle to the achievement of the two-State solution and a just, lasting
and comprehensive peace”.135 Regardless, the number of Israeli settlers transferred into the West Bank
(including East Jerusalem) has increased dramatically from an estimated 247,000 at the time of the Oslo
Accords,136 to over 700,000 in 2023.137 The Prosecutor of the International Criminal Court (‘ICC’) has
determined that there is “a reasonable basis to believe” that “members of the Israeli authorities have
committed war crimes… in relation, inter alia, to the transfer of Israeli civilians into the West Bank.138
34. The United Nations Special Rapporteur on the situation of human rights in the Palestinian
territories occupied since 1967, described the situation in the West Bank as follows:
“53. …There, the Palestinians are subject to a harsh and arbitrary legal system quite unequal to
that enjoyed by the Israeli settlers. Much of the West Bank is off-limits to Palestinians, and they
regularly endure significant restrictions on their freedom of movement through closures,
roadblocks, and the need for hard-to-obtain travel permits.
54. Access to the natural resources of the occupied territory, especially to water, is
disproportionately allocated to Israel and the settlers. Similarly, the planning system
administered by the occupying power for housing and commercial development throughout the
West Bank, including East Jerusalem, is deeply discriminatory in favour of settlement
construction, while imposing significant barriers on Palestinians, including ongoing land
confiscation, home demolitions and the denial of building permits. Israel employs practices that
in some cases may amount to the forcible transfer of Palestinians, primarily those living in rural
areas, as a means of confiscating land for settlements, military weapons training areas and other uses exclusive to the occupying power that have little or nothing to do with its legitimate
security requirements.
55. As for East Jerusalem, the occupation has increasingly detached it from its traditional
national, economic, cultural and family connections with the West Bank because of the wall,
the growing ring of settlements and related checkpoints, and the discriminatory permit regime.
It is neglected by the municipality in terms of services and infrastructure, the occupation has
depleted its economy and the Palestinians have only a small land area on which to build
housing.”139
35, The institutionalised regime of discriminatory laws, policies and practices applied by Israel
subjects Palestinians to what constitutes an apartheid regime.140 Palestinians in the West Bank are
contained behind a segregating Wall, subjected to: discriminatory land zoning and planning policies;
punitive and administrative house demolitions;141 violent Israeli army incursions into Palestinian
villages, towns, cities and refugee camps, including in Area A;142 routine violent Israeli raids on their
homes; arbitrary arrests and indefinitely renewable administrative detention (internment without trial);
and a dual legal system pursuant to which Palestinians are tried under Israeli military legislation in
Israeli military courts, without basic protections of international humanitarian and human rights law,
while Israeli settlers living in the same territory are subject to a different legal regime, and tried in Israeli
civilian courts with full due process.143
36. Palestinians in the West Bank are also subjected to routine violence by Israeli soldiers and
armed settlers. Prior to 7 October 2023, between 1 January and 6 October 2023, 199 Palestinians had
been killed by Israeli soldiers or settlers in the West Bank and 9,000 more had been injured.144 By September 2023, Save the Children had already declared 2023 the deadliest year for Palestinian children
in the West Bank since 2005 with at least 38 Palestinian children having been killed.145 Since 7 October
2023, a further 295 Palestinians, including 77 children, have been killed by Israeli soldiers and settlers,
and a further 3,803, including 576 children, wounded — many seriously.146 A total of 495 Palestinians
have been killed in total in the West Bank, making it “the deadliest year for Palestinians” since 2005.147
37. In a wave of arbitrary mass arrests, Israel has detained more than 3,000 Palestinians from the
West Bank and East Jerusalem, including for social media posts relating to the situation in Gaza.148
Israel significantly increased the number of Palestinians held in administrative detention, without
charge or trial, to 2070.149 Thousands of Palestinians from Gaza working in Israel were also arbitrarily
arrested and detained, with 3,200 being forcibly returned to Gaza on 3 November 2023 into intense full
scale bombardments. Reports that the Palestinian labourers were mistreated on arrest and subjected to
physical violence, abuse and humiliation are widespread.150 Many Palestinian adult and child detainees
from the West Bank released in exchange for Israeli hostages report also severe ill-treatment, serious
beatings and other outrages to personal dignity since 7 October 2023 in particular, alongside restrictions
on access to food, water, medical treatment, and electricity in Israeli detention.151 Six Palestinian
detainees from the West Bank have died in Israeli custody since 7 October 2023, in particular.152 19
Israeli prison guards were reportedly questioned for beating to death one of the prisoners, Tha’er Abu
Asab, in Ketziot Prison.153
38. Since 7 October 2023, Israeli forces have carried out airstrikes and military raids on refugee
camps in the West Bank, killing many Palestinians, bulldozing roads, and imposing severe restrictions
on movement.154 There have been 236 attacks on ‘healthcare’ — including hospitals — in the West
Bank, with Israeli forces detaining health staff and ambulances and preventing ambulances from accessing the wounded.155 Armed Israeli settler attacks on Palestinians — overtly supported by Israeli
politicians — have also escalated dramatically.156 Settlers — often accompanied by Israeli soldiers —
have killed at least eight Palestinians and injured at least 85 others, instilling terror among Palestinians,
especially farming communities, and damaging property.157 2,186 Palestinians in the West Bank,
including 1,058 children, have been internally displaced since 7 October 2023 as a result of extreme
Israeli settler violence, alongside punitive or administrative house demolitions carried out by the Israeli
army and damage caused to homes during Israeli military raids and operations.158 The Prosecutor of the
International Criminal Court indicated in December 2023 that he was “accelerating investigations” into
Israeli settler attacks in the West Bank.159
39. Israel’s actions in the West Bank since 7 October 2023 — including its support for and failure
to prevent or punish Israeli settlers for incitement and violence against Palestinians and Palestinian
property, including the driving out of vulnerable Palestinian communities from their lands — are
intrinsically connected to Israel’s actions in Gaza, and provide at the very least important context to
Israel’s violations of the Genocide Convention.
Another WWII reference, Still don't consider it "ethnic cleansing?" Page 30:
C. Genocidal Acts Committed against the Palestinian People
43. This section provides an overview of the acts in which Israel has engaged that are genocidal in
character, having regard to their nature, scope and context. These acts are ongoing, and ongoing in a
conflict context, where Israel is deliberately imposing telecommunications blackouts on Gaza and
restricting access by fact-finding bodies173 and the international media.174 At the same time Palestinian
journalists are being killed at a rate significantly higher than has occurred in any conflict in the past 100
years. In the two months since 7 October 2023, the number of journalists killed already exceeded that
of the entirety of World War II.175 Further detail will be provided regarding these acts over the course
of these proceedings. However, such information as is available establishes that Israel: (1) is engaged
in killing Palestinians in Gaza — including Palestinian children — in large numbers; (2) is causing
serious bodily and mental harm to Palestinians in Gaza, including Palestinian children; and is inflicting
on them conditions of life intended to bring about their destruction as a group. Those conditions include:
(3) expulsions from homes and mass displacement, alongside the large-scale destruction of homes and
residential areas; (4) deprivation of access to adequate food and water; (4) deprivation of access to
adequate medical care; (5) deprivation of access to adequate shelter, clothes, hygiene and sanitation;
and (6) the destruction of the life of the Palestinian people in Gaza; and (7) imposing measures intended
to prevent Palestinian births.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
0
Options
mickeyrat
up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 35,919
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Sure as hell sounds like ethnic cleansing to me. Pages 53-57:
87. Experts assess that the death toll from disease and hunger “could be multiples of that from
fighting and air strikes”.388 Israeli is through its relentless attacks on the Palestinian healthcare system
in Gaza is deliberately inflicting on Palestinians in Gaza conditions of life calculated to bring about
their destruction.389 Writing in the British medical journal, The Lancet, a group of medics “highlight the health dimensions of violence resulting from the ongoing siege and attacks against Palestinians” rightly
warning of a “grave risk of genocide against the Palestinian people”.390
7.
Destruction of Palestinian life in Gaza
88. On 16 November 2023, 15 United Nations Special Rapporteurs and 21 members of United
Nations Working Groups, warning of a “genocide in the making” in Gaza, observed that the level of
destruction that had by then taken place of “housing units, as well as hospitals, schools, mosques,
bakeries, water pipes, sewage and electricity networks . . . threatens to make the continuation of
Palestinian life in Gaza impossible”.391 As they note, Israel has in its bombing campaign against Gaza
used “powerful weaponry with inherently indiscriminate impacts, resulting in a colossal death toll
and destruction of life-sustaining infrastructure.”392 Israel has destroyed not only individual homes,
houses, and whole apartment blocks; it has destroyed entire streets, and entire neighbourhoods:
Shuja'iyya, a suburb of Gaza City, once home to approximately 110,000 Palestinians, appears to
now be a vast wasteland, entirely flattened as far as the eye can see.393 Its shops, schools, vibrant
market place, family homes, doctors clinics, historic streets and Ibn Uthman Mosque, and
everything that once sustained Palestinian life there has been damaged or destroyed, along with so
many of its people.394 Other areas in Gaza appear to have experienced a similar level of destruction,
including Beit Hanoun,395 Beit Lahia,396 Gaza Old City,397 Al Rimal,398 and Nuseirat refugee camp
in the South.399
89. Across Gaza, Israel has targeted the infrastructure and foundations of Palestinian life,
deliberately creating conditions of life calculated to bring about the physical destruction of
Palestinian people. In addition to the attacks previously cited on homes, neighbourhoods, hospitals,
water systems, agricultural lands, bakeries and mills, Israel has also targeted the foundational civil system in Gaza. Israel has targeted the Palace of Justice,
400 — the main Palestinian court building in
Gaza — housing the Palestinian Supreme Court, the Constitutional Court, the Court of Appeal, the
Court of First Instance, the Administrative Court and the Magistrates’ Court, as well as an archive of
court records and other historical files. Israel has also significantly damaged the Palestinian Legislative
Council complex.401 It has targeted Gaza City’s Central Archive building, containing thousands of
historical documents and national records dating back over 100 years, and forming an essential
archive of Palestinian history, as well as more modern records for Gaza City’s urban
development.402
90. Israel has left Gaza City’s main public library in ruins.403 It has also damaged or destroyed
countless bookshops, publishing houses, libraries,404 and hundreds of educational facilities.405 Israel has
targeted every one of Gaza’s four universities — including the Islamic University of Gaza, the oldest
higher education institution in the territory, which has trained generations of doctors and engineers,
amongst others,
406 — destroying campuses for the education of future generations of Palestinians in
Gaza. Alongside so many others, Israel has killed leading Palestinian academics, including: Professor
Sufian Tayeh, the President of the Islamic University — an award-winning physicist and UNESCO
Chair of Astronomy, Astrophysics and Space Sciences in Palestine — who died, alongside his family,
in an airstrike; Dr Ahmed Hamdi Abo Absa, Dean of the Software Engineering Department at the
University of Palestine, reportedly shot dead by Israeli soldiers as he walked away, having been released
from three days of enforced disappearance; and Professor Muhammad Eid Shabir, Professor of
Immunology and Virology, and former President of the Islamic University of Gaza, and Professor
Refaat Alareer, poet and Professor of Comparative Literature and Creative Writing at the Islamic
University of Gaza, were both killed by Israel with members of their families. Professor Alareer was a
co-founder of ‘We are Not Numbers’, a Palestinian youth project seeking to tell the stories behind
otherwise impersonal accounts of Palestinians — and Palestinian deaths — in the news.407
91. Israel has damaged and destroyed numerous centres of Palestinian learning and culture,
including: the Al Zafar Dmari Mosque and Center for Manuscripts and Ancient Documents;408 the
Orthodox Cultural Centre; the Al Qarara Cultural Museum; the Gaza Centre for Culture and Arts; the
Arab Social Cultural Centre; the Hakawi Society for Culture and Arts; and the Rafah Museum — Gaza's
newly opened museum of Palestinian heritage, housing hundreds of cultural and archaeological
artefacts. Israel’s attacks have destroyed Gaza’s ancient history: eight sites have been damaged or destroyed, including the ancient port of Gaza (known as ‘Anthedon Harbour’ or ‘Al Balakhiya’) — the
archaeological site of a 2,000-year-old Roman cemetery listed on both the Islamic Heritage List and the
tentative UNESCO World Heritage List.
409 Israel has also destroyed Gaza City’s ‘Old City’, including
its 146-year-old historic houses, mosques, churches, markets and schools. It has also destroyed Gaza’s
more recent history of more hopeful times, including the Rashad al-Shawa Cultural Center — site of a
historic meeting between United States President Bill Clinton and Palestinian President Yasser Arafat
25 years ago — and an important cultural hub for Palestinians in Gaza, with its theatre, library and
event space.410 And Israel is destroying Gaza’s future academic and cultural potential: alongside the
352 Palestinian schools it has damaged or destroyed,411 the 4,037 students and 209 teachers and
educational staff it has killed, alongside the other 7,259 students and 619 teachers it has injured.412
92. Israel has damaged or destroyed an estimated 318 Muslim and Christian religious sites,
demolishing the places where Palestinians have worshipped for generations.413 These include the Great
Omari Mosque, originally a fifth century Byzantine church, an iconic landmark of Gaza’s history,
architecture and cultural heritage, and a place of worship by Christians and Muslims for over 1,000
years.414 Israeli shelling has also damaged the Church of Saint Porphyrius, founded in 425 AD and
believed to be the third oldest church in the world — alongside two other churches that have
sustained direct Israeli fire.
415 Gaza’s Christians themselves have been targeted and killed by Israel
in the very church compounds where they sought shelter.416
93. Along with its destruction of the physical monuments to the history and heritage of the
Palestinians in Gaza, Israel has sought to destroy the very Palestinian people who form and create that
heritage: Gaza’s celebrated journalists, its teachers, intellectuals and public figures, its doctors and
nurses, its film-makers, writers and singers, the directors and deans of its universities, the heads of its
hospitals, its eminent scientists, linguists, playwrights, novelists, artists and musicians. Israel has killed
and is killing Palestinian story-tellers and poets, Palestinian farmers and fishermen, alongside Gaza’s
local legends: pastry chef Masoud Muhammad al-Qatati, killed in an Israeli airstrike on his house on 3
November 2023, whose shop’s motto ‘let the poor eat’ — and reputation for giving away the popular
Palestinian treat ‘knafeh’ to indigent customers — earned him the nickname ‘Father of the Poor’; 84-
year-old Elham Farah, from one of Palestine’s oldest Christian families — a reputed accordionist and
music teacher, known as ‘Mother Orange’ to generations of Palestinian music students for her shock of
red hair,
417 — shot dead by an Israeli sniper outside the Holy Family Church in Gaza City when she returned home for warm clothes, and was left to bleed to death;418 and Al-Shaima Saidam, the student
with the highest final high school exam grades in the whole of Palestine, killed with multiple members
of her family in a strike on Al Nuseirat refugee camp.419 Just as Israel is destroying the official memory
and records of Palestinians in Gaza through its destruction of Gaza’s archives and landmarks, it is
obliterating Palestinian personal lives and private memories, histories and futures, through bombing
and bulldozing graveyards,420 destroying family records and photographs, wiping out entire multigenerational families,421 and killing, maiming and traumatising a generation of children.422 As a
Palestinian man, in a video by UNRWA, succinctly sums up: “These are all our memories, our entire
lives . . . Now it’s all gone; everything has turned into ashes.”423
94. The Israeli army — erecting the Israeli flag over the wreckage of devastated Palestinian
homes, towns and cities, including in Gaza City’s Palestine Square itself,424 and spurred on by calls
from within the Israeli government and without to ‘flatten Gaza’ and re-establish Israeli settlements
on the rubble of Palestinian homes,
425 — is destroying the very fabric and basis of Palestinian life in
Gaza. Israel is thereby deliberately inflicting on the Palestinian group in Gaza conditions of life
calculated to bring about its destruction.
If this doesn't turn your stomach, then you don't have a conscience. But hey, he's only talking about it, right? Page 64:
Israeli Army reservist “motivational speech”:
On 11 October 2023, 95-year old Israeli
army reservist Ezra Yachin — a veteran of the Deir Yassin massacre during the 1948 Nakba —
reportedly called up for reserve duty to “boost morale” amongst Israeli troops ahead of the
ground invasion, was broadcast on social media inciting other soldiers to genocide as follows,
while being driven around in an Israeli army vehicle, dressed in Israeli army fatigues:
“Be triumphant and finish them off and don’t leave anyone behind. Erase the memory of
them. Erase them, their families, mothers and children. These animals can no longer live
. . . Every Jew with a weapon should go out and kill them. If you have an Arab neighbour,
don't wait, go to his home and shoot him . . . We want to invade, not like before, we want
to enter and destroy what’s in front of us, and destroy houses, then destroy the one after
it. With all of our forces, complete destruction, enter and destroy. As you can see, we
will witness things we’ve never dreamed of. Let them drop bombs on them and erase
them.”477
An honest question - whether or not it’s ethnic cleansing, what is accomplished by calling it that by you or me? No one is swaying hearts or minds on here, and extreme language like this that can be disputed only serves to further alienate each side from the other. Why not horrific, unimaginable, disproportionate, a nightmare, or some other words which are less likely to be disputed?
The kind of language used here just makes me convinced that no one is here to learn or teach, just to prove themselves right and to walk away a bit more smug than they arrived here. Not dissimilar to the state of discourse away from this forum either. Discourse is either venom spewed at your opponents or a circle jerk with those you agree with at this point.
'05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
An honest question - whether or not it’s ethnic cleansing, what is accomplished by calling it that by you or me? No one is swaying hearts or minds on here, and extreme language like this that can be disputed only serves to further alienate each side from the other. Why not horrific, unimaginable, disproportionate, a nightmare, or some other words which are less likely to be disputed?
The kind of language used here just makes me convinced that no one is here to learn or teach, just to prove themselves right and to walk away a bit more smug than they arrived here. Not dissimilar to the state of discourse away from this forum either. Discourse is either venom spewed at your opponents or a circle jerk with those you agree with at this point.
Wow. You summed up AMT so eloquently and the general problem in politics today. Well done
An honest question - whether or not it’s ethnic cleansing, what is accomplished by calling it that by you or me? No one is swaying hearts or minds on here, and extreme language like this that can be disputed only serves to further alienate each side from the other. Why not horrific, unimaginable, disproportionate, a nightmare, or some other words which are less likely to be disputed?
The kind of language used here just makes me convinced that no one is here to learn or teach, just to prove themselves right and to walk away a bit more smug than they arrived here. Not dissimilar to the state of discourse away from this forum either. Discourse is either venom spewed at your opponents or a circle jerk with those you agree with at this point.
Why not call it what it is? Then “never again” rings hollow. Or, there appears to be an exception to who the term “ethnic cleansing” applies to based upon who the perpetrators and victims are. Humanity needs, indeed requires, to be honest with itself. Collectively.
I implore everyone to read South Africa’s complaint. It’s only 85 pages, much of which is footnoted sources. But I’m sure most on here can’t “be bothered.”
Should we not call what Nazi Germany did a “holocaust” because it wasn’t fully successful or because we risk coming across as a “bit more smug?” The “smugness” is calling what is happening in Palestine just another conflict or “war is hell” and have we, collectively, and particularly the West, not learned a fucking thing?
An honest question - whether or not it’s ethnic cleansing, what is accomplished by calling it that by you or me? No one is swaying hearts or minds on here, and extreme language like this that can be disputed only serves to further alienate each side from the other. Why not horrific, unimaginable, disproportionate, a nightmare, or some other words which are less likely to be disputed?
The kind of language used here just makes me convinced that no one is here to learn or teach, just to prove themselves right and to walk away a bit more smug than they arrived here. Not dissimilar to the state of discourse away from this forum either. Discourse is either venom spewed at your opponents or a circle jerk with those you agree with at this point.
Why not call it what it is? Then “never again” rings hollow. Or, there appears to be an exception to who the term “ethnic cleansing” applies to based upon who the perpetrators and victims are. Humanity needs, indeed requires, to be honest with itself. Collectively.
I implore everyone to read South Africa’s complaint. It’s only 85 pages, much of which is footnoted sources. But I’m sure most on here can’t “be bothered.”
Should we not call what Nazi Germany did a “holocaust” because it wasn’t fully successful or because we risk coming across as a “bit more smug?” The “smugness” is calling what is happening in Palestine just another conflict or “war is hell” and have we, collectively, and particularly the West, not learned a fucking thing?
Call it what you (but not everyone) feels it is, and lose the audience of people you are trying to persuade. Suit yourself, but don’t be surprised when no one reads what you share. Like I said - when it’s clear you have more interest in being right than a genuine debate or discussion, you will sway no minds.
Post edited by benjs on
'05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
An honest question - whether or not it’s ethnic cleansing, what is accomplished by calling it that by you or me? No one is swaying hearts or minds on here, and extreme language like this that can be disputed only serves to further alienate each side from the other. Why not horrific, unimaginable, disproportionate, a nightmare, or some other words which are less likely to be disputed?
The kind of language used here just makes me convinced that no one is here to learn or teach, just to prove themselves right and to walk away a bit more smug than they arrived here. Not dissimilar to the state of discourse away from this forum either. Discourse is either venom spewed at your opponents or a circle jerk with those you agree with at this point.
Why not call it what it is? Then “never again” rings hollow. Or, there appears to be an exception to who the term “ethnic cleansing” applies to based upon who the perpetrators and victims are. Humanity needs, indeed requires, to be honest with itself. Collectively.
I implore everyone to read South Africa’s complaint. It’s only 85 pages, much of which is footnoted sources. But I’m sure most on here can’t “be bothered.”
Should we not call what Nazi Germany did a “holocaust” because it wasn’t fully successful or because we risk coming across as a “bit more smug?” The “smugness” is calling what is happening in Palestine just another conflict or “war is hell” and have we, collectively, and particularly the West, not learned a fucking thing?
Call it what you (but not everyone) feels it is, and lose the audience of people you are trying to persuade. Suit yourself, but don’t be surprised when no one reads what you share. Like I said - when it’s clear you have more interest in being right than a genuine debate or discussion, you will sway no minds.
I don’t really care if people “read what I write” but rather the source document information that I’ve posted. It’s not “me” making the claim but rather a UN recognized nation with street cred as it relates to these types of things. Feel free to put me on ignore or read/don’t read what I write, post or link to. It’s still a free country last time I checked. And if you, general you, don’t read the source material that I post, don’t expect me to take any subsequent posts of yours, general your, seriously.
As far as being “right” goes, I have yet to see any posts disputing what South Africa has alleged or anyone defending Israel except for “Hamas or ‘they’ started it”, continuing to conflate the Palestinian people as one complete terrorist organization as Israeli leadership, press and some of the public profess. Guess I’m “right?”
An honest question - whether or not it’s ethnic cleansing, what is accomplished by calling it that by you or me? No one is swaying hearts or minds on here, and extreme language like this that can be disputed only serves to further alienate each side from the other. Why not horrific, unimaginable, disproportionate, a nightmare, or some other words which are less likely to be disputed?
The kind of language used here just makes me convinced that no one is here to learn or teach, just to prove themselves right and to walk away a bit more smug than they arrived here. Not dissimilar to the state of discourse away from this forum either. Discourse is either venom spewed at your opponents or a circle jerk with those you agree with at this point.
I know you dislike the Israeli govt actions, personally I’d be thrilled if somehow Netanyahu could be forced out, be thrilled if somehow a peace deal can happen, but Hals non stop ranting of ethnic cleaning is a bit of a joke, I’d say offensive only because it’s been ongoing non stop for months. Ethnic cleaning that began with the murder of 1500 Jews and 250 hostages? Was that part of Israel’s plan ?
it’s a bit rich, considering the Jews are the victims of ethic cleansing unlike any other, from Hitler to the Romans.
Did Hal rant endlessly like this every day about Putin ethnically cleansing Ukraine? Did South America sue Russia? Something about the Jews and israel bring out hatred that other places do not.
Or he doesn’t because he doesn’t believe any Russian supporters read this forum? If that’s the case the mods should shut this and all mid east topics down permanently, as it’s not serving any purpose other than his targeting.
An honest question - whether or not it’s ethnic cleansing, what is accomplished by calling it that by you or me? No one is swaying hearts or minds on here, and extreme language like this that can be disputed only serves to further alienate each side from the other. Why not horrific, unimaginable, disproportionate, a nightmare, or some other words which are less likely to be disputed?
The kind of language used here just makes me convinced that no one is here to learn or teach, just to prove themselves right and to walk away a bit more smug than they arrived here. Not dissimilar to the state of discourse away from this forum either. Discourse is either venom spewed at your opponents or a circle jerk with those you agree with at this point.
Why not call it what it is? Then “never again” rings hollow. Or, there appears to be an exception to who the term “ethnic cleansing” applies to based upon who the perpetrators and victims are. Humanity needs, indeed requires, to be honest with itself. Collectively.
I implore everyone to read South Africa’s complaint. It’s only 85 pages, much of which is footnoted sources. But I’m sure most on here can’t “be bothered.”
Should we not call what Nazi Germany did a “holocaust” because it wasn’t fully successful or because we risk coming across as a “bit more smug?” The “smugness” is calling what is happening in Palestine just another conflict or “war is hell” and have we, collectively, and particularly the West, not learned a fucking thing?
Showing off your true colors. Your hatred is obvious.
Almost flagged this for the mods. This post is offensive. To compare the current horrible war in Gaza to Hitler is offensive. You are doing this with specific purpose to create anger amongst certain specific users. It is 100% in violation of the spirit of the rules here since it’s targeted towards a certain audience and has been occurring for months without end.
are the Israelis going door to door and pulling Palestinians from their home, putting them in concentration camps and killing six million of them?
about 20% of Israel’s population IS Palestinian. Inside Israel. Is Israel going door to door, pulling Palestinian parents from babies inside Israel and sending the parents to the gas chambers?
An honest question - whether or not it’s ethnic cleansing, what is accomplished by calling it that by you or me? No one is swaying hearts or minds on here, and extreme language like this that can be disputed only serves to further alienate each side from the other. Why not horrific, unimaginable, disproportionate, a nightmare, or some other words which are less likely to be disputed?
The kind of language used here just makes me convinced that no one is here to learn or teach, just to prove themselves right and to walk away a bit more smug than they arrived here. Not dissimilar to the state of discourse away from this forum either. Discourse is either venom spewed at your opponents or a circle jerk with those you agree with at this point.
Why not call it what it is? Then “never again” rings hollow. Or, there appears to be an exception to who the term “ethnic cleansing” applies to based upon who the perpetrators and victims are. Humanity needs, indeed requires, to be honest with itself. Collectively.
I implore everyone to read South Africa’s complaint. It’s only 85 pages, much of which is footnoted sources. But I’m sure most on here can’t “be bothered.”
Should we not call what Nazi Germany did a “holocaust” because it wasn’t fully successful or because we risk coming across as a “bit more smug?” The “smugness” is calling what is happening in Palestine just another conflict or “war is hell” and have we, collectively, and particularly the West, not learned a fucking thing?
Showing off your true colors. Your hatred is obvious.
Almost flagged this for the mods. This post is offensive. To compare the current horrible war in Gaza to Hitler is offensive. You are doing this with specific purpose to create anger amongst certain specific users. It is 100% in violation of the spirit of the rules here since it’s targeted towards a certain audience and has been occurring for months without end.
are the Israelis going door to door and pulling Palestinians from their home, putting them in concentration camps and killing six million of them?
about 20% of Israel’s population IS Palestinian. Inside Israel. Is Israel going door to door, pulling Palestinian parents from babies inside Israel and sending the parents to the gas chambers?
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
An honest question - whether or not it’s ethnic cleansing, what is accomplished by calling it that by you or me? No one is swaying hearts or minds on here, and extreme language like this that can be disputed only serves to further alienate each side from the other. Why not horrific, unimaginable, disproportionate, a nightmare, or some other words which are less likely to be disputed?
The kind of language used here just makes me convinced that no one is here to learn or teach, just to prove themselves right and to walk away a bit more smug than they arrived here. Not dissimilar to the state of discourse away from this forum either. Discourse is either venom spewed at your opponents or a circle jerk with those you agree with at this point.
Why not call it what it is? Then “never again” rings hollow. Or, there appears to be an exception to who the term “ethnic cleansing” applies to based upon who the perpetrators and victims are. Humanity needs, indeed requires, to be honest with itself. Collectively.
I implore everyone to read South Africa’s complaint. It’s only 85 pages, much of which is footnoted sources. But I’m sure most on here can’t “be bothered.”
Should we not call what Nazi Germany did a “holocaust” because it wasn’t fully successful or because we risk coming across as a “bit more smug?” The “smugness” is calling what is happening in Palestine just another conflict or “war is hell” and have we, collectively, and particularly the West, not learned a fucking thing?
Showing off your true colors. Your hatred is obvious.
Almost flagged this for the mods. This post is offensive. To compare the current horrible war in Gaza to Hitler is offensive. You are doing this with specific purpose to create anger amongst certain specific users. It is 100% in violation of the spirit of the rules here since it’s targeted towards a certain audience and has been occurring for months without end.
are the Israelis going door to door and pulling Palestinians from their home, putting them in concentration camps and killing six million of them?
about 20% of Israel’s population IS Palestinian. Inside Israel. Is Israel going door to door, pulling Palestinian parents from babies inside Israel and sending the parents to the gas chambers?
An honest question - whether or not it’s ethnic cleansing, what is accomplished by calling it that by you or me? No one is swaying hearts or minds on here, and extreme language like this that can be disputed only serves to further alienate each side from the other. Why not horrific, unimaginable, disproportionate, a nightmare, or some other words which are less likely to be disputed?
The kind of language used here just makes me convinced that no one is here to learn or teach, just to prove themselves right and to walk away a bit more smug than they arrived here. Not dissimilar to the state of discourse away from this forum either. Discourse is either venom spewed at your opponents or a circle jerk with those you agree with at this point.
I know you dislike the Israeli govt actions, personally I’d be thrilled if somehow Netanyahu could be forced out, be thrilled if somehow a peace deal can happen, but Hals non stop ranting of ethnic cleaning is a bit of a joke, I’d say offensive only because it’s been ongoing non stop for months. Ethnic cleaning that began with the murder of 1500 Jews and 250 hostages? Was that part of Israel’s plan ?
it’s a bit rich, considering the Jews are the victims of ethic cleansing unlike any other, from Hitler to the Romans.
Did Hal rant endlessly like this every day about Putin ethnically cleansing Ukraine? Did South America sue Russia? Something about the Jews and israel bring out hatred that other places do not.
Or he doesn’t because he doesn’t believe any Russian supporters read this forum? If that’s the case the mods should shut this and all mid east topics down permanently, as it’s not serving any purpose other than his targeting.
yes or no question for you.
do you believe that the october attack was in response to the policies of the israeli government?
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway
An honest question - whether or not it’s ethnic cleansing, what is accomplished by calling it that by you or me? No one is swaying hearts or minds on here, and extreme language like this that can be disputed only serves to further alienate each side from the other. Why not horrific, unimaginable, disproportionate, a nightmare, or some other words which are less likely to be disputed?
The kind of language used here just makes me convinced that no one is here to learn or teach, just to prove themselves right and to walk away a bit more smug than they arrived here. Not dissimilar to the state of discourse away from this forum either. Discourse is either venom spewed at your opponents or a circle jerk with those you agree with at this point.
Why not call it what it is? Then “never again” rings hollow. Or, there appears to be an exception to who the term “ethnic cleansing” applies to based upon who the perpetrators and victims are. Humanity needs, indeed requires, to be honest with itself. Collectively.
I implore everyone to read South Africa’s complaint. It’s only 85 pages, much of which is footnoted sources. But I’m sure most on here can’t “be bothered.”
Should we not call what Nazi Germany did a “holocaust” because it wasn’t fully successful or because we risk coming across as a “bit more smug?” The “smugness” is calling what is happening in Palestine just another conflict or “war is hell” and have we, collectively, and particularly the West, not learned a fucking thing?
Showing off your true colors. Your hatred is obvious.
Almost flagged this for the mods. This post is offensive. To compare the current horrible war in Gaza to Hitler is offensive. You are doing this with specific purpose to create anger amongst certain specific users. It is 100% in violation of the spirit of the rules here since it’s targeted towards a certain audience and has been occurring for months without end.
are the Israelis going door to door and pulling Palestinians from their home, putting them in concentration camps and killing six million of them?
about 20% of Israel’s population IS Palestinian. Inside Israel. Is Israel going door to door, pulling Palestinian parents from babies inside Israel and sending the parents to the gas chambers?
I suggest that you read all 85 pages of South Africa’s filing and complaint filed with the court. If you do, you’ll find the answers to whether Israelis, notice I didn’t say “Jews,” are wantonly and discriminately killing Palestinian men, woman and children non-combatants. Member nations of the UN are party to and have a responsibility to conduct military operations in a particular way. Jewish history and terrorist attacks don’t negate that responsibility nor excuse their actions.
Like Hillel, trying to shut down discussion and keep the truth from being known as if Israel is nothing but an innocent victim from 1947, and particularly since 1967, onward.
Unlike you, I can separate the Jewish religion from the State of Israel and the current Zionists running things, and I certainly don’t condemn all Jews for the actions of their recognized state of Israel.
Tell me, do the 250,000 Palestinians in Israel proper enjoy the full rights and benefits of it Jewish citizens? Are they considered and treated as equals?:
In Israel proper, Palestinians constitute almost 21 percent of the population as part of its Arab citizens. Many are Palestinian refugees or internally displaced Palestinians, including more than a million in the Gaza Strip, around 750,000 in the West Bank, and around 250,000 in Israel proper.
We know how Palestinians are treated in Gaza and the West Bank.
I’ll ask you again, knowing you won’t answer, how many dead Palestinians will it take to avenge Israel’s losses on 10/07/2023?
An honest question - whether or not it’s ethnic cleansing, what is accomplished by calling it that by you or me? No one is swaying hearts or minds on here, and extreme language like this that can be disputed only serves to further alienate each side from the other. Why not horrific, unimaginable, disproportionate, a nightmare, or some other words which are less likely to be disputed?
The kind of language used here just makes me convinced that no one is here to learn or teach, just to prove themselves right and to walk away a bit more smug than they arrived here. Not dissimilar to the state of discourse away from this forum either. Discourse is either venom spewed at your opponents or a circle jerk with those you agree with at this point.
I know you dislike the Israeli govt actions, personally I’d be thrilled if somehow Netanyahu could be forced out, be thrilled if somehow a peace deal can happen, but Hals non stop ranting of ethnic cleaning is a bit of a joke, I’d say offensive only because it’s been ongoing non stop for months. Ethnic cleaning that began with the murder of 1500 Jews and 250 hostages? Was that part of Israel’s plan ?
it’s a bit rich, considering the Jews are the victims of ethic cleansing unlike any other, from Hitler to the Romans.
Did Hal rant endlessly like this every day about Putin ethnically cleansing Ukraine? Did South America sue Russia? Something about the Jews and israel bring out hatred that other places do not.
Or he doesn’t because he doesn’t believe any Russian supporters read this forum? If that’s the case the mods should shut this and all mid east topics down permanently, as it’s not serving any purpose other than his targeting.
I’ll respond to the points you raise.
Did Bibi look the other way and support Hamas to prevent a two state or sharing of a single state solution and contribute to what happened on 10/07? Seems so based on past statements made by him and his Zionist supporters. Was it intentional? Question remains but certainly bears partial responsibility for the funding approval and ignorance of what was occurring and his government’s collective complacency. Not to mention 20+ years of land seizures and Israeli settler attacks in the West Bank.
One would think that knowing the history of Nazi germany, what occurred and the history of the Jews from the Romans to Hitler that they would be the last people to commit genocide (South Africa’s accusation and feel free to argue about what is and has happened in Gaza and the West Bank is not). Because they have suffered does not give them a pass or carte Blanche to committing military actions that result in the same outcome. Whether it’s 2000 lbs bombs dropped on apartment complexes, artillery barrages, sniper fire or house to house raids, forced evacuations and detainments without charge, collectively, it amounts to the same thing. Again, I refer you to South Africa’s court filing.
Did Russia invade Ukraine and commit war crimes? Absolutely. Should Putin on the ritz be held accountable? Absolutely. Does it disturb me as much as what is happening to the Palestinians? Absolutely. The difference? Ukraine has a standing army, western arms and support and seems to be holding their own under a government of their choosing and from within their recognized borders. What do the Palestinians have? A terrorist organization that has successfully convinced you and others that all Palestinians in Gaza are terrorists and deserve to be slaughtered. And not much else.
Let’s not forget the Chinese suppression and ethnic cleansing of the Uyghurs and Myanmar’s same of the Rohingya. Regardless of the perpetrators and victims, genocide and ethnic cleansing are always unacceptable and they all bother my conscience.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
The West Bank? I thought the West Bank was a shangrala of Palestinian freedom and self determination where they owned all the land and had freedom of movement and enjoy all the same rights and freedoms as Israelis? Why would blood be spilt in the West Bank? Oh, and let me guess, Israel bears no responsibility and is the victim here as well?
An honest question - whether or not it’s ethnic cleansing, what is accomplished by calling it that by you or me? No one is swaying hearts or minds on here, and extreme language like this that can be disputed only serves to further alienate each side from the other. Why not horrific, unimaginable, disproportionate, a nightmare, or some other words which are less likely to be disputed?
The kind of language used here just makes me convinced that no one is here to learn or teach, just to prove themselves right and to walk away a bit more smug than they arrived here. Not dissimilar to the state of discourse away from this forum either. Discourse is either venom spewed at your opponents or a circle jerk with those you agree with at this point.
I know you dislike the Israeli govt actions, personally I’d be thrilled if somehow Netanyahu could be forced out, be thrilled if somehow a peace deal can happen, but Hals non stop ranting of ethnic cleaning is a bit of a joke, I’d say offensive only because it’s been ongoing non stop for months. Ethnic cleaning that began with the murder of 1500 Jews and 250 hostages? Was that part of Israel’s plan ?
it’s a bit rich, considering the Jews are the victims of ethic cleansing unlike any other, from Hitler to the Romans.
Did Hal rant endlessly like this every day about Putin ethnically cleansing Ukraine? Did South America sue Russia? Something about the Jews and israel bring out hatred that other places do not.
Or he doesn’t because he doesn’t believe any Russian supporters read this forum? If that’s the case the mods should shut this and all mid east topics down permanently, as it’s not serving any purpose other than his targeting.
To the specific, bolded question about me, Ruska, the what?, #3 or maybe #5 military might in the world, nuclear armed too, and look and see how Israel has vastly surpassed them in a much less span of time (21 months vs. 3 months). Do the math.
It does make me wonder though, do you understand the concept of economies of scale? Because if you do, you’d admit that Israel is pretty efficient.
If you can admit that Putin on the ritz and Russia, Russia, Russia should be accused of war crimes and ethnic cleansing and held accountable, then surely you can admit that BiBi and Israel should be accused of war crimes and held accountable. Maybe you chose the wrong comparison?
Per the Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Human Rights, as of November 21, 2023 “At least 10,000 civilians, including more than 560 children, have been killed and over 18,500 have been injured since Russia launched its a full-scale armed attack against Ukraine on 24 February 2022 ...”
An honest question - whether or not it’s ethnic cleansing, what is accomplished by calling it that by you or me? No one is swaying hearts or minds on here, and extreme language like this that can be disputed only serves to further alienate each side from the other. Why not horrific, unimaginable, disproportionate, a nightmare, or some other words which are less likely to be disputed?
The kind of language used here just makes me convinced that no one is here to learn or teach, just to prove themselves right and to walk away a bit more smug than they arrived here. Not dissimilar to the state of discourse away from this forum either. Discourse is either venom spewed at your opponents or a circle jerk with those you agree with at this point.
I know you dislike the Israeli govt actions, personally I’d be thrilled if somehow Netanyahu could be forced out, be thrilled if somehow a peace deal can happen, but Hals non stop ranting of ethnic cleaning is a bit of a joke, I’d say offensive only because it’s been ongoing non stop for months. Ethnic cleaning that began with the murder of 1500 Jews and 250 hostages? Was that part of Israel’s plan ?
it’s a bit rich, considering the Jews are the victims of ethic cleansing unlike any other, from Hitler to the Romans.
Did Hal rant endlessly like this every day about Putin ethnically cleansing Ukraine? Did South America sue Russia? Something about the Jews and israel bring out hatred that other places do not.
Or he doesn’t because he doesn’t believe any Russian supporters read this forum? If that’s the case the mods should shut this and all mid east topics down permanently, as it’s not serving any purpose other than his targeting.
To the specific, bolded question about me, Ruska, the what?, #3 or maybe #5 military might in the world, nuclear armed too, and look and see how Israel has vastly surpassed them in a much less span of time (21 months vs. 3 months). Do the math.
It does make me wonder though, do you understand the concept of economies of scale? Because if you do, you’d admit that Israel is pretty efficient.
If you can admit that Putin on the ritz and Russia, Russia, Russia should be accused of war crimes and ethnic cleansing and held accountable, then surely you can admit that BiBi and Israel should be accused of war crimes and held accountable. Maybe you chose the wrong comparison?
Per the Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Human Rights, as of November 21, 2023 “At least 10,000 civilians, including more than 560 children, have been killed and over 18,500 have been injured since Russia launched its a full-scale armed attack against Ukraine on 24 February 2022 ...”
and hundreds of thousands kidnapped children too....
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
0
Options
mickeyrat
up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 35,919
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
0
Options
mickeyrat
up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 35,919
The fighting erupted on Oct. 7 when Hamas carried out a deadly attack in southern Israel. Since then, Israel has relentlessly pounded the Gaza Strip with airstrikes and a ground offensive that have wrought unprecedented destruction, flattening entire neighborhoods. The offensive has displaced the vast majority of Palestinians in Gaza, shuttered operations in more than half of Gaza's hospitals and caused widespread hunger, U.N. monitors say.
The Israeli military says it has now scaled back operations in the hard-hit north. But in the south, where it says Hamas' leaders are hiding, it presses forward at full strength. Meanwhile, Lebanon's Hezbollah militia and Israel have engaged in cross-border skirmishes nearly every day since the war began.
Here’s a look in numbers at the toll of the Israel-Hamas war, sourced from Palestinian Health Ministry and Israeli officials as well as international observers and aid groups.
TOTAL DEATHS
Number of Palestinians killed in Gaza: 23,843
Number of people killed in Israel: more than 1,200
Number of Palestinians killed in the West Bank: 347
CIVILIANS
Civilians killed in Gaza: The civilian toll of the war is unknown, with women and minors making up an estimated two-thirds of those killed
Number of civilians killed in Israel on Oct. 7: 790
U.N. staff killed in Gaza: 148
Health workers killed in Gaza: at least 337
Journalists killed in Gaza: 82
SOLDIERS/MILITANTS
Number of Israeli soldiers killed on Oct. 7: 314
Number of militants killed by Israel: Over 8,000
Number of Israeli soldiers killed in the Gaza ground offensive: 188
Number of Israeli soldiers killed on the northern front: 9
Number of Israeli soldiers killed by friendly fire or “accidents” in Gaza and the north: 29
DESTRUCTION/HUMANITARIAN SITUATION IN GAZA
Percentage of Gaza’s buildings likely damaged/destroyed: 45-56%
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
0
Options
mickeyrat
up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 35,919
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
0
Options
mickeyrat
up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 35,919
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Comments
astoria 06
albany 06
hartford 06
reading 06
barcelona 06
paris 06
wembley 07
dusseldorf 07
nijmegen 07
this song is meant to be called i got shit,itshould be called i got shit tickets-hartford 06 -
TEL AVIV, Israel (AP) — U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken on Tuesday called on Israel to work with moderate Palestinians and neighboring countries on plans for postwar Gaza, saying they were willing to help rebuild and govern the territory but only if there is a “pathway to a Palestinian state.”
The U.S. and Israel are united in the war against Hamas but sharply divided over Gaza's future, with Washington and its Arab allies hoping to revive the long-moribund peace process, an idea that Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and his coalition partners sharply oppose.
The war in Gaza is still raging, with no end in sight, and fueling a humanitarian catastrophe in the tiny coastal enclave. The fighting has also stoked escalating violence between Israel and Lebanon's Hezbollah militants that has raised fears of a wider conflict.
Speaking at a news conference after meeting with top Israeli leaders, Blinken said Israel “must stop taking steps that undercut the Palestinians' ability to govern themselves effectively.”
ISRAEL-HAMAS WAR
Live updates | Blinken presses Israel on Gaza’s postwar future as Lebanon border clashes escalate
Former UK opposition leader Corbyn to join South Africa's delegation accusing Israel of genocide
Hezbollah launches drone strike on base in northern Israel but military says there's no damage
TikTok restricts tool used by researchers - and its critics - to assess content on its platform
Israel, he added “must be a partner of the Palestinian leaders who are willing to lead their people” and live "side by side in peace with Israel.” Settler violence, settlement expansion, home demolitions and evictions “all make it harder, not easier, for Israel to achieve lasting peace and security."
U.S. officials have called for the Palestinian Authority, which currently administers parts of the Israeli-occupied West Bank, to take the reins in Gaza. Israeli leaders have rejected that idea but have not put forward a concrete plan beyond saying they will maintain open-ended military control over the territory.
Blinken has said that Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Qatar, the United Arab Emirates and Turkey agreed to begin planning for the reconstruction and governance of Gaza once the war ends. The leaders of Jordan, Egypt and the Palestinian Authority are set to meet Wednesday in Jordan’s southern Red Sea city of Aqaba.
HEAVY FIGHTING IN GAZA
The United States, which has provided crucial military and diplomatic support for Israel's offensive, has pressed it to shift to more precise operations targeting Hamas. But the pace of death and destruction has remained largely the same, with hundreds killed in recent days.
Israel has vowed to keep going until it destroys Hamas, which triggered the war with its Oct. 7 attack into southern Israel. Palestinian militants killed some 1,200 people, mainly civilians, and abducted around 250 others, nearly half of whom were released during a weeklong cease-fire in November.
The Israeli military says it has dismantled Hamas infrastructure in northern Gaza — where entire neighborhoods have been demolished — but is still battling small groups of militants. The offensive’s focus has shifted to the southern city of Khan Younis and built-up refugee camps in central Gaza.
“The fighting will continue throughout 2024,” said Rear Adm. Daniel Hagari, a military spokesman.
Since the war began, Israel’s assault in Gaza has killed more than 23,200 Palestinians, roughly 1% of the territory’s population, and more than 58,000 people have been wounded, according to the Health Ministry in Hamas-run Gaza. About two-thirds of the dead are women and children. The death toll does not distinguish between combatants and civilians.
A strike late Monday hit a house in the central town of Deir al-Balah, killing the mother, three daughters and three small grandchildren of Jamal Naeim, a well-known dentist in Gaza. Outside the hospital, Naeim cradled a small bundle of white cloth containing all that remained of one of his adult daughters, Shaimaa, who was also a dentist.
“This is what we found of her, just the skin of her head and her hair,” he said, breaking into sobs. Naeim is the brother of Bassem Naeim, a political figure in Hamas, but is not a member of the group himself, residents said.
At least eight people were killed when a strike hit a five-story residential building in Rafah in southern Gaza on Tuesday, Palestinian Health officials said. Six of the bodies were taken to nearby Kuwati hospital and were counted by an Associated Press journalist. Two other corpses were transported to Youssef al-Najjar Hospital, also in Rafah, according to Dr. Sohaib al-Hams, who works at al-Kuwati Hospital.
Monday was one of the deadliest days yet for Israeli troops in Gaza, with nine killed, according to the military. Six of them died in an accidental blast when forces were preparing a controlled demolition of a weapons production site in central Gaza, the military said.
It says 185 soldiers have been killed since the ground offensive began in late October.
A HUMANITARIAN CRISIS
Nearly 85% of Gaza’s population of 2.3 million have been driven from their homes by the fighting, and a quarter of its residents face starvation, with only a trickle of food, water, medicine and other supplies entering through an Israeli siege.
The U.N. humanitarian office, known as OCHA, warned that the fighting was severely hampering aid deliveries. Several warehouses, distribution centers, health facilities and shelters have been affected by the military’s evacuation orders, it said.
The situation is even more dire in northern Gaza, which Israeli forces cut off from the rest of the territory in late October. Tens of thousands of people who remain there face shortages of food and water.
The World Health Organization has been unable to deliver supplies to the north for two weeks. OCHA said the military rejected five planned aid convoys to the north over that period, including deliveries of medical supplies and fuel for water and sanitation facilities.
Blinken said more food, water, medicine and other aid needs to enter and be distributed effectively. He called on Israel to “do everything it can to remove any obstacles from crossings to other parts of Gaza."
FEARS OF A WIDER CONFLICT
The war in Gaza has threatened to trigger a wider conflict, with Israel and Lebanon's Hezbollah trading escalating strikes following the killing of Hamas' deputy political leader in Beirut last week.
On Tuesday, Hezbollah said its exploding drones targeted the Israeli army's northern command in the town of Safed — deeper into Israel than previous fire by the group. The Israeli military said a drone fell at a base in the north without causing damage, suggesting it had been intercepted. Military officials did not identify the base.
Israeli strikes in southern Lebanon meanwhile killed at least four Hezbollah members, including one who was killed in the village where a funeral was held for a Hezbollah commander killed the day before.
Israel claimed the man killed ahead of the funeral, Ali Hussein Barji, was in charge of Hezbollah's drones in the south, but a Hezbollah official, speaking on condition of anonymity in accordance with the group’s regulations, said he was only a fighter.
___
Jobain reported reported from Rafah, Gaza Strip, and Magdy from Cairo. Associated Press writers Tia Goldenberg in Jerusalem and Bassem Mroue in Beirut contributed to this report.
___
Find more of AP’s coverage at: https://apnews.com/hub/israel-hamas-war
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Between 29 September 2000 and 7 October 2023, approximately 7,569 Palestinians,102 including 1,699 children,103 were killed, including in those “four highly asymmetrical wars”, as well as other smaller military assaults, with tens of thousands of others injured. A further 214 Palestinians, including 46 children were killed during the ‘Great March of Return’,104 a large-scale peaceful protest along the separation fence between Gaza and Israel, in which thousands of Palestinians participated every Friday for over 18 months, demanding that “the blockade imposed on Gaza be lifted and the return of Palestinian refugees” to their homes and villages in Israel.105 On one particularly lethal day alone, Israel killed 60 Palestinian protesters.106 As determined by the Independent Commission of Inquiry on the protests in the occupied Palestinian territory (‘Commission’):
“[D]uring these weekly demonstrations, the Israeli Security Forces (ISF) killed and gravely injured civilians who were neither participating directly in hostilities nor posing an imminent threat to life. Among those shot were children, paramedics, journalists, and persons with disabilities.”107
28. Those killed by Israeli soldiers, firing from behind the separation fence, included three medics and two journalists. A total of over 36,100 Palestinians, including nearly 8,800 children,108 were injured by Israel, including 4,903 people who were shot in the lower limbs, “many while standing hundreds of metres away from the snipers, unarmed”.109 156 of them had to have at least one limb amputated,110 and over 1,200 required specialised limb reconstruction treatment.111 The Commission found that the maiming was not accidental: the rules of engagement adopted by Israel permitted snipers to shoot at the legs of the “major inciters”.112 One Israeli soldier admitted that he shot “42 knees in one day”.113
29. The Commission found that there were reasonable grounds to believe that Israeli snipers “intentionally shot” children, knowing them to be children,114 and they also “intentionally shot” health workers and journalists “despite seeing that they were clearly marked as such”.115 It further found “reasonable grounds to believe” that Israeli snipers shot disabled demonstrators “intentionally, despite seeing that they had visible disabilities” and despite them not presenting an imminent threat.116
Other reports by United Nations bodies and mandates have repeatedly found Israel to have acted in serious violation of international law in its previous military attacks on Gaza. By way of example: — Report of the human rights inquiry commission established pursuant to Commission resolution S-5/1 of 19 October 2000 (16 March 2001): 117
“50. . . . [T]he IDF apparently on grounds of military necessity, has destroyed homes and laid to waste a significant amount of agricultural land, especially in Gaza, which is already land starved. Statistics show that 94 homes have been demolished and 7,024 dunums of agricultural land bulldozed in Gaza. Damage to private houses is put at US$ 9.5 million and damage to agricultural land at about US$ 27 million. . . . Houses situated on this land had been destroyed and families compelled to live in tents. Water wells in the vicinity had also been completely destroyed. The Commission found it difficult to believe that such destruction, generally carried out in the middle of the night and without advance warning, was justified on grounds of military necessity. To the Commission it seemed that such destruction of property had been carried out in an intimidatory manner unrelated to security, disrespectful of civilian well-being and going well beyond the needs of military necessity. The evidence suggests that destruction of property and demolition of houses have been replicated elsewhere in the West Bank and Gaza. Palestinians, like other people, are deeply attached to their homes and agricultural land. The demolition of homes and the destruction of olive and citrus trees, nurtured by farmers over many years, has caused untold human suffering to persons unconnected with the present violence . . .
51. The Commission concludes that the IDF has engaged in the excessive use of force at the expense of life and property in Palestine.”
Application instituting proceedings and Request for the indication of provisional measures (icj-cij.org)
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
The Oslo Accords divided administrative competences over three areas of the West Bank (Areas A, B, and C — not including East Jerusalem) between the Palestinian Authority and Israel, the Occupying Power. Area A, comprising 18 per cent of the West Bank is stated to be under the full administrative control of the Palestinian Authority; Area B, comprising 22 per cent of the West Bank is under the administrative control of the Palestinian Authority and the security control of Israel; and Area C, comprising 60 per cent of the West Bank, is under full Israeli administrative and security control.132 In 1967, Israel purportedly annexed occupied East Jerusalem to its territory, and in 1980, it incorporated a provision into its Basic Law claiming Jerusalem ‘united’ as the capital of Israel, a move censured by the United Nations Security Council as “null and void” and to “be rescinded forthwith”.133 Since 1967, Israel has constructed 279 ‘settlements’ for Israeli civilians across the West Bank — including 14 settlements in East Jerusalem — appropriating 750,000 dunums (185,329 acres) of Palestinian land.134 The United Nations Security Council has repeatedly declared that the establishment of such settlements by Israel has “no legal validity and constitutes a flagrant violation under international law and a major obstacle to the achievement of the two-State solution and a just, lasting and comprehensive peace”.135 Regardless, the number of Israeli settlers transferred into the West Bank (including East Jerusalem) has increased dramatically from an estimated 247,000 at the time of the Oslo Accords,136 to over 700,000 in 2023.137 The Prosecutor of the International Criminal Court (‘ICC’) has determined that there is “a reasonable basis to believe” that “members of the Israeli authorities have committed war crimes… in relation, inter alia, to the transfer of Israeli civilians into the West Bank.138
34. The United Nations Special Rapporteur on the situation of human rights in the Palestinian territories occupied since 1967, described the situation in the West Bank as follows:
“53. …There, the Palestinians are subject to a harsh and arbitrary legal system quite unequal to that enjoyed by the Israeli settlers. Much of the West Bank is off-limits to Palestinians, and they regularly endure significant restrictions on their freedom of movement through closures, roadblocks, and the need for hard-to-obtain travel permits. 54. Access to the natural resources of the occupied territory, especially to water, is disproportionately allocated to Israel and the settlers. Similarly, the planning system administered by the occupying power for housing and commercial development throughout the West Bank, including East Jerusalem, is deeply discriminatory in favour of settlement construction, while imposing significant barriers on Palestinians, including ongoing land confiscation, home demolitions and the denial of building permits. Israel employs practices that in some cases may amount to the forcible transfer of Palestinians, primarily those living in rural areas, as a means of confiscating land for settlements, military weapons training areas and other uses exclusive to the occupying power that have little or nothing to do with its legitimate security requirements. 55. As for East Jerusalem, the occupation has increasingly detached it from its traditional national, economic, cultural and family connections with the West Bank because of the wall, the growing ring of settlements and related checkpoints, and the discriminatory permit regime. It is neglected by the municipality in terms of services and infrastructure, the occupation has depleted its economy and the Palestinians have only a small land area on which to build housing.”139
35, The institutionalised regime of discriminatory laws, policies and practices applied by Israel subjects Palestinians to what constitutes an apartheid regime.140 Palestinians in the West Bank are contained behind a segregating Wall, subjected to: discriminatory land zoning and planning policies; punitive and administrative house demolitions;141 violent Israeli army incursions into Palestinian villages, towns, cities and refugee camps, including in Area A;142 routine violent Israeli raids on their homes; arbitrary arrests and indefinitely renewable administrative detention (internment without trial); and a dual legal system pursuant to which Palestinians are tried under Israeli military legislation in Israeli military courts, without basic protections of international humanitarian and human rights law, while Israeli settlers living in the same territory are subject to a different legal regime, and tried in Israeli civilian courts with full due process.143 36. Palestinians in the West Bank are also subjected to routine violence by Israeli soldiers and armed settlers. Prior to 7 October 2023, between 1 January and 6 October 2023, 199 Palestinians had been killed by Israeli soldiers or settlers in the West Bank and 9,000 more had been injured.144 By September 2023, Save the Children had already declared 2023 the deadliest year for Palestinian children in the West Bank since 2005 with at least 38 Palestinian children having been killed.145 Since 7 October 2023, a further 295 Palestinians, including 77 children, have been killed by Israeli soldiers and settlers, and a further 3,803, including 576 children, wounded — many seriously.146 A total of 495 Palestinians have been killed in total in the West Bank, making it “the deadliest year for Palestinians” since 2005.147
37. In a wave of arbitrary mass arrests, Israel has detained more than 3,000 Palestinians from the West Bank and East Jerusalem, including for social media posts relating to the situation in Gaza.148 Israel significantly increased the number of Palestinians held in administrative detention, without charge or trial, to 2070.149 Thousands of Palestinians from Gaza working in Israel were also arbitrarily arrested and detained, with 3,200 being forcibly returned to Gaza on 3 November 2023 into intense full scale bombardments. Reports that the Palestinian labourers were mistreated on arrest and subjected to physical violence, abuse and humiliation are widespread.150 Many Palestinian adult and child detainees from the West Bank released in exchange for Israeli hostages report also severe ill-treatment, serious beatings and other outrages to personal dignity since 7 October 2023 in particular, alongside restrictions on access to food, water, medical treatment, and electricity in Israeli detention.151 Six Palestinian detainees from the West Bank have died in Israeli custody since 7 October 2023, in particular.152 19 Israeli prison guards were reportedly questioned for beating to death one of the prisoners, Tha’er Abu Asab, in Ketziot Prison.153
38. Since 7 October 2023, Israeli forces have carried out airstrikes and military raids on refugee camps in the West Bank, killing many Palestinians, bulldozing roads, and imposing severe restrictions on movement.154 There have been 236 attacks on ‘healthcare’ — including hospitals — in the West Bank, with Israeli forces detaining health staff and ambulances and preventing ambulances from accessing the wounded.155 Armed Israeli settler attacks on Palestinians — overtly supported by Israeli politicians — have also escalated dramatically.156 Settlers — often accompanied by Israeli soldiers — have killed at least eight Palestinians and injured at least 85 others, instilling terror among Palestinians, especially farming communities, and damaging property.157 2,186 Palestinians in the West Bank, including 1,058 children, have been internally displaced since 7 October 2023 as a result of extreme Israeli settler violence, alongside punitive or administrative house demolitions carried out by the Israeli army and damage caused to homes during Israeli military raids and operations.158 The Prosecutor of the International Criminal Court indicated in December 2023 that he was “accelerating investigations” into Israeli settler attacks in the West Bank.159
39. Israel’s actions in the West Bank since 7 October 2023 — including its support for and failure to prevent or punish Israeli settlers for incitement and violence against Palestinians and Palestinian property, including the driving out of vulnerable Palestinian communities from their lands — are intrinsically connected to Israel’s actions in Gaza, and provide at the very least important context to Israel’s violations of the Genocide Convention.
Application instituting proceedings and Request for the indication of provisional measures (icj-cij.org)
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
C. Genocidal Acts Committed against the Palestinian People
43. This section provides an overview of the acts in which Israel has engaged that are genocidal in character, having regard to their nature, scope and context. These acts are ongoing, and ongoing in a conflict context, where Israel is deliberately imposing telecommunications blackouts on Gaza and restricting access by fact-finding bodies173 and the international media.174 At the same time Palestinian journalists are being killed at a rate significantly higher than has occurred in any conflict in the past 100 years. In the two months since 7 October 2023, the number of journalists killed already exceeded that of the entirety of World War II.175 Further detail will be provided regarding these acts over the course of these proceedings. However, such information as is available establishes that Israel: (1) is engaged in killing Palestinians in Gaza — including Palestinian children — in large numbers; (2) is causing serious bodily and mental harm to Palestinians in Gaza, including Palestinian children; and is inflicting on them conditions of life intended to bring about their destruction as a group. Those conditions include: (3) expulsions from homes and mass displacement, alongside the large-scale destruction of homes and residential areas; (4) deprivation of access to adequate food and water; (4) deprivation of access to adequate medical care; (5) deprivation of access to adequate shelter, clothes, hygiene and sanitation; and (6) the destruction of the life of the Palestinian people in Gaza; and (7) imposing measures intended to prevent Palestinian births.
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
87. Experts assess that the death toll from disease and hunger “could be multiples of that from fighting and air strikes”.388 Israeli is through its relentless attacks on the Palestinian healthcare system in Gaza is deliberately inflicting on Palestinians in Gaza conditions of life calculated to bring about their destruction.389 Writing in the British medical journal, The Lancet, a group of medics “highlight the health dimensions of violence resulting from the ongoing siege and attacks against Palestinians” rightly warning of a “grave risk of genocide against the Palestinian people”.390 7.
Destruction of Palestinian life in Gaza
88. On 16 November 2023, 15 United Nations Special Rapporteurs and 21 members of United Nations Working Groups, warning of a “genocide in the making” in Gaza, observed that the level of destruction that had by then taken place of “housing units, as well as hospitals, schools, mosques, bakeries, water pipes, sewage and electricity networks . . . threatens to make the continuation of Palestinian life in Gaza impossible”.391 As they note, Israel has in its bombing campaign against Gaza used “powerful weaponry with inherently indiscriminate impacts, resulting in a colossal death toll and destruction of life-sustaining infrastructure.”392 Israel has destroyed not only individual homes, houses, and whole apartment blocks; it has destroyed entire streets, and entire neighbourhoods: Shuja'iyya, a suburb of Gaza City, once home to approximately 110,000 Palestinians, appears to now be a vast wasteland, entirely flattened as far as the eye can see.393 Its shops, schools, vibrant market place, family homes, doctors clinics, historic streets and Ibn Uthman Mosque, and everything that once sustained Palestinian life there has been damaged or destroyed, along with so many of its people.394 Other areas in Gaza appear to have experienced a similar level of destruction, including Beit Hanoun,395 Beit Lahia,396 Gaza Old City,397 Al Rimal,398 and Nuseirat refugee camp in the South.399
89. Across Gaza, Israel has targeted the infrastructure and foundations of Palestinian life, deliberately creating conditions of life calculated to bring about the physical destruction of Palestinian people. In addition to the attacks previously cited on homes, neighbourhoods, hospitals, water systems, agricultural lands, bakeries and mills, Israel has also targeted the foundational civil system in Gaza. Israel has targeted the Palace of Justice, 400 — the main Palestinian court building in Gaza — housing the Palestinian Supreme Court, the Constitutional Court, the Court of Appeal, the Court of First Instance, the Administrative Court and the Magistrates’ Court, as well as an archive of court records and other historical files. Israel has also significantly damaged the Palestinian Legislative Council complex.401 It has targeted Gaza City’s Central Archive building, containing thousands of historical documents and national records dating back over 100 years, and forming an essential archive of Palestinian history, as well as more modern records for Gaza City’s urban development.402
90. Israel has left Gaza City’s main public library in ruins.403 It has also damaged or destroyed countless bookshops, publishing houses, libraries,404 and hundreds of educational facilities.405 Israel has targeted every one of Gaza’s four universities — including the Islamic University of Gaza, the oldest higher education institution in the territory, which has trained generations of doctors and engineers, amongst others, 406 — destroying campuses for the education of future generations of Palestinians in Gaza. Alongside so many others, Israel has killed leading Palestinian academics, including: Professor Sufian Tayeh, the President of the Islamic University — an award-winning physicist and UNESCO Chair of Astronomy, Astrophysics and Space Sciences in Palestine — who died, alongside his family, in an airstrike; Dr Ahmed Hamdi Abo Absa, Dean of the Software Engineering Department at the University of Palestine, reportedly shot dead by Israeli soldiers as he walked away, having been released from three days of enforced disappearance; and Professor Muhammad Eid Shabir, Professor of Immunology and Virology, and former President of the Islamic University of Gaza, and Professor Refaat Alareer, poet and Professor of Comparative Literature and Creative Writing at the Islamic University of Gaza, were both killed by Israel with members of their families. Professor Alareer was a co-founder of ‘We are Not Numbers’, a Palestinian youth project seeking to tell the stories behind otherwise impersonal accounts of Palestinians — and Palestinian deaths — in the news.407
91. Israel has damaged and destroyed numerous centres of Palestinian learning and culture, including: the Al Zafar Dmari Mosque and Center for Manuscripts and Ancient Documents;408 the Orthodox Cultural Centre; the Al Qarara Cultural Museum; the Gaza Centre for Culture and Arts; the Arab Social Cultural Centre; the Hakawi Society for Culture and Arts; and the Rafah Museum — Gaza's newly opened museum of Palestinian heritage, housing hundreds of cultural and archaeological artefacts. Israel’s attacks have destroyed Gaza’s ancient history: eight sites have been damaged or destroyed, including the ancient port of Gaza (known as ‘Anthedon Harbour’ or ‘Al Balakhiya’) — the archaeological site of a 2,000-year-old Roman cemetery listed on both the Islamic Heritage List and the tentative UNESCO World Heritage List. 409 Israel has also destroyed Gaza City’s ‘Old City’, including its 146-year-old historic houses, mosques, churches, markets and schools. It has also destroyed Gaza’s more recent history of more hopeful times, including the Rashad al-Shawa Cultural Center — site of a historic meeting between United States President Bill Clinton and Palestinian President Yasser Arafat 25 years ago — and an important cultural hub for Palestinians in Gaza, with its theatre, library and event space.410 And Israel is destroying Gaza’s future academic and cultural potential: alongside the 352 Palestinian schools it has damaged or destroyed,411 the 4,037 students and 209 teachers and educational staff it has killed, alongside the other 7,259 students and 619 teachers it has injured.412
92. Israel has damaged or destroyed an estimated 318 Muslim and Christian religious sites, demolishing the places where Palestinians have worshipped for generations.413 These include the Great Omari Mosque, originally a fifth century Byzantine church, an iconic landmark of Gaza’s history, architecture and cultural heritage, and a place of worship by Christians and Muslims for over 1,000 years.414 Israeli shelling has also damaged the Church of Saint Porphyrius, founded in 425 AD and believed to be the third oldest church in the world — alongside two other churches that have sustained direct Israeli fire. 415 Gaza’s Christians themselves have been targeted and killed by Israel in the very church compounds where they sought shelter.416
93. Along with its destruction of the physical monuments to the history and heritage of the Palestinians in Gaza, Israel has sought to destroy the very Palestinian people who form and create that heritage: Gaza’s celebrated journalists, its teachers, intellectuals and public figures, its doctors and nurses, its film-makers, writers and singers, the directors and deans of its universities, the heads of its hospitals, its eminent scientists, linguists, playwrights, novelists, artists and musicians. Israel has killed and is killing Palestinian story-tellers and poets, Palestinian farmers and fishermen, alongside Gaza’s local legends: pastry chef Masoud Muhammad al-Qatati, killed in an Israeli airstrike on his house on 3 November 2023, whose shop’s motto ‘let the poor eat’ — and reputation for giving away the popular Palestinian treat ‘knafeh’ to indigent customers — earned him the nickname ‘Father of the Poor’; 84- year-old Elham Farah, from one of Palestine’s oldest Christian families — a reputed accordionist and music teacher, known as ‘Mother Orange’ to generations of Palestinian music students for her shock of red hair, 417 — shot dead by an Israeli sniper outside the Holy Family Church in Gaza City when she returned home for warm clothes, and was left to bleed to death;418 and Al-Shaima Saidam, the student with the highest final high school exam grades in the whole of Palestine, killed with multiple members of her family in a strike on Al Nuseirat refugee camp.419 Just as Israel is destroying the official memory and records of Palestinians in Gaza through its destruction of Gaza’s archives and landmarks, it is obliterating Palestinian personal lives and private memories, histories and futures, through bombing and bulldozing graveyards,420 destroying family records and photographs, wiping out entire multigenerational families,421 and killing, maiming and traumatising a generation of children.422 As a Palestinian man, in a video by UNRWA, succinctly sums up: “These are all our memories, our entire lives . . . Now it’s all gone; everything has turned into ashes.”423
94. The Israeli army — erecting the Israeli flag over the wreckage of devastated Palestinian homes, towns and cities, including in Gaza City’s Palestine Square itself,424 and spurred on by calls from within the Israeli government and without to ‘flatten Gaza’ and re-establish Israeli settlements on the rubble of Palestinian homes, 425 — is destroying the very fabric and basis of Palestinian life in Gaza. Israel is thereby deliberately inflicting on the Palestinian group in Gaza conditions of life calculated to bring about its destruction.
Application instituting proceedings and Request for the indication of provisional measures (icj-cij.org)
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
Israeli Army reservist “motivational speech”:
On 11 October 2023, 95-year old Israeli army reservist Ezra Yachin — a veteran of the Deir Yassin massacre during the 1948 Nakba — reportedly called up for reserve duty to “boost morale” amongst Israeli troops ahead of the ground invasion, was broadcast on social media inciting other soldiers to genocide as follows, while being driven around in an Israeli army vehicle, dressed in Israeli army fatigues: “Be triumphant and finish them off and don’t leave anyone behind. Erase the memory of them. Erase them, their families, mothers and children. These animals can no longer live . . . Every Jew with a weapon should go out and kill them. If you have an Arab neighbour, don't wait, go to his home and shoot him . . . We want to invade, not like before, we want to enter and destroy what’s in front of us, and destroy houses, then destroy the one after it. With all of our forces, complete destruction, enter and destroy. As you can see, we will witness things we’ve never dreamed of. Let them drop bombs on them and erase them.”477
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
The kind of language used here just makes me convinced that no one is here to learn or teach, just to prove themselves right and to walk away a bit more smug than they arrived here. Not dissimilar to the state of discourse away from this forum either. Discourse is either venom spewed at your opponents or a circle jerk with those you agree with at this point.
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
I implore everyone to read South Africa’s complaint. It’s only 85 pages, much of which is footnoted sources. But I’m sure most on here can’t “be bothered.”
Should we not call what Nazi Germany did a “holocaust” because it wasn’t fully successful or because we risk coming across as a “bit more smug?” The “smugness” is calling what is happening in Palestine just another conflict or “war is hell” and have we, collectively, and particularly the West, not learned a fucking thing?
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.
I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
As far as being “right” goes, I have yet to see any posts disputing what South Africa has alleged or anyone defending Israel except for “Hamas or ‘they’ started it”, continuing to conflate the Palestinian people as one complete terrorist organization as Israeli leadership, press and some of the public profess. Guess I’m “right?”
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
it’s a bit rich, considering the Jews are the victims of ethic cleansing unlike any other, from Hitler to the Romans.
are the Israelis going door to door and pulling Palestinians from their home, putting them in concentration camps and killing six million of them?
about 20% of Israel’s population IS Palestinian. Inside Israel. Is Israel going door to door, pulling Palestinian parents from babies inside Israel and sending the parents to the gas chambers?
@kat, please shut this topic down permanently
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
do you believe that the october attack was in response to the policies of the israeli government?
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Like Hillel, trying to shut down discussion and keep the truth from being known as if Israel is nothing but an innocent victim from 1947, and particularly since 1967, onward.
Unlike you, I can separate the Jewish religion from the State of Israel and the current Zionists running things, and I certainly don’t condemn all Jews for the actions of their recognized state of Israel.
Tell me, do the 250,000 Palestinians in Israel proper enjoy the full rights and benefits of it Jewish citizens? Are they considered and treated as equals?:
In Israel proper, Palestinians constitute almost 21 percent of the population as part of its Arab citizens. Many are Palestinian refugees or internally displaced Palestinians, including more than a million in the Gaza Strip, around 750,000 in the West Bank, and around 250,000 in Israel proper.
We know how Palestinians are treated in Gaza and the West Bank.
I’ll ask you again, knowing you won’t answer, how many dead Palestinians will it take to avenge Israel’s losses on 10/07/2023?
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
Did Bibi look the other way and support Hamas to prevent a two state or sharing of a single state solution and contribute to what happened on 10/07? Seems so based on past statements made by him and his Zionist supporters. Was it intentional? Question remains but certainly bears partial responsibility for the funding approval and ignorance of what was occurring and his government’s collective complacency. Not to mention 20+ years of land seizures and Israeli settler attacks in the West Bank.
One would think that knowing the history of Nazi germany, what occurred and the history of the Jews from the Romans to Hitler that they would be the last people to commit genocide (South Africa’s accusation and feel free to argue about what is and has happened in Gaza and the West Bank is not). Because they have suffered does not give them a pass or carte Blanche to committing military actions that result in the same outcome. Whether it’s 2000 lbs bombs dropped on apartment complexes, artillery barrages, sniper fire or house to house raids, forced evacuations and detainments without charge, collectively, it amounts to the same thing. Again, I refer you to South Africa’s court filing.
Did Russia invade Ukraine and commit war crimes? Absolutely. Should Putin on the ritz be held accountable? Absolutely. Does it disturb me as much as what is happening to the Palestinians? Absolutely. The difference? Ukraine has a standing army, western arms and support and seems to be holding their own under a government of their choosing and from within their recognized borders. What do the Palestinians have? A terrorist organization that has successfully convinced you and others that all Palestinians in Gaza are terrorists and deserve to be slaughtered. And not much else.
Let’s not forget the Chinese suppression and ethnic cleansing of the Uyghurs and Myanmar’s same of the Rohingya. Regardless of the perpetrators and victims, genocide and ethnic cleansing are always unacceptable and they all bother my conscience.
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
If you can admit that Putin on the ritz and Russia, Russia, Russia should be accused of war crimes and ethnic cleansing and held accountable, then surely you can admit that BiBi and Israel should be accused of war crimes and held accountable. Maybe you chose the wrong comparison?
Per the Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Human Rights, as of November 21, 2023 “At least 10,000 civilians, including more than 560 children, have been killed and over 18,500 have been injured since Russia launched its a full-scale armed attack against Ukraine on 24 February 2022 ...”
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
and hundreds of thousands kidnapped children too....
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
JERUSALEM (AP) — Now 100 days old, the latest Israel-Hamas war is by far the longest, bloodiest, and most destructive conflict between the bitter enemies.
The fighting erupted on Oct. 7 when Hamas carried out a deadly attack in southern Israel. Since then, Israel has relentlessly pounded the Gaza Strip with airstrikes and a ground offensive that have wrought unprecedented destruction, flattening entire neighborhoods. The offensive has displaced the vast majority of Palestinians in Gaza, shuttered operations in more than half of Gaza's hospitals and caused widespread hunger, U.N. monitors say.
The Israeli military says it has now scaled back operations in the hard-hit north. But in the south, where it says Hamas' leaders are hiding, it presses forward at full strength. Meanwhile, Lebanon's Hezbollah militia and Israel have engaged in cross-border skirmishes nearly every day since the war began.
Here’s a look in numbers at the toll of the Israel-Hamas war, sourced from Palestinian Health Ministry and Israeli officials as well as international observers and aid groups.
TOTAL DEATHS
Number of Palestinians killed in Gaza: 23,843
Number of people killed in Israel: more than 1,200
Number of Palestinians killed in the West Bank: 347
CIVILIANS
Civilians killed in Gaza: The civilian toll of the war is unknown, with women and minors making up an estimated two-thirds of those killed
Number of civilians killed in Israel on Oct. 7: 790
U.N. staff killed in Gaza: 148
Health workers killed in Gaza: at least 337
Journalists killed in Gaza: 82
SOLDIERS/MILITANTS
Number of Israeli soldiers killed on Oct. 7: 314
Number of militants killed by Israel: Over 8,000
Number of Israeli soldiers killed in the Gaza ground offensive: 188
Number of Israeli soldiers killed on the northern front: 9
Number of Israeli soldiers killed by friendly fire or “accidents” in Gaza and the north: 29
DESTRUCTION/HUMANITARIAN SITUATION IN GAZA
Percentage of Gaza’s buildings likely damaged/destroyed: 45-56%
Hospitals in Gaza partially functioning: 15/36
Palestinian civilians facing “catastrophic hunger and starvation”: 576,600 (26% of the population)
Percentage of school buildings in Gaza damaged: over 69%
Mosques damaged: 142
Churches damaged: 3
Ambulances damaged: 121
Students out of school: 625,000 (100% of students)
INJURIES
Palestinians injured in Gaza: 60,005
Palestinians injured in West Bank: more than 4,000
Total Israeli injuries: 12,536
Israeli soldiers injured in ground offensive: 1,085
Israeli soldiers injured since Oct. 7: 2,496
DISPLACEMENT
Number of Palestinians displaced in Gaza: 1.9 million (85% of Gaza’s population)
Number of Israelis displaced from northern and southern border communities: 249,263 (2.6% of the population)
HOSTAGES/PRISONERS
Hostages taken by Hamas on Oct. 7: 253
Hostages released: 121
Hostages taken Oct. 7 who remain in the strip: 132
1. 111 men, 19 women, 2 children2. 121 Israelis, 11 foreign nationals
Hostages who were killed or died in Hamas captivity: 33
Palestinian prisoners released during weeklong pause in fighting: 240
MUNITIONS
Number of rockets launched toward Israel: 14,000
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14