I don't think this whole Indiana debacle has anything to do with discrimination. A business cannot refuse services to someone simply because of their religion, age, sex, sexual orientation, race, etc... This all started from the bakery that didn't want to make a cake for a gay wedding. The baker wasn't comfortable with providing services for an event that conflicts with his/her religious or moral beliefs. So go to another bakery. Boycott them. They'll probably go out of business. What that law was about was to give the business owner the right to defend their actions in court and nothing else. It doesn't make it legal to discriminate against gay people.
That's a cop out argument. It's still discrimination. I don't remember seeing anything in the bible about making a cake for a gay wedding.
You can word it however you want. The bottom line is that it's discrimination. And this law provides business's an Avenue to do it legally.
And you can word it however you want... Including saying you didn't see anything in the bible about gay wedding cakes.
It's not a cop out argument. It's not discrimination. Understand the law. This law in no way provides an avenue to discriminate. Discrimination is still illegal. So go ahead and pretend you are advocating for the rights of gay people. You are missing the point, in my opinion.
I understand the law clearly. It allows bigots not to get sued because they feel that a gay persons dollar will infect them in some way or infringe upon their right to believe in an invisible man in the sky.
You are missing the point, you can probably find it in the 1950s.
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mickeyrat
up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 35,906
the law has been amended already to include nondiscrimination language. So really the seeming intended intent has been neutered.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
I just love it when assholes like some of these Republicans do shit like this it just makes them look fucking pathetic ....
Definitely... It makes it hard to imagine a Republican president. Of course, Hillary makes it a possibility lol shes a bit of a Romneyish character in that she doesn't have many friends among the moderates.
I just love it when assholes like some of these Republicans do shit like this it just makes them look fucking pathetic ....
Definitely... It makes it hard to imagine a Republican president. Of course, Hillary makes it a possibility lol shes a bit of a Romneyish character in that she doesn't have many friends among the moderates.
The republican candidates will force people to flock to Hillary or whatever Dem rather than elect a nutso republican...
Of course they won't be boycotted. People only care about what christian conservatives do.
It never even occured to me to compartmentalize these bigots actually. In couldn't care less what religion is dictating their bigotry.
I don't understand why people keep bringing up gay rights in the middle east when discussing this btw. This is happen in America, where the laws actually are supposed to protect equality for all.
The guy in that video is full of shit btw.
I just see the LGTB going after the easier target of Christians. Why not target all the religions that do not agree with their way of life?
Not just LGTB going after Christians, it's many Americans. This whole "gays are perverse and choose to be gay" is utterly nuts. Then how this all stinks of simple discrimination, many more Americans are chiming in with support. So it's not LGTB driven it's Human Decency driven.
Yes other religions/beliefs suck, but I'm American and I have to live with this shit and will call it out.
Of course they won't be boycotted. People only care about what christian conservatives do.
It never even occured to me to compartmentalize these bigots actually. In couldn't care less what religion is dictating their bigotry.
I don't understand why people keep bringing up gay rights in the middle east when discussing this btw. This is happen in America, where the laws actually are supposed to protect equality for all.
The guy in that video is full of shit btw.
I just see the LGTB going after the easier target of Christians. Why not target all the religions that do not agree with their way of life?
And you know Christians make themselves targets. Need to reassess what's important and maybe question their holy scripture.
Of course they won't be boycotted. People only care about what christian conservatives do.
It never even occured to me to compartmentalize these bigots actually. In couldn't care less what religion is dictating their bigotry.
I don't understand why people keep bringing up gay rights in the middle east when discussing this btw. This is happen in America, where the laws actually are supposed to protect equality for all.
The guy in that video is full of shit btw.
I just see the LGTB going after the easier target of Christians. Why not target all the religions that do not agree with their way of life?
And you know Christians make themselves targets. Need to reassess what's important and maybe question their holy scripture.
This reminds me of a point I haven't seen addressed here or anywhere else. If Christian bigots weren't so vocal they could easily get away with discrimination. Don't want to provide service for a same-sex wedding? Just tell them you are booked! Weddings are time sensitive and usually seasonal, services get booked and people have to make other plans. Happens all the time, but, since Christians have to blab about their fables and their superiority so much, trouble arises.
Of course they won't be boycotted. People only care about what christian conservatives do.
It never even occured to me to compartmentalize these bigots actually. In couldn't care less what religion is dictating their bigotry.
I don't understand why people keep bringing up gay rights in the middle east when discussing this btw. This is happen in America, where the laws actually are supposed to protect equality for all.
The guy in that video is full of shit btw.
I just see the LGTB going after the easier target of Christians. Why not target all the religions that do not agree with their way of life?
And you know Christians make themselves targets. Need to reassess what's important and maybe question their holy scripture.
This reminds me of a point I haven't seen addressed here or anywhere else. If Christian bigots weren't so vocal they could easily get away with discrimination. Don't want to provide service for a same-sex wedding? Just tell them you are booked! Weddings are time sensitive and usually seasonal, services get booked and people have to make other plans. Happens all the time, but, since Christians have to blab about their fables and their superiority so much, trouble arises.
That's what I've told people. If you don't want to, dont. Just don't tell them no because they're gay. It's really that easy.
Look I voted for gay marriage and could care less what people do. If you don't want to feed people food your business makes that's money out of your pocket. I really don't know why they choose to act like that but it's there choice. I will admit I'm "bigoted" I guess . I'm not sure how I feel about transgender. I can see loving someone of the same sex but I think it's weird switching sexes but again to each their own.
96 Randall's Island II
98 CAA
00 Virginia Beach;Camden I; Jones Beach III
05 Borgata Night I; Wachovia Center
06 Letterman Show; Webcast (guy in blue shirt), Camden I; DC
08 Camden I; Camden II; DC
09 Phillie III
10 MSG II
13 Wrigley Field
16 Phillie II
I don't think this whole Indiana debacle has anything to do with discrimination. A business cannot refuse services to someone simply because of their religion, age, sex, sexual orientation, race, etc... This all started from the bakery that didn't want to make a cake for a gay wedding. The baker wasn't comfortable with providing services for an event that conflicts with his/her religious or moral beliefs. So go to another bakery. Boycott them. They'll probably go out of business. What that law was about was to give the business owner the right to defend their actions in court and nothing else. It doesn't make it legal to discriminate against gay people.
That's a cop out argument. It's still discrimination. I don't remember seeing anything in the bible about making a cake for a gay wedding.
You can word it however you want. The bottom line is that it's discrimination. And this law provides business's an Avenue to do it legally.
And you can word it however you want... Including saying you didn't see anything in the bible about gay wedding cakes.
It's not a cop out argument. It's not discrimination. Understand the law. This law in no way provides an avenue to discriminate. Discrimination is still illegal. So go ahead and pretend you are advocating for the rights of gay people. You are missing the point, in my opinion.
I understand the law clearly. It allows bigots not to get sued because they feel that a gay persons dollar will infect them in some way or infringe upon their right to believe in an invisible man in the sky.
You are missing the point, you can probably find it in the 1950s.
OK so I went back to the 50's and my point was right where you said it would be. It turns out it is still applicable today. You have a right to practice freedom of religion in this country. You have a right to provide or deny services to whomever so long as it does not constitute discrimination. It should just stop there.
You would rather they just lie about the real reason they don't want to provide services? Just make up a story?
There does not need to be additional talk about a gay mans dollar infecting anyone. You made that up and that is crazy talk. Maybe the business owner would prefer to not participate in a transaction that goes against what he believes. He has the choice and he doesn't need you to guide him. Although, I will admit I have a hard time understanding why someone would have a hard time baking a cake for a gay wedding, I respect choice.
By the way, this type of thinking is not unique to those who believe in " an invisible man in the sky ".
I can't quote the above otherwise I will get called a troll and possibly get thrown in jail again for harassment.
But J1 your argument has no basis since you are on the fence. You bring no points to the table. Pro-choice is the only way to live. Anti-choice is not. The gay mans dollar is not made up nor is it crazy talk.
AMT has too many fence sitters causing shit with no opinion. Make a decision and stand by it or don't talk.
You said "Although, I will admit I have a hard time understanding why someone would have a hard time baking a cake for a gay wedding, I respect choice." - That is fence sitting and causes shit on both sides. That is not an opinion and causes divide.
So, the gay mans dollar is not made up. It happens and continues to happen while fence sitters continue.
Do something, get vocal, get active or shut up. Simon says sit down shut up you're out. Fence sitters. (Not you personally J1).
Another aspect that gets glossed over is the legitimacy (illegitimacy really) of Christianity being anti-gay to begin with. There are many laws to which Christians don't adhere (selling of children and treatment of slaves for instance) that are covered in much greater depth than the two paltry verses used to hate on gays. On top of that, there are dozens of verses which would require Christians to treat homosexuals with equal kindness and dignity, all of which are New Testament and therefore superseding the Old Testament gay hatin'.
Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
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hedonist
standing on the edge of forever Posts: 24,524
You would rather they just lie about the real reason they don't want to provide services? Just make up a story?
Nope, never - I'd rather true colors show, for better or worse.
As to PJfan...ease up a bit on the passive-aggressive nonsense, please. Everything is fine - no one sees you as a troll, you can quote to your heart's content, and I've never reported or flagged anything or anyone here. Mods can confirm.
Is it really only 8am?
*edit to mods - quote functions are a bit nutso this morning. FYI
I can't quote the above otherwise I will get called a troll and possibly get thrown in jail again for harassment.
But J1 your argument has no basis since you are on the fence. You bring no points to the table. Pro-choice is the only way to live. Anti-choice is not. The gay mans dollar is not made up nor is it crazy talk.
AMT has too many fence sitters causing shit with no opinion. Make a decision and stand by it or don't talk.
You said "Although, I will admit I have a hard time understanding why someone would have a hard time baking a cake for a gay wedding, I respect choice." - That is fence sitting and causes shit on both sides. That is not an opinion and causes divide.
So, the gay mans dollar is not made up. It happens and continues to happen while fence sitters continue.
Do something, get vocal, get active or shut up. Simon says sit down shut up you're out. Fence sitters. (Not you personally J1).
No, I don't think you're correct on this one. It is perfectly valid to not have a strong opinion on any particular topic. It's perfectly valid to see both sides, to wait for more information to come in, to see the grey instead of just the black or white.
(Note: I'm not arguing for this law or for discrimination)
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
^^^ I am not saying that one must have a strong opinion on any particular topic. I am merely saying that if one is always on the fence in the grey on a lot of matters or a singular important topic the grey zone increases to accommodate everyone and nothing gets solved. Seeing both sides is good on most things but some opinions should be automatic (for the better)
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You are missing the point, you can probably find it in the 1950s.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Yes other religions/beliefs suck, but I'm American and I have to live with this shit and will call it out.
http://www.tmz.com/2015/04/04/memories-pizza-money-donated-gofundme-indiana-gay-weddings/#disqus_thread
98 CAA
00 Virginia Beach;Camden I; Jones Beach III
05 Borgata Night I; Wachovia Center
06 Letterman Show; Webcast (guy in blue shirt), Camden I; DC
08 Camden I; Camden II; DC
09 Phillie III
10 MSG II
13 Wrigley Field
16 Phillie II
You would rather they just lie about the real reason they don't want to provide services? Just make up a story?
There does not need to be additional talk about a gay mans dollar infecting anyone. You made that up and that is crazy talk. Maybe the business owner would prefer to not participate in a transaction that goes against what he believes. He has the choice and he doesn't need you to guide him. Although, I will admit I have a hard time understanding why someone would have a hard time baking a cake for a gay wedding, I respect choice.
By the way, this type of thinking is not unique to those who believe in " an invisible man in the sky ".
Hi
I can't quote the above otherwise I will get called a troll and possibly get thrown in jail again for harassment.
But J1 your argument has no basis since you are on the fence.
You bring no points to the table.
Pro-choice is the only way to live. Anti-choice is not. The gay mans dollar is not made up nor is it crazy talk.
AMT has too many fence sitters causing shit with no opinion. Make a decision and stand by it or don't talk.
You said "Although, I will admit I have a hard time understanding why someone would have a hard time baking a cake for a gay wedding, I respect choice." - That is fence sitting and causes shit on both sides. That is not an opinion and causes divide.
So, the gay mans dollar is not made up. It happens and continues to happen while fence sitters continue.
Do something, get vocal, get active or shut up. Simon says sit down shut up you're out. Fence sitters. (Not you personally J1).
(Note: I'm not arguing for this law or for discrimination)
I am not saying that one must have a strong opinion on any particular topic.
I am merely saying that if one is always on the fence in the grey on a lot of matters or a singular important topic the grey zone increases to accommodate everyone and nothing gets solved.
Seeing both sides is good on most things but some opinions should be automatic (for the better)
ie- Stealing is wrong. No sides to see.
edit - grammar
edit - Start a philosophical thread to discuss stealing justification so we don't derail this one.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."