Student Loans / Debt

hedonist

Jason P said:

You will be making a lot more if you know how to run a welder compared to what most degrees offer and don't have to take on any debt.

One of the best parts is that training takes much less time to complete (and I assume learn on the job too).

I sound like one of those commercials

But I really do support learning a trade. You can take care of yourself, and your skill(s) will always be in demand.

The AC repair guys in Los Angeles are making a killing right now.

PJ_Soul

hedonist said:

Jason P said:

You will be making a lot more if you know how to run a welder compared to what most degrees offer and don't have to take on any debt.

One of the best parts is that training takes much less time to complete (and I assume learn on the job too).

I sound like one of those commercials

But I really do support learning a trade. You can take care of yourself, and your skill(s) will always be in demand.

The AC repair guys in Los Angeles are making a killing right now.

A lot of the trades actually take just as long to make decent money at as university does, and more. Apprenticeships and all that. I have a good friend who's a plumber/gas fitter and another who is an electrician and they both spent years doing the grunt work for and learning from older guys with experience and getting various certifications, etc. They make really great money now (they both take on apprentices themselves now). But it was a long haul to get there. Although there must be other trades that you can learn faster and make decent money sooner.

hedonist

Grunt work is necessary though; I mean, most people who make a good living now had to put their time in and work up from the bottom. With few exceptions, that would apply to the majority of professions. And learning from pros in the process? Invaluable!

The length of time though - is that particular to Canada? Seems it doesn't take as long here (and plumbers and electricians are in pretty high demand, probably always will be...so worth the investment).

FrankieG

oftenreading said:

FrankieG said:

I graduated college with student debt the size of a car loan. I have since payed it down to a smaller car loan. I never really thought about how much I would owe once I graduated. Not when I started, nor when I was in the middle of school. Only about 6 months before graduation did I know exactly how much I would owe. I consider myself lucky. I recieved alot of financial aide for my university. I applied for, and received a very significant amount of private scholarships. I saved my summer earnings to pay for part of the next year's tuition. I thought i was managing it well, but looking back, it could have turned out wayyy worse.

I have a younger cousin that is in high school, and I hope I can lead him in a direction away from student loans..

Was that a ferrari-sized car loan, or a kia-sized car loan??

) Definitely a Kia sized car loan, but that is sitll very substantial considering...

unsung

My girlfriend has a higher payment than my mortgage.

dignin

hedonist said:

Grunt work is necessary though; I mean, most people who make a good living now had to put their time in and work up from the bottom. With few exceptions, that would apply to the majority of professions. And learning from pros in the process? Invaluable!

The length of time though - is that particular to Canada? Seems it doesn't take as long here (and plumbers and electricians are in pretty high demand, probably always will be...so worth the investment).

In Canada most apprenticeships take 4 years. Source.....I'm a certified Journeyman welder.

lukin2006

Switzerland has one of the best education systems in the world and a lot of their system is apprenticeship based ... and they have one of the lowest youth unemployment rates.

Apprenticeships ensure that young people in Switzerland are employable

http://qz.com/122501/apprenticeships-make-young-people-in-switzerland-employable/

Walking the miles

dignin said:

hedonist said:

Grunt work is necessary though; I mean, most people who make a good living now had to put their time in and work up from the bottom. With few exceptions, that would apply to the majority of professions. And learning from pros in the process? Invaluable!

The length of time though - is that particular to Canada? Seems it doesn't take as long here (and plumbers and electricians are in pretty high demand, probably always will be...so worth the investment).

In Canada most apprenticeships take 4 years. Source.....I'm a certified Journeyman welder.

4 years sounds pretty good to me. I know a few people that are in the Trades and they do quite well. They weren't afraid to get dirty and work at it though. I've come to view Trades differently as I've gotten older. I had an opportunity to be in the gas fitter trade when I was younger, but didn't take it. That's the job my dad had. I wanted to do something different. I have no regrets, but looking back, I view it differently now. There is something to "An honest day's work".

FrankieG

unsung said:

My girlfriend has a higher payment than my mortgage.

:-O

rr165892

hedonist said:

Grunt work is necessary though; I mean, most people who make a good living now had to put their time in and work up from the bottom. With few exceptions, that would apply to the majority of professions. And learning from pros in the process? Invaluable!

The length of time though - is that particular to Canada? Seems it doesn't take as long here (and plumbers and electricians are in pretty high demand, probably always will be...so worth the investment).

Dead on Hedo!

PJ_Soul

rr165892 said:

hedonist said:

Grunt work is necessary though; I mean, most people who make a good living now had to put their time in and work up from the bottom. With few exceptions, that would apply to the majority of professions. And learning from pros in the process? Invaluable!

The length of time though - is that particular to Canada? Seems it doesn't take as long here (and plumbers and electricians are in pretty high demand, probably always will be...so worth the investment).

Dead on Hedo!

My friends who are in the trades do best financially out of all my friends (and myself) by far.
Definitely not for everyone though. And there is a sexual inequality problem in most trades, so that's a problem. I don't mean just that there are hardly any women in the trades (which is true). I mean that from everything I hear women are actually discriminated against when they enter the trades.

rgambs

The trades aren't without flaws either though. Some people are not willing to work 60 or more hours a week, you can buy anything but love and time, and since I have love I need time with my loves. The trades often (not always) require significant sacrifices that leave me thinking that Americans often care more about money than anything else.

JasonP the factory I quit is closing it's doors because it can't make money on so much forced OT. Graphic Packaging is no outlier, the big manufacturing corps are all going this route...maybe they want to drive them all under so they can relocate to the third world, I don't know, but it is not an isolated event for sure. I hope things stay reasonable where you are!

Jason P

Good points. And there is lots of travel involved in the trades as well. You have to be tough as nails to be an ironworker or millwright past the age of 50.

One thing trade schools and apprenticship should offer is life planning and money management courses (maybe they do). I see so many guys that get on a hot job making tons of O.T. for a good period of time just blow the money they make.

rgambs

Oh yeah, absolutely. First thing the frackers do is go buy a brand new truck for 30,000$. They live in hotels, drink, drug, and fast food themselves into oblivion, and are left with average salaries. Doesn't seem like living to me at all.

rr165892

PJ_Soul said:

rr165892 said:

hedonist said:

Grunt work is necessary though; I mean, most people who make a good living now had to put their time in and work up from the bottom. With few exceptions, that would apply to the majority of professions. And learning from pros in the process? Invaluable!

The length of time though - is that particular to Canada? Seems it doesn't take as long here (and plumbers and electricians are in pretty high demand, probably always will be...so worth the investment).

Dead on Hedo!

My friends who are in the trades do best financially out of all my friends (and myself) by far.
Definitely not for everyone though. And there is a sexual inequality problem in most trades, so that's a problem. I don't mean just that there are hardly any women in the trades (which is true). I mean that from everything I hear women are actually discriminated against when they enter the trades.

Hard work,but rewarding.For those that learn their craft,put in the time,and do exceptional work it can def lead to great salaries and comfortable living.
I dealt with the gender issue a month ago.A women applied with us for a job usually know as a mans position.(In our firm the office is all women and the field is all men).She was qualified,built to handle the physical nature of the position and hungry for the job.I was going to offer her the position but she had a bad driving record.so no go.But we had no issue with the gender.Her pay would have been dead even of that of a male in the same role.If you can do the job,more power to ya.

Jason P

rgambs said:

Oh yeah, absolutely. First thing the frackers do is go buy a brand new truck for 30,000$. They live in hotels, drink, drug, and fast food themselves into oblivion, and are left with average salaries. Doesn't seem like living to me at all.

Their skills will come in handy some day when NASA only has 18 days to train them to fly a space shuttle to an asteroid the size of Texas and drill 800 ft inside the asteroid and trigger a nuclear detonation that will split the asteroid in two, driving the pieces apart so both will fly safely past the Earth. Cause that's just science.

rgambs

Hahaha Steve Buschemi is the only thing that made me watch that one, that ugly sonofaB can make me tune into just about anything.

Jason P

rgambs said:

Hahaha Steve Buschemi is the only thing that made me watch that one, that ugly sonofaB can make me tune into just about anything.

And since this was a class photo, the circle has been completed and we are back to talking about students

PJ_Soul

rr165892 said:

PJ_Soul said:

rr165892 said:

hedonist said:

Grunt work is necessary though; I mean, most people who make a good living now had to put their time in and work up from the bottom. With few exceptions, that would apply to the majority of professions. And learning from pros in the process? Invaluable!

The length of time though - is that particular to Canada? Seems it doesn't take as long here (and plumbers and electricians are in pretty high demand, probably always will be...so worth the investment).

Dead on Hedo!

My friends who are in the trades do best financially out of all my friends (and myself) by far.
Definitely not for everyone though. And there is a sexual inequality problem in most trades, so that's a problem. I don't mean just that there are hardly any women in the trades (which is true). I mean that from everything I hear women are actually discriminated against when they enter the trades.

Hard work,but rewarding.For those that learn their craft,put in the time,and do exceptional work it can def lead to great salaries and comfortable living.
I dealt with the gender issue a month ago.A women applied with us for a job usually know as a mans position.(In our firm the office is all women and the field is all men).She was qualified,built to handle the physical nature of the position and hungry for the job.I was going to offer her the position but she had a bad driving record.so no go.But we had no issue with the gender.Her pay would have been dead even of that of a male in the same role.If you can do the job,more power to ya.

Too bad about her shitty driving, lol. Good for you that you would have otherwise been so open to it.... too bad so many others are not quite so enlightened (yet)!

PJ_Soul

Jason P said:

rgambs said:

Hahaha Steve Buschemi is the only thing that made me watch that one, that ugly sonofaB can make me tune into just about anything.

And since this was a class photo, the circle has been completed and we are back to talking about students

I wish he'd given us a nice toothy smile.