Great words. I'm sure people will twist it around as negative somehow... those people must work for Lockheed Martin
So the release clarifies what for those who were upset?
I agree that it does nothing to clarify the controversy. He basically continued his speech; let his words stand. He did make it clear it wasn't addressed to any one nation, but didn't absolve those who felt slighted. It seems like some people want a pass on their violence. He isn't biting. Good for him.
The simple way to silence a lot of the outrage is to place blame on Israel and Hamas for putting people in harms way.
Anti war... $$ wasted... Peace and love!
Done. Story over
Pretty much. Placing blame on both Israel and Hamas could be interpreted as taking back his words, and he was having none of it.
If his word offended someone's nationalist sensibilities, it might be time for a look in the mirror instead of lashing out.
Taking back his words? I thought he didn't reference that particular conflict? I'm confused...
The simple way to silence a lot of the outrage is to place blame on Israel and Hamas for putting people in harms way. .
Do you honestly believe that would silence any outrage? If anything that would only turn it up ten notches.
Yes. I honestly do.
why would it turn it up 10 notches? If he is anti-war and all-encompassing, like he said, then it's no big deal. Just say it.
He gave a broad anti-war speech that started this and people on both sides of one particular conflict lost their minds. I don't think assessing blame to both would stem the flow of their irrational thinking. Plus, it would give credibility to those who misinterpreted his original words.
I agree with everyone that this is well said and I'm sure everyone will agree it didn't even really need to be said as we fans know him. In fact I felt I've already said everything he wrote all week in defending him. I feel bad that it feels like the media possibly got to him and he felt the need to write this because the world needs more people like him speaking up; people with 100% pure goodness, hope, and faith in their hearts.
Great words. I'm sure people will twist it around as negative somehow... those people must work for Lockheed Martin
So the release clarifies what for those who were upset?
I agree that it does nothing to clarify the controversy. He basically continued his speech; let his words stand. He did make it clear it wasn't addressed to any one nation, but didn't absolve those who felt slighted. It seems like some people want a pass on their violence. He isn't biting. Good for him.
For those that were upset because they thought he was ripping on Israel during the show, I don't think the comments today are going to change their feelings. They either believe that Ed was talking in generalities during the show or not. The letter today was a general anti-war letter but that doesn't mean that the emotional, off-the-cuff speech during the show wasn't specific either.
This is just how I see it analytically. I don't care who Ed was talking about during the show. His point is spot on that it is insane that in 2014 there is so much unneccesary war and bloodshed going on in the world.
They aren't credible because they were offended by something that was never said. Both sides twisted his words to fit their own ideologies. I think placing blame on either or both side would have blown this up even further.
And Eddie is a guy who still has another show to play in Europe. This will have died down by October but not by Friday. He had to respond somehow.
People are being naive if they think his rant wasn't inspired by Israel/Palestine. It was the lead story on every news program the day he said this. But if he said anything about Israel/Palestine specifically, it would have taken away from the universality of his words. He did say many things that can be said about all 'dozen' conflicts, but when you talk about crossing borders and stealing land, it narrows the scope, and does point a finger at this as a cause of war. If the people who support crossing borders and stealing land are offended that they were called out...oh well. Again, good for him for not backing down from that. He speaks the truth.
How was playing Tel Aviv going to help? How would playing Tel Aviv help? Neil may have cancelled his show and pledged donations, but he did so only after a period of terrible publicity that the current conflict provided a ready-made excuse to mitigate. I like Neil, but I don't think he came out of this looking very good.
Neil Young did NOT cancel his show. The Israeli police cancelled it because of the unsafe conditions. Had it not been for the current violence, the show would have gone on...just as the Rolling Stones did, Justin Timberlake did, and many other of the biggest artists in the world.
Neil Young came out of it fine. He was unable to play the show but he issued an eloquent statement and made donations to worthy charities on both sides. No doubt he will be back in the future.
How was playing Tel Aviv going to help? How would playing Tel Aviv help? Neil may have cancelled his show and pledged donations, but he did so only after a period of terrible publicity that the current conflict provided a ready-made excuse to mitigate. I like Neil, but I don't think he came out of this looking very good.
I'm not sure that Neil canceled it for any other reason than safety or if it was even Neil's call. I would think any large gathering of people in Israel would be a target right now and would be canceled.
I don't know the reasoning either, just that the safety reason provided the perfect excuse to walk away from a show that was turning controversial. I'm sure there are/were legitimate safety concerns.
How was playing Tel Aviv going to help? How would playing Tel Aviv help? Neil may have cancelled his show and pledged donations, but he did so only after a period of terrible publicity that the current conflict provided a ready-made excuse to mitigate. I like Neil, but I don't think he came out of this looking very good.
Neil Young did NOT cancel his show. The Israeli police cancelled it because of the unsafe conditions. Had it not been for the current violence, the show would have gone on...just as the Rolling Stones did, Justin Timberlake did, and many other of the biggest artists in the world.
Neil Young came out of it fine. He was unable to play the show but he issued an eloquent statement and made donations to worthy charities on both sides. No doubt he will be back in the future.
Exactly my point. The conflict provided good cover for him to walk away from playing a controversial show. Maybe he will be back in the future, maybe he won't. But, if hostilities had not flared up like this in the days before his scheduled show, maybe he would have gone ahead and caved to outside pressure and cancelled. Maybe he would have gone ahead and played. We'll never know.
you know that 'oh noooo' feeling when one of your team scores an own goal? thats what this feels like... Ed had only two realistic options in all this. Say fuckin nothing and stand by it. Or nail his colours to the mast and instead name all the countries he meant and both would have gotten him grief but respect too for expanding on his rant(which i agreed with verbatim).
Instead he chose the worst option. He did an immense backpeddalling 'here's what I meant to say' and for that he's going to get shit from every direction. I love the guy and even I dont buy it. And it'll especially come from the pro Israel side. They're gonna dance all over him for this. He's basically backed down and now is going to be accused of being a coward as well as an anti Semite and all those other bullshit words those guys like throwing at anyone who disagrees with them. Shouldn't have opened his mouth to reply to it at all. heart was in the right place as always, but stand by it and own it, name and shame and expand to include al those countries(including his own) or say nothing and his point still would stand.
you know that 'oh noooo' feeling when one of your team scores an own goal? thats what this feels like... Ed had only two realistic options in all this. Say fuckin nothing and stand by it. Or nail his colours to the mast and instead name all the countries he meant and both would have gotten him grief but respect too for expanding on his rant(which i agreed with verbatim).
Instead he chose the worst option. He did an immense backpeddalling 'here's what I meant to say' and for that he's going to get shit from every direction. I love the guy and even I dont buy it. And it'll especially come from the pro Israel side. They're gonna dance all over him for this. He's basically backed down and now is going to be accused of being a coward as well as an anti Semite and all those other bullshit words those guys like throwing at anyone who disagrees with them. Shouldn't have opened his mouth to reply to it at all. heart was in the right place as always, but stand by it and own it, name and shame and expand to include al those countries(including his own) or say nothing and his point still would stand.
So well said, but no wonder. You always write beautifully. Your daughters are so very lucky to have you as a role model. I loved what you said at the concert,(seen footage on FB, and media). You were absolutely right and I thought saying at the concert was perfect. The more people the better, so many don't have a clue as to whats going on in the world, and many just don't care anyway, because it doesn't affect them personally. We all need more people like you! " War, what is it good for? Absolutely nothing" . Love ya Ed!
you know that 'oh noooo' feeling when one of your team scores an own goal? thats what this feels like... Ed had only two realistic options in all this. Say fuckin nothing and stand by it. Or nail his colours to the mast and instead name all the countries he meant and both would have gotten him grief but respect too for expanding on his rant(which i agreed with verbatim).
Instead he chose the worst option. He did an immense backpeddalling 'here's what I meant to say' and for that he's going to get shit from every direction. I love the guy and even I dont buy it. And it'll especially come from the pro Israel side. They're gonna dance all over him for this. He's basically backed down and now is going to be accused of being a coward as well as an anti Semite and all those other bullshit words those guys like throwing at anyone who disagrees with them. Shouldn't have opened his mouth to reply to it at all. heart was in the right place as always, but stand by it and own it, name and shame and expand to include al those countries(including his own) or say nothing and his point still would stand.
him replying to this was poorly advised.
"Call me naïve. I’d rather be naïve, heartfelt and hopeful than resigned to say nothing for fear of misinterpretation and retribution."
How was playing Tel Aviv going to help? How would playing Tel Aviv help? Neil may have cancelled his show and pledged donations, but he did so only after a period of terrible publicity that the current conflict provided a ready-made excuse to mitigate. I like Neil, but I don't think he came out of this looking very good.
Neil Young did NOT cancel his show. The Israeli police cancelled it because of the unsafe conditions. Had it not been for the current violence, the show would have gone on...just as the Rolling Stones did, Justin Timberlake did, and many other of the biggest artists in the world.
Neil Young came out of it fine. He was unable to play the show but he issued an eloquent statement and made donations to worthy charities on both sides. No doubt he will be back in the future.
Exactly my point. The conflict provided good cover for him to walk away from playing a controversial show. Maybe he will be back in the future, maybe he won't. But, if hostilities had not flared up like this in the days before his scheduled show, maybe he would have gone ahead and caved to outside pressure and cancelled. Maybe he would have gone ahead and played. We'll never know.
But we do know for sure. He did not walk away from the show. The Israeli authorities canceled it due to safety concerns. Otherwise, he was playing the show, something that had been repeatedly announced prior to the cancellation by Israeli authorities. Neil Young has played in Israel before (including with PJ minus Ed) and his statement makes it clear he will return. Roger Waters is an anti-Semite who, among other things, put the Star of David on a pig as a prop. It was clear for months that Neil Young was totally ignoring Waters on the issue, just as the Stones and countless others did. Waters finally went public against Young after he admitted that Neil was ignoring him.
you know that 'oh noooo' feeling when one of your team scores an own goal? thats what this feels like... Ed had only two realistic options in all this. Say fuckin nothing and stand by it. Or nail his colours to the mast and instead name all the countries he meant and both would have gotten him grief but respect too for expanding on his rant(which i agreed with verbatim).
Instead he chose the worst option. He did an immense backpeddalling 'here's what I meant to say' and for that he's going to get shit from every direction. I love the guy and even I dont buy it. And it'll especially come from the pro Israel side. They're gonna dance all over him for this. He's basically backed down and now is going to be accused of being a coward as well as an anti Semite and all those other bullshit words those guys like throwing at anyone who disagrees with them. Shouldn't have opened his mouth to reply to it at all. heart was in the right place as always, but stand by it and own it, name and shame and expand to include al those countries(including his own) or say nothing and his point still would stand.
him replying to this was poorly advised.
I don't think anyone thinks Eddie Vedder is anti-Semite. And if they did, his statement clearly shows he is not. There is a huge distinction between Ed and Roger Waters.
Roger Waters has used hateful rhetoric comparing Israel to the Nazis and suggesting they are conducting a second Holocaust (this is particularly ludicrous), put the Star of David on a pig as a prop, and is for a boycott that I don't even want to legitimize by actually discussing it seriously (fortunately the Rolling Stones, Neil Young, Justin Timberlake, and so many others do not take him seriously).
In the letter Ed says "call me naive" and I did just that the other day in talking to friends. Ed is clearly not a hater and I think today's letter shows that. Nobody should equate him with Roger Waters. But Ed has views that I disagree with and regard as overly-simplistic on this topic. Israel is surrounded by countries that would destroy it without a seconds hesitation if they could. Actions being taken now are extremely unfortunate but necessary, made abundantly clear by the fact that Hamas refused the cease fire that was proposed by the Egyptians. All civilian casualties are horrible and it is a moral quandary as Peres said yesterday but if Israel was really conducting themselves without any regard for civilians, tens of thousands of Palestinians would be dead, not 200.
you know that 'oh noooo' feeling when one of your team scores an own goal? thats what this feels like... Ed had only two realistic options in all this. Say fuckin nothing and stand by it. Or nail his colours to the mast and instead name all the countries he meant and both would have gotten him grief but respect too for expanding on his rant(which i agreed with verbatim).
Instead he chose the worst option. He did an immense backpeddalling 'here's what I meant to say' and for that he's going to get shit from every direction. I love the guy and even I dont buy it. And it'll especially come from the pro Israel side. They're gonna dance all over him for this. He's basically backed down and now is going to be accused of being a coward as well as an anti Semite and all those other bullshit words those guys like throwing at anyone who disagrees with them. Shouldn't have opened his mouth to reply to it at all. heart was in the right place as always, but stand by it and own it, name and shame and expand to include al those countries(including his own) or say nothing and his point still would stand.
him replying to this was poorly advised.
"Call me naïve. I’d rather be naïve, heartfelt and hopeful than resigned to say nothing for fear of misinterpretation and retribution."
to that, id ask who's job is it he wants? Bruce's or Bono's? we're all good for both, thanks. I'm with him 100% in his initial rant but the reply to the outcry was unnecessary completely. those people would rather not live in an open prison and in constant fear of imminent death, no amount of naivity good wishes or hope will alleviate that for them. even if it's from ed. and all us pj fans
I don't think anyone thinks Eddie Vedder is anti-Semite. And if they did, his statement clearly shows he is not. There is a huge distinction between Ed and Roger Waters.
Roger Waters has used hateful rhetoric comparing Israel to the Nazis and suggesting they are conducting a second Holocaust (this is particularly ludicrous), put the Star of David on a pig as a prop, and is for a boycott that I don't even want to legitimize by actually discussing it seriously (fortunately the Rolling Stones, Neil Young, Justin Timberlake, and so many others do not take him seriously).
In the letter Ed says "call me naive" and I did just that the other day in talking to friends. Ed is clearly not a hater and I think today's letter shows that. Nobody should equate him with Roger Waters. But Ed has views that I disagree with and regard as overly-simplistic on this topic. Israel is surrounded by countries that would destroy it without a seconds hesitation if they could. Actions being taken now are extremely unfortunate but necessary, made abundantly clear by the fact that Hamas refused the cease fire that was proposed by the Egyptians. All civilian casualties are horrible and it is a moral quandary as Peres said yesterday but if Israel was really conducting themselves without any regard for civilians, tens of thousands of Palestinians would be dead, not 200
This is exactly what I'm talking about. Because something ed said offended you, he is naive, and being overly simplistic with his views on this topic. He has yet to address this topic. Again - the only thing that could be interpreted as singling out Israel is the stealing land bit. What else could you find naive about his statement as it pertains to the conflict? You then openly legitimize the violence of only your side while condoning the other; you want a pass on your violence. Seems his speech was directed point blank at you, and others like you.
How was playing Tel Aviv going to help? How would playing Tel Aviv help? Neil may have cancelled his show and pledged donations, but he did so only after a period of terrible publicity that the current conflict provided a ready-made excuse to mitigate. I like Neil, but I don't think he came out of this looking very good.
Neil Young did NOT cancel his show. The Israeli police cancelled it because of the unsafe conditions. Had it not been for the current violence, the show would have gone on...just as the Rolling Stones did, Justin Timberlake did, and many other of the biggest artists in the world.
Neil Young came out of it fine. He was unable to play the show but he issued an eloquent statement and made donations to worthy charities on both sides. No doubt he will be back in the future.
Exactly my point. The conflict provided good cover for him to walk away from playing a controversial show. Maybe he will be back in the future, maybe he won't. But, if hostilities had not flared up like this in the days before his scheduled show, maybe he would have gone ahead and caved to outside pressure and cancelled. Maybe he would have gone ahead and played. We'll never know.
But we do know for sure. He did not walk away from the show. The Israeli authorities canceled it due to safety concerns. Otherwise, he was playing the show, something that had been repeatedly announced prior to the cancellation by Israeli authorities. Neil Young has played in Israel before (including with PJ minus Ed) and his statement makes it clear he will return. Roger Waters is an anti-Semite who, among other things, put the Star of David on a pig as a prop. It was clear for months that Neil Young was totally ignoring Waters on the issue, just as the Stones and countless others did. Waters finally went public against Young after he admitted that Neil was ignoring him.
I couldn't care less about Roger Waters. I also couldn't care less what the Israeli authorities say in this instance. I don't doubt there were legitimate security concerns and I don't doubt that is what cancelled the show. I simply question whether the show would indeed have gone on without those security concerns. As I said, it provided an easy way to walk away.
I'm not sure playing Israel in 1995 was as controversial on the world stage as playing there in 2014 is. Maybe Neil will be back and maybe he won't. Personally, I hope the day comes when he can go back and have it not be controversial, with no security concerns and no critics to labeled as anti-Semites.
___________________________________________
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
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hedonist
standing on the edge of forever Posts: 24,524
We had the privilege of see PJ at both Amsterdam shows and in Trieste. What my wife and I took away from the experience was meeting people... Yes, the music was magical, but the people we met from completely different backgrounds, countries.. etc.. coming together through music was the amazing. We made friendships that will carry on.... I learned a lot from just talking with people and I hope I passed on a little knowledge as well.
The fact that Eddie, Mike, Stone, Jeff, Matt, & Boom care and Eddie does speak out is one the reasons I've been a fan since Ten.
What amazes me is the backlash... Eddie has spoke out against war and guns for years.. Bushleager , Glorified G...hell lots of songs...?.... But now you're upset? I sense spin in the worse possible way... So people are upset about Eddie speaking out at a rock concert, but silent when people are being killed .... hmmmm I think those people that are upset should re-check priorities and remember People are DYING and your feelings are hurt from Eddie's words???? shame on you....
Keep talking Eddie. In Fact SHOUT... fuk'em
Post edited by myoung321 on
"The heart and mind are the true lens of the camera." - Yusuf Karsh
you know that 'oh noooo' feeling when one of your team scores an own goal? thats what this feels like... Ed had only two realistic options in all this. Say fuckin nothing and stand by it. Or nail his colours to the mast and instead name all the countries he meant and both would have gotten him grief but respect too for expanding on his rant(which i agreed with verbatim).
Instead he chose the worst option. He did an immense backpeddalling 'here's what I meant to say' and for that he's going to get shit from every direction. I love the guy and even I dont buy it. And it'll especially come from the pro Israel side. They're gonna dance all over him for this. He's basically backed down and now is going to be accused of being a coward as well as an anti Semite and all those other bullshit words those guys like throwing at anyone who disagrees with them. Shouldn't have opened his mouth to reply to it at all. heart was in the right place as always, but stand by it and own it, name and shame and expand to include al those countries(including his own) or say nothing and his point still would stand.
him replying to this was poorly advised.
I don't think anyone thinks Eddie Vedder is anti-Semite. And if they did, his statement clearly shows he is not. There is a huge distinction between Ed and Roger Waters.
Roger Waters has used hateful rhetoric comparing Israel to the Nazis and suggesting they are conducting a second Holocaust (this is particularly ludicrous), put the Star of David on a pig as a prop, and is for a boycott that I don't even want to legitimize by actually discussing it seriously (fortunately the Rolling Stones, Neil Young, Justin Timberlake, and so many others do not take him seriously).
In the letter Ed says "call me naive" and I did just that the other day in talking to friends. Ed is clearly not a hater and I think today's letter shows that. Nobody should equate him with Roger Waters. But Ed has views that I disagree with and regard as overly-simplistic on this topic. Israel is surrounded by countries that would destroy it without a seconds hesitation if they could. Actions being taken now are extremely unfortunate but necessary, made abundantly clear by the fact that Hamas refused the cease fire that was proposed by the Egyptians. All civilian casualties are horrible and it is a moral quandary as Peres said yesterday but if Israel was really conducting themselves without any regard for civilians, tens of thousands of Palestinians would be dead, not 200.
the last 5 or 6 lines of your post just made me wretch..
so it's neccessary? al this is neccassary? giving people a few minutes warning before a bomb takes their house and anyone in it out?
youre making excuses fella..this is genocide..no other way to descrbe it. Israel has the best equipped army in the world(The US still has the receipts thats why they wont get involved) against a few people on the ground fighting for their homeland back.,...you wouldnt fight back if it was your country?
I don't think anyone thinks Eddie Vedder is anti-Semite. And if they did, his statement clearly shows he is not. There is a huge distinction between Ed and Roger Waters.
Roger Waters has used hateful rhetoric comparing Israel to the Nazis and suggesting they are conducting a second Holocaust (this is particularly ludicrous), put the Star of David on a pig as a prop, and is for a boycott that I don't even want to legitimize by actually discussing it seriously (fortunately the Rolling Stones, Neil Young, Justin Timberlake, and so many others do not take him seriously).
In the letter Ed says "call me naive" and I did just that the other day in talking to friends. Ed is clearly not a hater and I think today's letter shows that. Nobody should equate him with Roger Waters. But Ed has views that I disagree with and regard as overly-simplistic on this topic. Israel is surrounded by countries that would destroy it without a seconds hesitation if they could. Actions being taken now are extremely unfortunate but necessary, made abundantly clear by the fact that Hamas refused the cease fire that was proposed by the Egyptians. All civilian casualties are horrible and it is a moral quandary as Peres said yesterday but if Israel was really conducting themselves without any regard for civilians, tens of thousands of Palestinians would be dead, not 200
This is exactly what I'm talking about. Because something ed said offended you, he is naive, and being overly simplistic with his views on this topic. He has yet to address this topic. Again - the only thing that could be interpreted as singling out Israel is the stealing land bit. What else could you find naive about his statement as it pertains to the conflict? You then openly legitimize the violence of only your side while condoning the other; you want a pass on your violence. Seems his speech was directed point blank at you, and others like you.
Your statements are absurd. There was a cease fire accepted by Israel the other day and Hamas fired 50 missiles into Israel instead of also agreeing to stop firing. I legitimize Israel's right to self defense, which incidentally President Obama stated again very clearly today as well. Hamas is causing the violence on their people by firing rockets from within the dense population and forcing Israel to respond and again, that response very much aims to minimize civilian casualties. Israel could level Gaza in an hour if they wanted to and there would be no more rockets fired into Israel. Nobody in Israel is interested in doing that.
I don't think anyone thinks Eddie Vedder is anti-Semite. And if they did, his statement clearly shows he is not. There is a huge distinction between Ed and Roger Waters.
Roger Waters has used hateful rhetoric comparing Israel to the Nazis and suggesting they are conducting a second Holocaust (this is particularly ludicrous), put the Star of David on a pig as a prop, and is for a boycott that I don't even want to legitimize by actually discussing it seriously (fortunately the Rolling Stones, Neil Young, Justin Timberlake, and so many others do not take him seriously).
In the letter Ed says "call me naive" and I did just that the other day in talking to friends. Ed is clearly not a hater and I think today's letter shows that. Nobody should equate him with Roger Waters. But Ed has views that I disagree with and regard as overly-simplistic on this topic. Israel is surrounded by countries that would destroy it without a seconds hesitation if they could. Actions being taken now are extremely unfortunate but necessary, made abundantly clear by the fact that Hamas refused the cease fire that was proposed by the Egyptians. All civilian casualties are horrible and it is a moral quandary as Peres said yesterday but if Israel was really conducting themselves without any regard for civilians, tens of thousands of Palestinians would be dead, not 200
This is exactly what I'm talking about. Because something ed said offended you, he is naive, and being overly simplistic with his views on this topic. He has yet to address this topic. Again - the only thing that could be interpreted as singling out Israel is the stealing land bit. What else could you find naive about his statement as it pertains to the conflict? You then openly legitimize the violence of only your side while condoning the other; you want a pass on your violence. Seems his speech was directed point blank at you, and others like you.
+1
I know I was born and I know that I'll die. The in between is mine.
I don't think anyone thinks Eddie Vedder is anti-Semite. And if they did, his statement clearly shows he is not. There is a huge distinction between Ed and Roger Waters.
Roger Waters has used hateful rhetoric comparing Israel to the Nazis and suggesting they are conducting a second Holocaust (this is particularly ludicrous), put the Star of David on a pig as a prop, and is for a boycott that I don't even want to legitimize by actually discussing it seriously (fortunately the Rolling Stones, Neil Young, Justin Timberlake, and so many others do not take him seriously).
In the letter Ed says "call me naive" and I did just that the other day in talking to friends. Ed is clearly not a hater and I think today's letter shows that. Nobody should equate him with Roger Waters. But Ed has views that I disagree with and regard as overly-simplistic on this topic. Israel is surrounded by countries that would destroy it without a seconds hesitation if they could. Actions being taken now are extremely unfortunate but necessary, made abundantly clear by the fact that Hamas refused the cease fire that was proposed by the Egyptians. All civilian casualties are horrible and it is a moral quandary as Peres said yesterday but if Israel was really conducting themselves without any regard for civilians, tens of thousands of Palestinians would be dead, not 200
This is exactly what I'm talking about. Because something ed said offended you, he is naive, and being overly simplistic with his views on this topic. He has yet to address this topic. Again - the only thing that could be interpreted as singling out Israel is the stealing land bit. What else could you find naive about his statement as it pertains to the conflict? You then openly legitimize the violence of only your side while condoning the other; you want a pass on your violence. Seems his speech was directed point blank at you, and others like you.
Your statements are absurd. There was a cease fire accepted by Israel the other day and Hamas fired 50 missiles into Israel instead of also agreeing to stop firing. I legitimize Israel's right to self defense, which incidentally President Obama stated again very clearly today as well. Hamas is causing the violence on their people by firing rockets from within the dense population and forcing Israel to respond and again, that response very much aims to minimize civilian casualties. Israel could level Gaza in an hour if they wanted to and there would be no more rockets fired into Israel. Nobody in Israel is interested in doing that.
I can rebuke every one of these Israeli government / hasbara talking points, but I unfortunately don't have the time at the moment, and I don't want this thread to get ugly - I'm sure the mods want to keep it stickied for a while. If anyone reading is interested in debunking these claims - human shields, the threat to Israel from Hamas missiles vs it's ridiculously disproportionate response, why the US supports israel dangerously and unconditionally, Israel's right to self defence < Palestine's right to self determination under international law, the ceasefire offers etc, it is all covered in threads in the moving train sub forum - just search each item.
Comments
2013- Brooklyn2, Philly1, Philly2, NOLA
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
This is just how I see it analytically. I don't care who Ed was talking about during the show. His point is spot on that it is insane that in 2014 there is so much unneccesary war and bloodshed going on in the world.
And for some reason, Eddie felt the need to respond to some level of pressure.
2013- Brooklyn2, Philly1, Philly2, NOLA
And Eddie is a guy who still has another show to play in Europe. This will have died down by October but not by Friday. He had to respond somehow.
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
Neil Young came out of it fine. He was unable to play the show but he issued an eloquent statement and made donations to worthy charities on both sides. No doubt he will be back in the future.
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
Ed's a genuine dude and it comes thru clearly.
We need more people speaking out against injustice
Ed had only two realistic options in all this. Say fuckin nothing and stand by it. Or nail his colours to the mast and instead name all the countries he meant and both would have gotten him grief but respect too for expanding on his rant(which i agreed with verbatim).
Instead he chose the worst option. He did an immense backpeddalling 'here's what I meant to say' and for that he's going to get shit from every direction. I love the guy and even I dont buy it. And it'll especially come from the pro Israel side. They're gonna dance all over him for this. He's basically backed down and now is going to be accused of being a coward as well as an anti Semite and all those other bullshit words those guys like throwing at anyone who disagrees with them. Shouldn't have opened his mouth to reply to it at all. heart was in the right place as always, but stand by it and own it, name and shame and expand to include al those countries(including his own) or say nothing and his point still would stand.
him replying to this was poorly advised.
I’d rather be naïve, heartfelt and hopeful than resigned to say
nothing for fear of misinterpretation and retribution."
Roger Waters has used hateful rhetoric comparing Israel to the Nazis and suggesting they are conducting a second Holocaust (this is particularly ludicrous), put the Star of David on a pig as a prop, and is for a boycott that I don't even want to legitimize by actually discussing it seriously (fortunately the Rolling Stones, Neil Young, Justin Timberlake, and so many others do not take him seriously).
In the letter Ed says "call me naive" and I did just that the other day in talking to friends. Ed is clearly not a hater and I think today's letter shows that. Nobody should equate him with Roger Waters. But Ed has views that I disagree with and regard as overly-simplistic on this topic. Israel is surrounded by countries that would destroy it without a seconds hesitation if they could. Actions being taken now are extremely unfortunate but necessary, made abundantly clear by the fact that Hamas refused the cease fire that was proposed by the Egyptians. All civilian casualties are horrible and it is a moral quandary as Peres said yesterday but if Israel was really conducting themselves without any regard for civilians, tens of thousands of Palestinians would be dead, not 200.
we're all good for both, thanks. I'm with him 100% in his initial rant but the reply to the outcry was unnecessary completely.
those people would rather not live in an open prison and in constant fear of imminent death, no amount of naivity good wishes or hope will alleviate that for them. even if it's from ed. and all us pj fans
This is exactly what I'm talking about. Because something ed said offended you, he is naive, and being overly simplistic with his views on this topic. He has yet to address this topic. Again - the only thing that could be interpreted as singling out Israel is the stealing land bit. What else could you find naive about his statement as it pertains to the conflict?
You then openly legitimize the violence of only your side while condoning the other; you want a pass on your violence. Seems his speech was directed point blank at you, and others like you.
I'm not sure playing Israel in 1995 was as controversial on the world stage as playing there in 2014 is. Maybe Neil will be back and maybe he won't. Personally, I hope the day comes when he can go back and have it not be controversial, with no security concerns and no critics to labeled as anti-Semites.
"...I changed by not changing at all..."
The fact that Eddie, Mike, Stone, Jeff, Matt, & Boom care and Eddie does speak out is one the reasons I've been a fan since Ten.
What amazes me is the backlash... Eddie has spoke out against war and guns for years.. Bushleager , Glorified G...hell lots of songs...?.... But now you're upset? I sense spin in the worse possible way... So people are upset about Eddie speaking out at a rock concert, but silent when people are being killed .... hmmmm I think those people that are upset should re-check priorities and remember People are DYING and your feelings are hurt from Eddie's words???? shame on you....
Keep talking Eddie. In Fact SHOUT... fuk'em
so it's neccessary? al this is neccassary? giving people a few minutes warning before a bomb takes their house and anyone in it out?
youre making excuses fella..this is genocide..no other way to descrbe it. Israel has the best equipped army in the world(The US still has the receipts thats why they wont get involved) against a few people on the ground fighting for their homeland back.,...you wouldnt fight back if it was your country?
nobody ever seems to be able to answer that