Thoughts on political stuff at shows

Vedder316

I was just driving home from work and the local radio station was just discussing the whole Ted Nugent thing where he bashed Obama at one of his shows and it got me to thinking. I attended 4 PJ shows in 2006, all which where awesome. At every show there was alot of discussion of George W, the war, Ann Coulter and even Fox News. All of the discussion was rather negative which sort of bothered me. Dont we hear enough of that shit EVERY WHERE in our normal day to day lives? I go to a concert to escape my normal day to day life. Even know I agree with most of whats being said and iam %100 in support of free speech I find it to be sort of a drag. I think the point can be displayed mighty well in a song Ala world wide suiciiiiiiiiiiide!!!!! I just feel it dampens the show. If you have a message or a feeling then sing/play about it. They could go on any tv radio or Internet site ect where its is more appropriate to discuss things like that. anytime they want. Or we could just hang out and B.S. (I WISH!!!) As Zappa once said "shut up and play your fucking guitars " Now with that said none of this will ever prevent me form seeing them, buying records ect. For they are the grandest band in the land. Thoughts??????

Paul

Hinny

Vedder316 wrote:

At every show there was alot of discussion of George W, the war, Ann Coulter and even Fox News.

...

Thoughts??????

Define 'a lot'.

dunkman

when Ed's chats about Bush during a bootleg for 3 minutes, i always think to myself.... fucker, you could have played Lukin 3 times!!!!!

Vedder316

Hinny wrote:

Define 'a lot'.

Carling Weekend Festival Leeds, Pittsburgh, Milwaukee, Cincinnati, Stanley's in Chicago, and the Gorge to name a few.

CJMST3K

dunkman wrote:

when Ed's chats about Bush during a bootleg for 3 minutes, i always think to myself.... fucker, you could have played Lukin 3 times!!!!!

nice.



pj determined at some point to become a political band. once bush was elected, it gave them lots of fodder.

i wonder what they would have written about if bush wasnt in the oval office.

...probably about flowers and rolling down hills on sunny days.

12345AGNST1

it gets a little repetitive but for the most part it doesnt bother me. when ed talks on stage it shows that he is a person. personally i love hearing all those sotries he tells onstage, id much rather him be like that then get onstage, do his job, and then say thank you godnight.

Pegasus

CJMST3K wrote:

nice.

pj determined at some point to become a political band. once bush was elected, it gave them lots of fodder.

i wonder what they would have written about if bush wasnt in the oval office.

...probably about flowers and rolling down hills on sunny days.

they've ALWAYS been a political band..just look at the MTV unplugged..

I have to admit that some of the speeches bore me, because many are just rants and not articulated arguments (which you don't have time to do at a concert), therefore not informing or convincing anyone.

I don't mind at all if Ed express political opinions in Print or TV forums (or the others; Ed gets the shit for what he says because he's got the mic more, but they all seem to share similar views when they get a chance to express them..and I'm sure they'd have got Ed to shut up at PJ gigs and events if they really disagreed) .

on particular local or precise points (like BP Amaco at Chicago for example), it can be useful though at gigs (even if it can't be fully discussed, it can point people to have a more detailed look..I wish they'd done the charity thing in Europe too, not just teh US..to raise awareness on local causes).

but 'Fuck Bush' is not going to push anyone torethink their position and is only pandering to people already agreeing (ok, can be fun occasionally...the W.M.A tag in Nijmegen cracked us up if only for the ':eek: did he just say that?!? ' element)

but to be really interesting, he needs to be making points, in a short time..and Ed is not the most 'to the point' person, bless him

Vedder316

When Eddie Just blurts out "W fuck you, and "Fox news Fuck you" ect with out a reason when he is ALWAYS talking about peace and love doesn't that make him a rather large hypocrite??? I miss the more fun loving PJ. Whats next pj opening for marilyn mansion? Come on theres enough hate in this world. It saddens me that PJ is sorta hading to it.

P

smile05

when Ed's chats about Bush during a bootleg for 3 minutes, i always think to myself.... fucker, you could have played Lukin 3 times!!!!!

reply of the day,couldnt of said it better myself

they wouldnt be PJ if they didnt have there political opinions but personally would sooner hear ANY other PJ song than something that sometimes oesnt concern me/the country they are playing in.

london wembley 96
manchester 00
berlin 06
london wembley 07

Hinny

Vedder316 wrote:

Carling Weekend Festival Leeds, Pittsburgh, Milwaukee, Cincinnati, Stanley's in Chicago, and the Gorge to name a few.

Yeah? And of the 140 minutes or thereabouts of each show, roughly how much time did he spend talking about the issues?

Kevin Davis

I don't deny his right to speak his mind politically, but I'd almost always rather hear music. He gets sounding a bit like the preacher in the pulpit sometimes, and sometimes it really messes up the vibe of the show. It's very easily dismissable, though, considering how rocking the rest of the show undoubtedly is.

eternalfan

dunkman wrote:

when Ed's chats about Bush during a bootleg for 3 minutes, i always think to myself.... fucker, you could have played Lukin 3 times!!!!!

eternalfan

Pegasus wrote:

they've ALWAYS been a political band..just look at the MTV unplugged..

I LOVE the fact they are trying to get ppl to pay attention to our world and issues. It's a part of them and should be a part of us. We CAN make a difference in our own way and why should they get up on stage and just play????
i recentley went to a concert and sat thorugh 3.5 hours of greatest hits/ improv's and NO COMMUNICATION from band members. IT SUCKED!

pjfan31

I like it. It is who he is as a person, and he is using his name and his position to pass a message on to the fans. In America where voting isn't compulsory (where is australia where i'm from it is) If he encourages one person or a thousand people to register to vote and get this arsehole out of office, then it has worked.

It would be irressponsible for eddie not to use a concert to pass the message. And if you have a problem witrh eddie doing this, I take it you have a problem with songs like No More and Bush leaguer.

Vedder316

Hinny wrote:

Yeah? And of the 140 minutes or thereabouts of each show, roughly how much time did he spend talking about the issues?

Iam not saying that he banters on and on. Iam just saying the negativity that Eddie displays sometimes in his messages just brings the show down a bit. It makes it seem like if you support Bush (which I proudly do) that iam an asshole and am not welcome there. And I do agree that I'll take 3 mins of Bashing for the best show money and spirit can buy. Good conversation as always here in the Pit.

I know this is off the subject but I'd love to see Eddie on The O'Reilly factor. A discussion/debate of two great minds.

Take care.

pajo

I don't mind the political stuff one bit. First of all, shows where there is no communication suck (for instance the recent Pixies shows where they put on a killer show music-wise but don't say a word) and make me feel as if the band is there just for 'work' (which they don't particulary like). Also, I don't think it is (or that it was ever) possible to separate PJ from politics so there's that as well.

And I personally can't understand this feeling 'we paid to hear your music, not Ed's political rants'. It seems to me (I'm not saying people who say that really feel that, I'm just saying it seems that way to me) that it's like saying 'I paid for a service and I want you to deliver'. And that just cannot be applied to a rock show (or not a good one), IMO.

StuartC

Although I am a conservative-leaning moderate, I actually don't mind the political rants too much. I like how they show that they care, and while they certainly advocate their liberal causes, more importantly they advocate just simply caring, and stress the importance of voting. If Eddie's political talk can convince a bunch of the people in a 40,000 plus crowd to get out and vote, it's worth it.

Also, I'd like to say that they should not talk American politics while touring abroad. The main reason being that the people probably just don't care, but also, I do not think Eddie should be including foreigners in a conversation about American politics. It is not their country to criticize, and as an American I don't appreciate Eddie instigating sour thoughts about my president and my congress no matter how dysfunctional and mindnumbing they really are.

But all in all, Eddie and the rest of the guys still rock!

eternalfan

OffStuGoes wrote:

Also, I'd like to say that they should not talk American politics while touring abroad. The main reason being that the people probably just don't care, but also, I do not think Eddie should be including foreigners in a conversation about American politics. It is not their country to criticize, and as an American I don't appreciate Eddie instigating sour thoughts about my president and my congress no matter how dysfunctional and mindnumbing they really are.

I live in a country (like most) where American/Chinese/UK decisions STRONGLY influence it's economy / environment / defence forces..............how can responsible political / humanitarians NOT bring certain issues in to the ring??

Pegasus

OffStuGoes wrote:

Although I am a conservative-leaning moderate, I actually don't mind the political rants too much. I like how they show that they care, and while they certainly advocate their liberal causes, more importantly they advocate just simply caring, and stress the importance of voting. If Eddie's political talk can convince a bunch of the people in a 40,000 plus crowd to get out and vote, it's worth it.

Also, I'd like to say that they should not talk American politics while touring abroad. The main reason being that the people probably just don't care, but also, I do not think Eddie should be including foreigners in a conversation about American politics. It is not their country to criticize, and as an American I don't appreciate Eddie instigating sour thoughts about my president and my congress no matter how dysfunctional and mindnumbing they really are.

But all in all, Eddie and the rest of the guys still rock!

when America stops mingling with the rest of the world politics, either directly or through economic pressure, then we'll stop caring who the fuck rules your country.
you don't care about who governs the UK, France or Zimbabwe because it doesn't affect you (or at least you don't think it does)..we know that Bush's actions have had effect on our lives, even if WE were not dumb enough to vote for him...or allowed to vote against..

Gary Carter

Vedder316 wrote:

I know this is off the subject but I'd love to see Eddie on The O'Reilly factor. A discussion/debate of two great minds.

Take care.

yeah ones a loud mouth asshole and the other says ummm and mumbles alot, real great debate there.

NY PJ1

it has gotten very old

lastexitlondon

each to there own . the music would not be the same without the feelings of the song writer explained in the song or before its performed why is it our concern what is said

StuartC

Pegasus wrote:

when America stops mingling with the rest of the world politics, either directly or through economic pressure, then we'll stop caring who the fuck rules your country.
you don't care about who governs the UK, France or Zimbabwe because it doesn't affect you (or at least you don't think it does)..we know that Bush's actions have had effect on our lives, even if WE were not dumb enough to vote for him...or allowed to vote against..

You have no right to vote in the U.S. and have no say in my government. If you are worried about how much the U.S. impacts your country (presumably the U.K.) then elect officials who have strong thoughts against dependency on other nations. Plus, I don't think you are in the right spot to complain being from where you are. Perhaps if you were a smaller nation particularly set back, then I would consider your argument.

My entire argument is spurned on by this example: Last year, Hugo Chavez (that mother-effing, facist, Castro-loving, tyrant that he is) came to the UN in NYC and started making political- but mainly- personal attacks on George W. Bush. (even going so far as to remark that there was a stench coming off him) The next day, both Republicans and Democrats alike were aggravated and insulted that a foreign leader dare come and make such dashing remarks about their own president on the international stage. Many Americans felt the same way, believing it was THEIR job to question and attack the president, rather than a foreign leader just looking for trouble.

brain of c

i want to be vice president.

vote for me.

Pegasus

OffStuGoes wrote:

You have no right to vote in the U.S. and have no say in my government. If you are worried about how much the U.S. impacts your country (presumably the U.K.) then elect officials who have strong thoughts against dependency on other nations. Plus, I don't think you are in the right spot to complain being from where you are. Perhaps if you were a smaller nation particularly set back, then I would consider your argument.

that's the problem.
I didn't say 'my country', I said the rest of the world..I'm able to think about other people, right now in particular thinking of the Iraqis..

and you're perfectly free to criticise our fuckers when they mess you up.... we're just better at doing it, we've got the practice: dissent is expected here.

My entire argument is spurned on by this example: Last year, Hugo Chavez (that mother-effing, facist, Castro-loving, tyrant that he is) came to the UN in NYC and started making political- but mainly- personal attacks on George W. Bush. (even going so far as to remark that there was a stench coming off him) The next day, both Republicans and Democrats alike were aggravated and insulted that a foreign leader dare come and make such dashing remarks about their own president on the international stage. Many Americans felt the same way, believing it was THEIR job to question and attack the president, rather than a foreign leader just looking for trouble.

not been doing a very good job of it since you still have him there, RE-elected him FFS!
(not that I approve of Chavez self-publicising methods btw)

laudenum

ed just needs to be carefull where he says what he says,personaly i agree with him as do ALOT of others. if the response to his remarks are boneheads turning their back to the stage,thats a drag. its not his opinion thats the problem but the reaction to it. if by now you dont know eds views on a variety of subjects....
well u havent beens paying attention at all.
in canada his remarks are warmly recieved:)

StuartC

Pegasus wrote:

that's the problem.
I didn't say 'my country', I said the rest of the world..I'm able to think about other people, right now in particular thinking of the Iraqis..

and you're perfectly free to criticise our fuckers when they mess you up.... we're just better at doing it, we've got the practice: dissent is expected here.


not been doing a very good job of it since you still have him there, RE-elected him FFS!
(not that I approve of Chavez self-publicising methods btw)

This is where you lose me. What is happening in Iraq to innocent citizens is horrible. There should be more humanitarian aide, and more international involvment in quelling the citizen death toll. However, it is not, has never been, and never will be the priority of American voters to focus on the lives and suffering of other people in foreign countries when voting. We're not talking "We care more about ourselves and our security, so vote candidate X and screw the foreign community" versus "Vote for me and I'll bring world peace"... We are instead talking about the importance of issues. It is hard to fault a voter for considering the things that affect him and his family domestically more than a person in a foreign land he has never met and shares few similarities with.

Let us please pretend for a moment that our debate does not involve Bush. Lets get back to generalities. We can (and both have) used him as an example for points, but really this is about whether or not foreignors should be included in conversation that is not about their own politics and government. Everyone is entitled to an opinion... but for someone in this instance to simply say "I'm right, you're wrong" is warrantless.

Hinny

OffStuGoes wrote:

but really this is about whether or not foreignors should be included in conversation that is not about their own politics and government.

How is this even up for debate?

Heineken Helen

laudenum wrote:

ed just needs to be carefull where he says what he says,personaly i agree with him as do ALOT of others. if the response to his remarks are boneheads turning their back to the stage,thats a drag. its not his opinion thats the problem but the reaction to it. if by now you dont know eds views on a variety of subjects....
well u havent beens paying attention at all.
in canada his remarks are warmly recieved:)

why should he need to be careful? Isn't America the land of free speech and all that bollox? A security guard at the vic brought up the Iraq thing with me and going on about uncivilised people and all that. I replied who's uncivilised? And he said 'oh ya know... the middle east'. :rolleyes: I reminded him we've had our problems in Ireland too and he said 'oh Ireland... that's a strange country... I wanna go there some day' :eek: I shoulda told him to come on over but I din't try and convince him, lol. Point is the entire time he was looking at me smugly for a reaction... I didn't give it. It was very fucking intimidating. I don't like having to keep my opinions to myself and I would imagine that the US of good ole A would appreciate freedom of speech?

Also, I never understand why you guys are so protective of your president? what's the big deal? Our Taoiseach attends most sporting events and ALWAYS gets booed... it's just what's done, lol. If we've something bad to say, we'll say it, and we don't get told to mind our own business. Nobody here would be offended if you say something bad about our leader. By the way I'm talking about your OWN people. Why should you be offended that Eddie doesn't like Bush?

Heineken Helen

OffStuGoes wrote:

We can (and both have) used him as an example for points, but really this is about whether or not foreignors should be included in conversation that is not about their own politics and government. Everyone is entitled to an opinion... but for someone in this instance to simply say "I'm right, you're wrong" is warrantless.

Wow! Ok first off, you say that you vote keeping in mind internal issues... like security for example. Why does voting for a warmonger and oil baron make you feel safer?

Whether you or I like it or not, we cannot vote in the US elections, yet the elections DO affect us and we're gonna fucking complain about it damn right. You have a point saying we should vote for someone who's not gonna support your administration. That would be very nice if such a party existed in any countries. The only countries who were independant enough to be ABLE to stand up are the likes of Germany, France (not so much anymore maybe) and Spain. We don't have that luxury. We're a small country who depend very much on the bigger countries. Yes, that's our own fault. We've had enough riches over the past decade and a half to become more self sustainable yet we didn't seize this opportunity and welcomed yet MORE foreign investment. Yes, this IS our own fault, this IS our problem but Bush saying things like 'you're either with us or against us' is NOT very helpful. Big countries can stand up to him and survive... WE can't. Yet we're a neutral country supposedly... what does he want from us? This is globalisation, it's bad, it's fucking disgusting. I can't vote but yet your elections effect the future of my country more than mine probably does :(

laudenum

Heineken Helen wrote:

why should he need to be careful? Isn't America the land of free speech and all that bollox? A security guard at the vic brought up the Iraq thing with me and going on about uncivilised people and all that. I replied who's uncivilised? And he said 'oh ya know... the middle east'. :rolleyes: I reminded him we've had our problems in Ireland too and he said 'oh Ireland... that's a strange country... I wanna go there some day' :eek: I shoulda told him to come on over but I din't try and convince him, lol. Point is the entire time he was looking at me smugly for a reaction... I didn't give it. It was very fucking intimidating. I don't like having to keep my opinions to myself and I would imagine that the US of good ole A would appreciate freedom of speech?

Also, I never understand why you guys are so protective of your president? what's the big deal? Our Taoiseach attends most sporting events and ALWAYS gets booed... it's just what's done, lol. If we've something bad to say, we'll say it, and we don't get told to mind our own business. Nobody here would be offended if you say something bad about our leader. By the way I'm talking about your OWN people. Why should you be offended that Eddie doesn't like Bush?

you totally misunderstood my statement.
i just meant that ed was criticised terribly when he "impaled" a bush mask on a mic stand.
i agree with his stance,and political views.i'd be the last to defend bush,and as would 99.999% of us canadians