This is why I NEED an AR-15 with 30rd mags

unsung

rgambs said:

libs don't like AR's because they are DESIGNED to deliver massive death in a maneuverable, reliable way. AR's are not made for hunting, or self-defense, they are intended for offensive operations. I hate AR's because they glorify war and make responsible "non-obsessed" gun owners look bad.
That being said, banning AR's doesn't affect gun death rates very much as the overwelming majority of cases involve handguns.

The US Department of Homeland Security would disagree with you. On one of their latest purchases the rifles were line item 'personal defense firearm'.

unsung

gimmesometruth27 said:

why not just put metal detectors up at every public place?? that way no guns go into an area where they shouldn't go. like a school, or a bar, or an airport, etc.

Or we could just put up signs that say "gun free zone", that'll work... oh wait.

unsung

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

rgambs said:

libs don't like AR's because they are DESIGNED to deliver massive death in a maneuverable, reliable way. AR's are not made for hunting, or self-defense, they are intended for offensive operations. I hate AR's because they glorify war and make responsible "non-obsessed" gun owners look bad.
That being said, banning AR's doesn't affect gun death rates very much as the overwelming majority of cases involve handguns.

But given their design and purpose... is there any need for them given the risk they carry and the mayhem they generate? They are at the core of some of your country's biggest national tragedies.

I agree that the handgun is the big problem with regards to your gun problem, but safeguarding future classrooms and movie theaters at the expense of shooting a really cool gun at beer cans at the local landfill seems reasonable.

So when the next crazy uses a handgun like that idiot in Arizona are you going to call for a ban?

What about a stabbing spree like what recently happened in China? Ban all knives?

Seriously where does the knee-jerk lunacy stop?

Thirty Bills Unpaid

unsung said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

rgambs said:

libs don't like AR's because they are DESIGNED to deliver massive death in a maneuverable, reliable way. AR's are not made for hunting, or self-defense, they are intended for offensive operations. I hate AR's because they glorify war and make responsible "non-obsessed" gun owners look bad.
That being said, banning AR's doesn't affect gun death rates very much as the overwelming majority of cases involve handguns.

But given their design and purpose... is there any need for them given the risk they carry and the mayhem they generate? They are at the core of some of your country's biggest national tragedies.

I agree that the handgun is the big problem with regards to your gun problem, but safeguarding future classrooms and movie theaters at the expense of shooting a really cool gun at beer cans at the local landfill seems reasonable.

So when the next crazy uses a handgun like that idiot in Arizona are you going to call for a ban?

What about a stabbing spree like what recently happened in China? Ban all knives?

Seriously where does the knee-jerk lunacy stop?

Speaking of lunacy... geez, man.

I've been calling for greater restrictions on handguns since my very first post with regards to this issue. One shouldn't be able to buy a handgun from 7-11. And not everyone should own a handgun.

Knives have multiple purposes and their ability to inflict damage compared to the AR-15 is significantly lower. If that little pencil-necked geek, Lanza, had a knife instead of an AR-15... your country wouldn't have the Sandy Hook calamity on its resume like it does now.

unsung

Well he murdered his mother and stole that firearm so lets not pretend that it was legally obtained.

JimmyV

unsung said:

Well he murdered his mother and stole that firearm so lets not pretend that it was legally obtained.

And in doing so he exemplified how very dangerous these legally obtained firearms are to society. The gun was legally obtained by its owner...and then it was used by a psychopath to murder innocent children. Had the mother not legally obtained such weapons, many of those children in Newtown would still be alive today.

cornnifer

people want to own AR-15s for the same reason they want to drive Hummers... really tiny weiners.

unsung

JimmyV said:

unsung said:

Well he murdered his mother and stole that firearm so lets not pretend that it was legally obtained.

And in doing so he exemplified how very dangerous these legally obtained firearms are to society. The gun was legally obtained by its owner...and then it was used by a psychopath to murder innocent children. Had the mother not legally obtained such weapons, many of those children in Newtown would still be alive today.

You don't know that for certain.

He committed about 35 felonies, how many more laws do you want him to break? All the laws written don't stop bad people from doing bad things.

All your solution does is punish the law abiding... Yeah yeah yeah, I know, law abiding until they aren't.

*looking for that dang roll eyes smiley*

Thirty Bills Unpaid

unsung said:

JimmyV said:

unsung said:

Well he murdered his mother and stole that firearm so lets not pretend that it was legally obtained.

And in doing so he exemplified how very dangerous these legally obtained firearms are to society. The gun was legally obtained by its owner...and then it was used by a psychopath to murder innocent children. Had the mother not legally obtained such weapons, many of those children in Newtown would still be alive today.

You don't know that for certain.

He committed about 35 felonies, how many more laws do you want him to break? All the laws written don't stop bad people from doing bad things.

All your solution does is punish the law abiding... Yeah yeah yeah, I know, law abiding until they aren't.

*looking for that dang roll eyes smiley*

How exactly is it 'punishing' the law abiding? You could still shoot stuff with some other guns.

Cosmo

unsung said:

JimmyV said:

unsung said:

Well he murdered his mother and stole that firearm so lets not pretend that it was legally obtained.

And in doing so he exemplified how very dangerous these legally obtained firearms are to society. The gun was legally obtained by its owner...and then it was used by a psychopath to murder innocent children. Had the mother not legally obtained such weapons, many of those children in Newtown would still be alive today.

You don't know that for certain.
He committed about 35 felonies, how many more laws do you want him to break? All the laws written don't stop bad people from doing bad things.
All your solution does is punish the law abiding... Yeah yeah yeah, I know, law abiding until they aren't.
*looking for that dang roll eyes smiley*

...
Wait... are you talking about Adam Lanza... did he commit 35 felonies prior to murdering those children? What felonies did Adam Lanza commit before his murderous spree?
...
i think the Newton case points out a lot of what is in this discussion.
Mrs. Lanza was a law abiding citizen. She obtained these weapons by legal means. She didn't buy the guns for her son.
By definition you can call her a responsible gun owner.
Where that definition fails in the fact that her son, Adam, had access to those same weapons.
...
What we saw was that there is a requirement for all gun ownser to fully secure all of his weapons from family members... or have full control over his family members in order to be responsible for his own gun.
Mrs/ Lanza could have either locked away all of her guns from her son... either in a gun safe where she held both of the keys or storge them offsite, away from the home she shared with her son... or sold off the guns until her son was out of the house. That... is being responsible.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

Cosmo said:

unsung said:

JimmyV said:

unsung said:

Well he murdered his mother and stole that firearm so lets not pretend that it was legally obtained.

And in doing so he exemplified how very dangerous these legally obtained firearms are to society. The gun was legally obtained by its owner...and then it was used by a psychopath to murder innocent children. Had the mother not legally obtained such weapons, many of those children in Newtown would still be alive today.

You don't know that for certain.
He committed about 35 felonies, how many more laws do you want him to break? All the laws written don't stop bad people from doing bad things.
All your solution does is punish the law abiding... Yeah yeah yeah, I know, law abiding until they aren't.
*looking for that dang roll eyes smiley*

...
Wait... are you talking about Adam Lanza... did he commit 35 felonies prior to murdering those children? What felonies did Adam Lanza commit before his murderous spree?
...
i think the Newton case points out a lot of what is in this discussion.
Mrs. Lanza was a law abiding citizen. She obtained these weapons by legal means. She didn't buy the guns for her son.
By definition you can call her a responsible gun owner.
Where that definition fails in the fact that her son, Adam, had access to those same weapons.
...
What we saw was that there is a requirement for all gun ownser to fully secure all of his weapons from family members... or have full control over his family members in order to be responsible for his own gun.
Mrs/ Lanza could have either locked away all of her guns from her son... either in a gun safe where she held both of the keys or storge them offsite, away from the home she shared with her son... or sold off the guns until her son was out of the house. That... is being responsible.

Your last passages regarding 'being responsible' will fall on deaf ears. This point has been brought up before to which, the response is always, "Well ya can't defend yourself against the bad guys if your gun is locked up in some locker now, can ya?"

The definition for responsible gun ownership on these pages is as long as you're not shooting anyone with your guns... you're responsible. The need to take precautions with your weapons that are commonplace in Canada are seen as 'ridiculous'. That's why we see 5 year old kids shooting each other.

Cosmo

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Cosmo said:

unsung said:

JimmyV said:

unsung said:

Well he murdered his mother and stole that firearm so lets not pretend that it was legally obtained.

And in doing so he exemplified how very dangerous these legally obtained firearms are to society. The gun was legally obtained by its owner...and then it was used by a psychopath to murder innocent children. Had the mother not legally obtained such weapons, many of those children in Newtown would still be alive today.

You don't know that for certain.
He committed about 35 felonies, how many more laws do you want him to break? All the laws written don't stop bad people from doing bad things.
All your solution does is punish the law abiding... Yeah yeah yeah, I know, law abiding until they aren't.
*looking for that dang roll eyes smiley*

...
Wait... are you talking about Adam Lanza... did he commit 35 felonies prior to murdering those children? What felonies did Adam Lanza commit before his murderous spree?
...
i think the Newton case points out a lot of what is in this discussion.
Mrs. Lanza was a law abiding citizen. She obtained these weapons by legal means. She didn't buy the guns for her son.
By definition you can call her a responsible gun owner.
Where that definition fails in the fact that her son, Adam, had access to those same weapons.
...
What we saw was that there is a requirement for all gun ownser to fully secure all of his weapons from family members... or have full control over his family members in order to be responsible for his own gun.
Mrs/ Lanza could have either locked away all of her guns from her son... either in a gun safe where she held both of the keys or storge them offsite, away from the home she shared with her son... or sold off the guns until her son was out of the house. That... is being responsible.

Your last passages regarding 'being responsible' will fall on deaf ears. This point has been brought up before to which, the response is always, "Well ya can't defend yourself against the bad guys if your gun is locked up in some locker now, can ya?"

The definition for responsible gun ownership on these pages is as long as you're not shooting anyone with your guns... you're responsible. The need to take precautions with your weapons that are commonplace in Canada are seen as 'ridiculous'. That's why we see 5 year old kids shooting each other.

...
One would think that... but, you could have that weapon on your person at all times, including when you are watching The Disney Channel with the family and handing out presents on Christmas morning. You can secure the weapon when you go to sleep... or better yet, you can stand guard all night.
That way, you can be sure that no one but yourself can ever do anything irresponsible with that gun.

rgambs

How about fingerprint identification on the safety? America is a place where Tylenol has to be in a child-safe container but guns have child-friendly operating mechanisms.
Simple but I am sure the gun crowd has a reason not to go this route, legitimate or not.

Also, in reference to my comments on AR's and handguns...I am not against AR regulations at all, I just don't think they will accomplish much. When a pyscho can't carry 1 gun with 100 rounds, he will carry 10 guns with 10 each. Maybe we can cut the carnage a little bit, but I doubt it.

Cosmo

rgambs said:

How about fingerprint identification on the safety? America is a place where Tylenol has to be in a child-safe container but guns have child-friendly operating mechanisms.
Simple but I am sure the gun crowd has a reason not to go this route, legitimate or not.

Also, in reference to my comments on AR's and handguns...I am not against AR regulations at all, I just don't think they will accomplish much. When a pyscho can't carry 1 gun with 100 rounds, he will carry 10 guns with 10 each. Maybe we can cut the carnage a little bit, but I doubt it.

...
Adam Lanza had 10 30-round clips for his Bushmaster and fired 153 rounds in 5 minutes. He swapped clips more than he needed to because investigators found 3 unused clips (90 rounds, total), plus several clips with ammo still present... which accounts for the other 57 unspent rounds). He had a total of 300 rounds, on his person, for use in one weapon.
My guess... which I freely admit, is based purely on unfounded, wild speculation... is that Adam ran out of moving targets and did not have the mental capacity to hunt down more victims, hiding in terror behind locked doors. As horrible as this crime was... it had the potential of being far worse... in my (unsupportable) opinion.

gimmesometruth27

unsung said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

why not just put metal detectors up at every public place?? that way no guns go into an area where they shouldn't go. like a school, or a bar, or an airport, etc.

Or we could just put up signs that say "gun free zone", that'll work... oh wait.

no, you want to make someplace safe, you put up metal detectors and people with guns are not allowed inside. it is that simple.

these politicians are fucking cowards. they want people to be able to take their guns into bars, church, school, but i want to take my gun into the senate chamber to watch them debate legislation. why can't i do that? because they won't let me. fucking pussies.

should we be allowed to take our guns into one of the houses of congress or the white house? a real 2nd amendment supporter would say yes.

unsung

Jesus man, you are smarter than that.

How is a metal detector going to stop anyone from bringing in a gun? Are you saying the Conn shooting wouldn't have happened?

And yes. You can carry inside many state Capitol building iirc. Haven't heard of a shooting there.

unsung

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

unsung said:

JimmyV said:

unsung said:

Well he murdered his mother and stole that firearm so lets not pretend that it was legally obtained.

And in doing so he exemplified how very dangerous these legally obtained firearms are to society. The gun was legally obtained by its owner...and then it was used by a psychopath to murder innocent children. Had the mother not legally obtained such weapons, many of those children in Newtown would still be alive today.

You don't know that for certain.

He committed about 35 felonies, how many more laws do you want him to break? All the laws written don't stop bad people from doing bad things.

All your solution does is punish the law abiding... Yeah yeah yeah, I know, law abiding until they aren't.

*looking for that dang roll eyes smiley*

How exactly is it 'punishing' the law abiding? You could still shoot stuff with some other guns.

So what do I, and millions of others do with our AR's and 30 rd standard capacity magazines?

rgambs

do the same as our govt does. sell them to 3rd world terrorists above market price lol

Thirty Bills Unpaid

unsung said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

unsung said:

JimmyV said:

unsung said:

Well he murdered his mother and stole that firearm so lets not pretend that it was legally obtained.

And in doing so he exemplified how very dangerous these legally obtained firearms are to society. The gun was legally obtained by its owner...and then it was used by a psychopath to murder innocent children. Had the mother not legally obtained such weapons, many of those children in Newtown would still be alive today.

You don't know that for certain.

He committed about 35 felonies, how many more laws do you want him to break? All the laws written don't stop bad people from doing bad things.

All your solution does is punish the law abiding... Yeah yeah yeah, I know, law abiding until they aren't.

*looking for that dang roll eyes smiley*

How exactly is it 'punishing' the law abiding? You could still shoot stuff with some other guns.

So what do I, and millions of others do with our AR's and 30 rd standard capacity magazines?

A buy back program.

But remember... it's not just about you.

unsung

You are right. There's millions of these in the US as it is the most common sporting rifle made, plus the standard 30rd mag is also one of the top sellers. There could be 10 million or more owners of this particular rifle.

What if nobody decides to sell?