Evolution v. Creationism Debate

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  • arq
    arq Posts: 8,101
    PJ_Soul said:

    The only debate I can logically muster is the one about how to get the nutjobs to shut the hell up and fuck off.

    I can't believe that modern day society can result in these people having such an influence or a platform. It's fucking terrifying.

    Wasting time and resources debating creationist feels retarded, but whatelse can we do? We can't ignore them because sadly people who believes in crazy shit is allowed to vote too.
    "The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it"
    Neil deGrasse Tyson

    Why not (V) (°,,,,°) (V) ?
  • callen
    callen Posts: 6,388
    Watched great film called "My Inner Fish". On Netflix.

    Detailed evolutionary linkage of humans to worlds creatures. Great cinematography and CGI
    10-18-2000 Houston, 04-06-2003 Houston, 6-25-2003 Toronto, 10-8-2004 Kissimmee, 9-4-2005 Calgary, 12-3-05 Sao Paulo, 7-2-2006 Denver, 7-22-06 Gorge, 7-23-2006 Gorge, 9-13-2006 Bern, 6-22-2008 DC, 6-24-2008 MSG, 6-25-2008 MSG
  • RSR
    RSR British Columbia, Canada Posts: 44
    PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

    Your entire post I was reading until I came up to the 6000yr old thing. It is simply impossible to have a reasoned debate with someone who truly believes the earth is 6000yrs old.

    I think if you look deep enough, you'll discover we all have at least one or two wacky beliefs about things. But the trick in discussions on politics and religion is to not go around in circles. As soon as that starts to happen ....

    image

    And some people can't have a reasonable discussion - it just turns into name-calling. I would avoid that, because they aren't really willing to discuss anything. So what I'm saying is that a reasonable person will recognize that just because they are passionate about something (i.e. creation science) doesn't give them the right to be mean or closed off to another perspective.
    I've been a Pearl Jam fan since I was 13 and first heard Ament's opening to Jeremy on the radio. To this day, Pearl Jam continues to inspire and challenge me to not just be better, but to be great.
  • callen
    callen Posts: 6,388
    Must be brutal attempting to interpret Bible to fit Science.

    Thinking though that this thought process will become the norm keeping Bible relevant for longer period of time.
    10-18-2000 Houston, 04-06-2003 Houston, 6-25-2003 Toronto, 10-8-2004 Kissimmee, 9-4-2005 Calgary, 12-3-05 Sao Paulo, 7-2-2006 Denver, 7-22-06 Gorge, 7-23-2006 Gorge, 9-13-2006 Bern, 6-22-2008 DC, 6-24-2008 MSG, 6-25-2008 MSG
  • PJfanwillneverleave1
    PJfanwillneverleave1 Posts: 12,885
    RSR said:

    PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

    Your entire post I was reading until I came up to the 6000yr old thing. It is simply impossible to have a reasoned debate with someone who truly believes the earth is 6000yrs old.

    I think if you look deep enough, you'll discover we all have at least one or two wacky beliefs about things. But the trick in discussions on politics and religion is to not go around in circles.
    And some people can't have a reasonable discussion - it just turns into name-calling. I would avoid that, because they aren't really willing to discuss anything. So what I'm saying is that a reasonable person will recognize that just because they are passionate about something (i.e. creation science) doesn't give them the right to be mean or closed off to another perspective.
    If I may ask you friend. Do you believe the earth is 6000yrs old?
  • RSR
    RSR British Columbia, Canada Posts: 44
    No, I'm comfortable with an evolving cosmos. I actually have a hard time seeing the problem between creation and evolution, aside from the debate itself being a problem. I think things like survival of the fittest are self-evident in nature. Foxes can kill and eat rabbits because foxes are stronger, more cunning etc. It would be futile to argue against a thing that happens.

    Interestingly, foxes do kill rabbits precisely because they can. People also hunt animals because we have the ability to do so. If we physically couldn't, we would still be eating tree nuts or whatever. There's nothing wrong with any of this, but I think it brings up the controversy of where to draw the lines ... or more importantly, why to draw the lines. I think there are several layers of assumptions we need to peel back before we can really answer a 'why' question like that.

    We assume that hunting people for sport is wrong. Why?
    Because we assume that it's wrong to kill someone who is innocent. why?
    Because our justice system frowns on .... why?
    Because ....

    My opinion is that while I am comfortable and supportive of old earth science, I don't think evolution provides a good enough basis for something like morality. I think Evolution does have a bearing on how morality gets worked out in our day-to-day lives, but I don't think it's the root cause of morality or even a good reason to have a moral position.
    I've been a Pearl Jam fan since I was 13 and first heard Ament's opening to Jeremy on the radio. To this day, Pearl Jam continues to inspire and challenge me to not just be better, but to be great.
  • PJfanwillneverleave1
    PJfanwillneverleave1 Posts: 12,885
    RSR said:

    No, I'm comfortable with an evolving cosmos.

    Nice
  • JWPearl
    JWPearl Posts: 19,893
    searching a seat for me here...and like to add a beautiful thought.....and not to get thrown in the debate pit but be in dominence of this thread...
    but evolution should not ever had halted if it existed, and creation is a thinker, evolution is not..
  • dignin
    dignin Posts: 9,478
    JWPearl said:


    but evolution should not ever had halted if it existed, and creation is a thinker, evolution is not..

    Care to elaborate a little further?

  • JWPearl
    JWPearl Posts: 19,893
    no not really, i think your smart enough to figure it out
  • dignin
    dignin Posts: 9,478
    JWPearl said:

    no not really, i think your smart enough to figure it out

    You think wrong, I can't wrap my head around it.

  • JWPearl
    JWPearl Posts: 19,893
    edited December 2014
    if evolution really existed and was the answer to our existance, things would still be ''vastly evolving'' like a big bang is not a thought process but a freak of nature, in which i assume has no thought process
    but creation on the other hand is a thought process and spirituality just does not coincidently evolve as well as emotions that go with it, and if you experienced harmony and love, you would then start to question evolution
  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    From the video: what chance have we got when the indoctrination- the imprinting- of a childhood leaves a mind so wrecked?

    The mind is a powerful thing.

    Just as an anorexic girl looks in the mirror and sees obesity while the rest of the world sees a skeleton... the devout follower believes what they been groomed to believe regardless of science based fact (or even common sense for that matter).

    * To the above post... evolution has not halted. What would make you say that?
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • JWPearl
    JWPearl Posts: 19,893
    its not vast to the extent that lifeform like humans are evolving, complete nonsense ;))
  • JWPearl
    JWPearl Posts: 19,893
    love to chat but i have to go to the doctors to get new medication, they just happened to evolve there, just for me and this horrible sickness i have ;)) sorry but i believe credit when credits due to our maker...
  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    JWPearl said:

    its not vast to the extent that lifeform like humans are evolving, complete nonsense ;))

    Maybe not, but there are ceilings to everything. The closer you come to biological ceilings... the less profound growth or evolution occurs.

    Speaking of nonsense... remember to say your prayers tonight. God will be listening to them- and all the other millions of people praying too. ;))
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • RSR
    RSR British Columbia, Canada Posts: 44
    JWPearl. I'm not sure what you're getting at here. It sounds like an argument against Evolution based on the idea that things don't appear to still be evolving. The reason this argument doesn't work is because evolution takes billions of years. You can't 'see' something evolving right now - although in a sense you are seeing evolution all the time. It's very, very, very, very, VERY slow. Scientists can only look back in hindsight and put the puzzle pieces together.

    In one sense, the idea of evolution was an answer to the question of: Why are things the way they are presently? Properly understood, Evolution as a working scientific body of knowledge provides some reasonable, verifiable answers. Improperly understood ... and you get Ken Ham debating Bill Nye.
    I've been a Pearl Jam fan since I was 13 and first heard Ament's opening to Jeremy on the radio. To this day, Pearl Jam continues to inspire and challenge me to not just be better, but to be great.
  • JWPearl
    JWPearl Posts: 19,893
    edited December 2014
    1, God does not answer all prayers, if you are not pleasing him or are doing wrong?
    2.Some things happen for a reason so what you praying for may not be what God has planned for you because his thoughts are higher than ours and you dont know whats best for you in his eyes not your own?
    3.Are you praying to the right God?
    4. We live in the devils world, even Gods son died on a cross, what did you do?
    5.Do you love God enough to be noticed?
    6.Is what your asking for a sin ?

    im leaving this thread that should be enough
    you can, go study monkeys,apes and their desire of spirituality,
  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    JWPearl said:

    love to chat but i have to go to the doctors to get new medication, they just happened to evolve there, just for me and this horrible sickness i have ;)) sorry but i believe credit when credits due to our maker...

    Huh? Exactly what does the maker get credit for in this situation?

    Why are you accessing a doctor and science? You shouldn't treat science like it's a buffet table: "I'll believe a little of this and a little of that... no... none of that science though... don't like that science."

    Sheesh.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • dignin
    dignin Posts: 9,478
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cdmqn9JIuzc

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