my wife and I have always lived the way we wanted to (believe in God and treat other people like we want to be treated) and we both have worked our entire adult lives to survive,we teach our Son that education is the best way to get ahead(knoledge is power) and be kind to people.
it seems that in most jobs we both have held there is someone elses rules we need to play by "remember the golden rule" (the one with gold makes the rules) :shock: but that dosn't mean giving up what you believe,my wife spent 12 years in the AirForce as a police officer (sgt.) but if you met her today you would never know it..unless you handed her a rifle or a .45 and asked her to hit a target or break it down.
point is that maybe we have to "play the game to survive" but we can keep who we are and hopefully our children will do better than us if we do all we can to teach them.
I don't know where the heck my rant came from but this is what came to mind after reading the op and some of the replys.
Hate to break it to this valedictorian, but just because you have a nice job doesn't mean your life is empty and souless nor does it mean you're obsessed with money. And the majority of those inhumane, nonsensical, corporations became successful by bucking the trends and celebrating innovation, uniqueness and people following their passions.
My speech; Life is what you make it. Concern yourself with living out your own experiences rather than bad mouthing the way you only think others are living theirs.
priceless...
but ignored by most here I see :?
I did what I was supposed to do and lived happily ever after in the big picture of life ...
what more could I ask for I've been one lucky lady
my wife and I have always lived the way we wanted to (believe in God and treat other people like we want to be treated) and we both have worked our entire adult lives to survive,we teach our Son that education is the best way to get ahead(knoledge is power) and be kind to people.
it seems that in most jobs we both have held there is someone elses rules we need to play by "remember the golden rule" (the one with gold makes the rules) :shock: but that dosn't mean giving up what you believe,my wife spent 12 years in the AirForce as a police officer (sgt.) but if you met her today you would never know it..unless you handed her a rifle or a .45 and asked her to hit a target or break it down.
point is that maybe we have to "play the game to survive" but we can keep who we are and hopefully our children will do better than us if we do all we can to teach them.
I don't know where the heck my rant came from but this is what came to mind after reading the op and some of the replys.
Godfather.
heres a question godfather....
when you told your son education is the best way to get ahead and that knowledge is power, were you speaking of institutionalised education? or autodidactic education?
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Hate to break it to this valedictorian, but just because you have a nice job doesn't mean your life is empty and souless nor does it mean you're obsessed with money. And the majority of those inhumane, nonsensical, corporations became successful by bucking the trends and celebrating innovation, uniqueness and people following their passions.
My speech; Life is what you make it. Concern yourself with living out your own experiences rather than bad mouthing the way you only think others are living theirs.
priceless...
but ignored by most here I see :?
I did what I was supposed to do and lived happily ever after in the big picture of life ...
what more could I ask for I've been one lucky lady
but what is it you thought you were 'suppose to do'?
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
my original post was in sync with the topic at hand. I wasn't about being negative I was about stating the obvious and saying ill live how I want, not how they want me to.
I know, it just got carried off in another direction; different topic altogether.
I do think that how our society was formed, and who formed its rules does have something to do with what "were supposed to do".
my wife and I have always lived the way we wanted to (believe in God and treat other people like we want to be treated) and we both have worked our entire adult lives to survive,we teach our Son that education is the best way to get ahead(knoledge is power) and be kind to people.
it seems that in most jobs we both have held there is someone elses rules we need to play by "remember the golden rule" (the one with gold makes the rules) :shock: but that dosn't mean giving up what you believe,my wife spent 12 years in the AirForce as a police officer (sgt.) but if you met her today you would never know it..unless you handed her a rifle or a .45 and asked her to hit a target or break it down.
point is that maybe we have to "play the game to survive" but we can keep who we are and hopefully our children will do better than us if we do all we can to teach them.
I don't know where the heck my rant came from but this is what came to mind after reading the op and some of the replys.
Godfather.
I feel the same way.....Parents set the path on "What we're supposed to do".
“We the people are the rightful masters of bothCongress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.” Abraham Lincoln
my wife and I have always lived the way we wanted to (believe in God and treat other people like we want to be treated) and we both have worked our entire adult lives to survive,we teach our Son that education is the best way to get ahead(knoledge is power) and be kind to people.
it seems that in most jobs we both have held there is someone elses rules we need to play by "remember the golden rule" (the one with gold makes the rules) :shock: but that dosn't mean giving up what you believe,my wife spent 12 years in the AirForce as a police officer (sgt.) but if you met her today you would never know it..unless you handed her a rifle or a .45 and asked her to hit a target or break it down.
point is that maybe we have to "play the game to survive" but we can keep who we are and hopefully our children will do better than us if we do all we can to teach them.
I don't know where the heck my rant came from but this is what came to mind after reading the op and some of the replys.
Godfather.
I feel the same way.....Parents set the path on "What we're supposed to do".
and as a parent what is it you think 'were suppose to do?' what is it you tell your children?
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Hate to break it to this valedictorian, but just because you have a nice job doesn't mean your life is empty and souless nor does it mean you're obsessed with money. And the majority of those inhumane, nonsensical, corporations became successful by bucking the trends and celebrating innovation, uniqueness and people following their passions.
My speech; Life is what you make it. Concern yourself with living out your own experiences rather than bad mouthing the way you only think others are living theirs.
priceless...
but ignored by most here I see :?
I did what I was supposed to do and lived happily ever after in the big picture of life ...
what more could I ask for I've been one lucky lady
but what is it you thought you were 'suppose to do'?
I do exactly what I want with my life within the confines of what is generally accepted as 'normal'(insert sarcasm)
Seriously, don't most of us follow the traditional dictates whether it be about jobs and how we live our lives? Even those that choose a slightly different path or those that feel 'happy and blessed' to have the life they want. I see that those who seek different ideals and different paths than the traditional American way of life being ridiculed if they don't believe in capitalism or guns or whatever the current topic of the day might be. I'm not saying that any of you are wrong for those beliefs but why are those of us who question these mores made to feel that something is wrong with us? I've spent most of my 20s and 30s seeking to follow that path that was laid out before me and I was very successful in following that path. However, I am now questioning the legitimacy of that very path. It's not bad or wrong but I have come to question the validity of that very way of life. We are living in the box of fear and some don't even know it.
Sorry muddled thoughts at this point so if my rambling doesn't make sense, so sorry. Not meant to be offensive or judgmental towards anyone that is ok with living and following this path but I've personally spent the last 3 years of my life questioning the very dictates that have guided my life since the beginning and it is difficult to reconcile all those parts.
Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
I do exactly what I want with my life within the confines of what is generally accepted as 'normal'(insert sarcasm)
Seriously, don't most of us follow the traditional dictates whether it be about jobs and how we live our lives? Even those that choose a slightly different path or those that feel 'happy and blessed' to have the life they want. I see that those who seek different ideals and different paths than the traditional American way of life being ridiculed if they don't believe in capitalism or guns or whatever the current topic of the day might be. I'm not saying that any of you are wrong for those beliefs but why are those of us who question these mores made to feel that something is wrong with us? I've spent most of my 20s and 30s seeking to follow that path that was laid out before me and I was very successful in following that path. However, I am now questioning the legitimacy of that very path. It's not bad or wrong but I have come to question the validity of that very way of life. We are living in the box of fear and some don't even know it.
Sorry muddled thoughts at this point so if my rambling doesn't make sense, so sorry. Not meant to be offensive or judgmental towards anyone that is ok with living and following this path but I've personally spent the last 3 years of my life questioning the very dictates that have guided my life since the beginning and it is difficult to reconcile all those parts.
well this is the thing isn't it? who dictates the 'right way to live'. what is acceptable and what is not? whose mores do we follow, accept and whose do we see as abhorrent. and why do we see them as such? speaking as someone who has lived her life arse backwards and with a low regard to what is acceptable I find it interesting what people find 'acceptable' and how they came to this way of thinking. my over riding credo is if you don't fuck with me I wont fuck with you. I will live my life so as not to infringe negatively upon your life. however if you choose to fuck with me or mine then all hell will break upon your head and you will only have yourself to blame. I may forgive but I will not forget and the blame for that will rest upon your shoulders. however the overwhelming feeling is that most likely youre not worth my time and effort so...
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
I see that those who seek different ideals and different paths than the traditional American way of life being ridiculed if they don't believe in capitalism or guns or whatever the current topic of the day might be. I'm not saying that any of you are wrong for those beliefs but why are those of us who question these mores made to feel that something is wrong with us? .
Not just the traditional 'american' way of life
When not conforming, it would seem one lives an 'alternative' lifestyle. Maybe one day alternative will become the norm!
Cincybeacat - a lot of people enjoy work, their life, etc. I don't think there is an issue with that at all. We do make our choices. What I think is that what prepares us to life (as young people) is very much the same (at least in the western world) and we have our hands tied to a point - eg compulsory education, etc. Doesn't give much initial scope to be able to 'break away' from this.
Cincybeacat - a lot of people enjoy work, their life, etc. I don't think there is an issue with that at all. We do make our choices. What I think is that what prepares us to life (as young people) is very much the same (at least in the western world) and we have our hands tied to a point - eg compulsory education, etc. Doesn't give much initial scope to be able to 'break away' from this.
Hmmm...perhaps. But school is only part of a child's life. Lot's of time outside school for activities, etc. But I see your point.
I agree with what someone else already said "Work to Live". It's a good strategy. Find something that will provide you with the time and resources to enjoy life and what you want to do. And if they are 1 in the same, terrific.
Hate to break it to this valedictorian, but just because you have a nice job doesn't mean your life is empty and souless nor does it mean you're obsessed with money. And the majority of those inhumane, nonsensical, corporations became successful by bucking the trends and celebrating innovation, uniqueness and people following their passions.
My speech; Life is what you make it. Concern yourself with living out your own experiences rather than bad mouthing the way you only think others are living theirs.
priceless...
but ignored by most here I see :?
I did what I was supposed to do and lived happily ever after in the big picture of life ...
what more could I ask for I've been one lucky lady
but what is it you thought you were 'suppose to do'?
Fifty years ago I think you might know what women were expected to do.
I had in my parents the most wonderful example of lifetime love, friendship, partnership.
What they instilled helped me know what I wanted and needed.
Thankfully JB had the same examples. Thankfully we met and made a grand life...
lifetime love, children, business.
This what I thought I was supposed to do and incredibly it worked out.
Fifty years ago I think you might know what women were expected to do.
I had in my parents the most wonderful example of lifetime love, friendship, partnership.
What they instilled helped me know what I wanted and needed.
Thankfully JB had the same examples. Thankfully we met and made a grand life...
lifetime love, children, business.
This what I thought I was supposed to do and incredibly it worked out.
50 years ago I wasn't even born so how would I know?? come on Pandora you know your vagueness doesn't fly with me... you've not said what it is you thought you were suppose to do. youve simply danced around giving no specifics. I don't ask question simply to amuse myself. I ask to seek answers and as usual you give none.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
“How can I set free anyone who doesn't have the guts to stand up alone and declare his own freedom? I think it's a lie – people claim they want to be free – everybody insists that freedom is what they want the most, the most sacred and precious thing a man can possess. But that's bullshit! People are terrified to be set free – they hold on to their chains. They fight anyone who tries to break those chains. It's their security…How can they expect me or anyone else to set them free if they don't really want to be free?”
Cincybeacat - a lot of people enjoy work, their life, etc. I don't think there is an issue with that at all. We do make our choices. What I think is that what prepares us to life (as young people) is very much the same (at least in the western world) and we have our hands tied to a point - eg compulsory education, etc. Doesn't give much initial scope to be able to 'break away' from this.
Hmmm...perhaps. But school is only part of a child's life. Lot's of time outside school for activities, etc. But I see your point.
I agree with what someone else already said "Work to Live". It's a good strategy. Find something that will provide you with the time and resources to enjoy life and what you want to do. And if they are 1 in the same, terrific.
I agree that school is only a part of life but I should have been a bit clearer when I gave this example of compulsory education. Coming back to what riotgrl had to say, it's the state of his education, wondering if the goal of education is the right one. If parents deem their child would be much better traveling the world and learning those life skills, that is not accepted. Naturally, there is home schooling but even that is regimented!
Also, maybe due to the parents' life, their upbringing, etc., they may not have the skills to enable the child to develop outside the school.
Work to live is definitely a good goal, though some people's 'passion'/goal may be success/money/riches and it is their choice to 'live for work'.
I think the basis of the OP is that 'we' have too many expectations dumped on us (and we 'dump' the same way on others), expecting things to be just so - go a certain way, follow a certain path and we are 'trained' for that. For example, in some western countries, women are still expected to be somewhat educated, well groomed, get married, have babies and look after their house and husband who will be bringing in the money. Outdated 'values' maybe but high expectations and one is 'moulded' into those expectations and accepts them. This is just an easy example - there are many more. Breaking this mould is made difficult by society as a whole and by one's self as well.
“How can I set free anyone who doesn't have the guts to stand up alone and declare his own freedom? I think it's a lie – people claim they want to be free – everybody insists that freedom is what they want the most, the most sacred and precious thing a man can possess. But that's bullshit! People are terrified to be set free – they hold on to their chains. They fight anyone who tries to break those chains. It's their security…How can they expect me or anyone else to set them free if they don't really want to be free?”
A man of my heart.... Jim - but you too DT!
So true though - what is known is comfort. A path 'planned' by society is comfort in a way. Deviating from that path can be scary.
Edit: Another one from him (and apt to the discussion)
“The most important kind of freedom is to be what you really are. You trade in your reality for a role. You trade in your sense for an act. You give up your ability to feel, and in exchange, put on a mask. There can't be any large-scale revolution until there's a personal revolution, on and individual level. It's got to happen inside first. You can take away a man's political freedom and you won't hurt him- unless you take away his freedom to feel. That can destroy him. That kind of freedom can't be granted. Nobody can win it for you.”
I agree that school is only a part of life but I should have been a bit clearer when I gave this example of compulsory education. Coming back to what riotgrl had to say, it's the state of his education, wondering if the goal of education is the right one. If parents deem their child would be much better traveling the world and learning those life skills, that is not accepted. Naturally, there is home schooling but even that is regimented!
Also, maybe due to the parents' life, their upbringing, etc., they may not have the skills to enable the child to develop outside the school.
Work to live is definitely a good goal, though some people's 'passion'/goal may be success/money/riches and it is their choice to 'live for work'.
I think the basis of the OP is that 'we' have too many expectations dumped on us (and we 'dump' the same way on others), expecting things to be just so - go a certain way, follow a certain path and we are 'trained' for that. For example, in some western countries, women are still expected to be somewhat educated, well groomed, get married, have babies and look after their house and husband who will be bringing in the money. Outdated 'values' maybe but high expectations and one is 'moulded' into those expectations and accepts them. This is just an easy example - there are many more. Breaking this mould is made difficult by society as a whole and by one's self as well.
the worst thing you can do is to tell me to what im suppose to do. my life is my own and as long as my children grow up intelligent, strong, with the ability to think for themselves and aware that society doesn't have their best interests at heart then that's all that matters.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Fifty years ago I think you might know what women were expected to do.
I had in my parents the most wonderful example of lifetime love, friendship, partnership.
What they instilled helped me know what I wanted and needed.
Thankfully JB had the same examples. Thankfully we met and made a grand life... lifetime love, children, business. This what I thought I was supposed to do and incredibly it worked out.[/quote]
50 years ago I wasn't even born so how would I know?? come on Pandora you know your vagueness doesn't fly with me... you've not said what it is you thought you were suppose to do. youve simply danced around giving no specifics. I don't ask question simply to amuse myself. I ask to seek answers and as usual you give none.
gee cate the answer stares you in face :? maybe if you listen a little better ...
Fifty years ago I think you might know what women were expected to do.
I had in my parents the most wonderful example of lifetime love, friendship, partnership.
What they instilled helped me know what I wanted and needed.
Thankfully JB had the same examples. Thankfully we met and made a grand life... lifetime love, children, business. This what I thought I was supposed to do and incredibly it worked out.[/quote]
50 years ago I wasn't even born so how would I know?? come on Pandora you know your vagueness doesn't fly with me... you've not said what it is you thought you were suppose to do. youve simply danced around giving no specifics. I don't ask question simply to amuse myself. I ask to seek answers and as usual you give none.
gee cate the answer stares you in face :? maybe if you listen a little better ...
don't get on your high horse with me pandora. you dont intimidate me nor do i think cause youre older youre the font of all knowledge and reason. I asked you a question, one of many and one finally youve felt the need to answer.. and yet you do so with some sort of superior attitude. are you fuckin' kidding me? lifetime love, children and business?? that's your specifics??? your parents instilled on you a need for children, lifetime love and business??? but what is it they said about those things? did they tell you that business was something that was expected of you? that love and children were what was required of you in this life? or did they say that these things would form the basis of a long and fruitful life? what was the advice they gave you? what was theyre expectation for you in relation to what society expected? you say you thought that this is what was expected of you, but what was it that you wanted? and did you ever think, even once, that this was the 'wrong' course? and did you think because it all worked out for you that it was the right thing? do/did you ever think there could be more?
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
my wife and I have always lived the way we wanted to (believe in God and treat other people like we want to be treated) and we both have worked our entire adult lives to survive,we teach our Son that education is the best way to get ahead(knoledge is power) and be kind to people.
it seems that in most jobs we both have held there is someone elses rules we need to play by "remember the golden rule" (the one with gold makes the rules) :shock: but that dosn't mean giving up what you believe,my wife spent 12 years in the AirForce as a police officer (sgt.) but if you met her today you would never know it..unless you handed her a rifle or a .45 and asked her to hit a target or break it down.
point is that maybe we have to "play the game to survive" but we can keep who we are and hopefully our children will do better than us if we do all we can to teach them.
I don't know where the heck my rant came from but this is what came to mind after reading the op and some of the replys.
Godfather.
heres a question godfather....
when you told your son education is the best way to get ahead and that knowledge is power, were you speaking of institutionalised education? or autodidactic education?
welll I'm not sure what autodidactic education means but one of things I tell him is pay attention and learn where ever he is,knoledge is never a waste of time.
but to answer your question I was speaking of institional education,common sense will grow as he does and he's pretty sharp for a 19 year old kid.
Interesting thread.. almost too much to comment on.
I think about this all the time because of expectations of others..
I just posted in the "Last movie you saw thread" about a flick called the Giant Mechanical Man. I suggest it to people feeling confused or curious about what path to take in life.
I like this quote, simple, but true:
"Do not go where the path may lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
welll I'm not sure what autodidactic education means but one of things I tell him is pay attention and learn where ever he is,knoledge is never a waste of time.
but to answer your question I was speaking of institional education,common sense will grow as he does and he's pretty sharp for a 19 year old kid.
Godfather.
Most will have a combination of institutionalised and autodidactic learning which, simply put, is learning on your own. Your own initiative, your own research... Like maybe learning to play guitar without a teacher or maybe being interested in astronomy and getting books about it. I'm sure your pretty sharp 19 year old kid will have plenty of this too!
Hopefully, the draw of autodicactic learning will be strong enough to more than supplement/compliment the institutionalised one.
welll I'm not sure what autodidactic education means but one of things I tell him is pay attention and learn where ever he is,knoledge is never a waste of time.
but to answer your question I was speaking of institional education,common sense will grow as he does and he's pretty sharp for a 19 year old kid.
Godfather.
self taught... that's what autodidactic means. as for institutionalised education...
... do you ever think, or know, that it has an agenda... an agenda set by the establishment and that it needs to be approached wearily and with a modicum of detachment knowing that what it has in mind isn't necessarily what is beneficial to the student?
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
0
brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 42,099
Cincybeacat - a lot of people enjoy work, their life, etc. I don't think there is an issue with that at all. We do make our choices. What I think is that what prepares us to life (as young people) is very much the same (at least in the western world) and we have our hands tied to a point - eg compulsory education, etc. Doesn't give much initial scope to be able to 'break away' from this.
Hmmm...perhaps. But school is only part of a child's life. Lot's of time outside school for activities, etc. But I see your point.
I agree with what someone else already said "Work to Live". It's a good strategy. Find something that will provide you with the time and resources to enjoy life and what you want to do. And if they are 1 in the same, terrific.
It's true that school is only part of a child's life, but it has always frustrated me that it is mostly a meaningless part of their lives. And our teachers- even our best teachers (and we have some great teachers right here on this board) have their hands tied by a static system.
One of my cousins put her daughter in a private "alternative" (Quaker, if I recall correctly) that I visited several years ago when I was taking classes to go into teaching. The curriculum in that school was totally integrated- not just integrated in terms of scholastic subjects, but integrated with life as a whole. Work, play, basic skills such as cooking, gardening, sewing, shop- it was all worked in together and I've never seen a healthier, happier group of kids anywhere.
So why is this type of schooling not the norm? Because our educational system is about training worker bees, not creative, whole persons.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.” Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.
Comments
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
it seems that in most jobs we both have held there is someone elses rules we need to play by "remember the golden rule" (the one with gold makes the rules) :shock: but that dosn't mean giving up what you believe,my wife spent 12 years in the AirForce as a police officer (sgt.) but if you met her today you would never know it..unless you handed her a rifle or a .45 and asked her to hit a target or break it down.
point is that maybe we have to "play the game to survive" but we can keep who we are and hopefully our children will do better than us if we do all we can to teach them.
I don't know where the heck my rant came from
Godfather.
but ignored by most here I see :?
I did what I was supposed to do and lived happily ever after in the big picture of life ...
what more could I ask for I've been one lucky lady
heres a question godfather....
when you told your son education is the best way to get ahead and that knowledge is power, were you speaking of institutionalised education? or autodidactic education?
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
but what is it you thought you were 'suppose to do'?
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
I agree.
Love this Brian!
I feel the same way.....Parents set the path on "What we're supposed to do".
and as a parent what is it you think 'were suppose to do?' what is it you tell your children?
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
I do exactly what I want with my life within the confines of what is generally accepted as 'normal'(insert sarcasm)
Seriously, don't most of us follow the traditional dictates whether it be about jobs and how we live our lives? Even those that choose a slightly different path or those that feel 'happy and blessed' to have the life they want. I see that those who seek different ideals and different paths than the traditional American way of life being ridiculed if they don't believe in capitalism or guns or whatever the current topic of the day might be. I'm not saying that any of you are wrong for those beliefs but why are those of us who question these mores made to feel that something is wrong with us? I've spent most of my 20s and 30s seeking to follow that path that was laid out before me and I was very successful in following that path. However, I am now questioning the legitimacy of that very path. It's not bad or wrong but I have come to question the validity of that very way of life. We are living in the box of fear and some don't even know it.
Sorry muddled thoughts at this point so if my rambling doesn't make sense, so sorry. Not meant to be offensive or judgmental towards anyone that is ok with living and following this path but I've personally spent the last 3 years of my life questioning the very dictates that have guided my life since the beginning and it is difficult to reconcile all those parts.
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
I AM MINE
well this is the thing isn't it? who dictates the 'right way to live'. what is acceptable and what is not? whose mores do we follow, accept and whose do we see as abhorrent. and why do we see them as such? speaking as someone who has lived her life arse backwards and with a low regard to what is acceptable I find it interesting what people find 'acceptable' and how they came to this way of thinking. my over riding credo is if you don't fuck with me I wont fuck with you. I will live my life so as not to infringe negatively upon your life. however if you choose to fuck with me or mine then all hell will break upon your head and you will only have yourself to blame. I may forgive but I will not forget and the blame for that will rest upon your shoulders. however the overwhelming feeling is that most likely youre not worth my time and effort so...
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
That's right, nothing. So why does everyone need to make the same choice? You are aware that some people like work.
Not just the traditional 'american' way of life
When not conforming, it would seem one lives an 'alternative' lifestyle. Maybe one day alternative will become the norm!
Cincybeacat - a lot of people enjoy work, their life, etc. I don't think there is an issue with that at all. We do make our choices. What I think is that what prepares us to life (as young people) is very much the same (at least in the western world) and we have our hands tied to a point - eg compulsory education, etc. Doesn't give much initial scope to be able to 'break away' from this.
Hmmm...perhaps. But school is only part of a child's life. Lot's of time outside school for activities, etc. But I see your point.
I agree with what someone else already said "Work to Live". It's a good strategy. Find something that will provide you with the time and resources to enjoy life and what you want to do. And if they are 1 in the same, terrific.
I had in my parents the most wonderful example of lifetime love, friendship, partnership.
What they instilled helped me know what I wanted and needed.
Thankfully JB had the same examples. Thankfully we met and made a grand life...
lifetime love, children, business.
This what I thought I was supposed to do and incredibly it worked out.
50 years ago I wasn't even born so how would I know?? come on Pandora you know your vagueness doesn't fly with me... you've not said what it is you thought you were suppose to do. youve simply danced around giving no specifics. I don't ask question simply to amuse myself. I ask to seek answers and as usual you give none.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
I agree that school is only a part of life but I should have been a bit clearer when I gave this example of compulsory education. Coming back to what riotgrl had to say, it's the state of his education, wondering if the goal of education is the right one. If parents deem their child would be much better traveling the world and learning those life skills, that is not accepted. Naturally, there is home schooling but even that is regimented!
Also, maybe due to the parents' life, their upbringing, etc., they may not have the skills to enable the child to develop outside the school.
Work to live is definitely a good goal, though some people's 'passion'/goal may be success/money/riches and it is their choice to 'live for work'.
I think the basis of the OP is that 'we' have too many expectations dumped on us (and we 'dump' the same way on others), expecting things to be just so - go a certain way, follow a certain path and we are 'trained' for that. For example, in some western countries, women are still expected to be somewhat educated, well groomed, get married, have babies and look after their house and husband who will be bringing in the money. Outdated 'values' maybe but high expectations and one is 'moulded' into those expectations and accepts them. This is just an easy example - there are many more. Breaking this mould is made difficult by society as a whole and by one's self as well.
A man of my heart....
So true though - what is known is comfort. A path 'planned' by society is comfort in a way. Deviating from that path can be scary.
Edit: Another one from him (and apt to the discussion)
“The most important kind of freedom is to be what you really are. You trade in your reality for a role. You trade in your sense for an act. You give up your ability to feel, and in exchange, put on a mask. There can't be any large-scale revolution until there's a personal revolution, on and individual level. It's got to happen inside first. You can take away a man's political freedom and you won't hurt him- unless you take away his freedom to feel. That can destroy him. That kind of freedom can't be granted. Nobody can win it for you.”
the worst thing you can do is to tell me to what im suppose to do. my life is my own and as long as my children grow up intelligent, strong, with the ability to think for themselves and aware that society doesn't have their best interests at heart then that's all that matters.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Last hour or so, I've had this part of Guaranteed in my mind.
"leave it to me as I find a way to be
consider me a satellite forever orbiting
I knew all the rules
but the rules did not know me"
(and this too - "there's still time to change the road you're on" - if you want to)
don't get on your high horse with me pandora. you dont intimidate me nor do i think cause youre older youre the font of all knowledge and reason. I asked you a question, one of many and one finally youve felt the need to answer.. and yet you do so with some sort of superior attitude. are you fuckin' kidding me? lifetime love, children and business?? that's your specifics??? your parents instilled on you a need for children, lifetime love and business??? but what is it they said about those things? did they tell you that business was something that was expected of you? that love and children were what was required of you in this life? or did they say that these things would form the basis of a long and fruitful life? what was the advice they gave you? what was theyre expectation for you in relation to what society expected? you say you thought that this is what was expected of you, but what was it that you wanted? and did you ever think, even once, that this was the 'wrong' course? and did you think because it all worked out for you that it was the right thing? do/did you ever think there could be more?
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
welll I'm not sure what autodidactic education means
but to answer your question I was speaking of institional education,common sense will grow as he does and he's pretty sharp for a 19 year old kid.
Godfather.
I think about this all the time because of expectations of others..
I just posted in the "Last movie you saw thread" about a flick called the Giant Mechanical Man. I suggest it to people feeling confused or curious about what path to take in life.
I like this quote, simple, but true:
"Do not go where the path may lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
Most will have a combination of institutionalised and autodidactic learning which, simply put, is learning on your own. Your own initiative, your own research... Like maybe learning to play guitar without a teacher or maybe being interested in astronomy and getting books about it. I'm sure your pretty sharp 19 year old kid will have plenty of this too!
Hopefully, the draw of autodicactic learning will be strong enough to more than supplement/compliment the institutionalised one.
self taught... that's what autodidactic means. as for institutionalised education...
... do you ever think, or know, that it has an agenda... an agenda set by the establishment and that it needs to be approached wearily and with a modicum of detachment knowing that what it has in mind isn't necessarily what is beneficial to the student?
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
It's true that school is only part of a child's life, but it has always frustrated me that it is mostly a meaningless part of their lives. And our teachers- even our best teachers (and we have some great teachers right here on this board) have their hands tied by a static system.
One of my cousins put her daughter in a private "alternative" (Quaker, if I recall correctly) that I visited several years ago when I was taking classes to go into teaching. The curriculum in that school was totally integrated- not just integrated in terms of scholastic subjects, but integrated with life as a whole. Work, play, basic skills such as cooking, gardening, sewing, shop- it was all worked in together and I've never seen a healthier, happier group of kids anywhere.
So why is this type of schooling not the norm? Because our educational system is about training worker bees, not creative, whole persons.