Do you think Fetuses have souls?

pj1981

If souls exist, if we have them then of course fetuses do too. I imagine everlasting energy
that we all share. Intelligent and emotional energy that is life. This energy that is us begins its life at conception.

Hugh Freaking Dillon

Prince Of Dorkness wrote:

dancepartner wrote:

But for the women who use abortion as a form of birth control — they have no soul.

There are no women who use abortion as birth control.

:fp:

actually, I know one. I slept with her. I later found out why she didn't care to use protection. She would just go get an abortion if she got pregnant. So yes, she used abortion as birth control. However, I don't believe this is common.

even flow - question mark

Worried about a fetus having a soul, but very quick to tell me that my pet dog, cat, fish, the cow in the barnyard, the horse I ride, the seal I club, the polar bear in the artic, etc....don't have souls. Odd, very, very, odd.

hedonist

even flow - question mark wrote:

Worried about a fetus having a soul, but very quick to tell me that my pet dog, cat, fish, the cow in the barnyard, the horse I ride, the seal I club, the polar bear in the artic, etc....don't have souls. Odd, very, very, odd.

Not sure to whom that was directed, but if souls do exist (and I liken the word "soul" to spirit, or energy, or intelligence), they're not exclusive to human beings.

Ever looked into the eyes of a gorilla? Hell, even our cats.

(and hell yes too, even the seal you club. I'll assume that was intended with humor/sarcasm)

It's funny too, how most - myself included - took the initial post to be about aborted life. Not sure if that was the intent, but seems how it's been generally taken. So I ask again, does one mourn in the same way the loss of life via an abortion as they would a miscarriage? Consider the former as not having a soul or spirit, and the latter as having it? And if so, why?

I still think the gum-on-shoe analogy is dismissive of how those fetuses died, whether the death was intentional or not.

inmytree

even flow - question mark wrote:

Worried about a fetus having a soul, but very quick to tell me that my pet dog, cat, fish, the cow in the barnyard, the horse I ride, the seal I club, the polar bear in the artic, etc....don't have souls. Odd, very, very, odd.

lolz....

glad so see some activity out of you, my friend...

Hugh Freaking Dillon

hedonist wrote:

even flow - question mark wrote:

Worried about a fetus having a soul, but very quick to tell me that my pet dog, cat, fish, the cow in the barnyard, the horse I ride, the seal I club, the polar bear in the artic, etc....don't have souls. Odd, very, very, odd.

Not sure to whom that was directed, but if souls do exist (and I liken the word "soul" to spirit, or energy, or intelligence), they're not exclusive to human beings.

Ever looked into the eyes of a gorilla? Hell, even our cats.

(and hell yes too, even the seal you club. I'll assume that was intended with humor/sarcasm)

It's funny too, how most - myself included - took the initial post to be about aborted life. Not sure if that was the intent, but seems how it's been generally taken. So I ask again, does one mourn in the same way the loss of life via an abortion as they would a miscarriage? Consider the former as not having a soul or spirit, and the latter as having it? And if so, why?

I still think the gum-on-shoe analogy is dismissive of how those fetuses died, whether the death was intentional or not.

I thought it was generally accepted amongst religious folks that only humans have souls and go to heaven?

even flow - question mark

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

hedonist wrote:

even flow - question mark wrote:

Worried about a fetus having a soul, but very quick to tell me that my pet dog, cat, fish, the cow in the barnyard, the horse I ride, the seal I club, the polar bear in the artic, etc....don't have souls. Odd, very, very, odd.

Not sure to whom that was directed, but if souls do exist (and I liken the word "soul" to spirit, or energy, or intelligence), they're not exclusive to human beings.

Ever looked into the eyes of a gorilla? Hell, even our cats.

(and hell yes too, even the seal you club. I'll assume that was intended with humor/sarcasm)

It's funny too, how most - myself included - took the initial post to be about aborted life. Not sure if that was the intent, but seems how it's been generally taken. So I ask again, does one mourn in the same way the loss of life via an abortion as they would a miscarriage? Consider the former as not having a soul or spirit, and the latter as having it? And if so, why?

I still think the gum-on-shoe analogy is dismissive of how those fetuses died, whether the death was intentional or not.

I thought it was generally accepted amongst religious folks that only humans have souls and go to heaven?

nyuk, nyuk, jokes on them.

hedonist

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

hedonist wrote:

Not sure to whom that was directed, but if souls do exist (and I liken the word "soul" to spirit, or energy, or intelligence), they're not exclusive to human beings.

Ever looked into the eyes of a gorilla? Hell, even our cats.

(and hell yes too, even the seal you club. I'll assume that was intended with humor/sarcasm)

It's funny too, how most - myself included - took the initial post to be about aborted life. Not sure if that was the intent, but seems how it's been generally taken. So I ask again, does one mourn in the same way the loss of life via an abortion as they would a miscarriage? Consider the former as not having a soul or spirit, and the latter as having it? And if so, why?

I still think the gum-on-shoe analogy is dismissive of how those fetuses died, whether the death was intentional or not.

I thought it was generally accepted amongst religious folks that only humans have souls and go to heaven?

But one can believe in the soul (catchall word) and not in heaven; they're not mutually-exclusive.

(that said, I'm not sure I've heard the only-humans-in-heaven theory)

even flow - question mark

inmytree wrote:

even flow - question mark wrote:

Worried about a fetus having a soul, but very quick to tell me that my pet dog, cat, fish, the cow in the barnyard, the horse I ride, the seal I club, the polar bear in the artic, etc....don't have souls. Odd, very, very, odd.

lolz....

glad so see some activity out of you, my friend...

WHERE'S THE VW BITCH?????? I mean Champ!

A bit of spare time on my hands now and then.

even flow - question mark

hedonist wrote:

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

hedonist wrote:

Not sure to whom that was directed, but if souls do exist (and I liken the word "soul" to spirit, or energy, or intelligence), they're not exclusive to human beings.

Ever looked into the eyes of a gorilla? Hell, even our cats.

(and hell yes too, even the seal you club. I'll assume that was intended with humor/sarcasm)

It's funny too, how most - myself included - took the initial post to be about aborted life. Not sure if that was the intent, but seems how it's been generally taken. So I ask again, does one mourn in the same way the loss of life via an abortion as they would a miscarriage? Consider the former as not having a soul or spirit, and the latter as having it? And if so, why?

I still think the gum-on-shoe analogy is dismissive of how those fetuses died, whether the death was intentional or not.

I thought it was generally accepted amongst religious folks that only humans have souls and go to heaven?

But one can believe in the soul (catchall word) and not in heaven; they're not mutually-exclusive.

(that said, I'm not sure I've heard the only-humans-in-heaven theory)

True be dat. And I will concur with you about the energy thingy, but I refuse to say soul. Cause I believe in ghosts and for me to make that statement it is either an energy or a soul. I prefer...energy.

Jeanwah

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

Prince Of Dorkness wrote:

dancepartner wrote:

But for the women who use abortion as a form of birth control — they have no soul.

There are no women who use abortion as birth control.

:fp:

actually, I know one. I slept with her. I later found out why she didn't care to use protection. She would just go get an abortion if she got pregnant. So yes, she used abortion as birth control. However, I don't believe this is common.

Why didn't you use protection? Not to be so abrasive, but you know that it takes two to tango...

inmytree

even flow - question mark wrote:

inmytree wrote:

even flow - question mark wrote:

Worried about a fetus having a soul, but very quick to tell me that my pet dog, cat, fish, the cow in the barnyard, the horse I ride, the seal I club, the polar bear in the artic, etc....don't have souls. Odd, very, very, odd.

lolz....

glad so see some activity out of you, my friend...

WHERE'S THE VW BITCH?????? I mean Champ!

A bit of spare time on my hands now and then.

she's safe and sound in the driveway...don't you worry...I'll take you for a ride when you come and visit...

Jeanwah

hedonist wrote:

even flow - question mark wrote:

Worried about a fetus having a soul, but very quick to tell me that my pet dog, cat, fish, the cow in the barnyard, the horse I ride, the seal I club, the polar bear in the artic, etc....don't have souls. Odd, very, very, odd.

Not sure to whom that was directed, but if souls do exist (and I liken the word "soul" to spirit, or energy, or intelligence), they're not exclusive to human beings.

Ever looked into the eyes of a gorilla? Hell, even our cats.

(and hell yes too, even the seal you club. I'll assume that was intended with humor/sarcasm)

It's funny too, how most - myself included - took the initial post to be about aborted life. Not sure if that was the intent, but seems how it's been generally taken. So I ask again, does one mourn in the same way the loss of life via an abortion as they would a miscarriage? Consider the former as not having a soul or spirit, and the latter as having it? And if so, why?

I still think the gum-on-shoe analogy is dismissive of how those fetuses died, whether the death was intentional or not.

(to the bolded part) It's likely to be a very personal experience and not one that can be generalized. I've known women to very much mourn... and I'm sure others who don't. Me, I've had a miscarriage - a LOT of women have them. And yes I did mourn.

To me, we're souls borrowing a human body than the other way around. The spirit lives before the birth of a human, and they continue on after the body dies. Spirit continues...

hedonist

Jeanwah wrote:

hedonist wrote:

Not sure to whom that was directed, but if souls do exist (and I liken the word "soul" to spirit, or energy, or intelligence), they're not exclusive to human beings.

Ever looked into the eyes of a gorilla? Hell, even our cats.

(and hell yes too, even the seal you club. I'll assume that was intended with humor/sarcasm)

It's funny too, how most - myself included - took the initial post to be about aborted life. Not sure if that was the intent, but seems how it's been generally taken. So I ask again, does one mourn in the same way the loss of life via an abortion as they would a miscarriage? Consider the former as not having a soul or spirit, and the latter as having it? And if so, why?

I still think the gum-on-shoe analogy is dismissive of how those fetuses died, whether the death was intentional or not.

(to the bolded part) It's likely to be a very personal experience and not one that can be generalized. I've known women to very much mourn... and I'm sure others who don't. Me, I've had a miscarriage - a LOT of women have them. And yes I did mourn.

I can respect this (and I'm sorry for your loss). I hope my question didn't come off as flippant or insinuating that all grieve (or not) as they need. It was more tied into the initial post, which struck me as a bit light for a rather heavy subject.

Probably just my own perception though.

MotoDC

davidtrios wrote:

if you think fetuses have souls, imagine would heaven would be like. you'd be tip toe-ing around, trying not to step on them. if you did, it would be like bubble gum stuck to your shoes.

I think what bothers me the most about this thread is the implication that if I die a crotchety and hardly able 95-year old man, and go to heaven, that I'm going to be a crotchety and hardly able 95-year old man in heaven. Forever. What kind of paradise is that?

Jeanwah

hedonist wrote:

Jeanwah wrote:

hedonist wrote:

Not sure to whom that was directed, but if souls do exist (and I liken the word "soul" to spirit, or energy, or intelligence), they're not exclusive to human beings.

Ever looked into the eyes of a gorilla? Hell, even our cats.

(and hell yes too, even the seal you club. I'll assume that was intended with humor/sarcasm)

It's funny too, how most - myself included - took the initial post to be about aborted life. Not sure if that was the intent, but seems how it's been generally taken. So I ask again, does one mourn in the same way the loss of life via an abortion as they would a miscarriage? Consider the former as not having a soul or spirit, and the latter as having it? And if so, why?

I still think the gum-on-shoe analogy is dismissive of how those fetuses died, whether the death was intentional or not.

(to the bolded part) It's likely to be a very personal experience and not one that can be generalized. I've known women to very much mourn... and I'm sure others who don't. Me, I've had a miscarriage - a LOT of women have them. And yes I did mourn.

I can respect this (and I'm sorry for your loss). I hope my question didn't come off as flippant or insinuating that all grieve (or not) as they need. It was more tied into the initial post, which struck me as a bit light for a rather heavy subject.

Probably just my own perception though.

Not at all.

Prince Of Dorkness

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

actually, I know one. I slept with her. I later found out why she didn't care to use protection. She would just go get an abortion if she got pregnant. So yes, she used abortion as birth control. However, I don't believe this is common.

Um... Ok not to point out the screamingly obvious... but saying that "SHE" didn't care to use protection is false.

Birth control isn't just the woman's responsibility. You also didn't use protection. So you should have said "WE." Unless she tied you up and had sex with you against your will, that was also partly your job and you chose not to do it.

So don't be blaming her... technically even if she DID use abortion for birth control... she still used more than you did.

Right?

Or wait... if your form of birth control "lose the slut's phone number once I had my fun?"

Hugh Freaking Dillon

Jeanwah wrote:

Why didn't you use protection? Not to be so abrasive, but you know that it takes two to tango...

I was young and stupid (many many years ago). I'm not blaming her for anything, all I was saying was this was the reason that I found out later why she didn't care about using it.

Hugh Freaking Dillon

hedonist wrote:

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

hedonist wrote:

Not sure to whom that was directed, but if souls do exist (and I liken the word "soul" to spirit, or energy, or intelligence), they're not exclusive to human beings.

Ever looked into the eyes of a gorilla? Hell, even our cats.

(and hell yes too, even the seal you club. I'll assume that was intended with humor/sarcasm)

It's funny too, how most - myself included - took the initial post to be about aborted life. Not sure if that was the intent, but seems how it's been generally taken. So I ask again, does one mourn in the same way the loss of life via an abortion as they would a miscarriage? Consider the former as not having a soul or spirit, and the latter as having it? And if so, why?

I still think the gum-on-shoe analogy is dismissive of how those fetuses died, whether the death was intentional or not.

I thought it was generally accepted amongst religious folks that only humans have souls and go to heaven?

But one can believe in the soul (catchall word) and not in heaven; they're not mutually-exclusive.

(that said, I'm not sure I've heard the only-humans-in-heaven theory)

could be just my brother and his religion.

oceaninmyeyes

Jeanwah wrote:

hedonist wrote:

Not sure to whom that was directed, but if souls do exist (and I liken the word "soul" to spirit, or energy, or intelligence), they're not exclusive to human beings.

Ever looked into the eyes of a gorilla? Hell, even our cats.

(and hell yes too, even the seal you club. I'll assume that was intended with humor/sarcasm)

It's funny too, how most - myself included - took the initial post to be about aborted life. Not sure if that was the intent, but seems how it's been generally taken. So I ask again, does one mourn in the same way the loss of life via an abortion as they would a miscarriage? Consider the former as not having a soul or spirit, and the latter as having it? And if so, why?

I still think the gum-on-shoe analogy is dismissive of how those fetuses died, whether the death was intentional or not.

(to the bolded part) It's likely to be a very personal experience and not one that can be generalized. I've known women to very much mourn... and I'm sure others who don't. Me, I've had a miscarriage - a LOT of women have them. And yes I did mourn.

Jeanwah - I agree. I've had a couple miscarriages, and grieving is a natural part of that. I am sure that there are callous women who may not think too much about having an abortion, I don't think they are the general rule though. The out-of-pocket expense would be a great hindrance if nothing else, not to mention the physical discomfort. As far as grieving after an abortion goes, what about the couple who is happy to be pregnant and then discovers to their horror that there is something so wrong that it is incompatible with life? I would guess that the grieving begins with that diagnosis and carries on long after the pregnancy is terminated.