I get what you're saying, but cooking good food healthfully is really, really expensive. Partly because non-processed foods and healthfully-sourced fish are pretty expensive, but also because of the waste (the amount of produce my wife and I throw out because we can't finish it before it goes bad is embarrassing).
I am not sure I buy cost of healthy food as a valid excuse. I mean sure shopping at a place like Whole Foods and only buying super healthy food is of course super expensive compared to a quarter pounder value meal. But buying moderatly healthy food is way cheaper than hitting up McDonalds. I mean you can pick up things like bags of frozen vegatbles or rice, or cans of tuna or beans or even chicken pieces or eggs, at the grocery store for super cheap. I mean yes those things are the most healthy things in the world but a meal of chicken, rice and some steamed frozen vegatables is way more healthy and cheaper than eating a big mac. But ordering a big mac or a pizza is easier so I think a lot of that comes down to lazyness.
Totally agree that there is a spectrum of prices for healthy(ier) food. Starting at the top -- fully organic, locally sourced, hand-massaged (haha), all that....then moving to whole foods type stuff...then the more basic rice/chicken/frozen veggies. I'd be interested to see if that last category is actually cheaper than a value meal and McDonald's. I'd be surprised if it were, but I don't know.
That aside, my initial point was more a rebuttal of RW's position that the mere existence of the profit motive in our food chain was enough to ensure that unhealthy options would always win out. The existence of (extremely) profitable companies selling healthy food belies that position somewhat.
It's cheap to eat healthy. Basic veggies and fruit, eggs and milk, canned goods, bread and lean ground beef (for the B12 and iron and zinc) is all cheap. People can be healthy for cheap if they want. I personally think that people just like food that tastes really good, and the majority of people think that McDonald's fries and quarter pounder,pizza, and Chinese take-out is tastier (and way easier) than basic healthy groceries. Not cheaper. And honestly, I'm pretty sure most people, particularly less educated people, really don't understand nutrition enough to know what is really really bad for you and why. I.e., many people don't know that one slice of garlic bread is as bad for you as a candy bar. But it is. A lot of people also don't know that drinking a glass of orange juice is as bad for you as a can of Coke with a vitamin C pill on the side.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Good point. There aren't really any grocery stores in Manhattan either I noticed when I went. Just take out places, food carts (including a fruit and veggie cart or stand here and there), and restaurants. No one wants to cook much in NYC as far as I can tell, hence no Safeways.
That's what happens when your kitchen is the size of an airplane bathroom.
... I certainly believe in personal responsbility and as a working mother I cook all the food for my family regardless of how tired I am; ...
lets not start thinking we are all the same. because you can do it doesnt mean all parents can. this is not an attack on you, im just saying.
Exactly what I was saying - just because I can do it doesn't mean others can or have the time or even want to. We need alot of options like education, like corporate responsibility, like nutrition labels to help everyone make the best choices possible.
Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
... I certainly believe in personal responsbility and as a working mother I cook all the food for my family regardless of how tired I am; ...
lets not start thinking we are all the same. because you can do it doesnt mean all parents can. this is not an attack on you, im just saying.
Exactly what I was saying - just because I can do it doesn't mean others can or have the time or even want to. We need alot of options like education, like corporate responsibility, like nutrition labels to help everyone make the best choices possible.
Agreed. Never good to become self-righteous when it comes to this issue. That's the kind of thing that makes people think they can hate fat people for being fat.
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Good point. There aren't really any grocery stores in Manhattan either I noticed when I went. Just take out places, food carts (including a fruit and veggie cart or stand here and there), and restaurants. No one wants to cook much in NYC as far as I can tell, hence no Safeways.
There are plenty of grocery stores/markets. Most importantly, there is a wide range of options, due to a more diverse citizenship: cuisines, specialty shops, smaller markets, health food stores, and big chains.
so let me get this straight, every individual has a timer on them that says when they become responsible for their own behavior, and it starts at exactly the same point in everyone's life cycle? how oversimplistic and absolutely absurd. .
No, I wouldn't say it's exactly the same for everyone. I'd say it's roughly around those points. Regardless of the age, there is always someone responsible (parent or child or mix). I know you dislike the thought of personal responsibility. You want to blame markets, capitalism and broader elements.... which I think (and know) is oversimplisitic and absolutely absurd. Capitalism, markets and broader elements don't put the food you eat in your mouth, chew it, and swallow for you.... You do.
it's funny that you call me a deflectionist as I am writing a presentation on the collision of being self-responsible, political, and interventionist and the contradictions that we all live with. .
No offense - I don't care what you're writing about and have no clue why this was brought up.
of course it's easier to sleep at night if we only criticize one (for you the individual, for me the system), and don't think about the other. .
Ironically, I've already said marketing can affect "preferences", for better or worse nutritionally. I've also said big government bodies like the FDA, tend to be corrupt, which can alter food safety. So, yes government and capitalism can have some effect on food. But, it's not like food that's nutritious is not available. Even at McDonalds they now have apple slices, etc. They may not be the best, but there's "more" nutritious options at fast food eateries than there once was. Regardless of the aforementioned, it's still the individual (or the parent, or both) that kinda is responsible in the long run. They make the final decision to walk into McDonalds, avoid the apple slices and choose the large fry. That's what you want to avoid.
in other words are you any less deflectionist (just in a different way) when you deny the a/effects a neoliberal economy has on shaping people's behavior and responsibility (or lack thereof)? .
No, I'm not. Once again, I admit that preferences may be semi-altered by capitalistic marketing. But, I also KNOW the individual makes the final say. I've never seen neoliberal economies literally put their hands on food and shove it in people's mouths and force them to swallow.
As for you, yes you seem to be a deflectionist. You seem to blame capitalism for individual decisions. Your focus have been completely OUTSIDE the scope of the person who chews the food. It's as if individuals have no choice to put food in their mouths and swallow. They may have less options, but they still have choice.
i mean jason p just put it out there: under the auspices of corporate capitalism companies like pizza hut have to infiltrate the minds of children (before they are responsible for their behavior based on your complex timeline) in order to stay in business. if this were not effective wouldn't they stop doing it? .
I don't know why you tend to go so far out there. Re-read everything I've written. Of course marketing sways behavior. But, you seem to believe that nutritional marketing does not. I say that's BS. Tons of examples of movement towards nutrition are available, even in fast food. At the end of the day, fatty food ads and nutrional ads should be allowed. And people should be able to decide. I see nothing wrong with being swayed to have a burger now and again. If you're responsible for your own actions, you'll know that you can afford that every now and again.
however, he claims that he gained weight because he's less active. although the idea that we are less active as a society is fallacious (we are actually more active than ever before), for him, as an individual, this is because work (he needs to make money to be able to keep eating shitty food) and other personal issues have come in the way. plus as he outlines playstation only stays on the market if it sells more, same with pharma companies, gym memberships, and food companies - so the underlying thread here is that capitalism creates the context from which individuals choose to behave. .
I know what you're getting at, but simply disagree on certain points. I agree with you that we're more active now. But, people, particularly in America eat worse, or have for a long time. Many (NOT ALL) parents grew up with a lack of personal responsibility for what they ate, or lack of knowledge of the effects. My point is that's individualized, and in my opinion, is starting to change. Why? Well, people are learning it's bad for them. Markets are responding to this change in demand for nutritious products. For example, my wife and I get organic vegetables delivered to our house. Several years back, we would not have "demanded" that, nor would an organization exist that would deliver that to your doorstep. That's capitalism/markets and that's good. It's not markets' fault. Capitalism or free-markets don't create demand, they respond to it.
i say it's silly just to blame the individual when it's clearly a systemic problem that creates a situation whereby individuals have the opportunity to make poor choices. this doesn't mean that i'm taking the blame away from individuals, it means that the responsibility is shared between the system and the individual. however, to criticize the system in your worldview is heretic it seems.
Individuals make poor decisions every day. I suppose you'd like to ban the possibility of poor decisions? How would you do that,... with an FDA-like body? ha ha.
I say individuals are capable of making poor decisions. I don't think it's the system's fault for their poor decisions. And further, I think there's absolutely no way "the system" or "government" or "anyone" can stop poor decisions from occurring. I mean, you really need to think through what you're saying. Should we ban alcohol? In that light, your argument seems to say that capitalism is creating liver problems from alcohol. It's not the person who drinks a fifth of whiskey every night or even his addiction, it's capitalism.
it's seems like we are arguing in circles here. after thoroughly reading your post it seems like you admit that there are systemic issues, but that, in the end it's still the individual's choice to do or not to do. i'm basically arguing the same thing. however, where we ultimately disagree is at the point of consumption what was going on in the person's head/body that compelled them to consume that food. in other words what was so affective about that particular product.
for you the individual operates somewhat independently of the structures guiding their lives, for me, i believe that the person consumes based on individual choice influenced in and through a variety of things that may or may not be in their best interest/fit their politics. the reason i talked about my paper was that i am working through why i would, for example, buy products from victoria's secret when it would seem to contradict my socio-political belief in feminism. what is so overpowering about their goods? do they really make a better product than other lingerie stores or is it a combination of a good product, good marketing, years of being persuaded to objectify women, mixed with my own affective desire that then compells me to go "yeah i'm gonna drop $10 on this product so my wife fits the social ideal of a 'sexy' body". getting back to food what is going through an individual's head, who is committed to being healthy, when they decide to forgo the whole foods and eat a $5 footlong from Subway with Jared's smiling mug telling them it's so good? is it simply taste? poor choices? a poor food culture in America? i don't think it's as simple as any of that, and it's kind of unmeasurable to see how much a choice was socially constructed and individually acted on.
[It's cheap to eat healthy. Basic veggies and fruit, eggs and milk, canned goods, bread and lean ground beef (for the B12 and iron and zinc) is all cheap. People can be healthy for cheap if they want. I personally think that people just like food that tastes really good, and the majority of people think that McDonald's fries and quarter pounder,pizza, and Chinese take-out is tastier (and way easier) than basic healthy groceries. Not cheaper. And honestly, I'm pretty sure most people, particularly less educated people, really don't understand nutrition enough to know what is really really bad for you and why. I.e., many people don't know that one slice of garlic bread is as bad for you as a candy bar. But it is. A lot of people also don't know that drinking a glass of orange juice is as bad for you as a can of Coke with a vitamin C pill on the side
Hi PJ_soul...I am a single dad and try so very very hard to provide good nutrition to my boys...you are right that many people dont understand enough about nutrition...I must be among the uneducated I am afraid...that blows me away that a glass of orange juice is as bad as a can of coke...makes me wonder about what other mistakes I am making!
Do you know any good, user friendly books I could get to educate myself???
"God created surfing and Pearl Jam so that the truely gifted, talented and most intelligent people wouldnt rule the world"...adapted from my bumper sticker
Fast food tastes like crap compared to home cooked ...
really just in and of itself no comparison needed.
If people would lay off for awhile and cook they would know this.
I swear fast food must be addicting the way some people eat it.
2 meals a day sometimes 3 :wtf:
Then getting their young kids to eat it that often they know nothing else growing up.
I've had children come to the house for meals not knowing what a carrot is :shock:
checking out at the grocery store I was asked by a young checker what celery was ...
alrighty then
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Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,200
I haven't read this entire thread but another contribution to America's unhealthy culture is the reduction of Physical Education in schools today. None of my 3 children at the moment take PE...2 in HS and 1 in MS. If is wan't for their oustside physical activity 2 in football and the other a competitive swimmer they probably be very out of shape. Many schools give the children the option of taking PE and many choose NOT to take it.
This is NOT good news in this computer age where many children are sitting and not being as active as they need to be. The heart is a muscle that needs to be kept active so it prolong a long life...bring back exercise in schools.
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
I haven't read this entire thread but another contribution to America's unhealthy culture is the reduction of Physical Education in schools today. None of my 3 children at the moment take PE...2 in HS and 1 in MS. If is wan't for their oustside physical activity 2 in football and the other a competitive swimmer they probably be very out of shape. Many schools give the children the option of taking PE and many choose NOT to take it.
This is NOT good news in this computer age where many children are sitting and not being as active as they need to be. The heart is a muscle that needs to be kept active so it prolong a long life...bring back exercise in schools.
Wow...I had no idea. PE was a requirement when I was in junior high and high school. Even in elementary school, recess was all about handball, tetherball, etc. - activity. Granted it's been many years since I was in school, but I just figured it was still in place.
How has Mrs. Obama not gotten all over this? Or has she?
(plus, why should today's kids be deprived of the shame of those awful PE uniforms and showering afterward?)
It's cheap to eat healthy. Basic veggies and fruit, eggs and milk, canned goods, bread and lean ground beef (for the B12 and iron and zinc) is all cheap. People can be healthy for cheap if they want. I personally think that people just like food that tastes really good, and the majority of people think that McDonald's fries and quarter pounder,pizza, and Chinese take-out is tastier (and way easier) than basic healthy groceries. Not cheaper. And honestly, I'm pretty sure most people, particularly less educated people, really don't understand nutrition enough to know what is really really bad for you and why. I.e., many people don't know that one slice of garlic bread is as bad for you as a candy bar. But it is. A lot of people also don't know that drinking a glass of orange juice is as bad for you as a can of Coke with a vitamin C pill on the side
Hi PJ_soul...I am a single dad and try so very very hard to provide good nutrition to my boys...you are right that many people dont understand enough about nutrition...I must be among the uneducated I am afraid...that blows me away that a glass of orange juice is as bad as a can of coke...makes me wonder about what other mistakes I am making!
Do you know any good, user friendly books I could get to educate myself???
Bindy, you didn't know that b/c it's not true. The notion that a glass of OJ is as bad for you as a glass of coke just demonstrates the nutritional ignorance (not saying PJsoul is ignorant -- perhaps he/she just didn't feel like putting it all down here) in America. A glass of OJ is calorically just as bad as Coke (which, admittedly, DOES surprise alot of people), but in terms of chemicals, preservatives, processing, etc, it's not even close. And for 95% of young, active kids, the 150ish calories in a glass of OJ are no big deal. The problem is if they drink half the carton of OJ and then go play Warcraft for 5 hours.
PJsoul - I already said it's possible to eat healthy relatively cheaply. Indeed, not everything has to be organic, gourmet, from Whole Foods. And if you want to eat nothing but plain, unflavored chicken, steamed veggies, and plain rice for every meal, then sure, in small portions that's probably about as cheap as fast food. However, that's a pretty boring, unrealistic, unsustainable diet. Oil, spices, sauces, etc, (i.e., flavor) all add up in terms of cost and, of course, calories.
Overall, 1/4 pounders, mass-produced pizza, and chinese take out don't "taste good". They overload the primary sensors -- salt, sweet, fat -- and train us to only enjoy those. It's more like addiction than an appreciation of what "tastes good".
edit: Of course I realize "fat" is not part of the primary taste spectrum, but it serves to enhance the other two -- salty and sweet.
the thing to note about fast food and a lot of processed junk food is that they are designed (operative word) to be like cigarettes in that you continually crave it ... a lot of people are actually addicted to coke and soft drinks ... fast food places like mcdonalds if eaten often will make you crave it ... for lack of a better phrase ... it feeds itself ...
i do think the point about ignorance is significant ... it can be confusing to someone when they are inundated with advertising and information that are only partial truths ... it's unsettling to know what certain industries get away with ...
if people want to be healthy - diet is by far the number 1 change they will have to make ... and then exercise ...
... A lot of people also don't know that drinking a glass of orange juice is as bad for you as a can of Coke with a vitamin C pill on the side...
make sure that glass of OJ is freshly squeezed. commercial juice just looks wrong. not to mention what they put in it. and its colour is def not the colour of orange juice straight from nature. the toddlermonster gets a kick out of watching me squeeze oranges(and lemons for that matter). its like some sort of revelation to her tiny mind. plus im sure she likes that im doing something for her. plus its good exercise for your hands.
Post edited by catefrances on
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the thing to note about fast food and a lot of processed junk food is that they are designed (operative word) to be like cigarettes in that you continually crave it ... a lot of people are actually addicted to coke and soft drinks ... fast food places like mcdonalds if eaten often will make you crave it ... for lack of a better phrase ... it feeds itself ...
i do think the point about ignorance is significant ... it can be confusing to someone when they are inundated with advertising and information that are only partial truths ... it's unsettling to know what certain industries get away with ...
if people want to be healthy - diet is by far the number 1 change they will have to make ... and then exercise ...
but now you are taking the sole blame away from the individual, and, apparently, there is no room for structural influence in our lives.
[It's cheap to eat healthy. Basic veggies and fruit, eggs and milk, canned goods, bread and lean ground beef (for the B12 and iron and zinc) is all cheap. People can be healthy for cheap if they want. I personally think that people just like food that tastes really good, and the majority of people think that McDonald's fries and quarter pounder,pizza, and Chinese take-out is tastier (and way easier) than basic healthy groceries. Not cheaper. And honestly, I'm pretty sure most people, particularly less educated people, really don't understand nutrition enough to know what is really really bad for you and why. I.e., many people don't know that one slice of garlic bread is as bad for you as a candy bar. But it is. A lot of people also don't know that drinking a glass of orange juice is as bad for you as a can of Coke with a vitamin C pill on the side
[quote/]Hi PJ_soul...I am a single dad and try so very very hard to provide good nutrition to my boys...you are right that many people dont understand enough about nutrition...I must be among the uneducated I am afraid...that blows me away that a glass of orange juice is as bad as a can of coke...makes me wonder about what other mistakes I am making!
Do you know any good, user friendly books I could get to educate myself???
Hi Bindy. Hmm. I do know a lot about it, but I'm afraid I've gleaned my knowledge over a long period of time from many different sources, so I can't recommend a particular place for you to go... But this is some advice:
The main problem with foods that are bad for you and cause weight gain is that they contain too many calories and/or fat and/or sugars (carbs). The food that is surprisingly unhealthy (like fruit juice and starches) tends to have one thing in common - a very high amount of sugar and carbs. Juice is a big one. Many of the schools who took soda out of schools also removed all juice from vending machines as well because the calorie and sugar content are the same. ALL fruit juice is simply incredibly high in calories because they have a high concentration of sugar (just think of how many oranges go into one glass of orange juice... once may as well eat 8 oranges in one go; an average glass of the stuff has 350 calories). So I would avoid juice for the most part, and stick with water and actual whole fruit only. Bread is also one. One bagel, for example, normally has 350 - 500 calories per! Make a sandwich with that and add mayo, cheese, meat, etc, and a salad with ranch dressing on the side and a glass of juice or milk, all of a sudden you've got a lunch that is as much as 1000+ calories, nearly half of what many people should eat in a whole day.
Fat is other big factor obviously - everyone knows that. The fries and ice cream and what not is obvious, but other things not as much. For example, a noodle cup has as much fat in it as 2 candy bars! 2% milk has, of course, double the fat as 1%. Cheese is basically solid fat, so go for the reduced fat harder cheeses, like medium half fat cheddar, which is actually still very tasty (the softer the cheese, the higher the fat) ... and so on. I really think it's just a matter of reading ALL labels for calories, carbs (sugars), and fat, and to pay special attention to the serving portions that the labels are talking about. I.e. one of those little bag of chips might have 40 chips in it, but the label is only giving you the nutritional info on 17 chips, not the whole bag. And watch out for sodium levels too. Some salt is necessary for health, but ONE slice of processed cheese has half of an entire day's recommended intake of sodium, and a noodle cup has more than 100%! Most processed food is loaded with sodium. Nutritionists recommend that you don't buy any product that has more than 15% of daily recommended intake per serving of sodium... and it's pretty surprising how hard it is to find that in pre-packaged food.
And finally, no one anywhere should ever drink non-diet soda. EVER. If you like soda, stick with diet (not too much because of the aspartame, or go for the ones sweetened with Splenda). Otherwise, just drink water and 1% or skim milk. And just take a vitamin C pill, as that is the only redeeming quality of juice, and an important vitamin, easily absorbed by the body when it comes in supplement form, unlike many other supplement vitamins. BTW, the vitamin pills that are readily absorbed by the body and therefore worth taking to supplement a healthy diet are:
Calcium
Vitamin D (important, as it is not in natural foods in any quantity - just in fortified milk products generally, and in sunshine... Apparently, 60% of Americans are now deficient in Vitamin D because no one spends enough time outside with exposed skin anymore, and sunscreen actually prevents absorption of Vitamin D as well, so it's a good supplement to take everyday)
Potassium
Zinc
Magnesium
B6 and B12
Anything else, you should try to get exclusively from real healthy food rather than trying to get some from supplements whenever possible, Vitamin D excluded.... and if you don't like bananas, I recommend a potassium supplement as well.
(sorry if I'm telling you a lot of stuff you already know)
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
... ALL fruit juice is simply incredibly high in calories because they have a high concentration of sugar (just think of how many oranges go into one glass of orange juice... once may as well eat 8 oranges in one go; an average glass of the stuff has 350 calories).
how big is that glass? and are you speaking of commercial juice and/or fresh ? cause i find 2 oranges is plenty of juice for breakfast(or whenever)... though more often than not i tend to cut it with the juice of a lemon.
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...Vitamin D (important, as it is not in natural foods in any quantity - just in fortified milk products generally, and in sunshine... Apparently, 60% of Americans are now deficient in Vitamin D because no one spends enough time outside with exposed skin anymore, and sunscreen actually prevents absorption of Vitamin D as well, so it's a good supplement to take everyday)...
i recently got my vitamin D levels tested as part of a bigger process and it turns out my levels are high. and thats from just going about my normal day. im not a fan of the sun so im not likely to be found lounging around in it. i dont wear sunscreen tho... i find it constrictive and icky.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
... ALL fruit juice is simply incredibly high in calories because they have a high concentration of sugar (just think of how many oranges go into one glass of orange juice... once may as well eat 8 oranges in one go; an average glass of the stuff has 350 calories).
how big is that glass? and are you speaking of commercial juice and/or fresh ? cause i find 2 oranges is plenty of juice for breakfast(or whenever)... though more often than not i tend to cut it with the juice of a lemon.
Most people have a much larger serving (and most don't squeeze their own, although there is no difference in calories between fresh and concentrate or bottled), and single serving bottles are 350ml to 500ml normally, like Coke, and given that it is fair to assume that a perceived serving is the same as that. They are comparable - i.e. same sized glass of each have about the same amount of calories.
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
...Vitamin D (important, as it is not in natural foods in any quantity - just in fortified milk products generally, and in sunshine... Apparently, 60% of Americans are now deficient in Vitamin D because no one spends enough time outside with exposed skin anymore, and sunscreen actually prevents absorption of Vitamin D as well, so it's a good supplement to take everyday)...
i recently got my vitamin D levels tested as part of a bigger process and it turns out my levels are high. and thats from just going about my normal day. im not a fan of the sun so im not likely to be found lounging around in it. i dont wear sunscreen tho... i find it constrictive and icky.
Great! Sounds like you're more healthy than the average American.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
If anyone is looking for a (good free) tool to help improve your own knowledge and health, Live Strong has a real nice calorie tracker. You just type in the food and it will auto-populate a list to choose from. It's easy to use and is eye opening.
The free version handled everything I needed. The most eye-opening thing to me was the amount of sodium that I took in each day. And there were several "holy crap, that has that many calories!!!" items that a removed from my intake completely.
After I started using it, I estimate I've taken about 700 calories less per day just from what I learned and adjusted ... and that isn't dieting, it's just making smart changes on what I ate. Trust me, you will avoid fast food once you plop in an average meal from McDonalds and see what the results are. :shock:
(although I still struggle to stay under my daily limit for sodium ... it's everywhere)
If anyone is looking for a (good free) tool to help improve your own knowledge and health, Live Strong has a real nice calorie tracker. You just type in the food and it will auto-populate a list to choose from. It's easy to use and is eye opening.
The free version handled everything I needed. The most eye-opening thing to me was the amount of sodium that I took in each day. And there were several "holy crap, that has that many calories!!!" items that a removed from my intake completely.
After I started using it, I estimate I've taken about 700 calories less per day just from what I learned and adjusted ... and that isn't dieting, it's just making smart changes on what I ate. Trust me, you will avoid fast food once you plop in an average meal from McDonalds and see what the results are. :shock:
(although I still struggle to stay under my daily limit for sodium ... it's everywhere)
Thanks for the tip!
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Comments
did you get some exercise running around looking for it?
take a good look
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hold my hand
lie beside me
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"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
Exactly what I was saying - just because I can do it doesn't mean others can or have the time or even want to. We need alot of options like education, like corporate responsibility, like nutrition labels to help everyone make the best choices possible.
Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...
I AM MINE
There are plenty of grocery stores/markets. Most importantly, there is a wide range of options, due to a more diverse citizenship: cuisines, specialty shops, smaller markets, health food stores, and big chains.
This is so true - my parents have been to Italy about 4 times and they never see any obese ppl.
Again - portion control and sizes are much smaller than here in the U.S.
for you the individual operates somewhat independently of the structures guiding their lives, for me, i believe that the person consumes based on individual choice influenced in and through a variety of things that may or may not be in their best interest/fit their politics. the reason i talked about my paper was that i am working through why i would, for example, buy products from victoria's secret when it would seem to contradict my socio-political belief in feminism. what is so overpowering about their goods? do they really make a better product than other lingerie stores or is it a combination of a good product, good marketing, years of being persuaded to objectify women, mixed with my own affective desire that then compells me to go "yeah i'm gonna drop $10 on this product so my wife fits the social ideal of a 'sexy' body". getting back to food what is going through an individual's head, who is committed to being healthy, when they decide to forgo the whole foods and eat a $5 footlong from Subway with Jared's smiling mug telling them it's so good? is it simply taste? poor choices? a poor food culture in America? i don't think it's as simple as any of that, and it's kind of unmeasurable to see how much a choice was socially constructed and individually acted on.
Me too - no one Hates fat ppl nor obese ppl. But, there comes a time when you get too obese that it affects your health... :(
thats cause they fed all the obese people to the lions at the coliseum.
take a good look
this could be the day
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lie beside me
i just need to say
Hi PJ_soul...I am a single dad and try so very very hard to provide good nutrition to my boys...you are right that many people dont understand enough about nutrition...I must be among the uneducated I am afraid...that blows me away that a glass of orange juice is as bad as a can of coke...makes me wonder about what other mistakes I am making!
Do you know any good, user friendly books I could get to educate myself???
really just in and of itself no comparison needed.
If people would lay off for awhile and cook they would know this.
I swear fast food must be addicting the way some people eat it.
2 meals a day sometimes 3 :wtf:
Then getting their young kids to eat it that often they know nothing else growing up.
I've had children come to the house for meals not knowing what a carrot is :shock:
checking out at the grocery store I was asked by a young checker what celery was ...
alrighty then
This is NOT good news in this computer age where many children are sitting and not being as active as they need to be. The heart is a muscle that needs to be kept active so it prolong a long life...bring back exercise in schools.
http://www.aahperd.org/naspe/advocacy/g ... AL-2-3.pdf
http://sitemaker.umich.edu/356.speregen ... erformance
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
How has Mrs. Obama not gotten all over this? Or has she?
(plus, why should today's kids be deprived of the shame of those awful PE uniforms and showering afterward?)
PJsoul - I already said it's possible to eat healthy relatively cheaply. Indeed, not everything has to be organic, gourmet, from Whole Foods. And if you want to eat nothing but plain, unflavored chicken, steamed veggies, and plain rice for every meal, then sure, in small portions that's probably about as cheap as fast food. However, that's a pretty boring, unrealistic, unsustainable diet. Oil, spices, sauces, etc, (i.e., flavor) all add up in terms of cost and, of course, calories.
Overall, 1/4 pounders, mass-produced pizza, and chinese take out don't "taste good". They overload the primary sensors -- salt, sweet, fat -- and train us to only enjoy those. It's more like addiction than an appreciation of what "tastes good".
edit: Of course I realize "fat" is not part of the primary taste spectrum, but it serves to enhance the other two -- salty and sweet.
i do think the point about ignorance is significant ... it can be confusing to someone when they are inundated with advertising and information that are only partial truths ... it's unsettling to know what certain industries get away with ...
if people want to be healthy - diet is by far the number 1 change they will have to make ... and then exercise ...
make sure that glass of OJ is freshly squeezed. commercial juice just looks wrong. not to mention what they put in it. and its colour is def not the colour of orange juice straight from nature. the toddlermonster gets a kick out of watching me squeeze oranges(and lemons for that matter). its like some sort of revelation to her tiny mind. plus im sure she likes that im doing something for her. plus its good exercise for your hands.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/3dc51a ... rel=player
Hi Bindy. Hmm. I do know a lot about it, but I'm afraid I've gleaned my knowledge over a long period of time from many different sources, so I can't recommend a particular place for you to go... But this is some advice:
The main problem with foods that are bad for you and cause weight gain is that they contain too many calories and/or fat and/or sugars (carbs). The food that is surprisingly unhealthy (like fruit juice and starches) tends to have one thing in common - a very high amount of sugar and carbs. Juice is a big one. Many of the schools who took soda out of schools also removed all juice from vending machines as well because the calorie and sugar content are the same. ALL fruit juice is simply incredibly high in calories because they have a high concentration of sugar (just think of how many oranges go into one glass of orange juice... once may as well eat 8 oranges in one go; an average glass of the stuff has 350 calories). So I would avoid juice for the most part, and stick with water and actual whole fruit only. Bread is also one. One bagel, for example, normally has 350 - 500 calories per! Make a sandwich with that and add mayo, cheese, meat, etc, and a salad with ranch dressing on the side and a glass of juice or milk, all of a sudden you've got a lunch that is as much as 1000+ calories, nearly half of what many people should eat in a whole day.
Fat is other big factor obviously - everyone knows that. The fries and ice cream and what not is obvious, but other things not as much. For example, a noodle cup has as much fat in it as 2 candy bars! 2% milk has, of course, double the fat as 1%. Cheese is basically solid fat, so go for the reduced fat harder cheeses, like medium half fat cheddar, which is actually still very tasty (the softer the cheese, the higher the fat) ... and so on. I really think it's just a matter of reading ALL labels for calories, carbs (sugars), and fat, and to pay special attention to the serving portions that the labels are talking about. I.e. one of those little bag of chips might have 40 chips in it, but the label is only giving you the nutritional info on 17 chips, not the whole bag. And watch out for sodium levels too. Some salt is necessary for health, but ONE slice of processed cheese has half of an entire day's recommended intake of sodium, and a noodle cup has more than 100%! Most processed food is loaded with sodium. Nutritionists recommend that you don't buy any product that has more than 15% of daily recommended intake per serving of sodium... and it's pretty surprising how hard it is to find that in pre-packaged food.
And finally, no one anywhere should ever drink non-diet soda. EVER. If you like soda, stick with diet (not too much because of the aspartame, or go for the ones sweetened with Splenda). Otherwise, just drink water and 1% or skim milk. And just take a vitamin C pill, as that is the only redeeming quality of juice, and an important vitamin, easily absorbed by the body when it comes in supplement form, unlike many other supplement vitamins. BTW, the vitamin pills that are readily absorbed by the body and therefore worth taking to supplement a healthy diet are:
Calcium
Vitamin D (important, as it is not in natural foods in any quantity - just in fortified milk products generally, and in sunshine... Apparently, 60% of Americans are now deficient in Vitamin D because no one spends enough time outside with exposed skin anymore, and sunscreen actually prevents absorption of Vitamin D as well, so it's a good supplement to take everyday)
Potassium
Zinc
Magnesium
B6 and B12
Anything else, you should try to get exclusively from real healthy food rather than trying to get some from supplements whenever possible, Vitamin D excluded.... and if you don't like bananas, I recommend a potassium supplement as well.
(sorry if I'm telling you a lot of stuff you already know)
how big is that glass? and are you speaking of commercial juice and/or fresh ? cause i find 2 oranges is plenty of juice for breakfast(or whenever)... though more often than not i tend to cut it with the juice of a lemon.
take a good look
this could be the day
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i just need to say
i recently got my vitamin D levels tested as part of a bigger process and it turns out my levels are high. and thats from just going about my normal day. im not a fan of the sun so im not likely to be found lounging around in it. i dont wear sunscreen tho... i find it constrictive and icky.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Here is the link:
http://www.livestrong.com/myplate/
The free version handled everything I needed. The most eye-opening thing to me was the amount of sodium that I took in each day. And there were several "holy crap, that has that many calories!!!" items that a removed from my intake completely.
After I started using it, I estimate I've taken about 700 calories less per day just from what I learned and adjusted ... and that isn't dieting, it's just making smart changes on what I ate. Trust me, you will avoid fast food once you plop in an average meal from McDonalds and see what the results are. :shock:
(although I still struggle to stay under my daily limit for sodium ... it's everywhere)