so,how cool and easy is lottery system,

boyo79

RedMosquito22 wrote:

This thread is utter nonsense. Everyone hates the ticket process and they want it with a mail in lottery or through ticketmaster. Then they realize ticketmaster still sux. Then they got shut out of the lottery for a show that had about 200 pairs per show and then they blame the lottery and want the old process back.

I just find it very comical.

Have to agree.

RE4790

RedMosquito22 wrote:

Ticketmaster blows. Of course they worked for the Canada tours, there isn't as big of a demand. Anyone who wants ticketmaster in charge of the 10 Club tickets is crazy. No thank you.

You may not be aware of this, but Ticketmaster successfully handles tickets for acts with far greater demand than Pearl Jam. I don't like them as a corporation, but their system is the best in the business and I really think it's silly and wasteful for the 10c to keep trying to reinvent the wheel so a few fans can keep pretending it's 1995.

Indifference

RE4790 wrote:

RedMosquito22 wrote:

Ticketmaster blows. Of course they worked for the Canada tours, there isn't as big of a demand. Anyone who wants ticketmaster in charge of the 10 Club tickets is crazy. No thank you.

You may not be aware of this, but Ticketmaster successfully handles tickets for acts with far greater demand than Pearl Jam. I don't like them as a corporation, but their system is the best in the business and I really think it's silly and wasteful for the 10c to keep trying to reinvent the wheel so a few fans can keep pretending it's 1995.

I'd agree with this and if I recall correctly they were used as part of the 2004 VFC tour. Every 10c member got a unique code to buy tickets via TM. They handle the volume (no server issues) and it is not a lottery (control your own destiny - which some have pointed out as their preference). I can appreciate the non (or minimal) TM stance the 10c has taken given the band's history, but given how everything else has changed I think it would be received positively.

MG79478

JimmyV wrote:

My favorite part of this thread is that making bizarre declarations like "I work harder than 99% of you!" supposedly constitutes a rational and well-thought argument. :roll:

My favorite part is when JimmyV picked one small piece out of one post and tried to make a point with it that made no sense. [sarcasm]Yes, that was the basis of all arguments, and nothing else was posted. Pages and pages of replies, and that is the only argument anyone made against the lottery [/sarcasm] Had you actually read the posts, you would have noticed that comment was in response to being called lazy for sitting in an office all day. It was meant to point out that although I am extremely busy, I still make time for things that are important to me, and I don’t make excuses. But hey… your reality is great too!

RedMosquito22

RE4790 wrote:

RedMosquito22 wrote:

Ticketmaster blows. Of course they worked for the Canada tours, there isn't as big of a demand. Anyone who wants ticketmaster in charge of the 10 Club tickets is crazy. No thank you.

You may not be aware of this, but Ticketmaster successfully handles tickets for acts with far greater demand than Pearl Jam. I don't like them as a corporation, but their system is the best in the business and I really think it's silly and wasteful for the 10c to keep trying to reinvent the wheel so a few fans can keep pretending it's 1995.

I don't want them anywhere near the 10 club allotment and the 10 Club doesn't either. It will always be in house so really your only options are the way it was or the lottery. Sorry. I have no problem with public sales.

cowboypjfan

RE4790 wrote:

You may not be aware of this, but Ticketmaster successfully handles tickets for acts with far greater demand than Pearl Jam. I don't like them as a corporation, but their system is the best in the business and I really think it's silly and wasteful for the 10c to keep trying to reinvent the wheel so a few fans can keep pretending it's 1995.

Exactly. When technology keeps advancing and you are still trying to fight that, you need to admit you have a problem.

Why use a fax machine when you have email?

RedMosquito22

crazypjfan wrote:

RE4790 wrote:

You may not be aware of this, but Ticketmaster successfully handles tickets for acts with far greater demand than Pearl Jam. I don't like them as a corporation, but their system is the best in the business and I really think it's silly and wasteful for the 10c to keep trying to reinvent the wheel so a few fans can keep pretending it's 1995.

Exactly. When technology keeps advancing and you are still trying to fight that, you need to admit you have a problem.

Why use a fax machine when you have email?

Technology isn't their problem, especially because ticketmaster also has hackers that bust their system. No matter how advanced your technology is, there are always hackers one step ahead of you. If they can make money off of these hacks it makes it even more dangerous. This is the reason I believe PJ is going to stick with the lottery. It will be more work for them but they can do it without hackers f'ng up their system and can allocate tickets without hassle. It makes it a smoother process for everyone.

I could be wrong and they could go back to having them online. I just don't see how it benefits them in any way. I wouldn't use the Ed tour as an example because there are far fewer seats available for those shows and I'd say there were far fewer complaints than say the Alpine and Canada complaints.

JimmyV

MG79478 wrote:

JimmyV wrote:

My favorite part of this thread is that making bizarre declarations like "I work harder than 99% of you!" supposedly constitutes a rational and well-thought argument. :roll:

My favorite part is when JimmyV picked one small piece out of one post and tried to make a point with it that made no sense. [sarcasm]Yes, that was the basis of all arguments, and nothing else was posted. Pages and pages of replies, and that is the only argument anyone made against the lottery [/sarcasm] Had you actually read the posts, you would have noticed that comment was in response to being called lazy for sitting in an office all day. It was meant to point out that although I am extremely busy, I still make time for things that are important to me, and I don’t make excuses. But hey… your reality is great too!

I've read your posts. It is a point you have made repeatedly, in this and other threads. If you are going to make declarations like that -- when you know almost nothing about what anyone else does for work or how they live their lives -- you should be prepared to be called out on it.

And if my point didn't make sense to you, well, maybe you should go back to school and better yourself. That is your advice to others, is it not?

JimmyV

Indifference wrote:

RE4790 wrote:

RedMosquito22 wrote:

Ticketmaster blows. Of course they worked for the Canada tours, there isn't as big of a demand. Anyone who wants ticketmaster in charge of the 10 Club tickets is crazy. No thank you.

You may not be aware of this, but Ticketmaster successfully handles tickets for acts with far greater demand than Pearl Jam. I don't like them as a corporation, but their system is the best in the business and I really think it's silly and wasteful for the 10c to keep trying to reinvent the wheel so a few fans can keep pretending it's 1995.

I'd agree with this and if I recall correctly they were used as part of the 2004 VFC tour. Every 10c member got a unique code to buy tickets via TM. They handle the volume (no server issues) and it is not a lottery (control your own destiny - which some have pointed out as their preference). I can appreciate the non (or minimal) TM stance the 10c has taken given the band's history, but given how everything else has changed I think it would be received positively.

Kelly Curtis stated in his online chat Q & A after the "sabotage" debacle that the band has no problem working with Ticketmaster in the future. They have moved on.

RedMosquito22

JimmyV wrote:

Kelly Curtis stated in his online chat Q & A after the "sabotage" debacle that the band has no problem working with Ticketmaster in the future. They have moved on.

not for 10 Club allocations. This was already talked about on the radio show. They can't see any situation that would take the 10 club allocation out f house.

Ticketmaster gets hacked also. Scalpers get access to the tickets minutes before fans and if you don't think those presale codes get in their hands you are crazy. there are plenty of scalpers in the 10 Club.

The lottery is by far the safest and hassle free way for the 10 Club to do the 10 Club allotment and then the leftover tickets and public sale through TM.

JimmyV

RedMosquito22 wrote:

JimmyV wrote:

Kelly Curtis stated in his online chat Q & A after the "sabotage" debacle that the band has no problem working with Ticketmaster in the future. They have moved on.

not for 10 Club allocations. This was already talked about on the radio show. They can't see any situation that would take the 10 club allocation out f house.

Ticketmaster gets hacked also. Scalpers get access to the tickets minutes before fans and if you don't think those presale codes get in their hands you are crazy. there are plenty of scalpers in the 10 Club.

The lottery is by far the safest and hassle free way for the 10 Club to do the 10 Club allotment and then the leftover tickets and public sale through TM.

The question Kelly answered was in regards to 10C allocations. And this was more recent than anything mentioned on the radio show, so things could have changed.

Not worth arguing over though as neither of us knows what 10C's future plans are. The lottery is just fine with me. Trying Ticketmaster again would be just fine, too.

RedMosquito22

JimmyV wrote:

RedMosquito22 wrote:

JimmyV wrote:

Kelly Curtis stated in his online chat Q & A after the "sabotage" debacle that the band has no problem working with Ticketmaster in the future. They have moved on.

not for 10 Club allocations. This was already talked about on the radio show. They can't see any situation that would take the 10 club allocation out f house.

Ticketmaster gets hacked also. Scalpers get access to the tickets minutes before fans and if you don't think those presale codes get in their hands you are crazy. there are plenty of scalpers in the 10 Club.

The lottery is by far the safest and hassle free way for the 10 Club to do the 10 Club allotment and then the leftover tickets and public sale through TM.

The question Kelly answered was in regards to 10C allocations. And this was more recent than anything mentioned on the radio show, so things could have changed.

Not worth arguing over though as neither of us knows what 10C's future plans are. The lottery is just fine with me. Trying Ticketmaster again would be just fine, too.

Agreed that neither of us know, but they said that they didn't want to have to give our info to anyone out of house, nor do I want them to. I don't trust ticketmaster with allocating seats at all. I prefer PJ working with the venues.

cowboypjfan

RedMosquito22 wrote:

crazypjfan wrote:

RE4790 wrote:

You may not be aware of this, but Ticketmaster successfully handles tickets for acts with far greater demand than Pearl Jam. I don't like them as a corporation, but their system is the best in the business and I really think it's silly and wasteful for the 10c to keep trying to reinvent the wheel so a few fans can keep pretending it's 1995.

Exactly. When technology keeps advancing and you are still trying to fight that, you need to admit you have a problem.

Why use a fax machine when you have email?

Technology isn't their problem.

Then it must be stubbornness to technology. If technology isn't their problem, the servers wouldn't crash and we would all have a nice system still in place to buy tickets in the goods section. How come Ticketmaster works so fluidly? I'll give ya a hint, 4 syllables...

Why make things difficult? You have the money(~300,000 paying tenclub members x $30 avg for membership = $9,000,000), why not invest in some better equipment or just pay ticketmaster to run these sales? I guess going back to the same lottery system they used in the mid 90's is a lot cheaper. :roll: Is that why you pay $40 for a membership? To get the cheap system that may not even be random? I don't think so...

btw, a breach in security or a 'sabotage' is in fact a technology problem. Curtis mentioned that the lottery is the safest way. It is probably because they don't want to spend the money upgrading their security technology.

All signs point to ticketmaster...

RedMosquito22

First of all Ticketmaster doesn't run smoothly. Scalpers are in to sales minutes before the public all the time, not to mention how this would take place during a 10 club Sale(yes, scalpers do have 10 Club memberships). I agree with Curtis that the lottery is the safest way and I applaud them for possibly going back to it.

It isn't their technology it is hackers ruining it during the sale. No matter what technology you use there are always hackers one step ahead of you. With the lottery there is no hacking and the tickets are allocated without hassle other than more hours spent working for them.

RE4790

RedMosquito22 wrote:

First of all Ticketmaster doesn't run smoothly. Scalpers are in to sales minutes before the public all the time,

Do you have evidence for this working in 10c pre-sale situation? 3rd party ticket resellers get tickets from venues and promoters, not necessarily by hacking TM.

RedMosquito22 wrote:

(yes, scalpers do have 10 Club memberships).

So hows does the lotto help?

cowboypjfan

RedMosquito22 wrote:

First of all Ticketmaster doesn't run smoothly. Scalpers are in to sales minutes before the public all the time, not to mention how this would take place during a 10 club Sale(yes, scalpers do have 10 Club memberships). I agree with Curtis that the lottery is the safest way and I applaud them for possibly going back to it.

It isn't their technology it is hackers ruining it during the sale. No matter what technology you use there are always hackers one step ahead of you. With the lottery there is no hacking and the tickets are allocated without hassle other than more hours spent working for them.

You shouldn't comment if you don't know what you're talking about

boyo79

Didn't Kelly Curtis say they don't want to deal with TM and the like for fanclub tickets because they want to keep fanclub tickets as low as possible and TM & others would want the prices increasing?

JimmyV

boyo79 wrote:

Didn't Kelly Curtis say they don't want to deal with TM and the like for fanclub tickets because they want to keep fanclub tickets as low as possible and TM & others would want the prices increasing?

I've heard this before, too. Not sure if/when he said it but I don't believe it was during the Europe Q&A. My memory is that he was open to using TM in the future, but I could be wrong.

boyo79

JimmyV wrote:

boyo79 wrote:

Didn't Kelly Curtis say they don't want to deal with TM and the like for fanclub tickets because they want to keep fanclub tickets as low as possible and TM & others would want the prices increasing?

I've heard this before, too. Not sure if/when he said it but I don't believe it was during the Europe Q&A. My memory is that he was open to using TM in the future, but I could be wrong.

Found it!

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=179067&p=4133342#p4133342

Kelly Curtis » 16 Dec 2011 22:24

GetALife wrote:Why was it not possible to hold back the 10c tickets although the public pre-sale started and, additional to that, since they 10c-pre-sale did not work out, hold back an extra amount of tickets from the public pre-sale? Would that have been so difficult? I don't understand why they had to be "thrown" into the public sale.

Second question is related to the general questions here about the info policy...why sending out the update at 1am CET? I was asleep and got notice of the update at 9am when the sale already had started...


we are dealing with a public on sale following our pre-sale in a very short window…. our fan club pre-sales are not very popular with promoters and therefore there is not a lot of help offered. one of the main reasons… is that SOME ..NOT ALL promoters would love to sell our fan club tickets at a very high price….. this is how pj has been abe to avoid widespread scalping. our goal has always been to get you .. the loyal pj fan the best of anything we have to offer at the best price possible.

JimmyV

boyo79 wrote:

JimmyV wrote:

boyo79 wrote:

Didn't Kelly Curtis say they don't want to deal with TM and the like for fanclub tickets because they want to keep fanclub tickets as low as possible and TM & others would want the prices increasing?

I've heard this before, too. Not sure if/when he said it but I don't believe it was during the Europe Q&A. My memory is that he was open to using TM in the future, but I could be wrong.

Found it!

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=179067&p=4133342#p4133342

Kelly Curtis » 16 Dec 2011 22:24

GetALife wrote:Why was it not possible to hold back the 10c tickets although the public pre-sale started and, additional to that, since they 10c-pre-sale did not work out, hold back an extra amount of tickets from the public pre-sale? Would that have been so difficult? I don't understand why they had to be "thrown" into the public sale.

Second question is related to the general questions here about the info policy...why sending out the update at 1am CET? I was asleep and got notice of the update at 9am when the sale already had started...


we are dealing with a public on sale following our pre-sale in a very short window…. our fan club pre-sales are not very popular with promoters and therefore there is not a lot of help offered. one of the main reasons… is that SOME ..NOT ALL promoters would love to sell our fan club tickets at a very high price….. this is how pj has been abe to avoid widespread scalping. our goal has always been to get you .. the loyal pj fan the best of anything we have to offer at the best price possible.

Hmmm...I'm not sure he is talking about the Ticketmaster in regards to presales there. I think his response is explaining why the presale was cancelled and the remaining 10C tickets put up for public sale. Again, I could be wrong. Here is the quote I was thinking about which, admittedly, is not nearly as strong as I remember it being:

Re: EUROPEAN TICKET PRE-SALE FORUM DIALOGUE WITH PJ MANAGER

Postby Kelly Curtis » 16 Dec 2011 17:08

veddertown wrote:Can PJ get over the Ticketmaster debacle from the 90's and move on now? Pre-sales have been disastrous and I don't see why they couldn't leave it to the professionals to handle such affairs? We deserve an organization that can cope with PJ's demand given that it us who put them and keep them where they are now. Do the band know how bad the ticketing fiasco is?


yes we worked with tm in canada.. it is not an option in all places in the world