You disagree based on what? They are literally told by their superiors to not mistreat the enemy's dead bodies. So mistreating an enemy's dead body absolutely goes against what they are trained to do. Now, it's possible that this group of soldiers may have had a superior who thought this was acceptable behavior, I have no idea one way or the other. But they are still told not to do things like that and they're old enough to know right from wrong when it's such a black and white example as this case. It takes more than a little nudge to go from killing to desecrating a dead body. If that was the case, this sort of thing would be done far more frequently.
The order from superiors may be black and white, but when people are blowing another person's brains out and then they're asked to treat the dead body with respect, that tends to put them in the "grey area" situation. The person is trained to not respect them when they're alive, why when they're dead?
umm, sorry to seem cold, but I think the bigger issue here is that THOSE GUYS ARE DEAD.
Was about to post the same thing. (Well The same point, I think)
---
We really have become (for the most part) immune to seeing dead bodies like that. So when we do see something that we don't see too often (unless we like to watch R-kelly Videos) like someone pissing on another, we will miss the bigger issue.
In this case, People are dead, why are they dead, who are they really and a list of other questions that need answers.
Shows: 6.27.08 Hartford, CT/5.15.10 Hartford, CT/6.18.2011 Hartford, CT (EV Solo)/10.19.13 Brooklyn/10.25.13 Hartford
"Becoming a Bruce fan is like hitting puberty as a musical fan. It's inevitable." - dcfaithful
This kind of abuse always goes on during wars of occupation. Soldiers cutting off ears, massacring people in cold blood, shooting passers-by for sport, e.t.c, e.t.c.
It happened in Vietnam, and it happened in Afghanistan and Iraq. And these atrocities will always happen as long as the public in Britain and the U.S choose to remain blinkered to the crimes of their governments.
People are already swallowing the latest bout of media bullshit regarding Iran, less than ten years after they swallowed the bullshit regarding Iraq. So this shit just goes on, and on...
But I suppose that as long as it's not Americans being mutilated and killed then it just doesn't matter.
It happened in Korea prior to its division, it happened in China, it happened in Russia (pre-Soviet Union), it happened in the Philippines, it happened in Afghanistan more than once, it happened in Chechnya, it happened in the former Yugoslavia, it happened on Guadalcanal....to paint war atrocities on only two nations is very near-sighted and small-minded....whether it's sticks and stones, spears and arrows or gun and bombs this type of behavior has and will always occur during warfare.
All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a thousand enemies, and whenever they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you, digger, listener, runner, prince with the swift warning. Be cunning and full of tricks and your people shall never be destroyed.
Judging from this article, it appears the person filming was doing it for fun, as the others asked if he's got it on film...we should be grateful those people insist on filming/taking pictures (remember abu ghraib) when they're acting like complete assholes, so at least there's proof and they can be held accountable, which I hope they will.
This kind of abuse always goes on during wars of occupation. Soldiers cutting off ears, massacring people in cold blood, shooting passers-by for sport, e.t.c, e.t.c.
It happened in Vietnam, and it happened in Afghanistan and Iraq. And these atrocities will always happen as long as the public in Britain and the U.S choose to remain blinkered to the crimes of their governments.
People are already swallowing the latest bout of media bullshit regarding Iran, less than ten years after they swallowed the bullshit regarding Iraq. So this shit just goes on, and on...
But I suppose that as long as it's not Americans being mutilated and killed then it just doesn't matter.
It happened in Korea prior to its division, it happened in China, it happened in Russia (pre-Soviet Union), it happened in the Philippines, it happened in Afghanistan more than once, it happened in Chechnya, it happened in the former Yugoslavia, it happened on Guadalcanal....to paint war atrocities on only two nations is very near-sighted and small-minded....whether it's sticks and stones, spears and arrows or gun and bombs this type of behavior has and will always occur during warfare.
You must have forgotten that we live in a world of unipolarity, and international hegemony for the United States. How convenient that must be for you.
probably because of what i said ... this is a systemic problem - not an isolated incident ... these things happen all the time and if you "tell" on your fellow soldiers - you are a rat and they will consider you the one to be dealt with ...
You have no idea. You are assuming a lot. And with the number of interactions our soldiers have you have no idea how many are good/bad/indifferent.
I agree it's disgusting and they should be held accountable. And I concede that if there wasn't a war it wouldn't happen at all. And I agree that it happening once is once too many.
As you are always asking in other topics, where's your data to prove it's a systemic problem? Or is it just another incident for people to put down the entire armed forces or entire country?
What are you talking about? You sound so sure of yourself. Of course, you have not even looked into the fact that plenty of people have written on the subject and found that a large amount of what polaris_x was saying is in fact true. How about you read a book: http://www.amazon.com/Collateral-Damage ... 291&sr=8-1
It happened in Korea prior to its division, it happened in China, it happened in Russia (pre-Soviet Union), it happened in the Philippines, it happened in Afghanistan more than once, it happened in Chechnya, it happened in the former Yugoslavia, it happened on Guadalcanal....to paint war atrocities on only two nations is very near-sighted and small-minded....whether it's sticks and stones, spears and arrows or gun and bombs this type of behavior has and will always occur during warfare.
Out of the list of wars you mention, how many of them were wars of occupation by a foreign army?
Not everyone, however, was saddened by the events. Anti-Muslim activist Pam Geller wrote in favor of the incident. “I love these Marines,” she said, adding, “Perhaps this is the infidel interpretation of the Islamic ritual of washing and preparing the body for burial.” A former Republican National Committee researcher tweeted wondering, “this is a story?” He added: “I could care less. Liberal media at work.” Michael Goldfarb, a neoconseravtive Republican operative (a former McCain campaign spokesman), lobbyist and, as of recently, chairman of a new conservative online media venture, retweeted the comments from the RNC researcher.
Shows: 6.27.08 Hartford, CT/5.15.10 Hartford, CT/6.18.2011 Hartford, CT (EV Solo)/10.19.13 Brooklyn/10.25.13 Hartford
"Becoming a Bruce fan is like hitting puberty as a musical fan. It's inevitable." - dcfaithful
In Burma, when men were captured they tied a string tightly around their testicles then pulled them off. When they captured women they inserted glass bottles into their vaginas and then broke the ends off with the butts of their rifles. Atrocities of war are a horrible thing that has occurred throughout human existence. I didn't like watching this video, I found it repulsive, but this is nothing compared to the atrocities that exist this day.
Not everyone, however, was saddened by the events. Anti-Muslim activist Pam Geller wrote in favor of the incident. “I love these Marines,” she said, adding, “Perhaps this is the infidel interpretation of the Islamic ritual of washing and preparing the body for burial.” A former Republican National Committee researcher tweeted wondering, “this is a story?” He added: “I could care less. Liberal media at work.” Michael Goldfarb, a neoconseravtive Republican operative (a former McCain campaign spokesman), lobbyist and, as of recently, chairman of a new conservative online media venture, retweeted the comments from the RNC researcher.
Despicable.
And yet many Americans still wonder why they're the most hated country in the World.
Here's your answer. It's because of scumbags like this.
It happened in Korea prior to its division, it happened in China, it happened in Russia (pre-Soviet Union), it happened in the Philippines, it happened in Afghanistan more than once, it happened in Chechnya, it happened in the former Yugoslavia, it happened on Guadalcanal....to paint war atrocities on only two nations is very near-sighted and small-minded....whether it's sticks and stones, spears and arrows or gun and bombs this type of behavior has and will always occur during warfare.
Out of the list of wars you mention, how many of them were wars of occupation by a foreign army?
Only Yugoslavia and Pre-Soviet Russia would not meet your criteria.
I am not defending indefensible behavior, but the idea that such behavior is an "American" trait or an "American" problem is absolutely insane. It is a human problem.
All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a thousand enemies, and whenever they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you, digger, listener, runner, prince with the swift warning. Be cunning and full of tricks and your people shall never be destroyed.
What do you mean by all the time? Just that it happens in limited situations in all wars, or that it is happening daily?
And to fuck, you have statistics from that book?
all the time just meant that it's not an isolated incident like many want to believe ... did you follow the wikileaks story? ... it showed countless cases of torture and abuse that went unpunished ...
forget about asking for stats - just think about it critically for a minute ... you think that the one incident of desecration just happened to be caught on video just like that one incident of prisoner abuse at abu ghraib just happened to have pictures?? ... odds are that this stuff is rampant and those are just two incidents that happened to get leaked by whatever reason ... and by rampant i mean that it happens at a level that i'm sure most solidiers have seen things or something similar to this ...
all this shit because of greed ... this is where americans need to ask themselves whether this is what you want your country to be about ... sending kids to kill and occupy other countries all in the name of greed ...
read all these incidents ... nothing done about it ... it's only when it gets released to the public is anything truly done ... this is the culture there ...
What do you mean by all the time? Just that it happens in limited situations in all wars, or that it is happening daily?
And to fuck, you have statistics from that book?
all the time just meant that it's not an isolated incident like many want to believe ... did you follow the wikileaks story? ... it showed countless cases of torture and abuse that went unpunished ...
forget about asking for stats - just think about it critically for a minute ... you think that the one incident of desecration just happened to be caught on video just like that one incident of prisoner abuse at abu ghraib just happened to have pictures?? ... odds are that this stuff is rampant and those are just two incidents that happened to get leaked by whatever reason ... and by rampant i mean that it happens at a level that i'm sure most solidiers have seen things or something similar to this ...
all this shit because of greed ... this is where americans need to ask themselves whether this is what you want your country to be about ... sending kids to kill and occupy other countries all in the name of greed ...
I'm sure it happens more than once. I disagree completely with your belief that "odds are that this stuff is rampant". I think that is a pretty statement you are making about soldiers...prejudice in fact. And I think if it was a different group even you'd see that.
I'm sure it happens more than once. I disagree completely with your belief that "odds are that this stuff is rampant". I think that is a pretty statement you are making about soldiers...prejudice in fact. And I think if it was a different group even you'd see that.
I'm sure it happens more than once. I disagree completely with your belief that "odds are that this stuff is rampant". I think that is a pretty statement you are making about soldiers...prejudice in fact. And I think if it was a different group even you'd see that.
Once is more than it should happen regardless.
hahaha ... ok ... i give up ... i tried ...
hahaha... I know what you are thinking, but it has nothing to do with American soldiers... I'm assuming you think it happens with all soldiers.
If I'm wrong let me know and let me know what you mean by your non-reply reply.
If I'm not wrong, then please stop reading what you think I'm writing and just read the words I type.
And I meant to have the word "bad" after pretty...I had shitty, went to replace it and messed up. Go figure.
hahaha... I know what you are thinking, but it has nothing to do with American soldiers... I'm assuming you think it happens with all soldiers.
If I'm wrong let me know and let me know what you mean by your non-reply reply.
If I'm not wrong, then please stop reading what you think I'm writing and just read the words I type.
And I meant to have the word "bad" after pretty...I had shitty, went to replace it and messed up. Go figure.
my non-reply reply is basically an indication of my frustration in trying to discuss this with you ...
1. i've pointed out all the incidents reported in which nothing has happened which is a) an indication that these incidents happen a lot and b) nothing is done about it
2. i knew you would pick up on the word rampant and so in the very next sentence i define it for you but like clockwork you focus on that and your entire response is based on that one statement ...
3. and lastly ... by calling my statement prejudiced - you are yet again invoking a projection of me ... which, like i've said, i completely understand ... you are not the only who thinks this ... and i'm done trying to convince people otherwise ...
Absolutely sickening.
I just saw the video of the US Marines pissing on dead bodies in Afghanistan. We have some real idiots representing us, just helping to anger our enemy even more.
I know, or I feel, this is a small percentage of the people doing this. But I mean, how stupid do you have to be? I think this kind of thing is going to really shake the beehive. Idiotic acts like this and the stuff in the photos from guantanamo or abu Ghraib need to have harsher penalties. Put these guy who cant keep their dicks in their pants in prison for awhile.
hahaha... I know what you are thinking, but it has nothing to do with American soldiers... I'm assuming you think it happens with all soldiers.
If I'm wrong let me know and let me know what you mean by your non-reply reply.
If I'm not wrong, then please stop reading what you think I'm writing and just read the words I type.
And I meant to have the word "bad" after pretty...I had shitty, went to replace it and messed up. Go figure.
my non-reply reply is basically an indication of my frustration in trying to discuss this with you ...
1. i've pointed out all the incidents reported in which nothing has happened which is a) an indication that these incidents happen a lot and b) nothing is done about it
2. i knew you would pick up on the word rampant and so in the very next sentence i define it for you but like clockwork you focus on that and your entire response is based on that one statement ...
3. and lastly ... by calling my statement prejudiced - you are yet again invoking a projection of me ... which, like i've said, i completely understand ... you are not the only who thinks this ... and i'm done trying to convince people otherwise ...
Damn it, I had an entire reply typed out and lost it. Don't have the energy now.
Again, you think I'm invoking something and I am not. I'm dealing with what you said in this thread. I'm trying to take your earlier criticism to heart and pull back on the reigns. Feedback is useful when you choose to use it.
What do you mean by all the time? Just that it happens in limited situations in all wars, or that it is happening daily?
And to fuck, you have statistics from that book?
If you don't have the time to bother reading that book, that's fine. We all can't read everything. But don't argue that it's a stretch to say that this type of behavior happens all the time and that it's something inherent in the American army. That book makes a strong case, through interviewing several veterans in different bases and troops in Iraq, that it is. Some research should be done before you make an argument, wouldn't you agree?
I am not defending indefensible behavior, but the idea that such behavior is an "American" trait or an "American" problem is absolutely insane. It is a human problem.
I didn't say it was an American problem. Still, what wars of occupation are you referring to with regards China and Korea? Are you talking about China's occupation of Tibet? How about Korea? Do you think the U.S occupied Korea?
Comments
best response I've read on this topic.
Godfather.
umm, sorry to seem cold, but I think the bigger issue here is that THOSE GUYS ARE DEAD.
The order from superiors may be black and white, but when people are blowing another person's brains out and then they're asked to treat the dead body with respect, that tends to put them in the "grey area" situation. The person is trained to not respect them when they're alive, why when they're dead?
Was about to post the same thing. (Well The same point, I think)
---
We really have become (for the most part) immune to seeing dead bodies like that. So when we do see something that we don't see too often (unless we like to watch R-kelly Videos) like someone pissing on another, we will miss the bigger issue.
In this case, People are dead, why are they dead, who are they really and a list of other questions that need answers.
http://www.cnn.com/2012/01/12/us/video- ... ?hpt=hp_t3
"Becoming a Bruce fan is like hitting puberty as a musical fan. It's inevitable." - dcfaithful
Judging from this article, it appears the person filming was doing it for fun, as the others asked if he's got it on film...we should be grateful those people insist on filming/taking pictures (remember abu ghraib) when they're acting like complete assholes, so at least there's proof and they can be held accountable, which I hope they will.
this is disgusting.
Out of the list of wars you mention, how many of them were wars of occupation by a foreign army?
http://thinkprogress.org/security/2012/ ... d-taliban/
"Becoming a Bruce fan is like hitting puberty as a musical fan. It's inevitable." - dcfaithful
Despicable.
And yet many Americans still wonder why they're the most hated country in the World.
Here's your answer. It's because of scumbags like this.
What do you mean by all the time? Just that it happens in limited situations in all wars, or that it is happening daily?
And to fuck, you have statistics from that book?
I am not defending indefensible behavior, but the idea that such behavior is an "American" trait or an "American" problem is absolutely insane. It is a human problem.
all the time just meant that it's not an isolated incident like many want to believe ... did you follow the wikileaks story? ... it showed countless cases of torture and abuse that went unpunished ...
forget about asking for stats - just think about it critically for a minute ... you think that the one incident of desecration just happened to be caught on video just like that one incident of prisoner abuse at abu ghraib just happened to have pictures?? ... odds are that this stuff is rampant and those are just two incidents that happened to get leaked by whatever reason ... and by rampant i mean that it happens at a level that i'm sure most solidiers have seen things or something similar to this ...
all this shit because of greed ... this is where americans need to ask themselves whether this is what you want your country to be about ... sending kids to kill and occupy other countries all in the name of greed ...
read all these incidents ... nothing done about it ... it's only when it gets released to the public is anything truly done ... this is the culture there ...
I guess it was done as sign of great disrespect to the dead
in turn it brought the same reaction to the living...
a great loss of respect for these our fighting boys....
is what I felt.
I'm sure it happens more than once. I disagree completely with your belief that "odds are that this stuff is rampant". I think that is a pretty statement you are making about soldiers...prejudice in fact. And I think if it was a different group even you'd see that.
Once is more than it should happen regardless.
hahaha ... ok ... i give up ... i tried ...
hahaha... I know what you are thinking, but it has nothing to do with American soldiers... I'm assuming you think it happens with all soldiers.
If I'm wrong let me know and let me know what you mean by your non-reply reply.
If I'm not wrong, then please stop reading what you think I'm writing and just read the words I type.
And I meant to have the word "bad" after pretty...I had shitty, went to replace it and messed up. Go figure.
my non-reply reply is basically an indication of my frustration in trying to discuss this with you ...
1. i've pointed out all the incidents reported in which nothing has happened which is a) an indication that these incidents happen a lot and b) nothing is done about it
2. i knew you would pick up on the word rampant and so in the very next sentence i define it for you but like clockwork you focus on that and your entire response is based on that one statement ...
3. and lastly ... by calling my statement prejudiced - you are yet again invoking a projection of me ... which, like i've said, i completely understand ... you are not the only who thinks this ... and i'm done trying to convince people otherwise ...
I just saw the video of the US Marines pissing on dead bodies in Afghanistan. We have some real idiots representing us, just helping to anger our enemy even more.
I know, or I feel, this is a small percentage of the people doing this. But I mean, how stupid do you have to be? I think this kind of thing is going to really shake the beehive. Idiotic acts like this and the stuff in the photos from guantanamo or abu Ghraib need to have harsher penalties. Put these guy who cant keep their dicks in their pants in prison for awhile.
Damn it, I had an entire reply typed out and lost it. Don't have the energy now.
Again, you think I'm invoking something and I am not. I'm dealing with what you said in this thread. I'm trying to take your earlier criticism to heart and pull back on the reigns. Feedback is useful when you choose to use it.
Agree. And I don't really want people that make those kinds of decisions carrying weapons and being the face of America to the world.
There are bad people everywhere. I do think you are correct, the punishment should be extremely severe in order to deter.
it's all about winning hearts and minds....
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
I didn't say it was an American problem. Still, what wars of occupation are you referring to with regards China and Korea? Are you talking about China's occupation of Tibet? How about Korea? Do you think the U.S occupied Korea?
and revenge would be taken