Putting it all in perspective
Paul Andrews
Posts: 2,489
I've held back on this post for a long time, but it’s time. I am no a suck up, I am not trying to ensure I get front row seats in a lottery, and I am not pretending problems do not exist - but enough is enough! This forum is becoming everything that is wrong with the internet when it used to be a shining light of compassion, fairness and humanity. But now it risks becoming a cess pit of immaturity and puerile shit! And I do not blame the 10 Club staff or leadership.
Some people on this forum need to take a long walk in the hall of mirrors and take a good hard look at themselves with a critical eye and put some serious consideration into their behaviour. Grown adults are acting worse than spoilt children and I really don’t care who I offend by saying it. Would you act like this in front of your children? Would you act like this in public or are you just message board trolls? How many of you bother to phone the 10 Club, or write a polite email before growing virtual testicles the size of basketballs and sprouting you immature bitterness and hate on here. Tough guys behind a keyboard = cowardly douchebags in the real world! I dare all of you haters to start posting using your real names, step out from behind your avatars and put your name to your posts.
The over the top hate spewed out in here cannot go unchallenged. Sure, you people have a legitimate gripe - ticketing has been a fiasco, but the ten club/pearl jam did not screw you over, the ten club/pearl jam did not disrespect you and the ten club/pearl jam did not take you for granted. They did their best and for one reason or another, it just was not good enough. Sure plenty of members have made gracious and fair comments and complaints and no-one (Tim, Kat, Sea et al) has censored these people. I’m not surprised Tim has lost his cool on occasion, he’d need thigh high boots to avoid stepping in the shit he has to take from so called fans. You’re lucky I don’t run the club because many of you’d be receiving a refund check counter signed fuck off and don’t come back.
The Ten Club has always treated me well. All my emails have been answered swiftly. All purchases delivered (safely to the other side of the world), and a couple of occasions where I fucked up (and I made a major fuck-up, the size most of you could never dream of making) - they have been sympathetic and fair.
It has been ups and downs for me too. I've missed out on fan club tickets and got them on other occasions, have followed the band around Australia, have petitioned for EV to play in my city (and was successful) visited USA twice to see them (LA3&4, Newark & MSG2), have purchased the Deluxe Bluray, the Billboard poster, the back pack, the PJ20 Vinyl and more t-shirts and posters than my wife can forgive but missed out on other things - but never felt the urge to come here and throw a tantrum like a toddler. I missed out on Benny Hall, missed out on merch at the shows but Life is life! On balance, being a member of this club has been great.
Through this band and this fan club I have met some of the nicest people in the world - you know who you are! I’ve received incredible acts of kindness from people I only know as nicknames on this forum, have participated in kindness for others. I have ever had the pleasure of going to gigs with some of the best people to be in a moshpit with. I’ve shared beers (or joints) with great people. I’ve waited in line all day long with great people. I’ve swapped rare items with people I don’t even know but trusted because they were from the Ten Club. I’ve helped 10C foreigners in my part of the world, and have been helped by others when I was in their part of the world. We’ve shared stories, dreams and experiences that I will never forget. I’ve found true friendship in total strangers who share a common love of this band. I want that to be a big part of my life forever.
To me the Ten Club is more than tickets, more than merchandise and more than bitching on a message board. It is a club, we're all in it together and never once have I felt that those running the club did not respect me or try their hardest for me (and others). There are obviously problems with ten club ticketing, but every time they have tried to fix it, unfortunately they have failed, but as someone who understands servers, websites and crashes, I can see what they are trying to do and why. I for one would be happy to use TM for presales and pay the price, but that won’t produce any extra tickets and it won’t make everyone happy.
Right now I know of two ten clubbers going through huge medical issues and the way people from all around the globe have come together to support them in one way or another is awesome. I’ve seen the band donate items to good causes, I’ve been lucky enough for Ed to send down from the stage his stage played pick to my stepson – and made sure he got it. I caught a Tamborine inb Melbourne meant for someone else and gladly handed it to them – too be patted on the back by about half a dozen people around me. I’ve seen Mike show concern for a member who was about to faint in the pit in Sydney and motion for security to help her out. I know of people who have bumped into members of the band in the street and had great conversations when others would have told them to get lost. I’ve listened to some of the greatest rock albums of all time and seen some of the greatest shows of all time. That is what this club and this band is about.
In every institution there are mistakes, there are fuck ups and there are times people wished they acted differently. And if we are to look at the ten club’s record, on balance they done a pretty good job over the years. Call me stupid, but I will always be an analogue member of this club. Yes, they could lose my patronage, but nothing I have seen or experienced thus far has even bough me close to leaving. And my great number from the 90s was lost long ago when I forgot to renew in the early 200s0, I’m on a shitty 360k number now. I can get better tickets from TM and I can afford to pay a scalper to get great seats if I so desire – but the ten club experience makes a show so much better.
Today I witnessed something that absolutely disgusted me. I’ve learnt to ignore the bitching and carry on here. It shits me and brings down the enjoyment of this forum, but the 10c has the balls to allow well written legitimate gripes to be posted on their forum and I have no doubt the band cares. I’ve learnt to forgive the sense of entitlement and the childish sulking that comes from some with missing out on tickets or a limited edition item. But when people start flooding Mike Mcready’s personal facebook page with the bitterness and immature ranting, they have crossed the line in a big way. And then when called out about it they defend their actions! They guy goes public on facebook, tried to connect with fans, let us into small snippets of his life, have some fun and just be an all round nice guy and certain people think it is fun to flood his facebook with their childish bitterness.
I once posted, who among you would welcome someone into your house and then sit by while they kick your dog, call your wife a whore and shit on your carpet – while expecting to be served caviar, dogfish ale and Cuban cigars. An apt metaphor for the behaviour of certain members on the forum of the band they supposedly love.
Shame on all who this applies to – let the flaming begin – unlike some of you I’m man enough to post my name, my picture and stand behind my words.
PS - this in no way applies to all those who post respectful, polite and constructive criticism.
Some people on this forum need to take a long walk in the hall of mirrors and take a good hard look at themselves with a critical eye and put some serious consideration into their behaviour. Grown adults are acting worse than spoilt children and I really don’t care who I offend by saying it. Would you act like this in front of your children? Would you act like this in public or are you just message board trolls? How many of you bother to phone the 10 Club, or write a polite email before growing virtual testicles the size of basketballs and sprouting you immature bitterness and hate on here. Tough guys behind a keyboard = cowardly douchebags in the real world! I dare all of you haters to start posting using your real names, step out from behind your avatars and put your name to your posts.
The over the top hate spewed out in here cannot go unchallenged. Sure, you people have a legitimate gripe - ticketing has been a fiasco, but the ten club/pearl jam did not screw you over, the ten club/pearl jam did not disrespect you and the ten club/pearl jam did not take you for granted. They did their best and for one reason or another, it just was not good enough. Sure plenty of members have made gracious and fair comments and complaints and no-one (Tim, Kat, Sea et al) has censored these people. I’m not surprised Tim has lost his cool on occasion, he’d need thigh high boots to avoid stepping in the shit he has to take from so called fans. You’re lucky I don’t run the club because many of you’d be receiving a refund check counter signed fuck off and don’t come back.
The Ten Club has always treated me well. All my emails have been answered swiftly. All purchases delivered (safely to the other side of the world), and a couple of occasions where I fucked up (and I made a major fuck-up, the size most of you could never dream of making) - they have been sympathetic and fair.
It has been ups and downs for me too. I've missed out on fan club tickets and got them on other occasions, have followed the band around Australia, have petitioned for EV to play in my city (and was successful) visited USA twice to see them (LA3&4, Newark & MSG2), have purchased the Deluxe Bluray, the Billboard poster, the back pack, the PJ20 Vinyl and more t-shirts and posters than my wife can forgive but missed out on other things - but never felt the urge to come here and throw a tantrum like a toddler. I missed out on Benny Hall, missed out on merch at the shows but Life is life! On balance, being a member of this club has been great.
Through this band and this fan club I have met some of the nicest people in the world - you know who you are! I’ve received incredible acts of kindness from people I only know as nicknames on this forum, have participated in kindness for others. I have ever had the pleasure of going to gigs with some of the best people to be in a moshpit with. I’ve shared beers (or joints) with great people. I’ve waited in line all day long with great people. I’ve swapped rare items with people I don’t even know but trusted because they were from the Ten Club. I’ve helped 10C foreigners in my part of the world, and have been helped by others when I was in their part of the world. We’ve shared stories, dreams and experiences that I will never forget. I’ve found true friendship in total strangers who share a common love of this band. I want that to be a big part of my life forever.
To me the Ten Club is more than tickets, more than merchandise and more than bitching on a message board. It is a club, we're all in it together and never once have I felt that those running the club did not respect me or try their hardest for me (and others). There are obviously problems with ten club ticketing, but every time they have tried to fix it, unfortunately they have failed, but as someone who understands servers, websites and crashes, I can see what they are trying to do and why. I for one would be happy to use TM for presales and pay the price, but that won’t produce any extra tickets and it won’t make everyone happy.
Right now I know of two ten clubbers going through huge medical issues and the way people from all around the globe have come together to support them in one way or another is awesome. I’ve seen the band donate items to good causes, I’ve been lucky enough for Ed to send down from the stage his stage played pick to my stepson – and made sure he got it. I caught a Tamborine inb Melbourne meant for someone else and gladly handed it to them – too be patted on the back by about half a dozen people around me. I’ve seen Mike show concern for a member who was about to faint in the pit in Sydney and motion for security to help her out. I know of people who have bumped into members of the band in the street and had great conversations when others would have told them to get lost. I’ve listened to some of the greatest rock albums of all time and seen some of the greatest shows of all time. That is what this club and this band is about.
In every institution there are mistakes, there are fuck ups and there are times people wished they acted differently. And if we are to look at the ten club’s record, on balance they done a pretty good job over the years. Call me stupid, but I will always be an analogue member of this club. Yes, they could lose my patronage, but nothing I have seen or experienced thus far has even bough me close to leaving. And my great number from the 90s was lost long ago when I forgot to renew in the early 200s0, I’m on a shitty 360k number now. I can get better tickets from TM and I can afford to pay a scalper to get great seats if I so desire – but the ten club experience makes a show so much better.
Today I witnessed something that absolutely disgusted me. I’ve learnt to ignore the bitching and carry on here. It shits me and brings down the enjoyment of this forum, but the 10c has the balls to allow well written legitimate gripes to be posted on their forum and I have no doubt the band cares. I’ve learnt to forgive the sense of entitlement and the childish sulking that comes from some with missing out on tickets or a limited edition item. But when people start flooding Mike Mcready’s personal facebook page with the bitterness and immature ranting, they have crossed the line in a big way. And then when called out about it they defend their actions! They guy goes public on facebook, tried to connect with fans, let us into small snippets of his life, have some fun and just be an all round nice guy and certain people think it is fun to flood his facebook with their childish bitterness.
I once posted, who among you would welcome someone into your house and then sit by while they kick your dog, call your wife a whore and shit on your carpet – while expecting to be served caviar, dogfish ale and Cuban cigars. An apt metaphor for the behaviour of certain members on the forum of the band they supposedly love.
Shame on all who this applies to – let the flaming begin – unlike some of you I’m man enough to post my name, my picture and stand behind my words.
PS - this in no way applies to all those who post respectful, polite and constructive criticism.
Post edited by Unknown User on
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This discussion has been closed.
Comments
(I haven't read a lot of the posts... so I'm not too sure what folks have been saying around here)
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013
Toronto I&II 2016
10C: 220xxx
Aimed at those who lack politeness, respect and understanding. Aimed at those who flooded Mike's facebook page and aimed at those who are less mature than my 5 year old daughter (judging by their posts on here).
Disappointment is fair and justified - abuse and hate is not.
PS - To put it in perspective.
My wife and I are waiting to take our beautiful daughter to a cardiac specialist. Her little heart is not well :( Come back and bitch and moan about how fucking unfair life is because you didn't get tickets when you gotta live through this hell! The percentages say she's probably going to be fine - and every test she has gives us greater comfort - but we wont know for a month!
Tonight an Aussie music legend lays in a coma somewhere between life an death after damaging his brain falling from a ladder.
Tonight thousands of war veterans will sleep on the cold streets of a US city.
Tomorrow a heap of staving people will die in Africa.
A rock'n'roll show can change your life - but it is not life! :evil:
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Thanks spags, I wish I hadn't posted that now - this community is the first ones outside of my immediate family I've told - and it risks derailing the point i was trying to make.
We're staying positive, we have a great family doctor - an incredibly good free (socialist??) public health system in Australia and terrific family - including many many people I have met on here who are more my friends than people I've known my entire life. It just saddens me to read the crap when the overwhelming positiveness and love between members is swallowed up by it all.
We're all better than this!
what were people putting on it? Just curious. Doesn't have to be specific... just in general.
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013
Toronto I&II 2016
10C: 220xxx
I hope people take the time to read it and get some perspective out of it. There is so much negative energy around this forum as of late, it kind of takes away any incentive to visit it.
I think the ticketing system in general has been taken over by touts, at least for the high-selling shows, and it is really hard to get tickets unless you have a really good internet connection. And this has been getting worse over time. Could the Ten Club have done more to foresee this? Maybe, but who knows? I for one, don't claim to know since I do not know what has and has not been done. I understand the frustration, trust me, I would have been devastated if I had not managed to secure tickets. But I believe you can channel this frustration in a constructive way, without spewing bile. I really would not want to be on the receiving end of all of this....
Getting Ten Club tickets for PJ has been complicated for quite some time now, maybe it is a combination of technical issues and too many people going for too few tickets, but it seems the general sale was problematic too, and that many people were shut out. So it can't all be technical issues...
I do feel there has not been enough response from the Ten Club, and I also question the sabotage theory, so in that respect I hope they are more forthcoming with information and more open in their communications in the forum and to people writing or calling in personally. I am sure they are looking hard and deep into all this ticketing situation. In the meantime, we need to grow some patience.
If I knew where it was I would take you there.
I have posted this sentiment previously. People need to step back. Yes i got my tickets I wanted first time from Crowdsurge and yes I would be freaked if I didn't, but unless the majority of posters on here are 15 years old with a shite attitude, then grow up people. you didn't get ur tickets. It happens. In your position I would be annoyed but i would just concentrate on getting a ticket to a show. You aint got a ticket yet, then book an Isle of Wight ticket. now you do have a ticket.
This band have not stopped giving to us, musically and so much more than that over the last 20 yrs. FFS for the 2nd time in two years they will be in Europe during July 4th choosing to do this as opposed to spending time during that day so important to the USA.
I know it aint even the majority that are on here moaning, but you have a barrell of wine, it only takes a small amount of shit to ruin it.
Here's hoping the guys don't say fuck this for a game of soldiers!!
J
Millstreet Arena - Oct 24, 1996
The Point - Oct 26, 1996
The Point - Jun 01, 2000
The Point - Aug 23, 2006
Wembley Arena - Jun 18, 2007
Manchester Evening News Arena - Aug 17, 2009
The O2 - Jun 22, 2010
Odyssey Arena - Jun 23, 2010
Manchester Evening News Arena - Jun 20 2012
Amsterdam Ziggo Dome - Jun 26 2012
Amsterdam Ziggo Dome - Jun 16 2014
adding a 2nd night and not telling anyone about it when fans are already incensed is akin to pissing petrol onto a lake of fire.
Take care,
Mike McGrath (the guy in the picture holding his son Matt) :arrow:
he always speaks a great deal of sense, and with great tact.
good for you Paul....I understand peoples issues and they are real, but like you said...There are issues of decency that everyone needs to be aware of.
I like the sincerity in your post. I respectfully disagree with some of what you are saying though.
My personal experience with 10C has been much different than yours. I have only emailed them on three or four occasions since I have been a member (never sent emails with a rude tone) always genuinely looking for their assistance for services that they offered. I have never once heard back.
Most recent was when my shipment was most likely stolen by someone at the UPS tent at Alpine. This shipment went un-traced and at the time UPS wasn't willing to help me out because I couldn't provide them with the store info.
I asked 10C if they were able to give me some sort of information or a contact name of someone who co-ordinated having UPS services onsite. Again, not one response (I later found out from another member that they did in-fact have that information) and I'm not sure why they couldn't give me some form of a response.
I understand that this is just merch but it's the principle of it.
This year alone I've estimated that I have spent over 30+ hours in front of the computer trying to purchase tickets. I do this because of how much I love seeing the band live. But I've come to a point in my life where time is sparse and I really need to use every bit of it effectively.
In my opinion the issues with 10C have been going on for years. Some people have had quite pleasant experiences with them and some have had the complete opposite and do feel like there has been a level of disrespect shown to them by the club.
I don't agree with verbally assaulting anyone but I do think that the tenclub deserves a lot of the frustration that has been directed their way.
Do I think that people should be verbally abusive to Mike on Facebook? Hell no!
But I do think that people have the right to express to Mike their displeasure with the people representing him, on his public facebook page.
im here for friend ,community and love of people and music..the rest are details doesnt count..
still we need to meet at a show...
"..That's One Happy Fuckin Ghost.."
“..That came up on the Pillow Case...This is for the Greek, With Our Apologies.....”
Fair comments - and these are the kinds of comments that are fair and justified - no hate, just a rational complaint and desire for better service.
Like I said, there are obviously some problems, but it is the manner certain people deal with these problems that I was referring to. I am no apologist for the club and don't live in La La Land, I understand disappointment, frustration and anger. I just wish all our communications/debates/gripes could be conducted more like Fareed Zakaria GPS on CNN than Sean Hannity on Faux News.
One day mate - one day!
manchester 09
belfast 2010
hyde park 2010
manchester 2012 1&2
amsterdam 2012 1&2
EV manchester 2012
EV london 31/7/12
brooklyn 2013 1&2
milano,leeds,milton keynes 2014
monkey driven call this living
2007 • Wembley - London
2009 • Melbourne
2010 • Madison Square Garden
Thanks for being an adult... I aspire everyday to be one.
Adam
For Shame!!!!!!!!!
Man this is terrible and I hope none of his family seen that crap.
are you implying that Sean Hannity is full of shit? good on ya. and nice original post. I have a couple of gripes, but they are repeated on a 24 hour cycle here, so no need for me to add to the fire. I have had very good experiences with 10club and my contacts with the people there, which happens very rarely. I'm guessing they are not happy that they are having problems and are attempting to fix things. Shit happens. I've been frustrated at times, sure, but bottom line, they seem like good people. Plus there is no other pearl jam fanclub, so i'm stuck here
10C has me listed as a member since 2008 but I have actually been a member on and off (more on then off) since I was 12 years old, beginning in 1994, under my maiden name. I have the Christmas singles to prove it. I must say that I have always hoped to get tickets to the shows that I have attended through the 10C and this tour is the time it really paid off. I got tickets to Eddie's solo tour through 10C and the seats were not great. Seats in the past that I have gotten through 10C for West Palm Beach and Mansfield, MA were not great either. WITH THAT SAID, at least I got tickets. I am not a member of the 10C solely for ticket benefits. I am a member because Pearl Jam is the GREATEST BAND EVER! Their music and lyrics got me through my turmultous teenage years, and they have gotten me through many difficulties throughout my life. I feel a deep spiritual connection to their music, to their lyrics, as if they have been written just for me. And the 10C offers me the closest thing to a relationship with the band. This is about LOVE, people! LOVE of the MUSIC, LOVE of the BAND. FORTHELOVEOFPEARLJAM
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