The Death Penalty

Thirty Bills Unpaid

oftenreading said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

I'm sure the last thing a murderer wants is to have their victim's family speak to how they've been impacted.

I'm pretty sure murderers would prefer the courts think of the victims as letters string together on a page in the form of a name- a faceless non entity.

Murderers do their best to minimize their actions seeking as little punishment as possible. I am not in favour of victim impact statements influencing sentences- I'm in favour of courts working on behalf of the victims regardless. From my way of thinking, in my country, I don't think this is being done. Simply put... we are too lenient.

We go in circles here. My only point is that justice is not being served if it does not also apply to the less popular of the victims.

And I'm in agreement with you.

I'm just adding that justice is hardly ever served though and if victim impact statements can assist motivating the courts to act with a heavier hand in at least some of the trials we experience... I'm not going to object.

HughFreakingDillon

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

oftenreading said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

I'm sure the last thing a murderer wants is to have their victim's family speak to how they've been impacted.

I'm pretty sure murderers would prefer the courts think of the victims as letters string together on a page in the form of a name- a faceless non entity.

Murderers do their best to minimize their actions seeking as little punishment as possible. I am not in favour of victim impact statements influencing sentences- I'm in favour of courts working on behalf of the victims regardless. From my way of thinking, in my country, I don't think this is being done. Simply put... we are too lenient.

We go in circles here. My only point is that justice is not being served if it does not also apply to the less popular of the victims.

And I'm in agreement with you.

I'm just adding that justice is hardly ever served though and if victim impact statements can assist motivating the courts to act with a heavier hand in at least some of the trials we experience... I'm not going to object.

but you just finished saying this:

"I am not in favour of victim impact statements influencing sentences"

callen

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

I'm sure the last thing a murderer wants is to have their victim's family speak to how they've been impacted.

I'm pretty sure murderers would prefer the courts think of the victims as letters string together on a page in the form of a name- a faceless non entity.

Murderers do their best to minimize their actions seeking as little punishment as possible. I am not in favour of victim impact statements influencing sentences- I'm in favour of courts working on behalf of the victims regardless. From my way of thinking, in my country, I don't think this is being done. Simply put... we are too lenient.

I love the fact victims families can face accusers and tell them what they feel. I also agree that some sentences are too light. 30 years for premeditated murder!!!!! Life wo possibility of parole. Okay we freinds again???

Thirty Bills Unpaid

HughFreakingDillon said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

oftenreading said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

I'm sure the last thing a murderer wants is to have their victim's family speak to how they've been impacted.

I'm pretty sure murderers would prefer the courts think of the victims as letters string together on a page in the form of a name- a faceless non entity.

Murderers do their best to minimize their actions seeking as little punishment as possible. I am not in favour of victim impact statements influencing sentences- I'm in favour of courts working on behalf of the victims regardless. From my way of thinking, in my country, I don't think this is being done. Simply put... we are too lenient.

We go in circles here. My only point is that justice is not being served if it does not also apply to the less popular of the victims.

And I'm in agreement with you.

I'm just adding that justice is hardly ever served though and if victim impact statements can assist motivating the courts to act with a heavier hand in at least some of the trials we experience... I'm not going to object.

but you just finished saying this:

"I am not in favour of victim impact statements influencing sentences"

I should have had a qualifying statement to what I said: however, given our consistently weak sentencing history... I can accept them if they are the only thing that pushes our courts to determine sentences that aren't laughable.

I would prefer the courts of our land to do the job we need them to do without pleading on the part of victims.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

callen said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

I'm sure the last thing a murderer wants is to have their victim's family speak to how they've been impacted.

I'm pretty sure murderers would prefer the courts think of the victims as letters string together on a page in the form of a name- a faceless non entity.

Murderers do their best to minimize their actions seeking as little punishment as possible. I am not in favour of victim impact statements influencing sentences- I'm in favour of courts working on behalf of the victims regardless. From my way of thinking, in my country, I don't think this is being done. Simply put... we are too lenient.

I love the fact victims families can face accusers and tell them what they feel. I also agree that some sentences are too light. 30 years for premeditated murder!!!!! Life wo possibility of parole. Okay we freinds again???

We're always friends, Callen.

HughFreakingDillon

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

oftenreading said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

I'm sure the last thing a murderer wants is to have their victim's family speak to how they've been impacted.

I'm pretty sure murderers would prefer the courts think of the victims as letters string together on a page in the form of a name- a faceless non entity.

Murderers do their best to minimize their actions seeking as little punishment as possible. I am not in favour of victim impact statements influencing sentences- I'm in favour of courts working on behalf of the victims regardless. From my way of thinking, in my country, I don't think this is being done. Simply put... we are too lenient.

We go in circles here. My only point is that justice is not being served if it does not also apply to the less popular of the victims.

And I'm in agreement with you.

I'm just adding that justice is hardly ever served though and if victim impact statements can assist motivating the courts to act with a heavier hand in at least some of the trials we experience... I'm not going to object.

but you just finished saying this:

"I am not in favour of victim impact statements influencing sentences"

I should have had a qualifying statement to what I said: however, given our consistently weak sentencing history... I can accept them if they are the only thing that pushes our courts to determine sentences that aren't laughable.

I would prefer the courts of our land to do the job we need them to do without pleading on the part of victims.

well, we absolutely agree on lenient sentencing issues in Canada.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

HughFreakingDillon said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

oftenreading said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

I'm sure the last thing a murderer wants is to have their victim's family speak to how they've been impacted.

I'm pretty sure murderers would prefer the courts think of the victims as letters string together on a page in the form of a name- a faceless non entity.

Murderers do their best to minimize their actions seeking as little punishment as possible. I am not in favour of victim impact statements influencing sentences- I'm in favour of courts working on behalf of the victims regardless. From my way of thinking, in my country, I don't think this is being done. Simply put... we are too lenient.

We go in circles here. My only point is that justice is not being served if it does not also apply to the less popular of the victims.

And I'm in agreement with you.

I'm just adding that justice is hardly ever served though and if victim impact statements can assist motivating the courts to act with a heavier hand in at least some of the trials we experience... I'm not going to object.

but you just finished saying this:

"I am not in favour of victim impact statements influencing sentences"

I should have had a qualifying statement to what I said: however, given our consistently weak sentencing history... I can accept them if they are the only thing that pushes our courts to determine sentences that aren't laughable.

I would prefer the courts of our land to do the job we need them to do without pleading on the part of victims.

well, we absolutely agree on lenient sentencing issues in Canada.

I know we do.

I understand fully we only differ with regards to what we feel is an appropriate punishment for some crimes- makes for good discussion though!

PJfanwillneverleave1

Well another one scheduled for tomorrow.
Anyone care?
or is it only that it's making headlines that people know this name now http://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/crime/judge-denies-stay-of-georgia-womans-execution/ar-AAeSMxP?li=AAadgLE&ocid=mailsignoutmd


https://www.themarshallproject.org/next-to-die

HughFreakingDillon

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Well another one scheduled for tomorrow.
Anyone care?
or is it only that it's making headlines that people know this name now http://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/crime/judge-denies-stay-of-georgia-womans-execution/ar-AAeSMxP?li=AAadgLE&ocid=mailsignoutmd


https://www.themarshallproject.org/next-to-die

can't imagine being one of the kids. I wouldn't have imagined they'd be on their mom's side, after she had their dad killed.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Well another one scheduled for tomorrow.
Anyone care?
or is it only that it's making headlines that people know this name now http://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/crime/judge-denies-stay-of-georgia-womans-execution/ar-AAeSMxP?li=AAadgLE&ocid=mailsignoutmd


https://www.themarshallproject.org/next-to-die

can't imagine being one of the kids. I wouldn't have imagined they'd be on their mom's side, after she had their dad killed.

I can see it. If anyone was going to forgive their mother... it would be her kids regardless of the fact it was their father who's life she took.

They are still angry- advocating for a life sentence- but don't want to see her executed. The conditions surrounding this murder aren't of the depraved variety: it's not a case I would seek a death sentence.

I wonder what the parents of the husband wish for?

HughFreakingDillon

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Well another one scheduled for tomorrow.
Anyone care?
or is it only that it's making headlines that people know this name now http://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/crime/judge-denies-stay-of-georgia-womans-execution/ar-AAeSMxP?li=AAadgLE&ocid=mailsignoutmd


https://www.themarshallproject.org/next-to-die

can't imagine being one of the kids. I wouldn't have imagined they'd be on their mom's side, after she had their dad killed.

I can see it. If anyone was going to forgive their mother... it would be her kids regardless of the fact it was their father who's life she took.

They are still angry- advocating for a life sentence- but don't want to see her executed. The conditions surrounding this murder aren't of the depraved variety: it's not a case I would seek a death sentence.

I wonder what the parents of the husband wish for?

yeah, I suppose....it's really difficult for me to put myself in their shoes....I mean, your Mom is your Mom, I suppose even if she had your Dad killed. But jesus, the conflicting emotions surrounding that would be horrendous.

Who Princess

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

can't imagine being one of the kids. I wouldn't have imagined they'd be on their mom's side, after she had their dad killed.

I can see it. If anyone was going to forgive their mother... it would be her kids regardless of the fact it was their father who's life she took.

They are still angry- advocating for a life sentence- but don't want to see her executed. The conditions surrounding this murder aren't of the depraved variety: it's not a case I would seek a death sentence.

I wonder what the parents of the husband wish for?

Looks like his family wants the execution to go ahead: http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/lethal-injection/victims-family-husband-killer-doesnt-deserve-clemency-n435566

I don't know anything about this case except what I've read in the last day or so, but it does bring up one of the things about the death penalty that bothers the hell out of me. The person who actually committed the murder received a life sentence while the plotter received the death penalty. When parties are tried separately, it's like a crap shoot when it comes to their punishment.

(Note: Read the article for what she requested for her last meal. )

PJ_Soul

Who Princess said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

can't imagine being one of the kids. I wouldn't have imagined they'd be on their mom's side, after she had their dad killed.

I can see it. If anyone was going to forgive their mother... it would be her kids regardless of the fact it was their father who's life she took.

They are still angry- advocating for a life sentence- but don't want to see her executed. The conditions surrounding this murder aren't of the depraved variety: it's not a case I would seek a death sentence.

I wonder what the parents of the husband wish for?

Looks like his family wants the execution to go ahead: http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/lethal-injection/victims-family-husband-killer-doesnt-deserve-clemency-n435566

I don't know anything about this case except what I've read in the last day or so, but it does bring up one of the things about the death penalty that bothers the hell out of me. The person who actually committed the murder received a life sentence while the plotter received the death penalty. When parties are tried separately, it's like a crap shoot when it comes to their punishment.

(Note: Read the article for what she requested for her last meal. )

I saw a story the other day where there was this mother, daughter, and then her daughter's black boyfriend committed murder. The mother orchestrated the murder of her husband, the daughter's dad. She manipulated her daughter and her black BF into helping her, and all three of them ended up beating him to death, as a team, and dumped the body. The mother got some prison time, and the daughter got some prison time, and the black boyfriend got life in prison without a chance of parole.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

Who Princess said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

can't imagine being one of the kids. I wouldn't have imagined they'd be on their mom's side, after she had their dad killed.

I can see it. If anyone was going to forgive their mother... it would be her kids regardless of the fact it was their father who's life she took.

They are still angry- advocating for a life sentence- but don't want to see her executed. The conditions surrounding this murder aren't of the depraved variety: it's not a case I would seek a death sentence.

I wonder what the parents of the husband wish for?

Looks like his family wants the execution to go ahead: http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/lethal-injection/victims-family-husband-killer-doesnt-deserve-clemency-n435566

I don't know anything about this case except what I've read in the last day or so, but it does bring up one of the things about the death penalty that bothers the hell out of me. The person who actually committed the murder received a life sentence while the plotter received the death penalty. When parties are tried separately, it's like a crap shoot when it comes to their punishment.

(Note: Read the article for what she requested for her last meal. )

Wouldn't be my last meal.

I agree with you that there's something fundamentally wrong with the actual murderer receiving a lesser sentence.

Who Princess

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Who Princess said:

(Note: Read the article for what she requested for her last meal. )

Wouldn't be my last meal.

It was the diet lemonade that got my attention. Diet? Diet?

Who Princess

PJ_Soul said:

I saw a story the other were there was this mother, daughter, and then her daughter's black boyfriend. The mother orchestrated the murder of her husband, the daughter's dad. She manipulated her daughter and her black BF into helping her, and all three of them ended up beating him to death, as a team, and dumped the body. The mother got some prison time, and the daughter got some prison time, and the black boyfriend got life in prison without a chance of parole.

I guess I shouldn't be surprised.

There seem to be so many cases where one person takes a plea deal and testifies against the others involved. Prosecutors always rave about how much money the taxpayers saved by avoiding so many trials but there's no consistency to the sentences.

Many years ago there was a notorious murder case where I live. You can read the details here: http://www.txexecutions.org/reports/233-Jeffrey-Dillingham.htm. I know there was a lot of discussion at the time about the differences in the sentences. Like I said above, it seems like kind of a crap shoot.

I live in the state where we seem to have no qualms about executing people. I can't tell that it makes any difference in crime rates and I feel sure that innocent people have been executed. We also have the highest number of death row exonerations. Sometimes someone is executed and it doesn't seem to bother me (Timothy McVeigh, John Allen Muhammad) but most of the time I can't see much point in it.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

Who Princess said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Who Princess said:

(Note: Read the article for what she requested for her last meal. )

Wouldn't be my last meal.

It was the diet lemonade that got my attention. Diet? Diet?

Hahahahhaha.

That one slipped by me.

PJfanwillneverleave1

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Who Princess said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

can't imagine being one of the kids. I wouldn't have imagined they'd be on their mom's side, after she had their dad killed.

I can see it. If anyone was going to forgive their mother... it would be her kids regardless of the fact it was their father who's life she took.

They are still angry- advocating for a life sentence- but don't want to see her executed. The conditions surrounding this murder aren't of the depraved variety: it's not a case I would seek a death sentence.

I wonder what the parents of the husband wish for?

Looks like his family wants the execution to go ahead: http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/lethal-injection/victims-family-husband-killer-doesnt-deserve-clemency-n435566

I don't know anything about this case except what I've read in the last day or so, but it does bring up one of the things about the death penalty that bothers the hell out of me. The person who actually committed the murder received a life sentence while the plotter received the death penalty. When parties are tried separately, it's like a crap shoot when it comes to their punishment.

(Note: Read the article for what she requested for her last meal. )

I agree with you that there's something fundamentally wrong with the actual murderer receiving a lesser sentence.

Passive Aggressive deterrent to future wanabee plotters?
Murderers already are missing vital parts of their brain it is the plotters who are the smart ones who get others to do the dirty work.

My last meal would be one anchovy pizza.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Who Princess said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

can't imagine being one of the kids. I wouldn't have imagined they'd be on their mom's side, after she had their dad killed.

I can see it. If anyone was going to forgive their mother... it would be her kids regardless of the fact it was their father who's life she took.

They are still angry- advocating for a life sentence- but don't want to see her executed. The conditions surrounding this murder aren't of the depraved variety: it's not a case I would seek a death sentence.

I wonder what the parents of the husband wish for?

Looks like his family wants the execution to go ahead: http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/lethal-injection/victims-family-husband-killer-doesnt-deserve-clemency-n435566

I don't know anything about this case except what I've read in the last day or so, but it does bring up one of the things about the death penalty that bothers the hell out of me. The person who actually committed the murder received a life sentence while the plotter received the death penalty. When parties are tried separately, it's like a crap shoot when it comes to their punishment.

(Note: Read the article for what she requested for her last meal. )

I agree with you that there's something fundamentally wrong with the actual murderer receiving a lesser sentence.

Passive Aggressive deterrent to future wanabee plotters?
Murderers already are missing vital parts of their brain it is the plotters who are the smart ones who get others to do the dirty work.

My last meal would be one anchovy pizza.

Charles Manson.

HughFreakingDillon

after thinking about it, when you have organized crime, for example, the mob boss who organized and ordered the thugs to get their hands dirty are the ones that should get the most time, not the guys on the front lines doing the deed. there is an extra level of intent there, scheming if you will, to get others to do it. I would have to agree that the conspirator should receive a harsher penalty than the perpetrator.