australia.. the dumb blonde

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  • pandorapandora Posts: 21,855
    dumb blondes are endearing :D
  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    pandora wrote:
    dumb blondes are endearing :D

    no theyre not. theyre dumb and tiresome.
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  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    Jason P wrote:
    Yahoo Serious did not do Australia any favors. I think he personally set Australia's image and culture back 50 years. :lol::lol:

    nope he did not. but you need to be able to laugh at yourself otherwise youll just take yourself way too seriously and start invading other countries.

    our most endearing national hero was a bushranger. 8-)
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  • Jason PJason P Posts: 19,158
    Jason P wrote:
    Yahoo Serious did not do Australia any favors. I think he personally set Australia's image and culture back 50 years. :lol::lol:

    nope he did not. but you need to be able to laugh at yourself otherwise youll just take yourself way too seriously and start invading other countries.

    our most endearing national hero was a bushranger. 8-)
    I always liked his goofy movies. :thumbup:

    Personally, I can't wait to visit Australia and New Zealand. I've never met anybody who has had a bad thing to say after visiting. Too bad airline tickets are so expensive :(
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  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    Jason P wrote:
    I always liked his goofy movies. :thumbup:

    Personally, I can't wait to visit Australia and New Zealand. I've never met anybody who has had a bad thing to say after visiting. Too bad airline tickets are so expensive :(

    well imagine how we feel living so far away from so much. it cant always be about 6 months in a leaky boat. 8-)
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  • stardust1976stardust1976 Posts: 1,301
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Germaine Greer
    '...I have to admit that if I hadn't been studying in England, if I hadn't been living in the genuinely multicultural society of postgraduate students in Cambridge, I might never have grasped the absurdity of Australians mounting street demonstrations against the South African Springbok tour in 1971. And might never have glimpsed the Australian situation from an international perspective.

    It was not until I was half a world away that I could suddenly see that what was operating in Australia was apartheid: the separation and alienation South Africa tried desperately and savagely to impose on their black majority, we had achieved, apparently effortlessly, with our black minority.'

    that was nearly 40 years ago steve. and i might add growing up in the 70s as i did, i came into contact with many indigenous peoples simply because they 'lived amongst us.' they werent the majority but they certainly werent invisible. and yes i know this wasnt the case everywhere.

    No, it's not the case everywhere, just as the alcoholism isn't the case with every Aboriginal. They aren't invisible, and yes, they 'live amongst us' here. There are many many Aboriginals who expect no special treatment because they are indigenous, and who study, and work, just like there are many many white Australians who are basically 'dole bludgers'. Which is the point I was getting at earlier (and clearly failing miserably to get across). There is racism throughout the country, as there is in EVERY country - but to suggest that every Australian you've ever spoken to IS racist, is more than a little extreme. I was not being racist when I stated that there is a major problem with alcoholism and the like in Indigenous communities - I was being real. It's a fact, and not a single Australian, white OR black, can deny it. For the vast majority of Australians, we would be happy if every person here got equal treatment, and made of it what they may. Take opportunity that is given to you and run with it. This is not being racist to suggest that a lot of Aboriginals don't do this, the same as it's not being racist to suggest that a lot of white Australians don't do it. It's simply stating facts. But saying that every Australian only says derogatory things about our indigenous people, well, that's far from fact, and you know it. To suggest that Australia lives in an apartheid state is very wrong. It's not the case, and if you lived here, you would see that, and understand it as well. Not suggesting there aren't problems, but please, give us some credit - you seem to be convinced that we are all horribly racist people who would like to lock all the Aboriginals up and throw away the key, and not think about them anymore, simply because you have read some things that someone who no longer lives here, has written about. THis is a big part of what irritates me about her - she writes things from a VERY one-eyed viewpoint.
  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    Byrnzie wrote:
    ...
    New Zealand has embraced the Maori culture, so why can't Australia embrace it's Aboriginal culture?..

    different circumstances. different indigenous cultures.
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  • stardust1976stardust1976 Posts: 1,301
    Jason P wrote:
    Yahoo Serious did not do Australia any favors. I think he personally set Australia's image and culture back 50 years. :lol::lol:

    nope he did not. but you need to be able to laugh at yourself otherwise youll just take yourself way too seriously and start invading other countries.

    our most endearing national hero was a bushranger. 8-)

    And don't we just love Ned? I actually have done several paintings of him (well, his helmet really!), and my kids favourite paintings are probably the 'Ned' ones by Sidney Nolan. They're so awesome! Pity he was Irish = but oh well... ;)
  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    Jason P wrote:
    Yahoo Serious did not do Australia any favors. I think he personally set Australia's image and culture back 50 years. :lol::lol:

    nope he did not. but you need to be able to laugh at yourself otherwise youll just take yourself way too seriously and start invading other countries.

    our most endearing national hero was a bushranger. 8-)

    And don't we just love Ned? I actually have done several paintings of him (well, his helmet really!), and my kids favourite paintings are probably the 'Ned' ones by Sidney Nolan. They're so awesome! Pity he was Irish = but oh well... ;)

    right now im looking up at the wall above my desk and there is a pic of the zoemonster with a large black rectangle painted over her head with a postbox slot in it so all i can see are her eyes. replicating an 87 photo of nolan himself. aussie history comes alive! :lol:

    p.s. nolan was born in carlton.
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  • stardust1976stardust1976 Posts: 1,301

    And don't we just love Ned? I actually have done several paintings of him (well, his helmet really!), and my kids favourite paintings are probably the 'Ned' ones by Sidney Nolan. They're so awesome! Pity he was Irish = but oh well... ;)

    right now im looking up at the wall above my desk and there is a pic of the zoemonster with a large black rectangle painted over her head with a postbox slot in it so all i can see are her eyes. replicating an 87 photo of nolan himself. aussie history comes alive! :lol:

    p.s. nolan was born in carlton.

    Carlton? Really - huh, for some reason I thought he was from NSW - must be getting him confused with someone else. I was talking about Ned Kelly being Irish though. Always did have a thing for Irishmen... ;)
  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003

    And don't we just love Ned? I actually have done several paintings of him (well, his helmet really!), and my kids favourite paintings are probably the 'Ned' ones by Sidney Nolan. They're so awesome! Pity he was Irish = but oh well... ;)

    right now im looking up at the wall above my desk and there is a pic of the zoemonster with a large black rectangle painted over her head with a postbox slot in it so all i can see are her eyes. replicating an 87 photo of nolan himself. aussie history comes alive! :lol:

    p.s. nolan was born in carlton.

    Carlton? Really - huh, for some reason I thought he was from NSW - must be getting him confused with someone else. I was talking about Ned Kelly being Irish though. Always did have a thing for Irishmen... ;)

    who doesnt. ;)8-)

    re:nolan.. id call you a dumb blonde aussie but youre not blonde. ;):lol:
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  • stardust1976stardust1976 Posts: 1,301

    right now im looking up at the wall above my desk and there is a pic of the zoemonster with a large black rectangle painted over her head with a postbox slot in it so all i can see are her eyes. replicating an 87 photo of nolan himself. aussie history comes alive! :lol:

    p.s. nolan was born in carlton.

    Carlton? Really - huh, for some reason I thought he was from NSW - must be getting him confused with someone else. I was talking about Ned Kelly being Irish though. Always did have a thing for Irishmen... ;)

    who doesnt. ;)8-)

    re:nolan.. id call you a dumb blonde aussie but youre not blonde. ;):lol:

    :lol::) nope - not currently, but have been!!!! And it's ok - I don't take offence to being called that every now and then, hehehehe...
  • pandorapandora Posts: 21,855
    pandora wrote:
    dumb blondes are endearing :D

    no theyre not. theyre dumb and tiresome.
    to those that don't constantly judge others on their less than.... they are endearing
    it's all in how you accept others and attempt to love them.
    None of us are perfect remember?
  • reading all of this has really given me an education about Australia. I didn't realize they treated their aboriginals the same, NEARLY IDENTICAL, historically as we did in Canada.

    it's insane the similarities, good and bad, about our two nations.
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  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    Paul David wrote:
    reading all of this has really given me an education about Australia. I didn't realize they treated their aboriginals the same, NEARLY IDENTICAL, historically as we did in Canada.

    it's insane the similarities, good and bad, about our two nations.

    but totally understandable considering.
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  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    pandora wrote:
    pandora wrote:
    dumb blondes are endearing :D

    no theyre not. theyre dumb and tiresome.
    to those that don't constantly judge others on their less than.... they are endearing
    it's all in how you accept others and attempt to love them.
    None of us are perfect remember?

    :roll:

    who is constantly judging? sorry, i dont find dumb people endearing. i find it frustrating. and i dont have to love them, i dont have to love everyone, just respect them as people. which is what i do.. doesnt change the fact theyre tiresome and frustrating for me.

    but you know whats worse? ... people who act dumb.
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  • I came from the dream time, from the dusty red soil plains,
    I am the ancient heart - the keeper of the flame,
    I stood upon the rocky shore, I watched the tall ships come,
    For forty thousand years I'd been the first Australian.

    We are one but we are many
    And from all the lands on earth we come,
    we share a dream,
    And sing with one voice,
    I am, you are, we are Australian.
  • ONCE DEVIDEDONCE DEVIDED Posts: 1,131
    Byrnzie wrote:
    so she can write papers based on what experience.
    she would need to be here for that.


    Why?

    When's the cut off point when someone's opinions can be dismissed just because they've lived in another part of the world - despite the fact she makes regular trips back there and keeps up to date on political and cultural developments?

    one year?
    two years?
    10 years?

    I've not lived in England for four years so can my comments on anything to do with England all be dismissed out of hand now?

    the piont is you seem to take her opinion from the other side of the world over people who live here, experience the culture, endure the society.
    its people like greer who continue the stereo type of bronzed aussie males and bonzer sheilas. and I can tell you its far from the truth.
    these days an average aussie may just look asian or middle eastern, or a blend in between.
    and a good 30 year gap is enough, that nearly my lifetime and I can tell you in my lifetimes there has been monumental change. massive change
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  • ByrnzieByrnzie Posts: 21,037
    edited October 2010
    Byrnzie wrote:
    so she can write papers based on what experience.
    she would need to be here for that.


    Why?

    When's the cut off point when someone's opinions can be dismissed just because they've lived in another part of the world - despite the fact she makes regular trips back there and keeps up to date on political and cultural developments?

    one year?
    two years?
    10 years?

    I've not lived in England for four years so can my comments on anything to do with England all be dismissed out of hand now?

    the piont is you seem to take her opinion from the other side of the world over people who live here, experience the culture, endure the society.
    its people like greer who continue the stereo type of bronzed aussie males and bonzer sheilas. and I can tell you its far from the truth.
    these days an average aussie may just look asian or middle eastern, or a blend in between.
    and a good 30 year gap is enough, that nearly my lifetime and I can tell you in my lifetimes there has been monumental change. massive change

    It's o.k, I get it: She doesn't live there now so she has no idea about the place, despite frequent visits, and having family and friends there, and keeping up to date on cultural and political developments.

    I'm not saying that her every word is sacrosanct - I was just throwing it out there. And I'm all for tearing people's arguments apart, but to dismiss her comments based simply on the fact that she doesn't now live in Australia doesn't cut it.
    Post edited by Byrnzie on
  • pandorapandora Posts: 21,855
    pandora wrote:

    no theyre not. theyre dumb and tiresome.
    to those that don't constantly judge others on their less than.... they are endearing
    it's all in how you accept others and attempt to love them.
    None of us are perfect remember?

    :roll:

    who is constantly judging? sorry, i dont find dumb people endearing. i find it frustrating. and i dont have to love them, i dont have to love everyone, just respect them as people. which is what i do.. doesnt change the fact theyre tiresome and frustrating for me.

    but you know whats worse? ... people who act dumb.
    It doesn't feel like respect, your words don't ring respectful. When you say someone is tiresome that sounds disrespectful and judgmental. And like you'd rather not engage.
  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    pandora wrote:
    :roll:

    who is constantly judging? sorry, i dont find dumb people endearing. i find it frustrating. and i dont have to love them, i dont have to love everyone, just respect them as people. which is what i do.. doesnt change the fact theyre tiresome and frustrating for me.

    but you know whats worse? ... people who act dumb.
    It doesn't feel like respect, your words don't ring respectful. When you say someone is tiresome that sounds disrespectful and judgmental. And like you'd rather not engage.

    so its more respectful to pretend?

    i stated that i find dumb people tiresome. all that is is a statement of fact. if that is judgemental then so be it. i find it difficult enough to engage with people in general, but dealing with dumb people... thats something i just cant do. its the same with racist or ignorant people. i simply have zero patience.
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  • ONCE DEVIDEDONCE DEVIDED Posts: 1,131
    It's o.k, I get it: She doesn't live there now so she has no idea about the place, despite frequent visits, and having family and friends there, and keeping up to date on cultural and political developments.

    I'm not saying that her every word is sacrosanct - I was just throwing it out there. And I'm all for tearing people's arguments apart, but to dismiss her comments based simply on the fact that she doesn't now live in Australia doesn't cut it.[/quote]

    as an australian we often get her quotes, her diatribes. her papers splashed throughout our society. and its mostly crap.
    I would listen more to eminent intelelgent Australians who live here, study here and travel the world bringing back more knowledge.
    Oh I went on holidays to Europe does that make me an expert on the subject.
    If you are not living in the society how can you know the nuances.
    How can you be an anarchist in a society , when you dont live in it.

    lots of people have ideas, why is hers the only one you bring to the table. I find that interesting.
    The female Eunach makes her an expert on everything ??
    AUSSIE AUSSIE AUSSIE
  • The female Eunach makes her an expert on everything ??
    i read the female eunuch and it was an interestíng read but not something i'd base my own thought on. not even close.
  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    ...If you are not living in the society how can you know the nuances.
    How can you be an anarchist in a society , when you dont live in it....

    of course it also depends on where in that society you live. though one would say we all live within the australian society i can tell you my sister, my parents and my own experiences are different. and this even despite my sister and i living in the same city. but even within that, within our own local areas contrary views and values will be found. stereotypes are destructive. and dismissing a whole people as racist is not only destructive, its lazy. and no one is more lazy than the media.
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  • ByrnzieByrnzie Posts: 21,037
    If you are not living in the society how can you know the nuances.
    How can you be an anarchist in a society , when you dont live in it.

    lots of people have ideas, why is hers the only one you bring to the table. I find that interesting.
    The female Eunach makes her an expert on everything ??

    She was born and raised there. I was born in England but I've lived in Asia the past 4 years, so is anything I say about England now irrelevant?

    And I've not read the female Eunach, but I did read 'White Fella Jump Up'. Did you even read the above excerpt from that book that I quoted on the first page of this thread?
  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    just for the record, nothing that germaine greer said in that extract is anything i disagree with.
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  • stardust1976stardust1976 Posts: 1,301
    Byrnzie wrote:
    If you are not living in the society how can you know the nuances.
    How can you be an anarchist in a society , when you dont live in it.

    lots of people have ideas, why is hers the only one you bring to the table. I find that interesting.
    The female Eunach makes her an expert on everything ??

    She was born and raised there. I was born in England but I've lived in Asia the past 4 years, so is anything I say about England now irrelevant?

    And I've not read the female Eunach, but I did read 'White Fella Jump Up'. Did you even read the above excerpt from that book that I quoted on the first page of this thread?

    I've read it. And I have to say, there is PLENTY that I disagree with. The first and foremost being the total and utter hypocrisy of her words. How can she claim to be wanting whitefellas to reverse the actions they have taken, when the actions they have taken have led to her being who she is and where she is today? She exists ONLY because of Europeans colonising Australia. The second hypocrisy I see, is the fact that she constantly states that no one living in inland Australia or rural areas has been there very long - that no one stays. She clearly has NOT been immersed in rural Australia. I have personally (meaning very very first hand experience, not quoted from a book), spoken to, and lived amongst people who have farmed the land for generations upon generations. How can she say that only blackfellas remain? ANd if she truly had emmersed herself in that culture as you so staunchly believe, she would understand that in most of these rural towns and outcrops, the Aboriginals live alongside white Australians, peacefully, no issues - no alcoholism, no violence. SHe clearly has little idea of what it means to live in Australia today. Perhaps some of her issues were relevant when she lived here, but 30 years IS a lifetime, and many steps towards change have been made in those 30 years. Without living here she doesn't have the chance to see those steps in action, and can not comment on them. Do I think there is a problem? YES. Do I think the Australian Government has a lot to do with the problem? YES. The biggest factor I can see, is the handing out of welfare payments. Whole communities are given lump sums of money each fortnight without having to work for it - no sense of self or direction is required. This leads to problems in ANY society, let alone one that is already troubled by a lack of, or loss of, identity. The solution has been slow coming, but it IS coming. Very slowly but surely the Government is putting into place programs to help Aboriginal communities get back that sense of identity that for so long has been denied. Most Australians that you speak to living here, will agree there is a problem, but most are also happy to learn about steps that are being taken to improve it. Yes, there is racism, but there is racism everywhere. We are a young nation, and giving the power of Government over to the Aboriginal elders would not fix the problem. We do not need to live as Aboriginals tell us - we need to respect their right to live how they choose and not impose our lifestyle on them,(and they need to respect OUR lifestyle as well), but to blithely say we need to become an Aboriginal country is niaive and wrong. We need to understand this is a shared nation, and as a truly multicultural society, allow ALL people to live there chosen life, whilst understanding that for the sake of society itself, there needs to be laws and regulations that govern our lives outside our own homes.
    This is the way ALL nations need to run, in our global community. WHy is Germaine Greer, spouting on about Australians and Aboriginals when she no longer chooses to live here in our nation, with our people? She could just as easily visit America a few times and spout on about Americans needing to become an Indian nation? Why is it any different? It's not - and the way of the modern world needs to be understood by her and other 'academics'. Sitting in a university planning ways to make the world better is irrelevant. To make the world better, you don't need to write books or papers. You need to get out there and understand that actions speak louder than words. If she is so passionate about it, why is she not here living it and making a difference? Why is she not here helping with the problem? THAT is my problem with Germaine Greer. Hypocrisy, plain and simple - it's one thing that I cannot tolerate, and she has bucket loads of it.

    Actions on ANY subject speak louder than words - and for ANYONE to make a difference on ANY subject, writing words on paper will never be the solution. Get out there and do something - if EVERYBODY contributes, then change ensues. Not from being an academic. Change comes from being committed enough to realise the issues and follow through with action - telling people what they are doing wrong will only ever result in getting someone's back up - showing them how to change and being committed to it personally will invoke a sense of respect and admiration, and result in more people wanting to commit to a cause, no matter what that cause is.
  • pjfan31pjfan31 Posts: 7,335
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Weird. I've never seen a blonde Aboriginal.

    But then for most people - Australians especially - the Aboriginals don't exist.


    Ouch... Can't paint us with the same brush.
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    I'm just going to run off and organise a packet of MnM's into alphabetical order
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  • stardust1976stardust1976 Posts: 1,301
    pjfan31 wrote:
    I'm just going to run off and organise a packet of MnM's into alphabetical order


    HAHA! This is funny - my three daughters were talking about exactly this the other day. Being that two of them are blonde and all! Is it bad to say the 8yr old blonde didn't get the joke AT ALL!? ;)
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