you have faith that the petrol you put in isnt dilluted for the profit of the seller, you have faith in your mechanic that he is doing his best and not ripping you off.
But I dont mind having faith in that,m people are real at least
OK i that may be true, but my mechanic exist and he doesn't have millions of people thinking that he created the universe, causing tsunamis, earthquakes and moving in mysterious ways. and i don't want to think what may happen to his only begotten son...
yes I agree with you on that. begotten son lol
But faith in others is my faith i think, my religon.
Im a humanist I have faith in my company managers that they wont stuff up my company making me unemployed. I have faith in others whilst uim driving, sometime this shouldnt be the case. Unfortunatly many break our faith and thus we create rules and laws , punishment for breaking them.
But your right each and everyone of these people I have faith in are real and tangible beings.
ahhh the closing verse to faithfull fits so well here
just be a darling and I will be too. FAITHFULL TO YOU
ahhh the closing verse to faithfull fits so well here
just be a darling and I will be too. FAITHFULL TO YOU
You just killed the mood , how could i be a mean atheist when you're treated with such kindness plus quoting my favorite PJ song, you're my kind of believer
"The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it"
Neil deGrasse Tyson
ahhh the closing verse to faithfull fits so well here
just be a darling and I will be too. FAITHFULL TO YOU
You just killed the mood , how could i be a mean atheist when you're treated with such kindness plus quoting my favorite PJ song, you're my kind of believer
nah mate maintain the rage
hmmm some creed
with arms wide open
you angry again
but there is a hint of faith i reckon.
You have faith that the maufcturer built the car correctly, you have faith in the dealer not ripping you off ( not)
you have faith that the petrol you put in isnt dilluted for the profit of the seller, you have faith in your mechanic that he is doing his best and not ripping you off.
But I dont mind having faith in that,m people are real at least
...
I believe you are speaking of Trust... not Faith.
Trusting that the people who work at the factory did their jobs to the specifications... Trust in the people at the dealership that sold you the car... Trust in your mechanic's skillset that he knows what the problem is and can fix it. Trust is built on a proven track record... Faith is based upon... Faith.
...
I'm sure people will believe that God has something to do with their car... but, i feel that it is better to have a trusted mechanic replace your rotors and pads than to have faith that God and prayer will stop your speeding car at the red light.
Point being... sometimes Trust, not Faith, is required.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
Adapted from:
St. Louis MetroVoice, August 1993, Vol. 3, No. 8
One of the most fundamental axioms of biology is that all life comes from pre-existing life. Still, until the later part of the 19th century, life was believed to arise from non-living matter by a process called ‘spontaneous generation.’ Ancient Egyptians, for example, thought mice arose from the mud of the Nile. In 1600, J.B. Helmont even reported ‘proof’ for the spontaneous generation of mice claiming that if wheat, cheese, and soiled linen are placed together in a jar, mice will eventually appear! This idea of the spontaneous generation of life from non-life was so deeply ingrained in biological thought that it took nearly 200 years of experimental evidence to completely disprove it.
In 1650, Francesco Redi, an Italian physician, proved that maggots come from living flies and not from lifeless meat as was widely believed. This was a serious blow to spontaneous generation, but when bacteria were later discovered, it was thought that at least microorganisms might arise from non-life. This notion too was finally laid to rest in 1864 by the great scientist (and creationist) Louis Pasteur, who demonstrated that bacteria can only come from living bacteria. When Pasteur reported his results before the French Academy he confidently declared that, ‘never will the doctrine of spontaneous generation arise from this mortal blow.’ Pasteur never dreamed that the widely discredited evolutionary ideas of his contemporary, Charles Darwin, would one day become widely accepted by the scientific community, reviving once again the notion of spontaneous generation. In his book, The Origins of Life, evolutionist Cyril Ponnamperuma said: ‘It is, perhaps, ironic that we tell beginning students in biology about Pasteur’s experiments as the triumph of reason over mysticism yet we are coming back to spontaneous generation, albeit in a more refined and scientific sense, namely to chemical evolution.’
Most evolutionists are dead certain that life evolved by chance (without divine intervention) from non-living chemicals through a process called ‘chemical evolution.’ Some evolutionists even insist that life must have independently evolved more than once on earth. Most evolutionists are confident that life has evolved many times in many other places in the universe. Although Darwin spoke longingly of the chance origin of life from simple chemicals in some ‘warm little pond,’ there has never been evidence that anything remotely like this has ever happened. In fact, the evidence for chemical evolution is so embarrassing, some evolutionists insist that the whole idea of the origin of life is not even a part of the theory of evolution but rather is a creationist plot to discredit evolution!
Evolutionists speculate that life gradually evolved from mere hydrogen in a series of stages. The first stage began about 15 billion years ago with the big bang which produced an expanding cloud of hydrogen gas—all else was void. With time and energy, hydrogen transformed into all the other chemical elements. Then, about 4 billion years ago, the earth’s atmosphere consisted of methane, ammonia, hydrogen and water, from which life would inevitably evolve.
During stage two it is believed that simple chemicals from stage one formed the small organic molecules essential to life, such as sugars, amino acids, and nucleotides. In 1953, Miller and Urey claimed to ‘simulate’ the evolution of some of these organic molecules from methane and ammonia using apparatus and conditions designed to achieve the desired result.
Stage three in chemical evolution is supposed to have involved the stringing together of small organic molecules into long chain-like molecules called polymers. The most important biological polymers are starches (polymers of sugars), proteins (polymers of amino acids), and DNA (polymers of nucleotides). In another ‘evolution simulation’ experiment, Sidney Fox produced protein-like molecules by heating pure-dry amino acids at high temperatures. When this material was allowed to cool in water it formed small globules which he called ‘microspheres.’ Although these microspheres are stone dead, evolutionists refer to them as ‘protocells,’ implying that they represent an early stage of living cells. In fact, about the only similarity between microspheres and living cells is that they are, as their name implies, small and spherical.
The final stage of chemical evolution involves the chance transformation of organic molecules and polymers into the unfathomably complex machinery of living cells. Here evolutionary speculation is so unrestrained by evidence, or even plausibility, that it fails to merit serious consideration. The biochemist Dr David Green pretty well summed it up when he said in his book Molecular Insights into the Living Process: ‘the macromolecule-to-cell transition is a jump of fantastic dimensions, which lies beyond the range of testable hypothesis. In this area all is conjecture. The available facts do not provide a basis for postulating that cells arose on this planet.’ Evolutionists have tried to get around this problem by invoking long periods of time in the hope that, given enough time, virtually anything is possible—except, of course, special creation.
Now even some evolutionists fear that time and chance may not be the answer. The Nobel laureate Dr Francis Crick (co-discoverer of the structure of DNA), in his book Life Itself, insists that the probability of life’s chance origin simply defies calculation. Crick, an atheist, says: ‘What is so frustrating for our present purpose is that it seems almost impossible to give any numerical value to the probability of what seems a rather unlikely sequence of events ... . An honest man, armed with all the knowledge available to us now, could only state that in some sense, the origin of life appears at the moment to be almost a miracle ...’ Incredibly, Crick concludes that the first living organisms on earth may have been ‘seeded’ in our oceans by intelligent beings from another planet! Obviously, this reasoning would only transfer the problem of origins to another place in the universe—if chemical evolution is impossible here, why would it be any more feasible elsewhere, given that the laws of physics and chemistry are the same? Or were the aliens created?
The late Sir Fred Hoyle, who coined the term big bang (in ridicule), has recently concluded that the origin of life by chance is an absurd idea. In his book Evolution From Space, Hoyle insists that it is obvious that the complexity of life demands an intelligent designer, possibly even (heaven forbid!) God. According to Hoyle: ‘Once we see, however, that the probability of life originating at random is so utterly minuscule as to make it absurd, it becomes sensible to think that the favorable properties of physics on which life depends are in every respect deliberate ... . It is therefore almost inevitable that our own measure of intelligence must reflect ... higher intelligences ... even to the limit of God ... such a theory is so obvious that one wonders why it is not widely accepted as being self-evident.’ In an address at Cal Tech, Hoyle said that no amount of time now being considered by evolutionists is even remotely adequate to accomplish the formation of a higher living organism by chance. Such an event, he said, would be comparable to the chance that ‘a tornado sweeping through a junk-yard might assemble a Boeing 747 from materials therein.’
Evolutionists, who must essentially invoke miracles without God, have no other choice than to believe in chance events so improbable they undermine the statistical foundation on which modern science rests. In his book Origins: A Skeptic’s Guide to Creation of Life on Earth, evolutionist Robert Shapiro abandons all skepticism and lamely argues: ‘One escape hatch yet exists for spontaneous generation. Why need the event have been probable? We can just stare at the odds, shrug, and note with thanks how lucky we were ... After all, improbable events occur all the time.’ Think of it, with an unquestioning faith like this in God, we Christians could move mountains!
The only thing out of that whole article that you found to talk about was that? Did you read all of it?
...
I'll take a shot...
So... what are you assuming with this... that because Man has not found the origins of life on Earth... the only conclusion is, "It must be God"?
What if life existed prior to the Big Bang and the Big Bang is a reoccuring event... compression, pressure/heat, explosion, expansion, contraction, compression, pressure/heat... etc? We don't know.
But... what we do know as a fact... the Earth is the right sized planet, circling the right sized star at the right distance, at the right speed to sustain the diversity of life... at this time. This wasn't always true and it isn't going to always be true. As the Earth slowly loses its Moon... and her core begins to cool... and her Sun begins to die... this planet will no longer be able to sustain life.
...
Just because science cannot explain something... or Man cannot comprehend it... does not prove that God must have been behind it.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
The only thing out of that whole article that you found to talk about was that? Did you read all of it?
I've read a lot more stuff than that, and when people give those kind of unscientific arguments there's nothing that we can debate or discuss because the science in that article is very poor, is like talking about mathematics but you deny the existence of the number 3 and 6. I'm not telling you that you need a phd in astro physics but at least you need to get the head out of your faith and read about some real science, not just the one that make you feel more comfortable with your believes.
I was a christian, and i studied and dedicated my self to learn and have a deep knowledge of my faith, I loved christian apologetics, and I'm pretty sure i know more about the bible (facts and history) than the majority of people how call them self christians, and thanks to all the time i invested studying and reading about my faith i was able to understand that Christianity is as real as any of the Disney's movies, just a fairy tale with (sometimes) a good teaching and that's all.
"The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it"
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Just because science cannot explain something... or Man cannot comprehend it... does not prove that God must have been behind it.
Bingoooo.
It's like when kids make up theories of how things work.
Only its cute when you're 4...
When people doesn't find an answer to the unknown the most easy thing to do is say "god moves in mysterious ways"... until science make a discovry and take another piece of what used to be god's terrain.
"The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it"
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Just because science cannot explain something... or Man cannot comprehend it... does not prove that God must have been behind it.
Bingoooo.
It's like when kids make up theories of how things work.
Only its cute when you're 4...
When people doesn't find an answer to the unknown the most easy thing to do is say "god moves in mysterious ways"... until science make a discovry and take another piece of what used to be god's terrain.
...
Like the Earth being the Center of the Universe... it HAD to be because Man HAD to be in the center... according to the Church. Astronomers had to come up with explanations for the motions of the outer planets to fit the Church's model... or be burned at the stake for disagreeing with or contradicting the Bible. Science used to be under the authority of the Church... along with just about everything else.
Wasn't Galileo forviven by the Catholic Church... in 2006 or something?
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
Back to the lecture at hand...
The point of the (parody) article is to point out a glaring pimple on the whole, 'Jesus Died For Your Sins' thing. The blemish being... even though you may face the penalties of Man's laws... you will be accepted into Heaven.
If this is not true... that Jesus is not about salvation and redemption... then, doesn't that throw a wrench into the the machinery that is the basis of Christianity?
If it is true... then, if Adolph Hitler (a devout Catholic) accepted Jesus as his personal saviour... wouldn't that mean Hitler is in Heaven?
...
My take... I follow the guidence of Jesus' teachings and have abandoned the constraints of the Christian Religion. I do not allow Christianity to get between me and Jesus.
I really don't care which religion someone follows... including no religions... as long as they pretty much leave me out of their belief systems. Let me deal with Jesus and God in my own way and worry about yourself... before you go about in other people's business. When you are Christ-like... come see me and we'll talk... until then, mind your own fucking business.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
i was able to understand that Christianity is as real as any of the Disney's movies, just a fairy tale with (sometimes) a good teaching and that's all.
And this is why I was so proud of my 5 year old daughter when she asked me while watching The Simpsons: "Who is the giant wizard with Homer?"
The only thing out of that whole article that you found to talk about was that? Did you read all of it?
I've read a lot more stuff than that, and when people give those kind of unscientific arguments there's nothing that we can debate or discuss because the science in that article is very poor, is like talking about mathematics but you deny the existence of the number 3 and 6. I'm not telling you that you need a phd in astro physics but at least you need to get the head out of your faith and read about some real science, not just the one that make you feel more comfortable with your believes.
I was a christian, and i studied and dedicated my self to learn and have a deep knowledge of my faith, I loved christian apologetics, and I'm pretty sure i know more about the bible (facts and history) than the majority of people how call them self christians, and thanks to all the time i invested studying and reading about my faith i was able to understand that Christianity is as real as any of the Disney's movies, just a fairy tale with (sometimes) a good teaching and that's all.
So let me get this straight, people think that this is all a big accident. Slugs crawl out of the ocean, develop into 5 human beings that belt out It's evolution baby with pieces of wood and some steel strings, some accident.
So let me get this straight, people think that this is all a big accident. Slugs crawl out of the ocean, develop into 5 human beings that belt out It's evolution baby with pieces of wood and some steel strings, some accident.
...
No. Life is a process. A process that has occurred does occur and will occur in those places in the Universe where the conditions are right for life to exist.
In our current state... on this planet, at this distance from a sun, that is in this period of its life, at this time... life exists. Earth wasn't alway hospitable for life to exist... and in the distant future, the Earth will no long be able to sustain life.
And maybe a slug crawled from the waters of another planet, circling at the right distance around another star in another galaxy and evolved to higher life forms... that all went extinct 600 million years ago when its sun died. Maybe, the ingredients for life exists all over the Universe, but the conditions need to be correct in order for the process to take place.
The only thing we really know is... We don't know. Whether we look in science books or Holy Texts... we don't know.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
So let me get this straight, people think that this is all a big accident. Slugs crawl out of the ocean, develop into 5 human beings that belt out It's evolution baby with pieces of wood and some steel strings, some accident.
I think people who are open to the big bang theory and of evolution (the latter which is a concept i think a lot of people misunderstand) are open to sweeping it under the rug if a new and better theory arises... which is the beauty of science!
Meanwhile, some people will never stop believing a big giant man in the sky made the universe and put dinosaurs in the ground as a joke and gave the authority to a church to tell everyone the sun wasn't the center of the universe...... oh yes, much more believable i think.
So let me get this straight, people think that this is all a big accident. Slugs crawl out of the ocean, develop into 5 human beings that belt out It's evolution baby with pieces of wood and some steel strings, some accident.
I think people who are open to the big bang theory and of evolution (the latter which is a concept i think a lot of people misunderstand) are open to sweeping it under the rug if a new and better theory arises... which is the beauty of science!
Meanwhile, some people will never stop believing a big giant man in the sky made the universe and put dinosaurs in the ground as a joke and gave the authority to a church to tell everyone the sun wasn't the center of the universe...... oh yes, much more believable i think.
I think the only thing we can truthfully say is, we don't have a clue! I have this nagging feeling that we are looking at things from this angle when we should be looking at them from 180 degrees the other way.
I think the only thing we can truthfully say is, we don't have a clue!
Exactly and the scientific method is the only way we have to explain the world and how it works with cold hard facts, no matter what religion people are in, science doesn't care it only care about facts.
Ok then, how we should look then? could you tell me an unbiased method?
I don't think we should be looking for the answer, we will never find it, it is kinda like asking a surgeon to remove the organ where hate, love, anxiety and conscience live.
Ok then, how we should look then? could you tell me an unbiased method?
I don't think we should be looking for the answer, we will never find it, it is kinda like asking a surgeon to remove the organ where hate, love, anxiety and conscience live.
Exactly! there's no answer :thumbup:
"The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it"
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Ok then, how we should look then? could you tell me an unbiased method?
I don't think we should be looking for the answer, we will never find it, it is kinda like asking a surgeon to remove the organ where hate, love, anxiety and conscience live.
Exactly! there's no answer :thumbup:
Why are people so discontent with the unknown?
Nothing has been proven absolutely... I lean towards the scientific theory of course but there's always room for new and greater theories should they arise.
Ok then, how we should look then? could you tell me an unbiased method?
I don't think we should be looking for the answer, we will never find it, it is kinda like asking a surgeon to remove the organ where hate, love, anxiety and conscience live.
The brain?
"First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win ."
Comments
yes I agree with you on that. begotten son lol
But faith in others is my faith i think, my religon.
Im a humanist I have faith in my company managers that they wont stuff up my company making me unemployed. I have faith in others whilst uim driving, sometime this shouldnt be the case. Unfortunatly many break our faith and thus we create rules and laws , punishment for breaking them.
But your right each and everyone of these people I have faith in are real and tangible beings.
ahhh the closing verse to faithfull fits so well here
just be a darling and I will be too. FAITHFULL TO YOU
You just killed the mood
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Why not (V) (°,,,,°) (V) ?
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
nah mate maintain the rage
hmmm some creed
with arms wide open
you angry again
<img src="http://i740.photobucket.com/albums/xx46/tremors25/thrillafixterorange.gif" align="left">
<img src="http://i740.photobucket.com/albums/xx46/tremors25/thrillafixterblack.gif" align="left">
<img src="http://i740.photobucket.com/albums/xx46/tremors25/thrillafixterwhite.gif" align="left
<img src="http://i740.photobucket.com/albums/xx46/tremors25/thefixerthrilla1.gif" align="left">
Thanks, i needed that, now i can return to my angry self
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Why not (V) (°,,,,°) (V) ?
I believe you are speaking of Trust... not Faith.
Trusting that the people who work at the factory did their jobs to the specifications... Trust in the people at the dealership that sold you the car... Trust in your mechanic's skillset that he knows what the problem is and can fix it. Trust is built on a proven track record... Faith is based upon... Faith.
...
I'm sure people will believe that God has something to do with their car... but, i feel that it is better to have a trusted mechanic replace your rotors and pads than to have faith that God and prayer will stop your speeding car at the red light.
Point being... sometimes Trust, not Faith, is required.
Hail, Hail!!!
The only thing out of that whole article that you found to talk about was that? Did you read all of it?
want to be enlightened"
I'll take a shot...
So... what are you assuming with this... that because Man has not found the origins of life on Earth... the only conclusion is, "It must be God"?
What if life existed prior to the Big Bang and the Big Bang is a reoccuring event... compression, pressure/heat, explosion, expansion, contraction, compression, pressure/heat... etc? We don't know.
But... what we do know as a fact... the Earth is the right sized planet, circling the right sized star at the right distance, at the right speed to sustain the diversity of life... at this time. This wasn't always true and it isn't going to always be true. As the Earth slowly loses its Moon... and her core begins to cool... and her Sun begins to die... this planet will no longer be able to sustain life.
...
Just because science cannot explain something... or Man cannot comprehend it... does not prove that God must have been behind it.
Hail, Hail!!!
It's like when kids make up theories of how things work.
Only its cute when you're 4...
I've read a lot more stuff than that, and when people give those kind of unscientific arguments there's nothing that we can debate or discuss because the science in that article is very poor, is like talking about mathematics but you deny the existence of the number 3 and 6. I'm not telling you that you need a phd in astro physics but at least you need to get the head out of your faith and read about some real science, not just the one that make you feel more comfortable with your believes.
I was a christian, and i studied and dedicated my self to learn and have a deep knowledge of my faith, I loved christian apologetics, and I'm pretty sure i know more about the bible (facts and history) than the majority of people how call them self christians, and thanks to all the time i invested studying and reading about my faith i was able to understand that Christianity is as real as any of the Disney's movies, just a fairy tale with (sometimes) a good teaching and that's all.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Why not (V) (°,,,,°) (V) ?
When people doesn't find an answer to the unknown the most easy thing to do is say "god moves in mysterious ways"... until science make a discovry and take another piece of what used to be god's terrain.
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Why not (V) (°,,,,°) (V) ?
Like the Earth being the Center of the Universe... it HAD to be because Man HAD to be in the center... according to the Church. Astronomers had to come up with explanations for the motions of the outer planets to fit the Church's model... or be burned at the stake for disagreeing with or contradicting the Bible. Science used to be under the authority of the Church... along with just about everything else.
Wasn't Galileo forviven by the Catholic Church... in 2006 or something?
Hail, Hail!!!
The point of the (parody) article is to point out a glaring pimple on the whole, 'Jesus Died For Your Sins' thing. The blemish being... even though you may face the penalties of Man's laws... you will be accepted into Heaven.
If this is not true... that Jesus is not about salvation and redemption... then, doesn't that throw a wrench into the the machinery that is the basis of Christianity?
If it is true... then, if Adolph Hitler (a devout Catholic) accepted Jesus as his personal saviour... wouldn't that mean Hitler is in Heaven?
...
My take... I follow the guidence of Jesus' teachings and have abandoned the constraints of the Christian Religion. I do not allow Christianity to get between me and Jesus.
I really don't care which religion someone follows... including no religions... as long as they pretty much leave me out of their belief systems. Let me deal with Jesus and God in my own way and worry about yourself... before you go about in other people's business. When you are Christ-like... come see me and we'll talk... until then, mind your own fucking business.
Hail, Hail!!!
And this is why I was so proud of my 5 year old daughter when she asked me while watching The Simpsons: "Who is the giant wizard with Homer?"
want to be enlightened"
Yeah i know because after this one is hell for me, isn't it?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Why not (V) (°,,,,°) (V) ?
No. Life is a process. A process that has occurred does occur and will occur in those places in the Universe where the conditions are right for life to exist.
In our current state... on this planet, at this distance from a sun, that is in this period of its life, at this time... life exists. Earth wasn't alway hospitable for life to exist... and in the distant future, the Earth will no long be able to sustain life.
And maybe a slug crawled from the waters of another planet, circling at the right distance around another star in another galaxy and evolved to higher life forms... that all went extinct 600 million years ago when its sun died. Maybe, the ingredients for life exists all over the Universe, but the conditions need to be correct in order for the process to take place.
The only thing we really know is... We don't know. Whether we look in science books or Holy Texts... we don't know.
Hail, Hail!!!
Meanwhile, some people will never stop believing a big giant man in the sky made the universe and put dinosaurs in the ground as a joke and gave the authority to a church to tell everyone the sun wasn't the center of the universe...... oh yes, much more believable i think.
Exactly and the scientific method is the only way we have to explain the world and how it works with cold hard facts, no matter what religion people are in, science doesn't care it only care about facts.
Ok then, how we should look then? could you tell me an unbiased method?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Why not (V) (°,,,,°) (V) ?
I don't think we should be looking for the answer, we will never find it, it is kinda like asking a surgeon to remove the organ where hate, love, anxiety and conscience live.
Exactly! there's no answer :thumbup:
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Why not (V) (°,,,,°) (V) ?
Nothing has been proven absolutely... I lean towards the scientific theory of course but there's always room for new and greater theories should they arise.
None of us can say for sure!
Isn't that exciting?
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Why not (V) (°,,,,°) (V) ?
...just waiting for that theory to be validated...
The brain?
"With our thoughts we make the world"