Michael Jackson

Paul Andrews

Funny this thread is on a Pearl Jam forum because I think Pearl Jam have dealt with fame and fortune better than most. They never fed the monster and so the monster never turned on the hand that fed it.

chadwick

Paul Andrews wrote:

Funny this thread is on a Pearl Jam forum because I think Pearl Jam have dealt with fame and fortune better than most. They never fed the monster and so the monster never turned on the hand that fed it.

wise words.

chadwick

like the death penalty thread in MT.
if found guilty when he was alive, should Mike have received a death sentence or just life in prison?
wait...

















i forgot...
in many cases a child molester is set free sooner than many drug offenders.
that is quality justice right there.

deal pot and get caught = could be doing more time than a pedophile, depending on the state anyway.

Nothingman54

chadwick wrote:

like the death penalty thread in MT.
if found guilty when he was alive, should Mike have received a death sentence or just life in prison?
wait...

















i forgot...
in many cases a child molester is set free sooner than many drug offenders.
that is quality justice right there.

deal pot and get caught = could be doing more time than a pedophile, depending on the state anyway.

you are correct, so sad. I think it's about time for another mj pic........

Nothingman54

chadwick

Nothingman54 wrote:

chadwick wrote:

like the death penalty thread in MT.
if found guilty when he was alive, should Mike have received a death sentence or just life in prison?
wait...















i forgot...
in many cases a child molester is set free sooner than many drug offenders.
that is quality justice right there.

deal pot and get caught = could be doing more time than a pedophile, depending on the state anyway.

you are correct, so sad. I think it's about time for another mj pic........

got one of Mikey with a big ole bob marley type joint?
if only Mike woulda smoked the greenery i would think he'd have been better off.

musicismylife78

chadwick wrote:

Paul Andrews wrote:

Funny this thread is on a Pearl Jam forum because I think Pearl Jam have dealt with fame and fortune better than most. They never fed the monster and so the monster never turned on the hand that fed it.

wise words.

yeah, but you talk to ed or mike and ask them how fame or money and all that has effected them. Ed has said many times he was headed down the same road as kurt, and mike has his demons as well. Ed's take on it, seems to be, almost, that at the time, it could have gone either way, kurt dead or ed dead. and kurt died and it freaked

That said, i get your point, that PJ have been anti commercial, or were anti commercial pre Avocado days, but that said, its not simplistic like your post suggests.

Same with people like Uncle Neil or Dylan, or whoever you want to point to as the quintessential "i will do what the hell I want, and to hell with you all" artist. Both Dylan and Uncle Neil battled some stuff as well.

I agree the anti commercial route is better but even those who follow that path have trouble

They werent paying the fame monster from the word go, but it still nearly destroyed the band, and nearly destroyed the human beings that make up the band.

musicismylife78

chadwick wrote:

like the death penalty thread in MT.
if found guilty when he was alive, should Mike have received a death sentence or just life in prison?
wait...

















i forgot...
in many cases a child molester is set free sooner than many drug offenders.
that is quality justice right there.

deal pot and get caught = could be doing more time than a pedophile, depending on the state anyway.

irrelevant. he wasnt found guilty. he was found innocent, and the evidence proves as such. Who knows what would have happened? What would have happened if the sky was green? Or the grass was purple? Who the hell cares?

I reiterate. The accusers, both, lied, willingly to destroy MJ, or were put up to it by their parents. MJ isnt alive. The parents of the kids, or the father of one accuser is and the mom of both are still alive. What should be done to those who lie, in court, under oath, and sling outrageous and beyond hurtful accusations at people, that have far reaching consequences?

You people need to stop the acid intake, if you dont think people who lie and say "he did this to me" knowing that he did no such thing, should be punished, jailed, or given the scarlet letter or some such punishment. Lying like that ruins peoples lives.

MJ wasnt found guilty. To think of a penalty for NOT commiting a crime is an exercise only an imbecile would undertake. Whats Ruben Carters penalty for NOT killing white people?

chadwick

musicismylife78 wrote:

yeah, but you talk to ed or mike and ask them how fame or money and all that has effected them. Ed has said many times he was headed down the same road as kurt, and mike has his demons as well. Ed's take on it, seems to be, almost, that at the time, it could have gone either way, kurt dead or ed dead. and kurt died and it freaked

That said, i get your point, that PJ have been anti commercial, or were anti commercial pre Avocado days, but that said, its not simplistic like your post suggests.

Same with people like Uncle Neil or Dylan, or whoever you want to point to as the quintessential "i will do what the hell I want, and to hell with you all" artist. Both Dylan and Uncle Neil battled some stuff as well.

I agree the anti commercial route is better but even those who follow that path have trouble

They werent paying the fame monster from the word go, but it still nearly destroyed the band, and nearly destroyed the human beings that make up the band.

neil, dylan, and the men of pj do not sleep in the same bed as children.
ed enjoys women.
neil enjoys women.
dylan enjoys women and weed.
see what we're sayin?

write music, get hammered, become wealthy beyond your wildest dreams, build empires that touch the sky but dont sleep with children... pretty fuckin easy to understand.

i bet you neil would beat a child predator with his guitar.
if not, give me the guitar and i'll do it.

Nothingman54

musicismylife78 wrote:

chadwick wrote:

like the death penalty thread in MT.
if found guilty when he was alive, should Mike have received a death sentence or just life in prison?
wait...

















i forgot...
in many cases a child molester is set free sooner than many drug offenders.
that is quality justice right there.

deal pot and get caught = could be doing more time than a pedophile, depending on the state anyway.

irrelevant. he wasnt found guilty. he was found innocent, and the evidence proves as such. Who knows what would have happened? What would have happened if the sky was green? Or the grass was purple? Who the hell cares?

I reiterate. The accusers, both, lied, willingly to destroy MJ, or were put up to it by their parents. MJ isnt alive. The parents of the kids, or the father of one accuser is and the mom of both are still alive. What should be done to those who lie, in court, under oath, and sling outrageous and beyond hurtful accusations at people, that have far reaching consequences?

You people need to stop the acid intake, if you dont think people who lie and say "he did this to me" knowing that he did no such thing, should be punished, jailed, or given the scarlet letter or some such punishment. Lying like that ruins peoples lives.

MJ wasnt found guilty. To think of a penalty for NOT commiting a crime is an exercise only an imbecile would undertake. Whats Ruben Carters penalty for NOT killing white people?

musicismylife78

I also think the whole notion that good people have good lives, and those who live wierdly or oddly only invite destruction and chaos and tragedy. thats absurd. Good people have bad lives. bad people have good lives. And vice versa. Feeding the fame monster has nothing to do with it.

MJ's supposed crime of feeding the fame monster, has no relation to 2 kids, or 2 kids parents lying and saying he did stuff to their children. His odd behavior makes it easier for the whole unthinking majority of folks to swallow the lies. As I said, MJ as an upstanding citizen, as a model citizen, someone who was still "black", someone who lived a "normal" life, wouldnt have met the same fate as this MJ did, the one that did exist. And thats sad. Its a result of many things. One of which is this insane idea that monsters arent real, we are told as we grow. But the real monsters of rapists, molestors, murderers, theives, cheats, swindlers, robbers, all do. And they dont look like normal people do they? No they are hideous. They wear scary masks. They look disfigured. They are insane and unstable. They are off their rocker.

But John and Suzy, the wealthy, happy, couple with the 3 kids, and the beautiful house, the picket fence, the minivan, the great jobs. The vacations in Palm Springs. No those people couldnt be abusers, or rapists or killers or any such deviants. They dont LOOK like that.

chadwick

mj is full of shit.
even right now.
dig up his box and you'll find shit.

btw, i like how you never answered several direct easy questions.

1. would you have allowed mike jackson to sleep in your childs bed?
2. why keep sleeping with children even after being accused of being a child predator?

chadwick

musicismylife78 wrote:

I also think the whole notion that good people have good lives, and those who live wierdly or oddly only invite destruction and chaos and tragedy. thats absurd. Good people have bad lives. bad people have good lives. And vice versa. Feeding the fame monster has nothing to do with it.

MJ's supposed crime of feeding the fame monster, has no relation to 2 kids, or 2 kids parents lying and saying he did stuff to their children. His odd behavior makes it easier for the whole unthinking majority of folks to swallow the lies. As I said, MJ as an upstanding citizen, as a model citizen, someone who was still "black", someone who lived a "normal" life, wouldnt have met the same fate as this MJ did, the one that did exist. And thats sad. Its a result of many things. One of which is this insane idea that monsters arent real, we are told as we grow. But the real monsters of rapists, molestors, murderers, theives, cheats, swindlers, robbers, all do. And they dont look like normal people do they? No they are hideous. They wear scary masks. They look disfigured. They are insane and unstable. They are off their rocker.

But John and Suzy, the wealthy, happy, couple with the 3 kids, and the beautiful house, the picket fence, the minivan, the great jobs. The vacations in Palm Springs. No those people couldnt be abusers, or rapists or killers or any such deviants. They dont LOOK like that.

that is insane.
you actually believe we are that naive?
evil takes many forms.
jon and suzy are bullshit.

musicismylife78

chadwick wrote:

musicismylife78 wrote:

yeah, but you talk to ed or mike and ask them how fame or money and all that has effected them. Ed has said many times he was headed down the same road as kurt, and mike has his demons as well. Ed's take on it, seems to be, almost, that at the time, it could have gone either way, kurt dead or ed dead. and kurt died and it freaked

That said, i get your point, that PJ have been anti commercial, or were anti commercial pre Avocado days, but that said, its not simplistic like your post suggests.

Same with people like Uncle Neil or Dylan, or whoever you want to point to as the quintessential "i will do what the hell I want, and to hell with you all" artist. Both Dylan and Uncle Neil battled some stuff as well.

I agree the anti commercial route is better but even those who follow that path have trouble

They werent paying the fame monster from the word go, but it still nearly destroyed the band, and nearly destroyed the human beings that make up the band.

neil, dylan, and the men of pj do not sleep in the same bed as children.
ed enjoys women.
neil enjoys women.
dylan enjoys women and weed.
see what we're sayin?

write music, get hammered, become wealthy beyond your wildest dreams, build empires that touch the sky but dont sleep with children... pretty fuckin easy to understand.

i bet you neil would beat a child predator with his guitar.
if not, give me the guitar and i'll do it.

Someone said they didnt pay the fame monster so things turned out alright. thats what I am responding to. Neil has had a hard life. His kids have cerebal palsy. He himself has epilepsy. Neil battled drugs for years, remember the cocaine visible during The last Waltz. Neil himself almost died a few years back. Not paying the fame monster has been a great choice for him no doubt but, its not like poof all his life is perfect.

Dylan, same thing. Does whatever he wants. But he battled drugs for years. And there are often stories of him dealing with the public or his bandmates even in ways that make me cringe. One band member in a 2001 RS article said it was verboten to even look or talk to Dylan.

MJ;s troubles didnt materialize because of the sleepovers. They materialized because 2 crazed and parent influenced kids, told lies and the public bought it.

Whats the punishment for serial sleepovers, where no abuse occurs? Oh yeah officer, he sleeps in the same bed as little kids, but we can prove he never did anything untoward, so yeah, arrest him, jail him for,... for... for... sleeping in bed with kids? WHats the sentence for that folks?

Nothingman54

chadwick wrote:

musicismylife78 wrote:

yeah, but you talk to ed or mike and ask them how fame or money and all that has effected them. Ed has said many times he was headed down the same road as kurt, and mike has his demons as well. Ed's take on it, seems to be, almost, that at the time, it could have gone either way, kurt dead or ed dead. and kurt died and it freaked

That said, i get your point, that PJ have been anti commercial, or were anti commercial pre Avocado days, but that said, its not simplistic like your post suggests.

Same with people like Uncle Neil or Dylan, or whoever you want to point to as the quintessential "i will do what the hell I want, and to hell with you all" artist. Both Dylan and Uncle Neil battled some stuff as well.

I agree the anti commercial route is better but even those who follow that path have trouble

They werent paying the fame monster from the word go, but it still nearly destroyed the band, and nearly destroyed the human beings that make up the band.

neil, dylan, and the men of pj do not sleep in the same bed as children.
ed enjoys women.
neil enjoys women.
dylan enjoys women and weed.
see what we're sayin?

write music, get hammered, become wealthy beyond your wildest dreams, build empires that touch the sky but dont sleep with children... pretty fuckin easy to understand.

i bet you neil would beat a child predator with his guitar.
if not, give me the guitar and i'll do it.

well said

chadwick

so it is fine and dandy for your own children to crash out with a 45 year old man
who has non-stop parties for children at fantasy land?

musicismylife78

chadwick wrote:

musicismylife78 wrote:

I also think the whole notion that good people have good lives, and those who live wierdly or oddly only invite destruction and chaos and tragedy. thats absurd. Good people have bad lives. bad people have good lives. And vice versa. Feeding the fame monster has nothing to do with it.

MJ's supposed crime of feeding the fame monster, has no relation to 2 kids, or 2 kids parents lying and saying he did stuff to their children. His odd behavior makes it easier for the whole unthinking majority of folks to swallow the lies. As I said, MJ as an upstanding citizen, as a model citizen, someone who was still "black", someone who lived a "normal" life, wouldnt have met the same fate as this MJ did, the one that did exist. And thats sad. Its a result of many things. One of which is this insane idea that monsters arent real, we are told as we grow. But the real monsters of rapists, molestors, murderers, theives, cheats, swindlers, robbers, all do. And they dont look like normal people do they? No they are hideous. They wear scary masks. They look disfigured. They are insane and unstable. They are off their rocker.

But John and Suzy, the wealthy, happy, couple with the 3 kids, and the beautiful house, the picket fence, the minivan, the great jobs. The vacations in Palm Springs. No those people couldnt be abusers, or rapists or killers or any such deviants. They dont LOOK like that.

that is insane.
you actually believe we are that naive?
evil takes many forms.
jon and suzy are bullshit.

You overestimate the intelligence of status quo america my friend. Whats the basis of every horror film? A normal couple, jon and suzy who are killers right? No, its Freddy Kreugar, or its an inbred family from Texas who wear human skin as masks, or its 2 face from batman. And I love comics and horror flicks. But lets call the truth the truth. And the truth is, the world, or america, views deviants as criminals. You remember the Elephant man? That was over a hundred years ago but tell me that guy wouldnt have gotten the same reaction in 2010 as well?

chadwick

musicismylife78 wrote:

You overestimate the intelligence of status quo america my friend. Whats the basis of every horror film? A normal couple, jon and suzy who are killers right? No, its Freddy Kreugar, or its an inbred family from Texas who wear human skin as masks, or its 2 face from batman. And I love comics and horror flicks. But lets call the truth the truth. And the truth is, the world, or america, views deviants as criminals. You remember the Elephant man? That was over a hundred years ago but tell me that guy wouldnt have gotten the same reaction in 2010 as well?

i have no idea i dont watch tv. i rarely see a movie.
my father was a prison guard for 30 years though.
i am pretty sure i know something about bullshit.

mj is bullshit.

btw, it's freddy krueger
oddly enough, same as my last name.

burp...

Paul Andrews

musicismylife78 wrote:

I also think the whole notion that good people have good lives, and those who live wierdly or oddly only invite destruction and chaos and tragedy. thats absurd. Good people have bad lives. bad people have good lives. And vice versa. Feeding the fame monster has nothing to do with it.

MJ's supposed crime of feeding the fame monster, has no relation to 2 kids, or 2 kids parents lying and saying he did stuff to their children. His odd behavior makes it easier for the whole unthinking majority of folks to swallow the lies. As I said, MJ as an upstanding citizen, as a model citizen, someone who was still "black", someone who lived a "normal" life, wouldnt have met the same fate as this MJ did, the one that did exist. And thats sad. Its a result of many things. One of which is this insane idea that monsters arent real, we are told as we grow. But the real monsters of rapists, molestors, murderers, theives, cheats, swindlers, robbers, all do. And they dont look like normal people do they? No they are hideous. They wear scary masks. They look disfigured. They are insane and unstable. They are off their rocker.

But John and Suzy, the wealthy, happy, couple with the 3 kids, and the beautiful house, the picket fence, the minivan, the great jobs. The vacations in Palm Springs. No those people couldnt be abusers, or rapists or killers or any such deviants. They dont LOOK like that.

When I was teaching high school there was no way I'd put myself in a situation where I could be accused of anything like this. This meant I took precautions: No being alone in a closed room or office with a student. If the room didn't have a window with witnesses outside then there was always another teacher in that room with me - no matter how innocent the interaction. No driving students alone in a car. No having students over to my house. No tender touching (this included hugging a distressed student - you invited one of their friends to do it). No going to parties thrown by students. No sharing phone numbers or facebook contacts with students.... you get my drift. It sucks you have to do some of this but this is the world we live in. Other things are what you'd call a professional boundary and quite acceptable and propper.

MJ should have known (and he would have been told) you do not have kids in your bed and you do not put yourself in a situation where these accusations can be made. The police and the prosecuter were doing their jobs, calling it a witchhunt is unfair. Trial by media, well that is another thing entirely and something he was a victim off - no doubt.

Sure he was a target for extortion - but let's be honest, he was an easy target because he made himself an easy target. If he'd used his brain it would never have happened - fair or not.

Nothingman54

chadwick wrote:

musicismylife78 wrote:

You overestimate the intelligence of status quo america my friend. Whats the basis of every horror film? A normal couple, jon and suzy who are killers right? No, its Freddy Kreugar, or its an inbred family from Texas who wear human skin as masks, or its 2 face from batman. And I love comics and horror flicks. But lets call the truth the truth. And the truth is, the world, or america, views deviants as criminals. You remember the Elephant man? That was over a hundred years ago but tell me that guy wouldnt have gotten the same reaction in 2010 as well?

i have no idea i dont watch tv. i rarely see a movie.
my father was a prison guard for 30 years though.
i am pretty sure i know something about bullshit.

mj is bullshit.

btw, it's freddy krueger
oddly enough, same as my last name.

burp...

he still has not answered a direct question. Lol.