No I am not...I am saying we should be Cautious ....
Cautious of WHAT??? OK. Let me 'splain it to you, Lucy... because you are obviously not aware of what it is like here in New York. Everywhere you go... there are people of different races and ethnicities, and with many differing religious beliefs. There are many, many Muslim people. My son's best friend at school is Shar, Muslim. There are tons of Muslims. We are to be cautious of them building a COMMUNITY CENTER AND A MOSQUE? You don't think that stating we should be cautious of this is hateful, fear-mongering BULLSHIT?
I personally knew four people who were killed on 9/11... was at two funerals.... Horrible. Most everyone I know (in NY) knew someone who died that day....
Additionally, I knew one person well who was killed years before when the Trade Center was bombed in 1993. Her name was Monica Smith. She was six months pregnant. I knew her, her husband and two of her three brothers through a close friendship with her sister in law with whom i worked for four years leading up to the bombing that day. We waited ALL DAY LONG to hear from Monica. We heard about the bombing... I told "Cara", her sister in law, not to worry... Then we heard which tower... I told her not to worry.. then we heard the basement... i told her not to worry... Cara and I had plans to go out that night... they never heard from Monica... she was dead... Her wake, with her pregnant belly in the casket was one of the most heart-wrenching of experiences... I asked Cara what she thought of this mosque.
She is not opposed.
But you know... Monica's family was from Equador. She was buried back in Equador. Her parents speak very little English... so I guess they all had no right being here anyway, huh?
Mosque to go up near New York's ground zero
By Nicole Bliman, CNN
May 7, 2010 3:19 a.m. EDT
New York (CNN) -- Plans to build a mosque two blocks away from ground zero have set off an emotional debate among area residents and relatives of victims of the September 11, 2001 terror attacks.
Cordoba House project calls for a 15-story community center including a mosque, performance art center, gym, swimming pool and other public spaces.
The project is a collaboration between the American Society for Muslim Advancement and the Cordoba Initiative, both of which work to improve relations with followers of the religion.
The two groups presented their vision to part of the Community Board of lower Manhattan on Wednesday night.
Ro Sheffe, a board member who attended the meeting, said the project did not need to get the board's approval.
"They own the land, and their plans don't have any zoning changes," Sheffe said. "They came to us for our opinions and to let us know their plans. It was purely voluntary on their part."
The 12 members who were at the meeting voted unanimously to support the project. Community board members are appointed by the borough president and serve as advisers to the borough president and the mayor's office.
Daisy Khan, executive director of the Muslim society, described her vision of a center led by Muslims, but serving the community as a whole.
"It will have a real community feel, to celebrate the pluralism in the United States, as well as in the Islamic religion," Khan said. "It will also serve as a major platform for amplifying the silent voice of the majority of Muslims who have nothing to do with extremist ideologies. It will counter the extremist momentum."
The need for the center is twofold, Khan said, because it will support the needs of the growing Muslim community.
"The time for a center like this has come because Islam is an American religion," Khan said. "We need to take the 9/11 tragedy and turn it into something very positive."
Sheffe said a community center for lower Manhattan residents is "desperately needed." The area was mostly commercial, Sheffe said, but as more people move downtown, the lack of residential amenities is a problem.
The project got mixed reviews from families and friends of September 11 victims.
"I think it's the right thing to do," said Marvin Bethea, who was a paramedic at ground zero. "I lost 16 friends down there. But Muslims also got killed on 9/11. It would be a good sign of faith that we're not condemning all Muslims and that the Muslims who did this happened to be extremists. As a black man, I know what it's like to be discriminated against when you haven't done anything."
Herbert Ouida, whose son was killed in the attacks, supports the project as a way to bridge cultural divide.
"I understand the anger, the bitterness and hatred, but it only generates more hatred," Ouida said. "Such a large part of the world has this faith, and to say anyone who has this faith is a terrorist, it's terrible."
Others decried the idea of building a mosque so close to where their relatives died.
"Lower Manhattan should be made into a shrine for the people who died there," said Michael Valentin, a retired city detective who worked at ground zero. "It breaks my heart for the families who have to put up with this. I understand they're [building] it in a respectful way, but it just shouldn't be down there."
Others such as Barry Zelman said the site's location will be a painful reminder.
"[The 9/11 terrorists] did this in the name of Islam," Zelman said. "It's a sacred ground where these people died, where my brother was murdered, and to be in the shadows of that religion, it's just hypocritical and sacrilegious. "
However, Khan emphasized that the attacks killed Muslims, too.
"Three hundred of the victims were Muslim, that's 10 percent of the victims," she said. "We are Americans too. The 9/11 tragedy hurt everybody including the Muslim community. We are all in this together and together we have to fight against extremism and terrorism."
Cordoba House is still in its early stages of development. The American Society for Muslim Advancement is hoping to raise funds for the center to be completed in three to five years.
bin laden or what ever his name is has said through video that there are sleepers through out America,do you think he's kidding ? maybe that is all she means, not all muslims but which ones ?
if what the muslims are saying is really in their hearts thats good but I have to agree that it would be a great disrespect to ALL the family's of the victims.
bin laden or what ever his name is has said through video that there are sleepers through out America,do you think he's kidding ? maybe that is all she means, not all muslims but which ones ?
Godfather.
Of course there are sleepers... but wtf does that have to do with a community center and a mosque?
This is somehow going to serve to aid and embolden terrorists?
good grief I'm glad we're not neighbors you would drive me crazy.
that is just my thought on it,if some the family's of the victims don't mind....cool but what about the other family's that do mind ? do they count in this at all ?
Godfather.
You wouldn't have to worry about me driving you crazy because I'd have killed you already.
Yes, the other victims count. But this country was founded on the principle that our rights end where others' begin and we can't infringe on this community's right to heal as they see fit, nor on anyone's right to practice their religion.
What if the victims' families were offended by Muslims living in Manhattan - would they have the right to ban them? What if the victims' families were offended by religion in general, based on the religious extremism that supposedly inprired the attacks? Would they have the right to ban all places of worship in the neighborhood?
What if it's really a bunch of hateful, fearful people from Florida and California - who weren't even there when the towers were hit and don't personally know any of the direct victims - who oppose this church in this far-away community? Should they have the right to prevent it from being built?
No I am not...I am saying we should be Cautious ....
Cautious of WHAT??? OK. Let me 'splain it to you, Lucy... because you are obviously not aware of what it is like here in New York. Everywhere you go... there are people of different races and ethnicities, and with many differing religious beliefs. There are many, many Muslim people. My son's best friend at school is Shar, Muslim. There are tons of Muslims. We are to be cautious of them building a COMMUNITY CENTER AND A MOSQUE? You don't think that stating we should be cautious of this is hateful, fear-mongering BULLSHIT?
I personally knew four people who were killed on 9/11... was at two funerals.... Horrible. Most everyone I know (in NY) knew someone who died that day....
Additionally, I knew one person well who was killed years before when the Trade Center was bombed in 1993. Her name was Monica Smith. She was six months pregnant. I knew her, her husband and two of her three brothers through a close friendship with her sister in law with whom i worked for four years leading up to the bombing that day. We waited ALL DAY LONG to hear from Monica. We heard about the bombing... I told "Cara", her sister in law, not to worry... Then we heard which tower... I told her not to worry.. then we heard the basement... i told her not to worry... Cara and I had plans to go out that night... they never heard from Monica... she was dead... Her wake, with her pregnant belly in the casket was one of the most heart-wrenching of experiences... I asked Cara what she thought of this mosque.
She is not opposed.
But you know... Monica's family was from Equador. She was buried back in Equador. Her parents speak very little English... so I guess they all had no right being here anyway, huh?
bin laden or what ever his name is has said through video that there are sleepers through out America,do you think he's kidding ? maybe that is all she means, not all muslims but which ones ?
Godfather.
How do we know you and aerial aren't part of the sleeper cells? Maybe we should be cautious of you....
bin laden or what ever his name is has said through video that there are sleepers through out America,do you think he's kidding ? maybe that is all she means, not all muslims but which ones ?
Godfather.
Of course there are sleepers... but wtf does that have to do with a community center and a mosque?
This is somehow going to serve to aid and embolden terrorists?
now that you mention it are you a 100% sure it will not ? it would be a great front...
scb you have a habit of trying to put words in peoples mouths thats why my replys are limited with you..
in all honesty there is no hate from me towards you but I don't care to dance around your questions to my opinions when you add thing like the Jewish thing or the german thing, my opinion is just that ...my opinion.
Godfather.
Hey Godfather I took the time to go through this entire thread and this should be right up your alley about the THING. It's incredible what has been said and you've said so far but you may like this one.
scb you have a habit of trying to put words in peoples mouths thats why my replys are limited with you..
in all honesty there is no hate from me towards you but I don't care to dance around your questions to my opinions when you add thing like the Jewish thing or the german thing, my opinion is just that ...my opinion.
Godfather.
Hey Godfather I took the time to go through this entire thread and this should be right up your alley about the THING. It's incredible what has been said and you've said so far but you may like this one.
good grief I'm glad we're not neighbors you would drive me crazy.
that is just my thought on it,if some the family's of the victims don't mind....cool but what about the other family's that do mind ? do they count in this at all ?
Godfather.
You wouldn't have to worry about me driving you crazy because I'd have killed you already.
Yes, the other victims count. But this country was founded on the principle that our rights end where others' begin and we can't infringe on this community's right to heal as they see fit, nor on anyone's right to practice their religion.
What if the victims' families were offended by Muslims living in Manhattan - would they have the right to ban them? What if the victims' families were offended by religion in general, based on the religious extremism that supposedly inprired the attacks? Would they have the right to ban all places of worship in the neighborhood?
What if it's really a bunch of hateful, fearful people from Florida and California - who weren't even there when the towers were hit and don't personally know any of the direct victims - who oppose this church in this far-away community? Should they have the right to prevent it from being built?
kill me .....now I'm hurt
I see what your saying but I also believe it's a country thing also, our home America was attacked, why can't we do this the right way and put it up for vote and all Americans can vote on it....
scb you have a habit of trying to put words in peoples mouths thats why my replys are limited with you..
in all honesty there is no hate from me towards you but I don't care to dance around your questions to my opinions when you add thing like the Jewish thing or the german thing, my opinion is just that ...my opinion.
Godfather.
Hey Godfather I took the time to go through this entire thread and this should be right up your alley about the THING. It's incredible what has been said and you've said so far but you may like this one.
LOL!!! I love it......aint that how this thing should be ???
I have neve seen the movie but I will make a point of it.
Godfather.
THING is after reading through this thread I was able to understand the analogy that was being made with the Jewish thing and German thing BASED on your posts. I thought it was rather simple and quite obvious but you failed to see it or chose not to see it. If only ONE family member from the 9/11 attack did not object to this Mosque being built well it should be respected also. At some point we as a country has to heal itself and as far as I can see this is s step in that direction. Can you see if we continued our encampment forever of the Japanese how there would NEVER be a chance to heal ourselves to make amends between each other.
It seems if you were back in that time you would want them to be sent back home and somehow that would solve how we had hate towards the Japanese at that time. Somehow that would solve the possibility of never having the possibility of being attacked again while NEVER seeing the chance of healing the wounds between each other.
The same could said with this Mosque being built, in this present day time of constant war and innocent civilians being killed in the name of the facade of the War On Terror this to me is quite simply a positive.
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
you know peeps this unwillingness to allow muslims to develop their own real estate is something we deal with here in oz too. whenever there is a hoohah over a new school development it is a future muslim school that is being condemned. there seems to be no problem with the proliferation of christian schools. and as im sure youre aware i dont see a difference. religion is religion and they are all the same to me.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
The religion of Islam did not attack on 9-11, a small group of people who have warped the religion with fanaticism and extremism is did. Don't blame everyone for the actions of very, very small minority within the religion. Not very complicated. Also, these extremists are a tiny percentage or representation of the whole religion and people who believe and practice it. Making such a correlation would probably be as legitimate as saying the KKK is a representation of all Americans or something similar.. pretty silly.
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
The religion of Islam did not attack on 9-11, a small group of people who have warped the religion with fanaticism and extremism is did. Don't blame everyone for the actions of very, very small minority within the religion. Not very complicated. Also, these extremists are a tiny percentage or representation of the whole religion and people who believe and practice it. Making such a correlation would probably be as legitimate as saying the KKK is a representation of all Americans or something similar.. pretty silly.
aah you know tis easier to blanket condemn a whole peoples instead of formulating an original thought.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
WTF is wrong with you I have opinions just like you.....You post this totally intolerant, hate filled statement... but call me the hater? all I said is “we should be cautious”
you seem to be intolerant to everyone except the damned terrorist just because you think they have good enough reason to strap bombs to themselves and kill Innocent civilians. Because Mothers , grandmothers, wives, PTA presidents, house keepers, never been arrested in there life, Type of people (me) made them mad!
That makes no sense.... ..
I do think that if they were really trying to extent an olive branch to all people why build a mosque? Why not just a Community Center?
because they OWN the land. they can build whatever they want on it. if a catholic group was going to do it would you be opposed to one of the floors in the 15 story building being a new church? jeez...
and yes, you are very intolerant. you are opposed to people that are different from you. that is why everyone argues with you because you have a very childish and immature way of looking at things, and you never back anything up with anything other than with your stereotypes and opinions.
I am not opposed to people that are different than me....that’s were you and sbc assume wrong...last time I checked cautious did not mean ...Hate all people
“We the people are the rightful masters of bothCongress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.” Abraham Lincoln
I am not opposed to people that are different than me....that’s were you and sbc assume wrong...last time I checked cautious did not mean ...Hate all people
sorry... too tired to go back through the thread.
what's this cautious thing you're on about?
I am not opposed to people that are different than me....that’s were you and sbc assume wrong...last time I checked cautious did not mean ...Hate all people
sorry... too tired to go back through the thread.
what's this cautious thing you're on about?
I am not opposed to people that are different than me....that’s were you and sbc assume wrong...last time I checked cautious did not mean ...Hate all people
It's scb, not sbc.
The problem is that every single thing you say in this forum comes across to many people as if you are opposed to people who are different than you. (Hell, didn't you even accuse me of hating the United States more than anyone you know when I expressed the idea that we should not violate people's rights & should have compassion for all human beings regardless of their country of origin?) Regardless of your feelings, what you don't seem willing to admit is that your actions/ideas support opposition to people based on their difference from you. If the World Trade Center had been attacked by Christian extremists, you wouldn't be opposing a Christian church.... because you are a Christian. It's your inconsistent application of your "caution" that's indicative of its xenophobic roots. Can you understand what I mean?
I am not opposed to people that are different than me....that’s were you and sbc assume wrong...last time I checked cautious did not mean ...Hate all people
sorry... too tired to go back through the thread.
what's this cautious thing you're on about?
I am not opposed to people that are different than me....that’s were you and sbc assume wrong...last time I checked cautious did not mean ...Hate all people
sorry... too tired to go back through the thread.
what's this cautious thing you're on about?
Nine alleged members of a radical US Christian militia group have been charged with conspiring to kill police officers and wage war against the US.....
It is alleged they planned to kill a police officer in Michigan and then stage a second attack on the funeral, using landmines and roadside bombs.
Three Burleson men who belong to a "radical Christian activist group" were in the Johnson County Jail on Friday night after a church deacon caught two of them attempting to ignite an explosive device on Independence Day at a church under construction in north Burleson, authorities said Friday.
Dayton Lee Calaway, 19, and Michael Philip Plaisted Jr., 18, were arrested Wednesday night near the Victory Family Church after they got bogged down in mud as a fleet-footed deacon chased them from the church in the 400 block of Northwest John Jones Drive, police said.
Two other people drove away, the deacon told officers.
An explosive device in a glass container was found propped against the church door. The suspects apparently tried to detonate the device twice before being interrupted by the deacon, police and Burleson Fire Marshal Stacy Singleton said.
don't compete; coexist
what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?
"I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama
when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
I am not opposed to people that are different than me....that’s were you and sbc assume wrong...last time I checked cautious did not mean ...Hate all people
sorry... too tired to go back through the thread.
what's this cautious thing you're on about?
...
That is an example of an identified individual terrorist who is openly associated with an openly terrorist group, al Qaeda.
Following your reasoning, since John Gotti headed up the Gambino Family... all Italian American are potential Mafia.
My point... yes, go after the ones that head the criminal enterprises with solid police work and identify the individuals within the population instead of treating the entire population as criminals.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
I don't have a huge problem with this, but i do think it may be in bad taste in ways.
It reminds me of when the Klan put up their cross here on our city square at christmas time.
they have the right to do it in the name of their christian beliefs, but it's also bad form.
I don't know.
I don't really think comparing a Muslim peace group to the KKK is a good analogy. I don't think you meant to imply a similarity between the groups, but I think the implication is there nonetheless.
I also don't think this was meant to be an in-your-face-with-our-religion type of thing. My understanding is that there has been much talk about how best to rebuild this neighborhood and how to turn it into a site for peace and healing instead of war and suffering. Then this group stepped up and suggested that they could build a community center, which the community needs, and it could be a place where all kinds of people could come together as a neighborhood and learn to love one another across their differences. I believe the mosque part is their way of reclaiming Islam from the extremists, and showing the community that it is a peaceful religion, that they don't hate anyone, and that everyone is welcome.
I don't see this as being in any way similar to the KKK claiming your city square for their religion. I understand that some people may see it that way, but I think those would be the people who are ignorant about and bigoted against Muslims. I don't think the community should be denied their opportunity to heal in the way they see fit just to placate some hate groups.
thank you, I am in no way trying to imply or even compare the two. I do think some will and do see it the same way though.
I meant it reminds me of the first few years the KKK put their cross up, lots of talk about it all over Cincinnati, and then it just kind of went away.
I also do not think this is an "in your face" type of deal at all. I guess I'm just saying I'm not surprised one bit at the reaction from some people.
Peace, Love.
"To question your government is not unpatriotic --
to not question your government is unpatriotic."
-- Sen. Chuck Hagel
...
That is an example of an identified individual terrorist who is openly associated with an openly terrorist group, al Qaeda.
Following your reasoning, since John Gotti headed up the Gambino Family... all Italian American are potential Mafia.
My point... yes, go after the ones that head the criminal enterprises with solid police work and identify the individuals within the population instead of treating the entire population as criminals.
I would like to add that this is not just the just thing to do, but it's also in the best interest of national security. When you treat people like criminals, they become criminals. (Or at least they're more likely to.)
I am not opposed to people that are different than me....that’s were you and sbc assume wrong...last time I checked cautious did not mean ...Hate all people
sorry... too tired to go back through the thread.
what's this cautious thing you're on about?
this thread is way too long to go through and i don't see how some of you have the patience or will to keep hitting a ball against a brick wall.
it seems like some have a problem with not just a mosque at that location but in general because they are in america now so welcome to the land of freedom but you have to act like us. what about all the mosques already built? should they be taken over, divided amongst the accepted methods of worship and converted?
and as has been pointed out many family members of victims support this so what is really the argument?
don't compete; coexist
what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?
"I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama
when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
Comments
bin laden or what ever his name is has said through video that there are sleepers through out America,do you think he's kidding ? maybe that is all she means, not all muslims but which ones ?
Godfather.
Did you not sat ALL? Honestly.... what the hell? Now you are changing it up?
Whatever
Of course there are sleepers... but wtf does that have to do with a community center and a mosque?
This is somehow going to serve to aid and embolden terrorists?
I don't know but he is dead right...as he should be ?..I think so.
Godfather.
You wouldn't have to worry about me driving you crazy because I'd have killed you already.
Yes, the other victims count. But this country was founded on the principle that our rights end where others' begin and we can't infringe on this community's right to heal as they see fit, nor on anyone's right to practice their religion.
What if the victims' families were offended by Muslims living in Manhattan - would they have the right to ban them? What if the victims' families were offended by religion in general, based on the religious extremism that supposedly inprired the attacks? Would they have the right to ban all places of worship in the neighborhood?
What if it's really a bunch of hateful, fearful people from Florida and California - who weren't even there when the towers were hit and don't personally know any of the direct victims - who oppose this church in this far-away community? Should they have the right to prevent it from being built?
How do we know you and aerial aren't part of the sleeper cells? Maybe we should be cautious of you....
now that you mention it are you a 100% sure it will not ? it would be a great front...
Godfather.
Godfather.
LOL!!! I love it......aint that how this thing should be ???
I have neve seen the movie but I will make a point of it.
Godfather.
kill me .....now I'm hurt
I see what your saying but I also believe it's a country thing also, our home America was attacked, why can't we do this the right way and put it up for vote and all Americans can vote on it....
Godfather.
Hey! Something we can agree on!!
LOL!!! great !
Godfather.
THING is after reading through this thread I was able to understand the analogy that was being made with the Jewish thing and German thing BASED on your posts. I thought it was rather simple and quite obvious but you failed to see it or chose not to see it. If only ONE family member from the 9/11 attack did not object to this Mosque being built well it should be respected also. At some point we as a country has to heal itself and as far as I can see this is s step in that direction. Can you see if we continued our encampment forever of the Japanese how there would NEVER be a chance to heal ourselves to make amends between each other.
It seems if you were back in that time you would want them to be sent back home and somehow that would solve how we had hate towards the Japanese at that time. Somehow that would solve the possibility of never having the possibility of being attacked again while NEVER seeing the chance of healing the wounds between each other.
The same could said with this Mosque being built, in this present day time of constant war and innocent civilians being killed in the name of the facade of the War On Terror this to me is quite simply a positive.
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
aah you know tis easier to blanket condemn a whole peoples instead of formulating an original thought.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
what's this cautious thing you're on about?
maybe stuff like this ?
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2010/05/16 ... latestnews
Godfather.
It's scb, not sbc.
The problem is that every single thing you say in this forum comes across to many people as if you are opposed to people who are different than you. (Hell, didn't you even accuse me of hating the United States more than anyone you know when I expressed the idea that we should not violate people's rights & should have compassion for all human beings regardless of their country of origin?) Regardless of your feelings, what you don't seem willing to admit is that your actions/ideas support opposition to people based on their difference from you. If the World Trade Center had been attacked by Christian extremists, you wouldn't be opposing a Christian church.... because you are a Christian. It's your inconsistent application of your "caution" that's indicative of its xenophobic roots. Can you understand what I mean?
Want to know how to feel safer? Stop watching Fox "news".
I challenge all of you to go just 3 months without watching Fox or listening to any of those radical right-wing radio shows.
what does al qaeda supporting a cleric in yemen have to do with a mosque and cultural center being built in new york? :?
and what about stuff like this??
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8593975.stm
US 'Christian militants' charged after FBI raids
Nine alleged members of a radical US Christian militia group have been charged with conspiring to kill police officers and wage war against the US.....
It is alleged they planned to kill a police officer in Michigan and then stage a second attack on the funeral, using landmines and roadside bombs.
or
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-rel ... 2183/posts
Three Burleson men in jail over bomb at church
Three Burleson men who belong to a "radical Christian activist group" were in the Johnson County Jail on Friday night after a church deacon caught two of them attempting to ignite an explosive device on Independence Day at a church under construction in north Burleson, authorities said Friday.
Dayton Lee Calaway, 19, and Michael Philip Plaisted Jr., 18, were arrested Wednesday night near the Victory Family Church after they got bogged down in mud as a fleet-footed deacon chased them from the church in the 400 block of Northwest John Jones Drive, police said.
Two other people drove away, the deacon told officers.
An explosive device in a glass container was found propped against the church door. The suspects apparently tried to detonate the device twice before being interrupted by the deacon, police and Burleson Fire Marshal Stacy Singleton said.
what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?
"I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama
when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
That is an example of an identified individual terrorist who is openly associated with an openly terrorist group, al Qaeda.
Following your reasoning, since John Gotti headed up the Gambino Family... all Italian American are potential Mafia.
My point... yes, go after the ones that head the criminal enterprises with solid police work and identify the individuals within the population instead of treating the entire population as criminals.
Hail, Hail!!!
thank you, I am in no way trying to imply or even compare the two. I do think some will and do see it the same way though.
I meant it reminds me of the first few years the KKK put their cross up, lots of talk about it all over Cincinnati, and then it just kind of went away.
I also do not think this is an "in your face" type of deal at all. I guess I'm just saying I'm not surprised one bit at the reaction from some people.
"To question your government is not unpatriotic --
to not question your government is unpatriotic."
-- Sen. Chuck Hagel
I would like to add that this is not just the just thing to do, but it's also in the best interest of national security. When you treat people like criminals, they become criminals. (Or at least they're more likely to.)
all that, Dubya talk about how "terrorism is the greatest threat" bs you've been listening to
it seems like some have a problem with not just a mosque at that location but in general because they are in america now so welcome to the land of freedom but you have to act like us. what about all the mosques already built? should they be taken over, divided amongst the accepted methods of worship and converted?
and as has been pointed out many family members of victims support this so what is really the argument?
what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?
"I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama
when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'