You make fun of "normals" like me and jlew, saying we'll "believe what anyone tells us." A random 48-year-old businessman from Houston is about as "anyone" as it gets.
When have I ever said that I regard Jlew as normal?
What it boils down to is, you'll believe anyone who says something that fits your proconceived notion of what is true.
I don't possess a pre-conceived notion of what is 'true'. But I do know what the U.S government/power elites are capable of. History is a wonderful teacher.
And the case of 9/11 there are so many lies and omissions surrounding the official story that I think anyone who doesn't suspect something is up with it is being dishonest to themselves.
Which brings us to No. 3 -- The Taliban went on television mere hours after the towers fell. I watched it, live. If they really HAD tried to offer up bin Laden, why no mention of it then? Seems like that would have been a good point to make to a worldwide audience. Maybe they just forgot. It was a pretty hectic day, after all.
Maybe nobody asked them to. Or maybe nobody had presented any evidence that Bin Laden was responsible? - Something that never happened, even to this day.
Maybe nobody asked them to. Or maybe nobody had presented any evidence that Bin Laden was responsible? - Something that never happened, even to this day.
Maybe nobody asked them to? I swear to God, if I were looking down the barrel of a loaded gun, and the world was saying, "Give up bin Laden, or die" ... nobody would have to ASK me to volunteer the fact that I'd already tried to hand him over. It would sort of be the first fucking words out my mouth.
Nobody asked them to? Are you serious?
You're right about nobody presenting evidence that Bin Laden was responsible ... except for bin Laden himself. The guy fucking confessed. What more do you want? Maybe he can come to your house and show you his diary. Would that help?
This is the part I can't get over. The guy tried to take down the towers once and failed, vowed repeatedly to do it again, did it again and succeeded, and people don't believe him.
It's like your neighbor tries to shoot you, ends up winging you with a flesh wound, then spends the next eight years telling everybody, "I'm going to kill that motherfucker." Then you turn up dead. Your neighbor says, "Yup, I killed the motherfucker."
I think most rational people would take his word for it. Instead of saying, you know ... I think the U.S. government did it.
I know it's hard to believe for you free thinkers out there, but sometimes the most rational explanation really IS the truth.
everybody wants the most they can possibly get
for the least they could possibly do
Maybe nobody asked them to. Or maybe nobody had presented any evidence that Bin Laden was responsible? - Something that never happened, even to this day.
Maybe nobody asked them to? I swear to God, if I were looking down the barrel of a loaded gun, and the world was saying, "Give up bin Laden, or die" ... nobody would have to ASK me to volunteer the fact that I'd already tried to hand him over. It would sort of be the first fucking words out my mouth.
Your previous post stated that : 'The Taliban went on television mere hours after the towers fell. I watched it, live.'
At what point 'mere hours after the towers fell' did anyone ask the Taliban to hand over Bin Laden? And what 'loaded gun' was pointing at them 'mere hours after the towers fell'? The loaded gun that is Fox News? Or the loaded gun that is NBC news, or Sky news?
Fine. If I'm not serious then you'll have no trouble pointing out to me who did ask them to hand over Bin Laden on t.v 'mere hours after the towers fell'.
In addition, the Bush adminstration failed at just about everything they did. From keeping torture quiet to convincing the US about WMD in Iraq. You really think they could pull off the largest mass murder in American history and no one would hear anything 8 years later? You people are fucking morons. Was the 9/11 commission very flawed? Yes, but an inside job? You are out of your fucking minds.
And not only that National Geographic had a 2 hr show called 911 conspiracy and science where they debunked all of Dr.Ray Griffin's and the 911 truthers claims on how they think the Towers were brought down. It made them look like a bunch of fools. I couldn't stop laughing. Every time they debunked one of their claims all they would say is Oh that's irrelevant or that's ridiculous. It was a damn joke.
And not only that National Geographic had a 2 hr show called 911 conspiracy and science where they debunked all of Dr.Ray Griffith's and the 911 truthers claims on how they think the Towers were brought down. It made them look like a bunch of fools. I couldn't stop laughing. Every time they debunked one of their claims all they would say is Oh that's irrelevant or that's ridiculous. It was a damn joke.
National Geographic - or was it discovery? - also aired a show in which they claimed to debunk the 'conspiracy theories' surrounding the murder of JFK, and it was all just a whitewash. They debunked nothing but just made themselves lose credibility and look ridiculous.
It makes you wonder who pays their wages.
Im not saying that I don't think there are some questions that still need to be answered but to for some of these people to think that we were attacked deliberately by our own gov. is ludachrist. It's been 8 years since we were attacked if this crap were true somebody would have came forward. There's no way any man or woman with any kind of conscious could live with themselves knowing that they helped murder 3000 innocent people
There's no way it could be kept quiet, It all comes down to CIA and the Feds not cooperating with each other and sharing info period.
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Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,200
Im not saying that I don't think there are some questions that still need to be answered but to for some of these people to think that we were attacked deliberately by our own gov. is ludachrist. It's been 8 years since we were attacked if this crap were true somebody would have came forward. There's no way any man or woman with any kind of conscious could live with themselves knowing that they helped murder 3000 innocent people
There's no way it could be kept quiet, It all comes down to CIA and the Feds not cooperating with each other and sharing info period.
Not saying none of what you stated is not true but we're humans and if more than enough money is paid mouths could be easily shut.
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Im not saying that I don't think there are some questions that still need to be answered but to for some of these people to think that we were attacked deliberately by our own gov. is ludachrist. It's been 8 years since we were attacked if this crap were true somebody would have came forward. There's no way any man or woman with any kind of conscious could live with themselves knowing that they helped murder 3000 innocent people
There's no way it could be kept quiet, It all comes down to CIA and the Feds not cooperating with each other and sharing info period.
I don't think that you were attacked by your own government, though I do believe that they allowed the attacks to happen.
Im not saying that I don't think there are some questions that still need to be answered but to for some of these people to think that we were attacked deliberately by our own gov. is ludachrist. It's been 8 years since we were attacked if this crap were true somebody would have came forward. There's no way any man or woman with any kind of conscious could live with themselves knowing that they helped murder 3000 innocent people
There's no way it could be kept quiet, It all comes down to CIA and the Feds not cooperating with each other and sharing info period.
I don't think that you were attacked by your own government, though I do believe that they allowed the attacks to happen.
which has been proven to be false time and time again.
not to mention this coming from someone who believes bombs were planted in WTC and a missile hit the pentagon. your kind have people a laughing stock since being discredited so many times over
i believe they failed to act on information that could have averted the attacks and have lied to try and cover that up.
thats true. but they failed to act because of ignorance and incompetence. then the facts were spun to make themselves look less stupid.
less stupid, and, they completely underestimated the intellect of their people, by thinking that we wouldn't see this. how insulting.
you know the saying 'fool me once, shame on you...fool me twice, shame on me'?
i question everything and don't just accept what i'm told from one source, i educate myself and then i make my own informed decision. i know plenty of others do the same.
There's no way any man or woman with any kind of conscious could live with themselves knowing that they helped murder 3000 innocent people.
it didn't seem to bother bush and co. they were quite ok with murdering innocent civilians form Iraq and Afghanistan.
Really.... that's funny because it must not seem to bother Obama much either. and not to mention the dems that voted for the wars when bush was in office
There's no way any man or woman with any kind of conscious could live with themselves knowing that they helped murder 3000 innocent people.
it didn't seem to bother bush and co. they were quite ok with murdering innocent civilians form Iraq and Afghanistan.
Really.... that's funny because it doesn't seem to bother Obama either and not to mention the dems that voted for the wars when bush was in office
i'm not arguing that..i said bush and co..duh...
you said There's no way any man or woman with any kind of conscious could live with themselves knowing that they helped murder 3000 innocent people., i proved you wrong. i don't care if it's batman who made the call.
You see, no evidence. Just more baiting gibberish.
from your holy grail....
21. The omission of the fact that pictures from various security cameras---including the camera at the gas station across from the Pentagon, the film from which was reportedly confiscated by the FBI immediately after the strike---could presumably answer the question of what really hit the Pentagon (37-38).
do you believe a plane hit the pentagon?
you seem to be very concerned about the 115 things listed in the report. you keep saying over and over and over and over again. that must mean you believe them right?
I have no further questions your honor.
it goes on and on..
16. The omission of the fact that the west wing of the Pentagon would have been the least likely spot to be targeted by al-Qaeda terrorists, for several reasons (33-34).
17. The omission of any discussion of whether the damage done to the Pentagon was consistent with the impact of a Boeing 757 going several hundred miles per hour (34).
18. The omission of the fact that there are photos showing that the west wing's façade did not collapse until 30 minutes after the strike and also that the entrance hole appears too small for a Boeing 757 to have entered (34).
19. The omission of all testimony that has been used to cast doubt on whether remains of a Boeing 757 were visible either inside or outside the Pentagon (34-36).
20. The omission of any discussion of whether the Pentagon has a anti-missile defense system that would have brought down a commercial airliner---even though the Commission suggested that the al-Qaeda terrorists did not attack a nuclear power plant because they assumed that it would be thus defended (36).
21. The omission of the fact that pictures from various security cameras---including the camera at the gas station across from the Pentagon, the film from which was reportedly confiscated by the FBI immediately after the strike---could presumably answer the question of what really hit the Pentagon (37-38).
22. The omission of Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld's reference to "the missile [used] to damage [the Pentagon]" (39).
You see, no evidence. Just more baiting gibberish.
form your holy grail...
9. The omission of the fact that the collapse of the Twin Towers (like that of Building 7) exemplified at least 10 features suggestive of controlled demolition (26-27).
since you continually say all 115 items are accurate....
Anyway, is that what we're discussing here? I thought we were discussing the 115 lies and omissions contained in the 9/11 commission report?
how about YOU address some of these points.
Do you believe a plane hit the Pentagon?
if not, we can then cover the 15 or so points in your list that try to say something other the a plane hit the building. if you do however believe a plane hit the pentagon, then lets start by saying, alot of your list is utterly nonsense.
Do I believe that a plane hit the Pentagon? The answer to that question is that I don't know. I also don't have answers to the other 114 questions listed. And neither does the U.S government as things stand. They've chosen to side-step them instead of addressing them. Hence the problem people have in believing the official story.
Do I believe that a plane hit the Pentagon?The answer to that question is that I don't know. I also don't have answers to the other 114 questions listed. And neither does the U.S government as things stand. They've chosen to side-step them instead of addressing them. Hence the problem people have in believing the official story.
Good night!
for the record. the answer is YES. a plane hit the pentagon.
next question. do you believe bombs were planted in WTC?
Maybe nobody asked them to. Or maybe nobody had presented any evidence that Bin Laden was responsible? - Something that never happened, even to this day.
Maybe nobody asked them to? I swear to God, if I were looking down the barrel of a loaded gun, and the world was saying, "Give up bin Laden, or die" ... nobody would have to ASK me to volunteer the fact that I'd already tried to hand him over. It would sort of be the first fucking words out my mouth.
Nobody asked them to? Are you serious?
You're right about nobody presenting evidence that Bin Laden was responsible ... except for bin Laden himself. The guy fucking confessed. What more do you want? Maybe he can come to your house and show you his diary. Would that help?
This is the part I can't get over. The guy tried to take down the towers once and failed, vowed repeatedly to do it again, did it again and succeeded, and people don't believe him.
It's like your neighbor tries to shoot you, ends up winging you with a flesh wound, then spends the next eight years telling everybody, "I'm going to kill that motherfucker." Then you turn up dead. Your neighbor says, "Yup, I killed the motherfucker."
I think most rational people would take his word for it. Instead of saying, you know ... I think the U.S. government did it.
I know it's hard to believe for you free thinkers out there, but sometimes the most rational explanation really IS the truth.[/]
while i don't think it was 'mere hours after the towers were hit or fell' Afghanistan offered to hand over bin laden if we provided proof of his guilt. what seems wrong with that? if Afghanistan said hey, we KNOW slightofjeff helped carry out a terrorist attack against us! you'd have no problem with our government just saying 'oh, ok' and handing you over without asking for the proof? instead of giving proof we choose to bomb them.
also, bin laden had denied being a part of the attacks after they happened then later a tape came out, miraculously found in a home of bin laden supposedly talking about the attacks, yet he wrote with the opposite hand as stated in his CIA file.
i don't know what happened, i think at the very least they sat back and did nothing. too much doesn't make sense
jlew can roll his eyes at PNAC all he wants but Cheney and company sure made sure their policies got enacted
don't compete; coexist
what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?
"I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama
when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
[
it didn't seem to bother bush and co. they were quite ok with murdering innocent civilians form Iraq and Afghanistan.
Really.... that's funny because it doesn't seem to bother Obama either and not to mention the dems that voted for the wars when bush was in office
i'm not arguing that..i said bush and co..duh...
you said There's no way any man or woman with any kind of conscious could live with themselves knowing that they helped murder 3000 innocent people., i proved you wrong. i don't care if it's batman who made the call.
before Cheney was vp he was asked how he and his company can do business with a few countries, some in violation of US law, that have horrid human rights records? his answer: i don't think about it
don't compete; coexist
what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?
"I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama
when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
jlew can roll his eyes at PNAC all he wants but Cheney and company sure made sure their policies got enacted
do you know that this almighty powerful organization doesnt even exist anymore? and at best had a one room office in Washington. please research the PNAC. you clearly know little about it besides thinking they somehow hatched a plan to attack and kill Americans.
Comments
When have I ever said that I regard Jlew as normal?
I don't possess a pre-conceived notion of what is 'true'. But I do know what the U.S government/power elites are capable of. History is a wonderful teacher.
And the case of 9/11 there are so many lies and omissions surrounding the official story that I think anyone who doesn't suspect something is up with it is being dishonest to themselves.
Maybe nobody asked them to. Or maybe nobody had presented any evidence that Bin Laden was responsible? - Something that never happened, even to this day.
Maybe nobody asked them to? I swear to God, if I were looking down the barrel of a loaded gun, and the world was saying, "Give up bin Laden, or die" ... nobody would have to ASK me to volunteer the fact that I'd already tried to hand him over. It would sort of be the first fucking words out my mouth.
Nobody asked them to? Are you serious?
You're right about nobody presenting evidence that Bin Laden was responsible ... except for bin Laden himself. The guy fucking confessed. What more do you want? Maybe he can come to your house and show you his diary. Would that help?
This is the part I can't get over. The guy tried to take down the towers once and failed, vowed repeatedly to do it again, did it again and succeeded, and people don't believe him.
It's like your neighbor tries to shoot you, ends up winging you with a flesh wound, then spends the next eight years telling everybody, "I'm going to kill that motherfucker." Then you turn up dead. Your neighbor says, "Yup, I killed the motherfucker."
I think most rational people would take his word for it. Instead of saying, you know ... I think the U.S. government did it.
I know it's hard to believe for you free thinkers out there, but sometimes the most rational explanation really IS the truth.
for the least they could possibly do
Your previous post stated that : 'The Taliban went on television mere hours after the towers fell. I watched it, live.'
At what point 'mere hours after the towers fell' did anyone ask the Taliban to hand over Bin Laden? And what 'loaded gun' was pointing at them 'mere hours after the towers fell'? The loaded gun that is Fox News? Or the loaded gun that is NBC news, or Sky news?
Fine. If I'm not serious then you'll have no trouble pointing out to me who did ask them to hand over Bin Laden on t.v 'mere hours after the towers fell'.
I'll wait patiently for you to enlighten me.
And not only that National Geographic had a 2 hr show called 911 conspiracy and science where they debunked all of Dr.Ray Griffin's and the 911 truthers claims on how they think the Towers were brought down. It made them look like a bunch of fools. I couldn't stop laughing. Every time they debunked one of their claims all they would say is Oh that's irrelevant or that's ridiculous. It was a damn joke.
http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/episode/9-11-science-and-conspiracy-4067/Overview
National Geographic - or was it discovery? - also aired a show in which they claimed to debunk the 'conspiracy theories' surrounding the murder of JFK, and it was all just a whitewash. They debunked nothing but just made themselves lose credibility and look ridiculous.
It makes you wonder who pays their wages.
There's no way it could be kept quiet, It all comes down to CIA and the Feds not cooperating with each other and sharing info period.
Not saying none of what you stated is not true but we're humans and if more than enough money is paid mouths could be easily shut.
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
I don't think that you were attacked by your own government, though I do believe that they allowed the attacks to happen.
which has been proven to be false time and time again.
not to mention this coming from someone who believes bombs were planted in WTC and a missile hit the pentagon. your kind have people a laughing stock since being discredited so many times over
i do not believe that the government carried out the attacks.
thats true. but they failed to act because of ignorance and incompetence. then the facts were spun to make themselves look less stupid.
you know the saying 'fool me once, shame on you...fool me twice, shame on me'?
i question everything and don't just accept what i'm told from one source, i educate myself and then i make my own informed decision. i know plenty of others do the same.
Hilarious!
What would be even funnier is if this baiting troll could provide any evidence to support this accusation.
Really.... that's funny because it must not seem to bother Obama much either. and not to mention the dems that voted for the wars when bush was in office
you said There's no way any man or woman with any kind of conscious could live with themselves knowing that they helped murder 3000 innocent people., i proved you wrong. i don't care if it's batman who made the call.
its not an accusation. you've stated many times before. if I'm wrong, say so.
is this a court room?
do you sir believe bombs were planted in WTC?
do you sir believe a plane hit the Pentagon?
I have no further questions your honor.
from your holy grail....
21. The omission of the fact that pictures from various security cameras---including the camera at the gas station across from the Pentagon, the film from which was reportedly confiscated by the FBI immediately after the strike---could presumably answer the question of what really hit the Pentagon (37-38).
do you believe a plane hit the pentagon?
you seem to be very concerned about the 115 things listed in the report. you keep saying over and over and over and over again. that must mean you believe them right?
I have no further questions your honor.
it goes on and on..
16. The omission of the fact that the west wing of the Pentagon would have been the least likely spot to be targeted by al-Qaeda terrorists, for several reasons (33-34).
17. The omission of any discussion of whether the damage done to the Pentagon was consistent with the impact of a Boeing 757 going several hundred miles per hour (34).
18. The omission of the fact that there are photos showing that the west wing's façade did not collapse until 30 minutes after the strike and also that the entrance hole appears too small for a Boeing 757 to have entered (34).
19. The omission of all testimony that has been used to cast doubt on whether remains of a Boeing 757 were visible either inside or outside the Pentagon (34-36).
20. The omission of any discussion of whether the Pentagon has a anti-missile defense system that would have brought down a commercial airliner---even though the Commission suggested that the al-Qaeda terrorists did not attack a nuclear power plant because they assumed that it would be thus defended (36).
21. The omission of the fact that pictures from various security cameras---including the camera at the gas station across from the Pentagon, the film from which was reportedly confiscated by the FBI immediately after the strike---could presumably answer the question of what really hit the Pentagon (37-38).
22. The omission of Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld's reference to "the missile [used] to damage [the Pentagon]" (39).
DO YOU BELIEVE A PLANE HIT THE PENTAGON?
I rest my case
form your holy grail...
9. The omission of the fact that the collapse of the Twin Towers (like that of Building 7) exemplified at least 10 features suggestive of controlled demolition (26-27).
since you continually say all 115 items are accurate....
were bombs planted in WTC?
I have no further questions your honor.
I provided it.
not shocking you have nothing to say. do you enjoy being embarrassed like this?
how about YOU address some of these points.
Do you believe a plane hit the Pentagon?
if not, we can then cover the 15 or so points in your list that try to say something other the a plane hit the building. if you do however believe a plane hit the pentagon, then lets start by saying, alot of your list is utterly nonsense.
ready when you are....
Good night!
wasn't such a hilarious accusation now was it? :roll: you are something else dude.
for the record. the answer is YES. a plane hit the pentagon.
next question. do you believe bombs were planted in WTC?
Maybe nobody asked them to? I swear to God, if I were looking down the barrel of a loaded gun, and the world was saying, "Give up bin Laden, or die" ... nobody would have to ASK me to volunteer the fact that I'd already tried to hand him over. It would sort of be the first fucking words out my mouth.
Nobody asked them to? Are you serious?
You're right about nobody presenting evidence that Bin Laden was responsible ... except for bin Laden himself. The guy fucking confessed. What more do you want? Maybe he can come to your house and show you his diary. Would that help?
This is the part I can't get over. The guy tried to take down the towers once and failed, vowed repeatedly to do it again, did it again and succeeded, and people don't believe him.
It's like your neighbor tries to shoot you, ends up winging you with a flesh wound, then spends the next eight years telling everybody, "I'm going to kill that motherfucker." Then you turn up dead. Your neighbor says, "Yup, I killed the motherfucker."
I think most rational people would take his word for it. Instead of saying, you know ... I think the U.S. government did it.
I know it's hard to believe for you free thinkers out there, but sometimes the most rational explanation really IS the truth.[/]
while i don't think it was 'mere hours after the towers were hit or fell' Afghanistan offered to hand over bin laden if we provided proof of his guilt. what seems wrong with that? if Afghanistan said hey, we KNOW slightofjeff helped carry out a terrorist attack against us! you'd have no problem with our government just saying 'oh, ok' and handing you over without asking for the proof? instead of giving proof we choose to bomb them.
also, bin laden had denied being a part of the attacks after they happened then later a tape came out, miraculously found in a home of bin laden supposedly talking about the attacks, yet he wrote with the opposite hand as stated in his CIA file.
i don't know what happened, i think at the very least they sat back and did nothing. too much doesn't make sense
jlew can roll his eyes at PNAC all he wants but Cheney and company sure made sure their policies got enacted
what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?
"I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama
when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
before Cheney was vp he was asked how he and his company can do business with a few countries, some in violation of US law, that have horrid human rights records? his answer: i don't think about it
what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?
"I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home. We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank." - Barack Obama
when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
do you know that this almighty powerful organization doesnt even exist anymore? and at best had a one room office in Washington. please research the PNAC. you clearly know little about it besides thinking they somehow hatched a plan to attack and kill Americans.