Dave A putting up videos on youyube!

great post VOLITION

I love his cymbal work; the more cymbals the better I say; come on Matt switch back to the Ayottes and add some china and splash cymbals!

nathanastin wrote:

I love his cymbal work; the more cymbals the better I say; come on Matt switch back to the Ayottes and add some china and splash cymbals!

I'm with you on that. That's one of the biggest things I miss about Dave being in the band.

I miss Pearl Jam circa 92/93.

JimNastics wrote:

I miss Matt's drumming like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-nzmd86qO8

From 1:55 onwards it's just immense. I love the guy big time, but I also wouldn't mind if he started hitting a few more symbals again!

Matt in PJ is a completely different drummer than he was in SG.

Many SG songs have the drums as a central focus, in PJ drums have become more of a rhythm holder (good or bad).
I think coming in the guys pretty much told him what they wanted from him and that was that.

VOLITION wrote:

I miss Dave but the band reached a boiling point and something had to give, it's unfortunate but he had to go. Ed was fucked from all the attention and becoming more reclusive. Communication amongst the band broke down badly to the point where they barely spoke to each other.
I remember watching the SNL show after Kurt died and how uncertain and angry all of the guys except Dave appeared. Dave was having fun rocking the fuck out with a big smile on his face enjoying himself, he seemed out of place. I'm sure this urked Ed increasingly, which is unfortunate.

Ed wanted to pull back and i think Stone and Jeff understood, Mike wasn't happy about it but knew it had to be done to save Ed's sanity. Dave on the other hand wanted things to blow up bigger and didn't see what the big deal was and that was the deciding factor most of us assume.
Jack Irons was the saving grace as every band member has stated on numerous occasions. He forced all of the guys to start talking and work out their differances and they became better musicians and friends because of it.
Out of all the drummers i feel Dave had the most passion and played with the highest level of intensity every single night. When things starting getting volatile he seemed to played like every night could be his last.
Jack Irons had the most flavour but Matt overall is the better drummer on a techincal level and seems to connect better with the guys.Jeff said Matt and him had have the best chemistry compared to the past drummers.

thanks for the link and thank you for the memories Dave!

My understanding was that it was Ed and Jeff that were pissed with Dave.
I believe Ed was upset with Dave for wanting to be a "rockstar" when the band was trying to take a step back. I don't know why Jeff was pissed, but listening to old boots maybe it was because Jeff couldn't keep up (not a knock on Jeff at all). The two of them would get off rhythm really bad at times in that era. Some boots I have are pretty bad, and songs at time would go through a bit of a mid-song, non-bridge "transition" where it seemed like Jeff and Dave would have to figure it out on the fly.
I think Jack and Matt are just much easier to play with from a bass player's perspective (I play mostly guitar and some drums myself but could see how playing bass with Dave could be tricky).
It would not surprise me if Jeff and the group wanted Dave to change it up a bit, and he flat out said "no".

But, who knows...

Spiritual_Chaos wrote:

I think that Ed never got along with Dave and always wanted irons as the drummer (even believing he would be drumming in PJ when getting that demo-cassette). I don't think Dave wanted to be a rockstar á motley crue but he enjoyed the success of the band. But maybe he didn't have a place in the plan Eddie had for PJ when he became the powerfactor in the band-

I don't think Stone and especially Mike had ANY problems with Dave. Dave and Mike seemed to be great friends and having fun together.

Mike is a sweetheart, and Dave seemed like one too. I can see why they would get along so well.

Here's rare footage of him chatting about drumming. It's the only footage I've seen where he's talking. I don't see any "rock star" guy here. Just a nice, cool dude who loved playing, and was damn good at it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oAYoo5SDM9A

CJMST3K wrote:

Here's rare footage of him chatting about drumming. It's the only footage I've seen where he's talking. I don't see any "rock star" guy here. Just a nice, cool dude who loved playing, and was damn good at it.

where is the footage??

Out of all the drummers i feel Dave had the most passion and played with the highest level of intensity every single night. When things starting getting volatile he seemed to played like every night could be his last.

Jack Irons had the most flavor but Matt overall is the better drummer on a technical level and seems to connect better with the guys.Jeff said Matt and him had have the best chemistry compared to the past drummer

Thanks Volition, you put into words what I've been trying to in all these Drummer discussions. The '91-'94 years we all can agree had the most passion, I regret not being able to see them during those years. That said they were also very tumultuous for the band, and unfortunately that era ended with the firing of Dave.

I also agree strongly with the other poster who pointed out what Ed, Jeff and Mike have all stated in various interviews over the years. Jack and Matt saved the band, they both came into the band during important times and help anchor their efforts both professionally and emotionally.

I know there will always be the arguments on here of who the best Pearl Jam drummer was, but if we could move the argument from our perspectives on the outside looking in to their position being on the inside the most important element would most definitely be chemistry. While chemistry between band members might not be as vigorous a discussion as who's the best drummer, for the members of Pearl Jam I think it's the most important aspect in their careers right now. I think they truly enjoy each other, and I think they are better connected to each other than during any part of their career. They all give credit to Matt for their good relationship, I feel in earlier years it was Stone who was the intermediary between Ed, Jeff, Dave and Mike.

Now I think that role is Matt's, I think he keeps the lines of communication between everyone open. I also think he's helped them grow up as being the first band Member with kids, I think he's shown the other members who have recently started families how to balance the rock star life with the soccer/PTA Dad. I think it's so cool he was doing the Rock Band thing with his kids, letting fans play with him and his kids. That's awesome.

dreamweaver wrote:

matt is a better player than dave, imo... and pearl jam has played/ put on much better shows in the past decade than most shows in the early nineties. their sound is warmer and they play together much much better. I can understand why people jump on that stupid fuckin dave a. bandwagon though.. only because he set up his cymbals to look cool while he bashes on them the whole time.

...sigh...

How about we do an "apples to apples" comparison, and just base this on the music... deal?

Dave just posted new video of Blood.

I actually don't like how he has all the splashes and such, so for me your assessment of "only because he set up his cymbals to look cool" is way off. Frankly I think he looks a little too "metal" when he plays... but then again, i'm not judging by looks, as you are suggesting. I'm judging strictly by the music.

Dave just posted this video camera footage of him playing. From this angle, you can't see the cymbals very well, so you'll just have to pay attention to the actual playing.


Dave:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoclgBmo ... annel_page

Dave's timing was great. It lined up with the guitar changes. The right hand is playing the china and/or crashes with the guitar changes, and his left hand is keeping a straight snare beat. The snare and cymbal hits only line up once per measure as the count restarts each go-around. It has a great musicality to it. Dave also did great, tight rudiments on a tight hihat during this song.



Here's Jack playing Blood:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FsP0TQvKniQ

Jack's timing was pretty much identical with Dave's. Jack's right hand was striking the cymbals and his left was keeping a straight snare beat, once again the snare and cymbal hits only line up once per measure. He used different cymbals (a ride many times), but Jack "got it" as far as how the cymbals interlocked with the guitar changes, while keeping a steady on the snare. Jack couldn't do the rudiments (imho as a drummer), so he just did a simple beat on the hihat, and his fills were a bit loose. Seeing as how he got the rest of the song right, I won't begrudge him this difference. Dave's "thing" was rudiments, so it's hard for most drummers to compare on that part.



Here's Matt playing Blood:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZO_B2pMTCEw

I chose this audience video because it sounded a little less muddy than the pro-shot stuff, and on the latter-half of the video you can see Matt playing more at the 2:00 mark, than the pro-shot stuff. Matt's timing on cymbals is a basic beat - he's not hitting the crashes in timing with the music. Matt's just kinda playing a generic beat and slamming the crashes in time with himself, regardless of how the rest of the song goes. His cymbal hits and snare hits line up twice per measure.


Now I know my description may be lost on some... if you can't hear the difference, I truly envy you. This song used to be a favorite because of how intertwined the cymbal hits and guitar intertwined, plus the rudiments, and now with all the changes, it is no longer.

For those who complain that "Dave played cymbals too much", then where are you now on this? If you count, every measure, Matt is hitting the cymbals 6 times. Dave is only hitting them 4 times. This makes it muddy sounding when Matt is playing (plus not in time with the guitar changes), whereas Dave's cymbal hits were spaced out, so you could hear each one.

In order of my preference on Blood: Dave, Jack, Matt



edit: However dreamweaver, I will agree that on new records, I enjoy Matt's approach. Even simple songs like Light Years sound better with Matt than they probably would have with Dave. I'm commenting strictly on the pre-Matt material, particularly Vs & Vitalogy... and some of Ten and No Code.