Stanford rapist

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Comments

  • RiotZactRiotZact Posts: 4,945
    Just read her whole statement. What a brave person she must be, one of the most powerful things I've ever read.
  • pjhawkspjhawks Posts: 8,657
    RiotZact said:

    Just read her whole statement. What a brave person she must be, one of the most powerful things I've ever read.

    just read it myself. agree powerful stuff, just re-iterates what a fucking joke of a sentence he got they should make every college freshman read that letter.
  • Gern BlanstenGern Blansten Your Mom'sPosts: 7,386
    It's a really tough issue.

    Reminds me of a 23 year old from our neighborhood that killed two people driving drunk one night. I believe she ended up serving 30 days in jail and has a few years of home detention. She came from a wealthy family and was able to hire an expensive attorney.

    I still don't know how you kill two people and don't serve longer than that.
    Former BernieBro, turned Hillary rotten Clinton #1 Fanboy

    1998: Noblesville
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    2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
    2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville
    2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
    2013: London ON, Chicago
    2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
    2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 14,747

    I'm wondering where the liberal think tank is on this issue?

    I constantly hear- especially in the DP thread- that the court system should not concern itself with justice for the victims (ultimately enacting what some consider a measure of revenge in retaliation for a crime). It has been suggested by many that the court system's real purpose is to safeguard society from future harm and seeking justice for the victims amounts to nothing more than punishing people. And... that we should be above 'punishing people'.

    So... if this guy is determined to not be a risk to reoffend... any sentence we issue amounts to revenge/punishment and is a poor course of action for some that think this way. No?

    If it's about safeguarding society from future harm... then are we sure six months is going to do the trick? It's hard to establish exactly what the recidivism rate is for sex offenders given the variances among the offences (violent, pedophelia, etc.); however, 25% is a number that has been generally accepted. One in four rape again.

    Are we comfortable with such a predictor of future behaviour? Knowing one in four rape again, do we roll the dice for the benefit of the three in four that do not rape again? Exactly what do we owe a convicted rapist? What recidivism rate would be unacceptable for attempting to reintroduce rapists to society to see if they can function in society without raping anyone's daughter/wife/mother?

    http://www.publicsafety.gc.ca/cnt/rsrcs/pblctns/sx-ffndr-rcdvsm/index-en.aspx

    the liberal think tank. lol.

    I think it's disgusting that he gets only 6 months. If I was the perp here, my Dad would be the one asking the judge for MORE time. Not less.

    I can say in all honesty, 30, that I cannot answer your questions. I don't know what the proper amount of time for them to spend behind bars for their crimes.

    and while I have been one of the proponents of the revenge-less justice system, I can't say that if even this guy was a certainty not to re-offend that I'd agree with him spending no time in jail. that would obviously make no sense. just not sure what the answers are.
  • polaris_xpolaris_x Posts: 13,551
    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
  • hedonisthedonist standing on the edge of foreverPosts: 19,156
    Good read, E. Thank you.
  • Gern BlanstenGern Blansten Your Mom'sPosts: 7,386
    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    Former BernieBro, turned Hillary rotten Clinton #1 Fanboy

    1998: Noblesville
    2003: Noblesville
    2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
    2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville
    2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
    2013: London ON, Chicago
    2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
    2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1
  • polaris_xpolaris_x Posts: 13,551

    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    i'm not saying it is ...

    but if she drinks that much and gets in a car - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and vandalizes a house - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and breaks a leg falling down stairs - no one would have too much sympathy for her ... if any of the above happened - we'd be sitting around discussing how irresponsible she was with her alcohol consumption but we aren't ...
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 41,849
    edited June 2016
    polaris_x said:

    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    i'm not saying it is ...

    but if she drinks that much and gets in a car - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and vandalizes a house - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and breaks a leg falling down stairs - no one would have too much sympathy for her ... if any of the above happened - we'd be sitting around discussing how irresponsible she was with her alcohol consumption but we aren't ...
    And the thing that all of your examples have in common is that no one else attacked her. If someone had PUSHED her down those stairs, I'm pretty sure people would be after the pusher, not the drunk pushee for standing too close to a flight of stairs while wasted.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • Gern BlanstenGern Blansten Your Mom'sPosts: 7,386
    PJ_Soul said:

    polaris_x said:

    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    i'm not saying it is ...

    but if she drinks that much and gets in a car - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and vandalizes a house - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and breaks a leg falling down stairs - no one would have too much sympathy for her ... if any of the above happened - we'd be sitting around discussing how irresponsible she was with her alcohol consumption but we aren't ...
    And the thing that all of your examples have in common is that no one else attacked her. If someone had PUSHED her down those stairs, I'm pretty sure people would be after the pusher, not the drunk pushee for standing too close to a flight of stairs while wasted.
    exactly...holy shit
    Former BernieBro, turned Hillary rotten Clinton #1 Fanboy

    1998: Noblesville
    2003: Noblesville
    2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
    2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville
    2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
    2013: London ON, Chicago
    2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
    2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 14,747
    jesus christ. put that father in jail too. his stance on rape is obviously where this shithead got it from.
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 14,747

    PJ_Soul said:

    polaris_x said:

    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    i'm not saying it is ...

    but if she drinks that much and gets in a car - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and vandalizes a house - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and breaks a leg falling down stairs - no one would have too much sympathy for her ... if any of the above happened - we'd be sitting around discussing how irresponsible she was with her alcohol consumption but we aren't ...
    And the thing that all of your examples have in common is that no one else attacked her. If someone had PUSHED her down those stairs, I'm pretty sure people would be after the pusher, not the drunk pushee for standing too close to a flight of stairs while wasted.
    exactly...holy shit
    um, yeah. polaris, I think you need to rethink your stance on this.
  • F Me In The BrainF Me In The Brain this knows everybody from other commetsPosts: 13,090
    edited June 2016
    polaris_x said:

    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    i'm not saying it is ...

    but if she drinks that much and gets in a car - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and vandalizes a house - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and breaks a leg falling down stairs - no one would have too much sympathy for her ... if any of the above happened - we'd be sitting around discussing how irresponsible she was with her alcohol consumption but we aren't ...
    I have to disagree with your stance in general. I dont think she should be held accountable. She can kick herself but if she drank too much and passed out at a party, someone should take care of her. Throw a blanket on her. Worst case, balance beer cans on top of her and take a picture.
    No way does someone drag her out of a party, behind a dumpster and rape her.
    That is not on her.
    I blacked out many times. Never once did I get into a car and drive.
    Never once did I rape someone. I am a believer in who you are always finding a way to come through.

    This piece of crap is a predator, someone who did this and used booze as his excuse. She was the victim in this and to look at this as a lesson to others on why not to drink too much looks past the basic problem with our society turning into a bunch of frigging animals and that we find a way to accept it. (Or....take a wimpy 6 month sentence and go on with things while the victim is left to deal with people suggesting she should share in some of the blame because she got drunk.)

    :unamused:
    Post edited by F Me In The Brain on
    The love he receives is the love that is saved
  • F Me In The BrainF Me In The Brain this knows everybody from other commetsPosts: 13,090
    The love he receives is the love that is saved
  • pjhawkspjhawks Posts: 8,657
    Enkidu said:
    for the most part I think this is a good read but I think your friend loses some credibility by constantly harping on the kids name. it's frankly juvenile to pick on someone because of their name. the kids name doesn't have one thing to do with this. he is a piece of shit whatever his name is.
  • Who PrincessWho Princess out here in the fieldsPosts: 7,115
    polaris_x said:

    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    i'm not saying it is ...

    but if she drinks that much and gets in a car - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and vandalizes a house - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and breaks a leg falling down stairs - no one would have too much sympathy for her ... if any of the above happened - we'd be sitting around discussing how irresponsible she was with her alcohol consumption but we aren't ...
    Did you read the victim's letter? She acknowledges she drank too much. Unlike your examples, she harmed no one. Someone chose to take advantage of the situation and harm her.

    Sheesh . . . You never did anything dumb in your life? Locked your keys in the car? Left your wallet on the dresser? Poured water in the coffee maker and forgot to put the pot underneath? We all do stupid things; rarely does someone experience what this woman went through on account of it and she does NOT deserve any blame.
    "The stars are all connected to the brain."
  • polaris_xpolaris_x Posts: 13,551

    PJ_Soul said:

    polaris_x said:

    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    i'm not saying it is ...

    but if she drinks that much and gets in a car - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and vandalizes a house - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and breaks a leg falling down stairs - no one would have too much sympathy for her ... if any of the above happened - we'd be sitting around discussing how irresponsible she was with her alcohol consumption but we aren't ...
    And the thing that all of your examples have in common is that no one else attacked her. If someone had PUSHED her down those stairs, I'm pretty sure people would be after the pusher, not the drunk pushee for standing too close to a flight of stairs while wasted.
    exactly...holy shit
    um, yeah. polaris, I think you need to rethink your stance on this.
    as expected ... don't think anyone gets my point ... oh well ... too much to ask of the train I think ...
  • Gern BlanstenGern Blansten Your Mom'sPosts: 7,386
    polaris_x said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    polaris_x said:

    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    i'm not saying it is ...

    but if she drinks that much and gets in a car - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and vandalizes a house - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and breaks a leg falling down stairs - no one would have too much sympathy for her ... if any of the above happened - we'd be sitting around discussing how irresponsible she was with her alcohol consumption but we aren't ...
    And the thing that all of your examples have in common is that no one else attacked her. If someone had PUSHED her down those stairs, I'm pretty sure people would be after the pusher, not the drunk pushee for standing too close to a flight of stairs while wasted.
    exactly...holy shit
    um, yeah. polaris, I think you need to rethink your stance on this.
    as expected ... don't think anyone gets my point ... oh well ... too much to ask of the train I think ...
    actually we all get your point....
    Former BernieBro, turned Hillary rotten Clinton #1 Fanboy

    1998: Noblesville
    2003: Noblesville
    2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
    2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville
    2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
    2013: London ON, Chicago
    2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
    2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1
  • EnkiduEnkidu So CalPosts: 2,945
    pjhawks said:

    Enkidu said:
    for the most part I think this is a good read but I think your friend loses some credibility by constantly harping on the kids name. it's frankly juvenile to pick on someone because of their name. the kids name doesn't have one thing to do with this. he is a piece of shit whatever his name is.
    I don't know her, she's a friend of a friend. And I agree about the name thing. And yes, it could have used a spellcheck. Or two.

    I saw on FB (so who knows if it's true) that somehow the police won't release his mugshot so that's why they keep running the yearbook or swimming pictures.
  • rgambsrgambs Posts: 11,074
    edited June 2016
    polaris_x said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    polaris_x said:

    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    i'm not saying it is ...

    but if she drinks that much and gets in a car - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and vandalizes a house - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and breaks a leg falling down stairs - no one would have too much sympathy for her ... if any of the above happened - we'd be sitting around discussing how irresponsible she was with her alcohol consumption but we aren't ...
    And the thing that all of your examples have in common is that no one else attacked her. If someone had PUSHED her down those stairs, I'm pretty sure people would be after the pusher, not the drunk pushee for standing too close to a flight of stairs while wasted.
    exactly...holy shit
    um, yeah. polaris, I think you need to rethink your stance on this.
    as expected ... don't think anyone gets my point ... oh well ... too much to ask of the train I think ...
    I get your point, and it does have some validity, though it is insensitive by very nature. I don't see it as victim blaming, but I'm sure some will. As far as I see it, you aren't calling for anything more than for young people (women particularly) to take this as an example of how important it is for each individual to ensure their own safety by maintaining situational awareness.
    It is not OK for the attacker (or anyone on his side) to invoke the binge drinking culture in any way, but I feel it is OK for those on the victim's side to try and pass on the message that people can't be trusted and getting blackout drunk is a very bad idea under ANY circumstance.
    Post edited by rgambs on
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 13,887
    polaris_x said:

    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    i'm not saying it is ...

    but if she drinks that much and gets in a car - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and vandalizes a house - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and breaks a leg falling down stairs - no one would have too much sympathy for her ... if any of the above happened - we'd be sitting around discussing how irresponsible she was with her alcohol consumption but we aren't ...
    all are consequences of her decisions. you seem to suggest she is responsible for HIS decision and its consequences.
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  • polaris_xpolaris_x Posts: 13,551

    polaris_x said:

    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    i'm not saying it is ...

    but if she drinks that much and gets in a car - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and vandalizes a house - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and breaks a leg falling down stairs - no one would have too much sympathy for her ... if any of the above happened - we'd be sitting around discussing how irresponsible she was with her alcohol consumption but we aren't ...
    Did you read the victim's letter? She acknowledges she drank too much. Unlike your examples, she harmed no one. Someone chose to take advantage of the situation and harm her.

    Sheesh . . . You never did anything dumb in your life? Locked your keys in the car? Left your wallet on the dresser? Poured water in the coffee maker and forgot to put the pot underneath? We all do stupid things; rarely does someone experience what this woman went through on account of it and she does NOT deserve any blame.
    I have done things that I regret and I hope I've learned from them ... If I drank so much that something bad happened and I can't remember - I think the conversation should at least be partly about whether I should drink that much ...

    Although some of you want to interpret my words as me partly blaming her ... it's not ... all I am trying to do is address the topic that no one wants to discuss ...
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 14,747
    polaris_x said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    polaris_x said:

    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    i'm not saying it is ...

    but if she drinks that much and gets in a car - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and vandalizes a house - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and breaks a leg falling down stairs - no one would have too much sympathy for her ... if any of the above happened - we'd be sitting around discussing how irresponsible she was with her alcohol consumption but we aren't ...
    And the thing that all of your examples have in common is that no one else attacked her. If someone had PUSHED her down those stairs, I'm pretty sure people would be after the pusher, not the drunk pushee for standing too close to a flight of stairs while wasted.
    exactly...holy shit
    um, yeah. polaris, I think you need to rethink your stance on this.
    as expected ... don't think anyone gets my point ... oh well ... too much to ask of the train I think ...
    then explain it, polaris. your hypotheticals were things the person did to others. this woman did nothing to anyone. she got fucking bat shit loaded. and she got assaulted. how can you correlate drinking and driving with drinking and getting assaulted?
  • F Me In The BrainF Me In The Brain this knows everybody from other commetsPosts: 13,090
    edited June 2016
    I drove a car and a drunk driver runs into me. Should we discuss the potential risks of my driving a car perfectly sober?
    The love he receives is the love that is saved
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 14,747
    rgambs said:

    polaris_x said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    polaris_x said:

    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    i'm not saying it is ...

    but if she drinks that much and gets in a car - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and vandalizes a house - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and breaks a leg falling down stairs - no one would have too much sympathy for her ... if any of the above happened - we'd be sitting around discussing how irresponsible she was with her alcohol consumption but we aren't ...
    And the thing that all of your examples have in common is that no one else attacked her. If someone had PUSHED her down those stairs, I'm pretty sure people would be after the pusher, not the drunk pushee for standing too close to a flight of stairs while wasted.
    exactly...holy shit
    um, yeah. polaris, I think you need to rethink your stance on this.
    as expected ... don't think anyone gets my point ... oh well ... too much to ask of the train I think ...
    I get your point, and it does have some validity, though it is insensitive by very nature. I don't see it as victim blaming, but I'm sure some will. As far as I see it, you aren't calling for anything more than for young people (women particularly) to take this as an example of how important it is for each individual to ensure their own safety by maintaining situational awareness.
    It is not OK for the attacker (or anyone on his side) to invoke the binge drinking culture in any way, but I feel it is OK for those on the victim's side to try and pass on the message that people can't be trusted and getting blackout drunk is a very bad idea under ANY circumstance.
    for women. therein lies the problem with this message. guys can do what they want (get blind drunk) without consequence, but a woman can't. this message is no different than saying "don't wear a short skirt if you know what's good for you".
  • polaris_xpolaris_x Posts: 13,551
    rgambs said:

    polaris_x said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    polaris_x said:

    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    i'm not saying it is ...

    but if she drinks that much and gets in a car - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and vandalizes a house - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and breaks a leg falling down stairs - no one would have too much sympathy for her ... if any of the above happened - we'd be sitting around discussing how irresponsible she was with her alcohol consumption but we aren't ...
    And the thing that all of your examples have in common is that no one else attacked her. If someone had PUSHED her down those stairs, I'm pretty sure people would be after the pusher, not the drunk pushee for standing too close to a flight of stairs while wasted.
    exactly...holy shit
    um, yeah. polaris, I think you need to rethink your stance on this.
    as expected ... don't think anyone gets my point ... oh well ... too much to ask of the train I think ...
    I get your point, and it does have some validity, though it is insensitive by very nature. I don't see it as victim blaming, but I'm sure some will. As far as I see it, you aren't calling for anything more than for young people (women particularly) to take this as an example of how important it is for each individual to ensure their own safety by maintaining situational awareness.
    It is not OK for the attacker (or anyone on his side) to invoke the binge drinking culture in any way, but I feel it is OK for those on the victim's side to try and pass on the message that people can't be trusted and getting blackout drunk is a very bad idea under ANY circumstance.
    exactly!

    it is somewhat insensitive in that if we are to attach personal emotions to this story ... but my comment was a rational one based on an objective look at this story ...
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 14,747
    rgambs said:

    polaris_x said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    polaris_x said:

    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    i'm not saying it is ...

    but if she drinks that much and gets in a car - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and vandalizes a house - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and breaks a leg falling down stairs - no one would have too much sympathy for her ... if any of the above happened - we'd be sitting around discussing how irresponsible she was with her alcohol consumption but we aren't ...
    And the thing that all of your examples have in common is that no one else attacked her. If someone had PUSHED her down those stairs, I'm pretty sure people would be after the pusher, not the drunk pushee for standing too close to a flight of stairs while wasted.
    exactly...holy shit
    um, yeah. polaris, I think you need to rethink your stance on this.
    as expected ... don't think anyone gets my point ... oh well ... too much to ask of the train I think ...
    I get your point, and it does have some validity, though it is insensitive by very nature. I don't see it as victim blaming, but I'm sure some will. As far as I see it, you aren't calling for anything more than for young people (women particularly) to take this as an example of how important it is for each individual to ensure their own safety by maintaining situational awareness.
    It is not OK for the attacker (or anyone on his side) to invoke the binge drinking culture in any way, but I feel it is OK for those on the victim's side to try and pass on the message that people can't be trusted and getting blackout drunk is a very bad idea under ANY circumstance.
    it has some validity in the context of being a responsible human being in general. but it has no place in the realm of sexual assault.
  • F Me In The BrainF Me In The Brain this knows everybody from other commetsPosts: 13,090
    I think that binge drinking on campuses is already a big topic. No need to bring it into this discussion imo. This is about an assault, an unrepentant perpetrator, a sad excuse for a parent, and a disgusting display of judicial system abuse by a moron of a judge.
    The love he receives is the love that is saved
  • polaris_xpolaris_x Posts: 13,551
    mickeyrat said:

    polaris_x said:

    polaris_x said:

    Enkidu said:
    she clearly needs an editor ... like is spell check not available?

    in any case - this story is all too familiar ... i do think what's in pandora's box should be discussed but will never be because it's now considered victim-blaming ... but the reality is that there are a multitude of consequences associated with getting that drunk that would have left her crucified by society but because of what happened - it's not being discussed at all ...

    before people get bent out of shape ... i don't condone rape or sexual assault of any kind and this asshole clearly did not get a harsh enough sentence ... it's simply that the victim has to hold herself to account ... saying she drank too much not factoring she didn't have the tolerance of when she was in college is her rationalizing her own role in this ... again - i'm not making excuses for the assailant here nor saying she deserved it ... just asking where she is in acknowledging the fact she got so damn drunk that she couldn't remember a single thing ...
    Drinking so much you don't remember shit isn't a felony. Rape is.
    i'm not saying it is ...

    but if she drinks that much and gets in a car - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and vandalizes a house - she'd be crucified; if she drinks that much and breaks a leg falling down stairs - no one would have too much sympathy for her ... if any of the above happened - we'd be sitting around discussing how irresponsible she was with her alcohol consumption but we aren't ...
    all are consequences of her decisions. you seem to suggest she is responsible for HIS decision and its consequences.
    no ... again ... I, in now way, am saying that he is not fully responsible for his actions ... nor am I saying she is responsible for her rape ...
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