2025/2026 NBA Season October 22nd Opening Tip off! Pg 185

Yeah, I wouldn't take LeBron James on my team (yes, said with sarcasm). 

My old school friends say Wilt Chamberlain was the best ever (GOAT.) Wilt Chamberlain pretty much has his own record Book and then the rest of the NBA players have theirs's=LOL

tempo_n_groove said:

Poncier said:

Garnett was traded away from Minnesota. He didn't want to leave and had to be convinced to by Trader Danny and Ray Allen to wave his no trade clause. There is a difference. Lebron has orchestrated all of his team to team moves since taking his talents to Souf Beach.

He didn't want to leave but he saw the writing on the wall and the team wasn't going to build around him.  He even said later he should have left earlier.

Most players are orchestrating moves.  You think Paul George and Kawhi didn't chat before going to the Clippers? Or Kyrie and Durant?

I don't fault Lebron for wanting to leave.  He had the Cleveland team on his back.  I don't like how he went about it but now it is forever engrained in peoples mind and the best HS player, Tyran Stokes used the line "I'm taking my talents to Kansas University."

The league is much different now.  The players all talk to each other and hang out.  It's not the 80's 90's when everyone hated each other.

Players understand the business and want to move around and win.

Yes, players talk and orchestrate moves now. And who do we have to thank for that?

Poncier said:

cutz said:

Yeah, I wouldn't take LeBron James on my team (yes, said with sarcasm). 

My old school friends say Wilt Chamberlain was the best ever (GOAT.) Wilt Chamberlain pretty much has his own record Book and then the rest of the NBA players have theirs's=LOL

LOL indeed.

I was talking strictly talent.

By ring Logic, Robert Horry has to be considered one of the best ever to play=LOL Heck, I think Steve Kerr has 4 or 5 as a player.

tempo_n_groove said:

CROJAM95 said:

LeBron has been swept how many times? His crying, his brick shooting… he was the most physically imposing player in nba history who wasn’t a BIG… yea he’s great. I take a bunch of guys over him ( too many) and him chasing super teams… Jordan would never.

the kids today who forgot the greatness of Michael… they can start only fans but can’t figure out to work a YouTube of Michael to really see before they even say LeBron is in his realm. 

He can also thank Ray Allen for a title, Covid as his Laker title.. looked like a HS championship 

I will give him credit for searingly being a decent person from all accounts.. not easy with the $$ n fame 

I never once watch him and said how do you stop this?  Kawhi 2 runs were more Jordan esque than LeBron in his best dream 

Dwayne Wade 100x more clutch 

Steph is better im
larry
msgic
duncam 
Hakeem 
Kobe
Wemby at 22

many others

#2 my ass

Huge Lebron fan here.  

This has waned over the years though.  When he blocked that shot for the chasedown that saved the game and the championship was the last time he really played defense.

Nobody could stop him if he willed his ability some more.  He never had the killer instinct and it bugged the hell out of me.

Statistically he will be the best ever,  He is not better than Jordan though.

I never get the "chasing rings" angle.  It's ok to go to a different team.  Do people give Garnett shit for leaving Minnesota?  

Todays players are built different.  Wemby looks like he is cut from an old cloth.  Like Giannis was when he first came in.  Hungry.

I'd like to see more of that from Pablo, Cade and Antman.  Cade has it turned up the most right not.  Lets see if Antman can do the same.

yes thank LeBron for that.  flopping all over the place, load management. unfortunately that will be a part of his legacy.  His flopping started the trend that has become an embarrassment to the league how much guys do it now.

as someone else said I don't see LeBron retiring because you know he wants everyone fawning over him. He will play one more year and announce his retirement so every city can lick his nuts.

the thing that makes Jordan the greatest ever, like Brady and Tiger had, was the killer instinct.  With those guys winning was the only thing that mattered and they'd rip your heart out at a drop of a hat to do it.  LeBron never felt like he had that.  LeBron's ability to play as well as he has as old as he is is darn impressive though.  Ill give him that but i honestly don't think he is close to Jordan.  Id say if you go from the 70s he is probably the 2nd best of all time behind Jordan, but there are some arguments for Kareem , Magic and Bird as well.  I think Kareem's greatness is being forgotten a bit now.

cutz said:

Poncier said:

cutz said:

Yeah, I wouldn't take LeBron James on my team (yes, said with sarcasm). 

My old school friends say Wilt Chamberlain was the best ever (GOAT.) Wilt Chamberlain pretty much has his own record Book and then the rest of the NBA players have theirs's=LOL

LOL indeed.

I was talking strictly talent.

By ring Logic, Robert Horry has to be considered one of the best ever to play=LOL Heck, I think Steve Kerr has 4 or 5 as a player.

You didn't just compare the impact of Bill Russell to winning to that of Big Shot Bob and Steve Kerr, did you?

tempo_n_groove said:

pjhawks said:

tempo_n_groove said:

CROJAM95 said:

LeBron has been swept how many times? His crying, his brick shooting… he was the most physically imposing player in nba history who wasn’t a BIG… yea he’s great. I take a bunch of guys over him ( too many) and him chasing super teams… Jordan would never.

the kids today who forgot the greatness of Michael… they can start only fans but can’t figure out to work a YouTube of Michael to really see before they even say LeBron is in his realm. 

He can also thank Ray Allen for a title, Covid as his Laker title.. looked like a HS championship 

I will give him credit for searingly being a decent person from all accounts.. not easy with the $$ n fame 

I never once watch him and said how do you stop this?  Kawhi 2 runs were more Jordan esque than LeBron in his best dream 

Dwayne Wade 100x more clutch 

Steph is better im
larry
msgic
duncam 
Hakeem 
Kobe
Wemby at 22

many others

#2 my ass

Huge Lebron fan here.  

This has waned over the years though.  When he blocked that shot for the chasedown that saved the game and the championship was the last time he really played defense.

Nobody could stop him if he willed his ability some more.  He never had the killer instinct and it bugged the hell out of me.

Statistically he will be the best ever,  He is not better than Jordan though.

I never get the "chasing rings" angle.  It's ok to go to a different team.  Do people give Garnett shit for leaving Minnesota?  

Todays players are built different.  Wemby looks like he is cut from an old cloth.  Like Giannis was when he first came in.  Hungry.

I'd like to see more of that from Pablo, Cade and Antman.  Cade has it turned up the most right not.  Lets see if Antman can do the same.

yes thank LeBron for that.  flopping all over the place, load management. unfortunately that will be a part of his legacy.  His flopping started the trend that has become an embarrassment to the league how much guys do it now.

as someone else said I don't see LeBron retiring because you know he wants everyone fawning over him. He will play one more year and announce his retirement so every city can lick his nuts.

the thing that makes Jordan the greatest ever, like Brady and Tiger had, was the killer instinct.  With those guys winning was the only thing that mattered and they'd rip your heart out at a drop of a hat to do it.  LeBron never felt like he had that.  LeBron's ability to play as well as he has as old as he is is darn impressive though.  Ill give him that but i honestly don't think he is close to Jordan.  Id say if you go from the 70s he is probably the 2nd best of all time behind Jordan, but there are some arguments for Kareem , Magic and Bird as well.  I think Kareem's greatness is being forgotten a bit now.

Everyone forgets the Euro players started flopping first.  I remember Reggie Miller feigning during his career too.

Lebron was the most prolific so he gets the blame, lol.  Does he flop? Yep.  Was he the innovator? Nope.

I agree with Jordans killer instinct.  I called it "hungry" for the other guys mentioned above.

Most prolific flopper ever was Manu (Manflop) Ginobli by a country mile.