Police Reform (Please Don’t Call It Defund)

lindamarie73 said:

mace1229 said:

Hobbes said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Gern Blansten said:

Parksy said:

The 'cops' in Uvalde are cowards... plain and simple.  That's not to say all cops are. This is honestly the first I've ever heard of a situation like this where the cops don't engage immediately. 

I will say this.. and this will something to keep an eye on:  The problem with cops and the thin blue line, or the blue brotherhood, or the blue lives matter crowd is that they all protect themselves.  It's an unwritten rule that cops help cops and that cops don't rat other cops out. That's just wrong. Plain and simple wrong. There are a lot of excellent cops out there and they need credit for not only being brave but for putting up with a lot of shit and stress.  But this is an opportunity to show just how brave you are. 

Police across your country need to condemn this and call for all of their badges.. now.  Don't let it be the people protesting outside the station... call out your own. Don't ignore social media... don't ignore the news.  Call them out. And do it now.  Their negligence, cowardice, and laziness cost children's lives. 

The personal safety of an officer takes precedence in ALMOST every scenario .. EXCEPT THIS ONE.  Active shooter = go... no matter what.  To me that's the MOST important reason you cops have a gun. 

We don't know the whole story yet. There were several officers that entered the school soon after the shooting started. All of the facts are not in a usable format yet. A lot of people are focusing on video of officers keeping parents back....there were tons of officers there...not just those few.

you're right. I'll reserve further outrage for more information. But I will say...it sounds like there is a cover up happening with changing of stories and facts etc. Seems like massive damage control. 

I wonder how the police would treat a suspect who changed their story this many times. Hmm…

Did the police change their story? Or was it media and other non law enforcement officials who were spreading the rumors that turned out to be false and the police the corrected it?

Nailed it there Mace.  The media depends on creating shock value that  the weak minded eat up and crave.  Godbless all involved in this tragedy, the real investigation into this matter is just beginning.  

What are you even talking about? Abbott even spewed the bullshit version of events because that's what he was told by LE officials, until they had to walk that back. Unless by media you meant Breitbart and the like.

Also, you sound like a conspiracy theorist with that last sentence. I sure hope you aren't implying this was some staged event.

nicknyr15 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

nicknyr15 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

has there ever been a song called "fuck the fire department"? if not, they must be doing something right. better than the police anyway.

What? The fire department don’t go after criminals. Pretty sure the gentleman who made that song had a shady lifestyle. I think only “fire” would say fuck the fire department. I get it. You hate cops. But this is a reach. 

i don't hate cops. i hate people who do not do their job when called upon to do so. i hate "good guys with guns" who do not do what they are trained to do. have you heard the summaries of the calls to 911 from the children inside that school? the kids were begging the dispatchers to send the police now.

the fire department runs into dangerous situations to save people every day. that is much more than i can say for the cops who stood by and left kids in that school with the gunman.

Ok. It’s just when someone makes donut jokes multiple times it adds to the idea that they just hate cops. Comparing firemen to cops is apples to oranges. And saying there’s no song called “fuck the fireman” is a huge reach to make your point. But yea. Fuck the police. Until you’re in trouble. Fuck these guys? Yea. But you don’t hear about every time an officer saves a life because they’re just doing their job and it’s not newsworthy. I just don’t get the fuck the police stance. Unless you’re a criminal. Then I get it. If I had to I’d choose being a fireman over a cop 100% of the time. More money, less variables, no “anti fireman” rhetoric to deal with, not dealing with the absolute worst society has to offer every day, and tons of time to do side work and make even more money. 

so are we now supposed to praise government employees for doing what they are supposed to do? doing what their job is?

you do not get the "fuck the police" stance? where have you been the last 5 years with cops always killing unarmed black men? have you not been in the george floyd thread? have you not been reading about the racist cops and police culture over the years? what about how the thin blue line protects dirty cops? come on, man.

we all do our jobs every day without a thank you. we do our jobs every day without a pat on the back. and we do not expect one. you know why? because we do our job that we signed up to do. these cops here not only did not go in that building to engage the shooter, but they kept others from going in since the police would not act. they roughed up and detained parents for trying to save their kids. they did not go in when kids were calling 911 from inside the classroom begging for the dispatcher to send in the cops right away. they told feds to stay out of the building. the cops that did go in went in to find their own kids and left when they found them.  i will not praise these guys. i will not thank them. because they did not even do the bare minimum of what is expected of them. then the department and the governor lied about it. they are now admitting they made mistakes because the timeline does not add up. they failed, and then they lied about it. they should be held accountable.

tbergs said:

lindamarie73 said:

mace1229 said:

Hobbes said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Gern Blansten said:

Parksy said:

The 'cops' in Uvalde are cowards... plain and simple.  That's not to say all cops are. This is honestly the first I've ever heard of a situation like this where the cops don't engage immediately. 

I will say this.. and this will something to keep an eye on:  The problem with cops and the thin blue line, or the blue brotherhood, or the blue lives matter crowd is that they all protect themselves.  It's an unwritten rule that cops help cops and that cops don't rat other cops out. That's just wrong. Plain and simple wrong. There are a lot of excellent cops out there and they need credit for not only being brave but for putting up with a lot of shit and stress.  But this is an opportunity to show just how brave you are. 

Police across your country need to condemn this and call for all of their badges.. now.  Don't let it be the people protesting outside the station... call out your own. Don't ignore social media... don't ignore the news.  Call them out. And do it now.  Their negligence, cowardice, and laziness cost children's lives. 

The personal safety of an officer takes precedence in ALMOST every scenario .. EXCEPT THIS ONE.  Active shooter = go... no matter what.  To me that's the MOST important reason you cops have a gun. 

We don't know the whole story yet. There were several officers that entered the school soon after the shooting started. All of the facts are not in a usable format yet. A lot of people are focusing on video of officers keeping parents back....there were tons of officers there...not just those few.

you're right. I'll reserve further outrage for more information. But I will say...it sounds like there is a cover up happening with changing of stories and facts etc. Seems like massive damage control. 

I wonder how the police would treat a suspect who changed their story this many times. Hmm…

Did the police change their story? Or was it media and other non law enforcement officials who were spreading the rumors that turned out to be false and the police the corrected it?

Nailed it there Mace.  The media depends on creating shock value that  the weak minded eat up and crave.  Godbless all involved in this tragedy, the real investigation into this matter is just beginning.  

What are you even talking about? Abbott even spewed the bullshit version of events because that's what he was told by LE officials, until they had to walk that back. Unless by media you meant Breitbart and the like.

Also, you sound like a conspiracy theorist with that last sentence. I sure hope you aren't implying this was some staged event.

i will never stop being entertained by someone who calls the POTUS a "mushbrain" but articulates themselves at a much lower level than he does. lol

gimmesometruth27 said:

nicknyr15 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

nicknyr15 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

has there ever been a song called "fuck the fire department"? if not, they must be doing something right. better than the police anyway.

What? The fire department don’t go after criminals. Pretty sure the gentleman who made that song had a shady lifestyle. I think only “fire” would say fuck the fire department. I get it. You hate cops. But this is a reach. 

i don't hate cops. i hate people who do not do their job when called upon to do so. i hate "good guys with guns" who do not do what they are trained to do. have you heard the summaries of the calls to 911 from the children inside that school? the kids were begging the dispatchers to send the police now.

the fire department runs into dangerous situations to save people every day. that is much more than i can say for the cops who stood by and left kids in that school with the gunman.

Ok. It’s just when someone makes donut jokes multiple times it adds to the idea that they just hate cops. Comparing firemen to cops is apples to oranges. And saying there’s no song called “fuck the fireman” is a huge reach to make your point. But yea. Fuck the police. Until you’re in trouble. Fuck these guys? Yea. But you don’t hear about every time an officer saves a life because they’re just doing their job and it’s not newsworthy. I just don’t get the fuck the police stance. Unless you’re a criminal. Then I get it. If I had to I’d choose being a fireman over a cop 100% of the time. More money, less variables, no “anti fireman” rhetoric to deal with, not dealing with the absolute worst society has to offer every day, and tons of time to do side work and make even more money. 

so are we now supposed to praise government employees for doing what they are supposed to do? doing what their job is?

you do not get the "fuck the police" stance? where have you been the last 5 years with cops always killing unarmed black men? have you not been in the george floyd thread? have you not been reading about the racist cops and police culture over the years? what about how the thin blue line protects dirty cops? come on, man.

we all do our jobs every day without a thank you. we do our jobs every day without a pat on the back. and we do not expect one. you know why? because we do our job that we signed up to do. these cops here not only did not go in that building to engage the shooter, but they kept others from going in since the police would not act. they roughed up and detained parents for trying to save their kids. they did not go in when kids were calling 911 from inside the classroom begging for the dispatcher to send in the cops right away. they told feds to stay out of the building. the cops that did go in went in to find their own kids and left when they found them.  i will not praise these guys. i will not thank them. because they did not even do the bare minimum of what is expected of them. then the department and the governor lied about it. they are now admitting they made mistakes because the timeline does not add up. they failed, and then they lied about it. they should be held accountable.

You hate cops. It’s all good. I don’t understand the fuck the police. I never defended these cops or any of the other cops you mentioned. They’re pieces of shit. Do you demand perfection in any other profession? There’s garbage people in every profession. A cop should be held accountable like anyone else. But fuck the police? No. Sorry. You say fuck the teachers because every now and then one molests a minor? I feel differently and there’s nothing wrong with us disagreeing. Unfortunately like everything else in this country police have become political and I think that has a lot to do with it. If trump said fuck the police, there would be a different reaction from some folks.

where did gimme say he hates cops? I haven't seen it. I think he's like rest of us...hates bad cops. and cop culture. 

nicknyr15 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

nicknyr15 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

nicknyr15 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

has there ever been a song called "fuck the fire department"? if not, they must be doing something right. better than the police anyway.

What? The fire department don’t go after criminals. Pretty sure the gentleman who made that song had a shady lifestyle. I think only “fire” would say fuck the fire department. I get it. You hate cops. But this is a reach. 

i don't hate cops. i hate people who do not do their job when called upon to do so. i hate "good guys with guns" who do not do what they are trained to do. have you heard the summaries of the calls to 911 from the children inside that school? the kids were begging the dispatchers to send the police now.

the fire department runs into dangerous situations to save people every day. that is much more than i can say for the cops who stood by and left kids in that school with the gunman.

Ok. It’s just when someone makes donut jokes multiple times it adds to the idea that they just hate cops. Comparing firemen to cops is apples to oranges. And saying there’s no song called “fuck the fireman” is a huge reach to make your point. But yea. Fuck the police. Until you’re in trouble. Fuck these guys? Yea. But you don’t hear about every time an officer saves a life because they’re just doing their job and it’s not newsworthy. I just don’t get the fuck the police stance. Unless you’re a criminal. Then I get it. If I had to I’d choose being a fireman over a cop 100% of the time. More money, less variables, no “anti fireman” rhetoric to deal with, not dealing with the absolute worst society has to offer every day, and tons of time to do side work and make even more money. 

so are we now supposed to praise government employees for doing what they are supposed to do? doing what their job is?

you do not get the "fuck the police" stance? where have you been the last 5 years with cops always killing unarmed black men? have you not been in the george floyd thread? have you not been reading about the racist cops and police culture over the years? what about how the thin blue line protects dirty cops? come on, man.

we all do our jobs every day without a thank you. we do our jobs every day without a pat on the back. and we do not expect one. you know why? because we do our job that we signed up to do. these cops here not only did not go in that building to engage the shooter, but they kept others from going in since the police would not act. they roughed up and detained parents for trying to save their kids. they did not go in when kids were calling 911 from inside the classroom begging for the dispatcher to send in the cops right away. they told feds to stay out of the building. the cops that did go in went in to find their own kids and left when they found them.  i will not praise these guys. i will not thank them. because they did not even do the bare minimum of what is expected of them. then the department and the governor lied about it. they are now admitting they made mistakes because the timeline does not add up. they failed, and then they lied about it. they should be held accountable.

You hate cops. It’s all good. I don’t understand the fuck the police. I never defended these cops or any of the other cops you mentioned. They’re pieces of shit. Do you demand perfection in any other profession? There’s garbage people in every profession. A cop should be held accountable like anyone else. But fuck the police? No. Sorry. You say fuck the teachers because every now and then one molests a minor? I feel differently and there’s nothing wrong with us disagreeing. Unfortunately like everything else in this country police have become political and I think that has a lot to do with it. If trump said fuck the police, there would be a different reaction from some folks.

talk to some minorities. there's not many black folk up here in winnipeg, but I know the indigenous population holds the same view. 

HughFreakingDillon said:

where did gimme say he hates cops? I haven't seen it. I think he's like rest of us...hates bad cops. and cop culture. 

Donut jokes and fuck the police talk usually  come from criminals or people who hate cops for a variety of reasons.  

HughFreakingDillon said:

nicknyr15 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

nicknyr15 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

nicknyr15 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

nicknyr15 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

has there ever been a song called "fuck the fire department"? if not, they must be doing something right. better than the police anyway.

What? The fire department don’t go after criminals. Pretty sure the gentleman who made that song had a shady lifestyle. I think only “fire” would say fuck the fire department. I get it. You hate cops. But this is a reach. 

i don't hate cops. i hate people who do not do their job when called upon to do so. i hate "good guys with guns" who do not do what they are trained to do. have you heard the summaries of the calls to 911 from the children inside that school? the kids were begging the dispatchers to send the police now.

the fire department runs into dangerous situations to save people every day. that is much more than i can say for the cops who stood by and left kids in that school with the gunman.

Ok. It’s just when someone makes donut jokes multiple times it adds to the idea that they just hate cops. Comparing firemen to cops is apples to oranges. And saying there’s no song called “fuck the fireman” is a huge reach to make your point. But yea. Fuck the police. Until you’re in trouble. Fuck these guys? Yea. But you don’t hear about every time an officer saves a life because they’re just doing their job and it’s not newsworthy. I just don’t get the fuck the police stance. Unless you’re a criminal. Then I get it. If I had to I’d choose being a fireman over a cop 100% of the time. More money, less variables, no “anti fireman” rhetoric to deal with, not dealing with the absolute worst society has to offer every day, and tons of time to do side work and make even more money. 

so are we now supposed to praise government employees for doing what they are supposed to do? doing what their job is?

you do not get the "fuck the police" stance? where have you been the last 5 years with cops always killing unarmed black men? have you not been in the george floyd thread? have you not been reading about the racist cops and police culture over the years? what about how the thin blue line protects dirty cops? come on, man.

we all do our jobs every day without a thank you. we do our jobs every day without a pat on the back. and we do not expect one. you know why? because we do our job that we signed up to do. these cops here not only did not go in that building to engage the shooter, but they kept others from going in since the police would not act. they roughed up and detained parents for trying to save their kids. they did not go in when kids were calling 911 from inside the classroom begging for the dispatcher to send in the cops right away. they told feds to stay out of the building. the cops that did go in went in to find their own kids and left when they found them.  i will not praise these guys. i will not thank them. because they did not even do the bare minimum of what is expected of them. then the department and the governor lied about it. they are now admitting they made mistakes because the timeline does not add up. they failed, and then they lied about it. they should be held accountable.

You hate cops. It’s all good. I don’t understand the fuck the police. I never defended these cops or any of the other cops you mentioned. They’re pieces of shit. Do you demand perfection in any other profession? There’s garbage people in every profession. A cop should be held accountable like anyone else. But fuck the police? No. Sorry. You say fuck the teachers because every now and then one molests a minor? I feel differently and there’s nothing wrong with us disagreeing. Unfortunately like everything else in this country police have become political and I think that has a lot to do with it. If trump said fuck the police, there would be a different reaction from some folks.

talk to some minorities. there's not many black folk up here in winnipeg, but I know the indigenous population holds the same view. 

No offense but I grew up in Brooklyn around all kinds of people. I’ve heard more privilege upper class white people say fuck the police than people of color. You can’t compare Winnipeg to NYC. Two completely different perspectives. 

why would I be offended that you grew up in Brooklyn? lol 

Haha hahahah. True I don’t know why I even typed that. 

nicknyr15 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

nicknyr15 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

nicknyr15 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

nicknyr15 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

nicknyr15 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

has there ever been a song called "fuck the fire department"? if not, they must be doing something right. better than the police anyway.

What? The fire department don’t go after criminals. Pretty sure the gentleman who made that song had a shady lifestyle. I think only “fire” would say fuck the fire department. I get it. You hate cops. But this is a reach. 

i don't hate cops. i hate people who do not do their job when called upon to do so. i hate "good guys with guns" who do not do what they are trained to do. have you heard the summaries of the calls to 911 from the children inside that school? the kids were begging the dispatchers to send the police now.

the fire department runs into dangerous situations to save people every day. that is much more than i can say for the cops who stood by and left kids in that school with the gunman.

Ok. It’s just when someone makes donut jokes multiple times it adds to the idea that they just hate cops. Comparing firemen to cops is apples to oranges. And saying there’s no song called “fuck the fireman” is a huge reach to make your point. But yea. Fuck the police. Until you’re in trouble. Fuck these guys? Yea. But you don’t hear about every time an officer saves a life because they’re just doing their job and it’s not newsworthy. I just don’t get the fuck the police stance. Unless you’re a criminal. Then I get it. If I had to I’d choose being a fireman over a cop 100% of the time. More money, less variables, no “anti fireman” rhetoric to deal with, not dealing with the absolute worst society has to offer every day, and tons of time to do side work and make even more money. 

so are we now supposed to praise government employees for doing what they are supposed to do? doing what their job is?

you do not get the "fuck the police" stance? where have you been the last 5 years with cops always killing unarmed black men? have you not been in the george floyd thread? have you not been reading about the racist cops and police culture over the years? what about how the thin blue line protects dirty cops? come on, man.

we all do our jobs every day without a thank you. we do our jobs every day without a pat on the back. and we do not expect one. you know why? because we do our job that we signed up to do. these cops here not only did not go in that building to engage the shooter, but they kept others from going in since the police would not act. they roughed up and detained parents for trying to save their kids. they did not go in when kids were calling 911 from inside the classroom begging for the dispatcher to send in the cops right away. they told feds to stay out of the building. the cops that did go in went in to find their own kids and left when they found them.  i will not praise these guys. i will not thank them. because they did not even do the bare minimum of what is expected of them. then the department and the governor lied about it. they are now admitting they made mistakes because the timeline does not add up. they failed, and then they lied about it. they should be held accountable.

You hate cops. It’s all good. I don’t understand the fuck the police. I never defended these cops or any of the other cops you mentioned. They’re pieces of shit. Do you demand perfection in any other profession? There’s garbage people in every profession. A cop should be held accountable like anyone else. But fuck the police? No. Sorry. You say fuck the teachers because every now and then one molests a minor? I feel differently and there’s nothing wrong with us disagreeing. Unfortunately like everything else in this country police have become political and I think that has a lot to do with it. If trump said fuck the police, there would be a different reaction from some folks.

talk to some minorities. there's not many black folk up here in winnipeg, but I know the indigenous population holds the same view. 

No offense but I grew up in Brooklyn around all kinds of people. I’ve heard more privilege upper class white people say fuck the police than people of color. You can’t compare Winnipeg to NYC. Two completely different perspectives. 

why would I be offended that you grew up in Brooklyn? lol 

Haha hahahah. True I don’t know why I even typed that. 

lol, I know why you typed it. just funny how it came across. 

now, to your serious point, I totally agree. winnipeg and NYC aren't comparable. I'm just saying, relatively speaking, any oppressed minority, regardless of city/town/etc, is going to have a certain sentiment towards the police force. In large part, they are treated as more of a nuisance and, worse, mainly criminals, whether that classification is true or not. now, I also can understand where the police are coming from. they are only human, and are going to have their own biases based on experience, and that would be very difficult to be objective about on a case by case basis. when you see the same thing from the same group day in and day out, how could you not be affected by that? but looking at it from the non-cop perspective, it's got to be infuriating. I'm sure there are perfectly good cops that struggle with those biases all the time. But the bad ones don't struggle with it. They act on it. and THOSE are the ones that are the issue. 

it is interesting though, when you say you've heard more white people say fuck the police than people of colour. I know you said you grew up amongst all types of people, but would you say all those types were in your usual circle all the time? or just on the fringe, and you mostly hung out with whites? me? I've been exposed to indigenous, but I mostly hung out with white people. there just weren't many minorities in my community (middle class, not upper by any stretch). my two best friends in high school were half indigenous, but they weren't "in the community" if you know what I mean. they were white people with darker complexions, culturally speaking.