Police Reform (Please Don’t Call It Defund)

Halifax2TheMax · May 2022

They should also make them wear a white cowboy hat and a badge along with the pistol strapped to their hip. Those things make you tough.

OnWis97 · May 2022

Amazing…a solution from politicians that get a lot of NRA a money results in the need to purchase a lot of guns.

Cropduster-80 · May 2022

OnWis97 said:

Amazing…a solution from politicians that get a lot of NRA a money results in the need to purchase a lot of guns.

its evil genius type stuff.

Once you own a gun you are less likely to give it up. I’m not aware of many ex gun owners

getting people who would not normally own a gun to own one is pretty calculating. It’s not about safety at all, it’s about guns

Parksy · May 2022

The 'cops' in Uvalde are cowards... plain and simple. That's not to say all cops are. This is honestly the first I've ever heard of a situation like this where the cops don't engage immediately.

I will say this.. and this will something to keep an eye on: The problem with cops and the thin blue line, or the blue brotherhood, or the blue lives matter crowd is that they all protect themselves. It's an unwritten rule that cops help cops and that cops don't rat other cops out. That's just wrong. Plain and simple wrong. There are a lot of excellent cops out there and they need credit for not only being brave but for putting up with a lot of shit and stress. But this is an opportunity to show just how brave you are.

Police across your country need to condemn this and call for all of their badges.. now. Don't let it be the people protesting outside the station... call out your own. Don't ignore social media... don't ignore the news. Call them out. And do it now. Their negligence, cowardice, and laziness cost children's lives.

The personal safety of an officer takes precedence in ALMOST every scenario .. EXCEPT THIS ONE. Active shooter = go... no matter what. To me that's the MOST important reason you cops have a gun.

Cropduster-80 · May 2022

^ cops as individuals can be fine. Cops as an institution are rotten. Good cops in an awful institution are awful by association. It’s hard to be a good cop swimming upstream in that river of sewage

Gern Blansten · May 2022

Parksy said:

The 'cops' in Uvalde are cowards... plain and simple. That's not to say all cops are. This is honestly the first I've ever heard of a situation like this where the cops don't engage immediately.

I will say this.. and this will something to keep an eye on: The problem with cops and the thin blue line, or the blue brotherhood, or the blue lives matter crowd is that they all protect themselves. It's an unwritten rule that cops help cops and that cops don't rat other cops out. That's just wrong. Plain and simple wrong. There are a lot of excellent cops out there and they need credit for not only being brave but for putting up with a lot of shit and stress. But this is an opportunity to show just how brave you are.

Police across your country need to condemn this and call for all of their badges.. now. Don't let it be the people protesting outside the station... call out your own. Don't ignore social media... don't ignore the news. Call them out. And do it now. Their negligence, cowardice, and laziness cost children's lives.

The personal safety of an officer takes precedence in ALMOST every scenario .. EXCEPT THIS ONE. Active shooter = go... no matter what. To me that's the MOST important reason you cops have a gun.

We don't know the whole story yet. There were several officers that entered the school soon after the shooting started. All of the facts are not in a usable format yet. A lot of people are focusing on video of officers keeping parents back....there were tons of officers there...not just those few.

Gern Blansten · May 2022

https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/26/us/uvalde-texas-elementary-school-shooting-thursday/index.html

Officers arrived at the school at 11:44 a.m., but when they went to confront the gunman, they received fire and took cover, Escalon said. Three law enforcement officers went in the same door the shooter used to enter the school and four went through another school entrance, DPS spokesperson Chris Olivarez told CNN's Wolf Blitzer.

Officers called for more resources and personnel, evacuated students and teachers in other parts of the school, and at some point entered "negotiations" with the suspect, Escalon said. After about an hour, a US Border Patrol tactical team came to the classroom, forced entry and fatally shot the suspect, he said.

Olivarez said officers saved lives despite waiting before physically confronting the suspect.

"At that point, they had the suspect contained inside the classroom," he told CNN. "If those officers weren't there, if they did not maintain their presence, there is a good chance that gunman could have made it to other classrooms and commit more killings."

The news conference underscored the confusion and disorganization of the police response and failed to answer questions as to how the gunman was able to remain inside the classroom for such a long time.

Uvalde Police Chief Daniel Rodriguez issued a statement Thursday defending his officers' response to the shooting. Two responding officers were shot by the suspect but are expected to survive.

"It is important for our community to know that our officers responded within minutes" alongside school resource officers, he said.

Olivarez said Thursday morning the suspect had barricaded himself in the classroom, which was attached to an adjoining room. All of the 21 killed and 17 injured were inside those classrooms, officials have said.

"We're still trying to establish if that classroom was locked, and if it was locked, was there some type of barricade, was there some type of locking mechanism that did not allow those officers to make entry," he said.

Since the Columbine school shooting of 1999, emergency responder protocol in such situations is to end the threat as quickly as possible because fatalities occur in seconds to minutes.

"It's almost incomprehensible for me to come up with a rational explanation as to why you would wait 30 minutes to an hour to get in there," Andrew McCabe, CNN senior law enforcement analyst, said before the news conference. "The door breaching, if it's just a locked door, that doesn't take 30 minutes to get into."

HughFreakingDillon · May 2022

Gern Blansten said:

Parksy said:

The 'cops' in Uvalde are cowards... plain and simple. That's not to say all cops are. This is honestly the first I've ever heard of a situation like this where the cops don't engage immediately.

I will say this.. and this will something to keep an eye on: The problem with cops and the thin blue line, or the blue brotherhood, or the blue lives matter crowd is that they all protect themselves. It's an unwritten rule that cops help cops and that cops don't rat other cops out. That's just wrong. Plain and simple wrong. There are a lot of excellent cops out there and they need credit for not only being brave but for putting up with a lot of shit and stress. But this is an opportunity to show just how brave you are.

Police across your country need to condemn this and call for all of their badges.. now. Don't let it be the people protesting outside the station... call out your own. Don't ignore social media... don't ignore the news. Call them out. And do it now. Their negligence, cowardice, and laziness cost children's lives.

The personal safety of an officer takes precedence in ALMOST every scenario .. EXCEPT THIS ONE. Active shooter = go... no matter what. To me that's the MOST important reason you cops have a gun.

We don't know the whole story yet. There were several officers that entered the school soon after the shooting started. All of the facts are not in a usable format yet. A lot of people are focusing on video of officers keeping parents back....there were tons of officers there...not just those few.

you're right. I'll reserve further outrage for more information. But I will say...it sounds like there is a cover up happening with changing of stories and facts etc. Seems like massive damage control.

Gern Blansten · May 2022

HughFreakingDillon said:

Gern Blansten said:

Parksy said:

The 'cops' in Uvalde are cowards... plain and simple. That's not to say all cops are. This is honestly the first I've ever heard of a situation like this where the cops don't engage immediately.

I will say this.. and this will something to keep an eye on: The problem with cops and the thin blue line, or the blue brotherhood, or the blue lives matter crowd is that they all protect themselves. It's an unwritten rule that cops help cops and that cops don't rat other cops out. That's just wrong. Plain and simple wrong. There are a lot of excellent cops out there and they need credit for not only being brave but for putting up with a lot of shit and stress. But this is an opportunity to show just how brave you are.

Police across your country need to condemn this and call for all of their badges.. now. Don't let it be the people protesting outside the station... call out your own. Don't ignore social media... don't ignore the news. Call them out. And do it now. Their negligence, cowardice, and laziness cost children's lives.

The personal safety of an officer takes precedence in ALMOST every scenario .. EXCEPT THIS ONE. Active shooter = go... no matter what. To me that's the MOST important reason you cops have a gun.

We don't know the whole story yet. There were several officers that entered the school soon after the shooting started. All of the facts are not in a usable format yet. A lot of people are focusing on video of officers keeping parents back....there were tons of officers there...not just those few.

you're right. I'll reserve further outrage for more information. But I will say...it sounds like there is a cover up happening with changing of stories and facts etc. Seems like massive damage control.

It's a tough spot. And we just can't blame the police for not being experienced with those situations. It's not smart to go running into a situation (especially a school with it's maze of rooms/hallways/stairways/restrooms, etc) without having some idea as to what is going on.

If the CNN article is right it seems to me that they did exactly what they were supposed to do.

Hobbes · May 2022

HughFreakingDillon said:

Gern Blansten said:

Parksy said:

The 'cops' in Uvalde are cowards... plain and simple. That's not to say all cops are. This is honestly the first I've ever heard of a situation like this where the cops don't engage immediately.

I will say this.. and this will something to keep an eye on: The problem with cops and the thin blue line, or the blue brotherhood, or the blue lives matter crowd is that they all protect themselves. It's an unwritten rule that cops help cops and that cops don't rat other cops out. That's just wrong. Plain and simple wrong. There are a lot of excellent cops out there and they need credit for not only being brave but for putting up with a lot of shit and stress. But this is an opportunity to show just how brave you are.

Police across your country need to condemn this and call for all of their badges.. now. Don't let it be the people protesting outside the station... call out your own. Don't ignore social media... don't ignore the news. Call them out. And do it now. Their negligence, cowardice, and laziness cost children's lives.

The personal safety of an officer takes precedence in ALMOST every scenario .. EXCEPT THIS ONE. Active shooter = go... no matter what. To me that's the MOST important reason you cops have a gun.

We don't know the whole story yet. There were several officers that entered the school soon after the shooting started. All of the facts are not in a usable format yet. A lot of people are focusing on video of officers keeping parents back....there were tons of officers there...not just those few.

you're right. I'll reserve further outrage for more information. But I will say...it sounds like there is a cover up happening with changing of stories and facts etc. Seems like massive damage control.

I wonder how the police would treat a suspect who changed their story this many times. Hmm…

Cropduster-80 · May 2022

Hobbes said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Gern Blansten said:

Parksy said:

The 'cops' in Uvalde are cowards... plain and simple. That's not to say all cops are. This is honestly the first I've ever heard of a situation like this where the cops don't engage immediately.

I will say this.. and this will something to keep an eye on: The problem with cops and the thin blue line, or the blue brotherhood, or the blue lives matter crowd is that they all protect themselves. It's an unwritten rule that cops help cops and that cops don't rat other cops out. That's just wrong. Plain and simple wrong. There are a lot of excellent cops out there and they need credit for not only being brave but for putting up with a lot of shit and stress. But this is an opportunity to show just how brave you are.

Police across your country need to condemn this and call for all of their badges.. now. Don't let it be the people protesting outside the station... call out your own. Don't ignore social media... don't ignore the news. Call them out. And do it now. Their negligence, cowardice, and laziness cost children's lives.

The personal safety of an officer takes precedence in ALMOST every scenario .. EXCEPT THIS ONE. Active shooter = go... no matter what. To me that's the MOST important reason you cops have a gun.

We don't know the whole story yet. There were several officers that entered the school soon after the shooting started. All of the facts are not in a usable format yet. A lot of people are focusing on video of officers keeping parents back....there were tons of officers there...not just those few.

you're right. I'll reserve further outrage for more information. But I will say...it sounds like there is a cover up happening with changing of stories and facts etc. Seems like massive damage control.

I wonder how the police would treat a suspect who changed their story this many times. Hmm…

Why is it that once they settle on what the story even is, then that’s the story that’s the official one?

Eyewitnesses are unreliable etc. no matter what happens a final account will go to great lengths to paint them in the most favourable light possible. That’s not to say it won’t note problems, but those are just the problems they can’t reasonably explain away

it’s not like the police don’t already have a reputation for protecting each other. Why would this or anything else be different?

HughFreakingDillon · May 2022

Hobbes said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Gern Blansten said:

Parksy said:

The 'cops' in Uvalde are cowards... plain and simple. That's not to say all cops are. This is honestly the first I've ever heard of a situation like this where the cops don't engage immediately.

I will say this.. and this will something to keep an eye on: The problem with cops and the thin blue line, or the blue brotherhood, or the blue lives matter crowd is that they all protect themselves. It's an unwritten rule that cops help cops and that cops don't rat other cops out. That's just wrong. Plain and simple wrong. There are a lot of excellent cops out there and they need credit for not only being brave but for putting up with a lot of shit and stress. But this is an opportunity to show just how brave you are.

Police across your country need to condemn this and call for all of their badges.. now. Don't let it be the people protesting outside the station... call out your own. Don't ignore social media... don't ignore the news. Call them out. And do it now. Their negligence, cowardice, and laziness cost children's lives.

The personal safety of an officer takes precedence in ALMOST every scenario .. EXCEPT THIS ONE. Active shooter = go... no matter what. To me that's the MOST important reason you cops have a gun.

We don't know the whole story yet. There were several officers that entered the school soon after the shooting started. All of the facts are not in a usable format yet. A lot of people are focusing on video of officers keeping parents back....there were tons of officers there...not just those few.

you're right. I'll reserve further outrage for more information. But I will say...it sounds like there is a cover up happening with changing of stories and facts etc. Seems like massive damage control.

I wonder how the police would treat a suspect who changed their story this many times. Hmm…

I haven't read all the changes/amendments. All I've read is that it has changed. However, I will say that in chaotic situations like this, often there's a lot of misinformation purple-monkey-dishwasher type shit floating around until the dust settles.

Cropduster-80 · May 2022

HughFreakingDillon said:

Hobbes said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Gern Blansten said:

Parksy said:

The 'cops' in Uvalde are cowards... plain and simple. That's not to say all cops are. This is honestly the first I've ever heard of a situation like this where the cops don't engage immediately.

I will say this.. and this will something to keep an eye on: The problem with cops and the thin blue line, or the blue brotherhood, or the blue lives matter crowd is that they all protect themselves. It's an unwritten rule that cops help cops and that cops don't rat other cops out. That's just wrong. Plain and simple wrong. There are a lot of excellent cops out there and they need credit for not only being brave but for putting up with a lot of shit and stress. But this is an opportunity to show just how brave you are.

Police across your country need to condemn this and call for all of their badges.. now. Don't let it be the people protesting outside the station... call out your own. Don't ignore social media... don't ignore the news. Call them out. And do it now. Their negligence, cowardice, and laziness cost children's lives.

The personal safety of an officer takes precedence in ALMOST every scenario .. EXCEPT THIS ONE. Active shooter = go... no matter what. To me that's the MOST important reason you cops have a gun.

We don't know the whole story yet. There were several officers that entered the school soon after the shooting started. All of the facts are not in a usable format yet. A lot of people are focusing on video of officers keeping parents back....there were tons of officers there...not just those few.

you're right. I'll reserve further outrage for more information. But I will say...it sounds like there is a cover up happening with changing of stories and facts etc. Seems like massive damage control.

I wonder how the police would treat a suspect who changed their story this many times. Hmm…

I haven't read all the changes/amendments. All I've read is that it has changed. However, I will say that in chaotic situations like this, often there's a lot of misinformation purple-monkey-dishwasher type shit floating around until the dust settles.

Police engaging before he entered to police didn’t engage until after he entered is a big change.

you either shot at him outside or you didn’t. Why that’s hard to figure out is beyond me unless you are trying to make the police response look better than it was only to revise it when that story doesn’t stick

Gern Blansten · May 2022

HughFreakingDillon said:

Hobbes said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Gern Blansten said:

Parksy said:

The 'cops' in Uvalde are cowards... plain and simple. That's not to say all cops are. This is honestly the first I've ever heard of a situation like this where the cops don't engage immediately.

I will say this.. and this will something to keep an eye on: The problem with cops and the thin blue line, or the blue brotherhood, or the blue lives matter crowd is that they all protect themselves. It's an unwritten rule that cops help cops and that cops don't rat other cops out. That's just wrong. Plain and simple wrong. There are a lot of excellent cops out there and they need credit for not only being brave but for putting up with a lot of shit and stress. But this is an opportunity to show just how brave you are.

Police across your country need to condemn this and call for all of their badges.. now. Don't let it be the people protesting outside the station... call out your own. Don't ignore social media... don't ignore the news. Call them out. And do it now. Their negligence, cowardice, and laziness cost children's lives.

The personal safety of an officer takes precedence in ALMOST every scenario .. EXCEPT THIS ONE. Active shooter = go... no matter what. To me that's the MOST important reason you cops have a gun.

We don't know the whole story yet. There were several officers that entered the school soon after the shooting started. All of the facts are not in a usable format yet. A lot of people are focusing on video of officers keeping parents back....there were tons of officers there...not just those few.

you're right. I'll reserve further outrage for more information. But I will say...it sounds like there is a cover up happening with changing of stories and facts etc. Seems like massive damage control.

I wonder how the police would treat a suspect who changed their story this many times. Hmm…

I haven't read all the changes/amendments. All I've read is that it has changed. However, I will say that in chaotic situations like this, often there's a lot of misinformation purple-monkey-dishwasher type shit floating around until the dust settles.

yeah if the first reports are shit than really nothing has changed....

I just heard a report that the majority of shots came as soon as he entered the building. People are acting like the cops stood around outside while he walked freely shooting people. That doesn't seem to be the case. They entered the building pretty quickly and isolated him. But yeah....nothing solid yet

tempo_n_groove · May 2022

Parksy said:

The 'cops' in Uvalde are cowards... plain and simple. That's not to say all cops are. This is honestly the first I've ever heard of a situation like this where the cops don't engage immediately.

I will say this.. and this will something to keep an eye on: The problem with cops and the thin blue line, or the blue brotherhood, or the blue lives matter crowd is that they all protect themselves. It's an unwritten rule that cops help cops and that cops don't rat other cops out. That's just wrong. Plain and simple wrong. There are a lot of excellent cops out there and they need credit for not only being brave but for putting up with a lot of shit and stress. But this is an opportunity to show just how brave you are.

Police across your country need to condemn this and call for all of their badges.. now. Don't let it be the people protesting outside the station... call out your own. Don't ignore social media... don't ignore the news. Call them out. And do it now. Their negligence, cowardice, and laziness cost children's lives.

The personal safety of an officer takes precedence in ALMOST every scenario .. EXCEPT THIS ONE. Active shooter = go... no matter what. To me that's the MOST important reason you cops have a gun.

I believe Congress has asked for a thorough FBI investigation. I would like to see them get it.

HughFreakingDillon · May 2022

Cropduster-80 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Hobbes said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Gern Blansten said:

Parksy said:

The 'cops' in Uvalde are cowards... plain and simple. That's not to say all cops are. This is honestly the first I've ever heard of a situation like this where the cops don't engage immediately.

I will say this.. and this will something to keep an eye on: The problem with cops and the thin blue line, or the blue brotherhood, or the blue lives matter crowd is that they all protect themselves. It's an unwritten rule that cops help cops and that cops don't rat other cops out. That's just wrong. Plain and simple wrong. There are a lot of excellent cops out there and they need credit for not only being brave but for putting up with a lot of shit and stress. But this is an opportunity to show just how brave you are.

Police across your country need to condemn this and call for all of their badges.. now. Don't let it be the people protesting outside the station... call out your own. Don't ignore social media... don't ignore the news. Call them out. And do it now. Their negligence, cowardice, and laziness cost children's lives.

The personal safety of an officer takes precedence in ALMOST every scenario .. EXCEPT THIS ONE. Active shooter = go... no matter what. To me that's the MOST important reason you cops have a gun.

We don't know the whole story yet. There were several officers that entered the school soon after the shooting started. All of the facts are not in a usable format yet. A lot of people are focusing on video of officers keeping parents back....there were tons of officers there...not just those few.

you're right. I'll reserve further outrage for more information. But I will say...it sounds like there is a cover up happening with changing of stories and facts etc. Seems like massive damage control.

I wonder how the police would treat a suspect who changed their story this many times. Hmm…

I haven't read all the changes/amendments. All I've read is that it has changed. However, I will say that in chaotic situations like this, often there's a lot of misinformation purple-monkey-dishwasher type shit floating around until the dust settles.

Police engaging before he entered to police didn’t engage until after he entered is a big change.

you either shot at him outside or you didn’t. Why that’s hard to figure out is beyond me unless you are trying to make the police response look better than it was only to revise it when that story doesn’t stick

like I said, I haven't read all the story changes, but I thought it was maintained from the get go that they engaged him outside, but that they didn't follow him in?

Gern Blansten · May 2022

Parksy said:

The 'cops' in Uvalde are cowards... plain and simple. That's not to say all cops are. This is honestly the first I've ever heard of a situation like this where the cops don't engage immediately.

I will say this.. and this will something to keep an eye on: The problem with cops and the thin blue line, or the blue brotherhood, or the blue lives matter crowd is that they all protect themselves. It's an unwritten rule that cops help cops and that cops don't rat other cops out. That's just wrong. Plain and simple wrong. There are a lot of excellent cops out there and they need credit for not only being brave but for putting up with a lot of shit and stress. But this is an opportunity to show just how brave you are.

Police across your country need to condemn this and call for all of their badges.. now. Don't let it be the people protesting outside the station... call out your own. Don't ignore social media... don't ignore the news. Call them out. And do it now. Their negligence, cowardice, and laziness cost children's lives.

The personal safety of an officer takes precedence in ALMOST every scenario .. EXCEPT THIS ONE. Active shooter = go... no matter what. To me that's the MOST important reason you cops have a gun.

I can't imagine the training that would need to take place for these situations. Remember that the majority of work these cops did was likely traffic stops and pulling over drunk drivers. This is an extremely unusual situation.

Parksy · May 2022

Shooter arrived at 11:40AM and was shot dead at 12:45PM. That's over an hour. There is no negotiation. There is no assessment. He has already shot and killed people.

If this was a hostage situation... that's different. This was an active shooter situation. These cops were not trained to do their jobs properly.

School tweeted about an active shooter at like 1:17PM. Everything about this stinks.

An official is already on record as saying that there was a worry cops would be shot. Well no shit sherlock.

Parksy · May 2022

Gern Blansten said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Gern Blansten said:

Parksy said:

The 'cops' in Uvalde are cowards... plain and simple. That's not to say all cops are. This is honestly the first I've ever heard of a situation like this where the cops don't engage immediately.

I will say this.. and this will something to keep an eye on: The problem with cops and the thin blue line, or the blue brotherhood, or the blue lives matter crowd is that they all protect themselves. It's an unwritten rule that cops help cops and that cops don't rat other cops out. That's just wrong. Plain and simple wrong. There are a lot of excellent cops out there and they need credit for not only being brave but for putting up with a lot of shit and stress. But this is an opportunity to show just how brave you are.

Police across your country need to condemn this and call for all of their badges.. now. Don't let it be the people protesting outside the station... call out your own. Don't ignore social media... don't ignore the news. Call them out. And do it now. Their negligence, cowardice, and laziness cost children's lives.

The personal safety of an officer takes precedence in ALMOST every scenario .. EXCEPT THIS ONE. Active shooter = go... no matter what. To me that's the MOST important reason you cops have a gun.

We don't know the whole story yet. There were several officers that entered the school soon after the shooting started. All of the facts are not in a usable format yet. A lot of people are focusing on video of officers keeping parents back....there were tons of officers there...not just those few.

you're right. I'll reserve further outrage for more information. But I will say...it sounds like there is a cover up happening with changing of stories and facts etc. Seems like massive damage control.

It's a tough spot. And we just can't blame the police for not being experienced with those situations. It's not smart to go running into a situation (especially a school with it's maze of rooms/hallways/stairways/restrooms, etc) without having some idea as to what is going on.

If the CNN article is right it seems to me that they did exactly what they were supposed to do.

Sorry to say this.. .cause you're a beauty... but it's only a 'tough spot' for us civilians. Not police.

This is what they're trained for. I have done this training with cops. At a school. In Canada. With mock drills... mock students. Mock gunman. This is the book on these situations. Active shooter... you go in, you find, you kill.

"How can you tell who the gunman is?" They train for this.
"What about multiple shooters?" They train for this.
"Couldn't they mistake a student for the shooter?" They train for this.

Gern Blansten · May 2022

Parksy said:

Shooter arrived at 11:40AM and was shot dead at 12:45PM. That's over an hour. There is no negotiation. There is no assessment. He has already shot and killed people.

If this was a hostage situation... that's different. This was an active shooter situation. These cops were not trained to do their jobs properly.

School tweeted about an active shooter at like 1:17PM. Everything about this stinks.

An official is already on record as saying that there was a worry cops would be shot. Well no shit sherlock.

so you are ignoring the CNN article I posted? Cops entered the school at 1144 and isolated him

Police Reform (Please Don’t Call It Defund)

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