Eating Less Meat Helps Protect the Planet From Climate Change

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  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,473
    i've heard the beyond burgers are awesome. still haven't had one, but i've never heard one complaint about them. the amount of sodium is a bit alarming though. 
    By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.




  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    edited August 2019
    What is it anyway with these phony meatless meat products? I think it's kind of sad, maybe even pathetic, that we in the west are so enamored with our burgers that we have to make Fake Burgers.  I'll admit I've eaten plenty of beef, turkey and chicken burgers in my life, but it's not something I do very often any more.  I mean, think about it.  We start with some ground up meat that unless we've ground it ourselves, we have no idea what floor sweeping ended up in the meat.  And then, unless we have organic, non-GMO bread (and even a lot of that is questionable unless we make the bread ourselves), we slap that artery hardening fried ground dead animal between two precisely sliced layers of carb laden flour product, add some wimpy nearly nutrient-free iceberg lettuce, squeeze out a dab of tomato catsup that has zero nutritional benefits, maybe add a slice of cheese made from same dead animal's baby's milk, and call that a "meal"?

    And then we go vegetarian and try to imitate that?  We are such a strange species!
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,473
    brianlux said:
    What is it anyway with these phony meatless meat products? I think it's kind of sad, maybe even pathetic, that we in the west are so enamored with our burgers that we have to make Fake Burgers.  I'll admit I've eaten plenty of beef, turkey and chicken burgers in my life, but it's not something I do very often any more.  I mean, think about it.  We start with some ground up meat that unless we've ground it ourselves, we have no idea what floor sweeping ended up in the meat.  And then, unless we have organic, non-GMO bread (and even a lot of that is questionable unless we make the bread ourselves), we slap that artery hardening fried ground dead animal between two precisely sliced layers of carb laden flour product, add some wimpy nearly nutrient-free iceberg lettuce, squeeze out a dab of tomato catsup that has zero nutritional benefits, maybe add a slice of cheese made from same dead animal's baby's milk, and call that a "meal"?

    And then we go vegetarian and try to imitate that?  We are such a strange species!
    because at some point in our evolution eating went from survival to enjoyment. in the last century I'm guessing. 
    By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.




  • oftenreading
    oftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    HughFreakingDillon said:
    i've heard the beyond burgers are awesome. still haven't had one, but i've never heard one complaint about them. the amount of sodium is a bit alarming though. 

    Yes, and I hope they look at reducing it.

    Another thing to bear in mind is that the comparison was made with beef with nothing added to it, which isn't the way most burgers are served. Restaurants will always add salt, and most home cooks do as well. 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    HughFreakingDillon said:
    brianlux said:
    What is it anyway with these phony meatless meat products? I think it's kind of sad, maybe even pathetic, that we in the west are so enamored with our burgers that we have to make Fake Burgers.  I'll admit I've eaten plenty of beef, turkey and chicken burgers in my life, but it's not something I do very often any more.  I mean, think about it.  We start with some ground up meat that unless we've ground it ourselves, we have no idea what floor sweeping ended up in the meat.  And then, unless we have organic, non-GMO bread (and even a lot of that is questionable unless we make the bread ourselves), we slap that artery hardening fried ground dead animal between two precisely sliced layers of carb laden flour product, add some wimpy nearly nutrient-free iceberg lettuce, squeeze out a dab of tomato catsup that has zero nutritional benefits, maybe add a slice of cheese made from same dead animal's baby's milk, and call that a "meal"?

    And then we go vegetarian and try to imitate that?  We are such a strange species!
    because at some point in our evolution eating went from survival to enjoyment. in the last century I'm guessing. 
    Good point!
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 9,825
    edited August 2019
    mcgruff10 said:
    benjs said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    No way I could be vegan, I would miss cheese too much.  
    My brother's a realistic vegan and will treat himself every now and then to something he misses. Cheese (which was once a favourite with as much passion as what you're describing) isn't even on that list for him anymore. I know he's not making it up because there are other things I can hand him that he absolutely will cheat with, no questions asked. 
    I never understood why cheese is on the vegan no no list since the animal isn't being killed.  
    Isn’t that the difference between vegan and vegetarian? 
    And when did vegan become more popular than vegetarian? I remember growing up rarely hearing about vegan, now it’s on every menu.
    I don’t necessarily agree with all the points for being vegetarian (although I know as a country we should cut back on our meat intake) but at least I understand the purpose. But vegan doesn’t make sense to me, I don’t understand the purpose of avoiding all animal products, what’s the harm in milk and cheese and things that don’t harm animals like you said. (Yes, I realize not every dairy farm treats animals well, but I’m sure there’s local ones that do.) And that was a real question, not just a comment. Would be interested why someone thinks a balanced diet that includes dairy is not good.
    It’s also a pet peeve when people claim to be vegan, but then make an exception for their latte at Starbucks. Just admit you’re not vegan then! It’s okay. 
    Post edited by mace1229 on
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    mace1229 said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    benjs said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    No way I could be vegan, I would miss cheese too much.  
    My brother's a realistic vegan and will treat himself every now and then to something he misses. Cheese (which was once a favourite with as much passion as what you're describing) isn't even on that list for him anymore. I know he's not making it up because there are other things I can hand him that he absolutely will cheat with, no questions asked. 
    I never understood why cheese is on the vegan no no list since the animal isn't being killed.  
    Isn’t that the difference between vegan and vegetarian? 
    And when did vegan become more popular than vegetarian? I remember growing up rarely hearing about vegan, now it’s on every menu.
    I don’t necessarily agree with all the points for being vegetarian (although I know as a country we should cut back on our meat intake) but at least I understand the purpose. But vegan doesn’t make sense to me, I don’t understand the purpose of avoiding all animal products, what’s the harm in milk and cheese and things that don’t harm animals like you said. (Yes, I realize not every dairy farm treats animals well, but I’m sure there’s local ones that do.) And that was a real question, not just a comment. Would be interested why someone thinks a balanced diet that includes dairy is not good.
    It’s also a pet peeve when people claim to be vegan, but then make an exception for their latte at Starbucks. Just admit you’re not vegan then! It’s okay. 
    I was curious about that too, Mace, so I poked around and found this article.  The argument seems to me, someone who admittedly eats dairy, eggs, and small amounts of meat, to present some thoughts that are pretty hard to argue.  I thinks it's worth looking at.


    As for vegans and lattes at Starbucks, is that something you've actually witnessed?  I have not.

    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    Fact:  Much of the beef produced in South America comes from logged or burned rain forest.
    Fact:  Much of the beef consumed in the U.S. and elsewhere comes from South America.
    Fact:  Many of the fires burning in the Amazon are a result of the above.

    We would be smart to cut back on the beef, especially when we don't know where it comes from.
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 9,825
    brianlux said:
    Fact:  Much of the beef produced in South America comes from logged or burned rain forest.
    Fact:  Much of the beef consumed in the U.S. and elsewhere comes from South America.
    Fact:  Many of the fires burning in the Amazon are a result of the above.

    We would be smart to cut back on the beef, especially when we don't know where it comes from.
    Maybe not that exact example with Starbucks, but just last week bbq was brought it at work and a I saw a teacher who said she was vegetarian eating it all. Turns out she just doesn’t eat red meat, but calls herself vegetarian.
    I do see examples like that a lot, pretty sure I’ve seen vegans eat pizza with cheese and justify why that doesn’t count. Probably more with vegetarians than vegans though, I’ve met him plenty of vegetarians who still eat chicken and fish-all the meat they actually like. It isn’t a big deal, it’s just funny to me and makes me laugh a little inside. I never say anything to them.
    Thanks for sharing that link, I’ll have to read it later.
  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,473
    mace1229 said:
    brianlux said:
    Fact:  Much of the beef produced in South America comes from logged or burned rain forest.
    Fact:  Much of the beef consumed in the U.S. and elsewhere comes from South America.
    Fact:  Many of the fires burning in the Amazon are a result of the above.

    We would be smart to cut back on the beef, especially when we don't know where it comes from.
    Maybe not that exact example with Starbucks, but just last week bbq was brought it at work and a I saw a teacher who said she was vegetarian eating it all. Turns out she just doesn’t eat red meat, but calls herself vegetarian.
    I do see examples like that a lot, pretty sure I’ve seen vegans eat pizza with cheese and justify why that doesn’t count. Probably more with vegetarians than vegans though, I’ve met him plenty of vegetarians who still eat chicken and fish-all the meat they actually like. It isn’t a big deal, it’s just funny to me and makes me laugh a little inside. I never say anything to them.
    Thanks for sharing that link, I’ll have to read it later.
    there are many different types of vegetarians, some that don't eat meat, some that don't eat red meat, etc, so it's most likely that they are just saying "vegetarian" instead of the full term to avoid the explanation and ensuing conversation and potential debate that would surely follow. 
    By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.




  • rustneversleeps
    rustneversleeps The Motel of Lost Companions Posts: 2,209
    beyond burgers.  hhaha
  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 44,370
    mace1229 said:
    brianlux said:
    Fact:  Much of the beef produced in South America comes from logged or burned rain forest.
    Fact:  Much of the beef consumed in the U.S. and elsewhere comes from South America.
    Fact:  Many of the fires burning in the Amazon are a result of the above.

    We would be smart to cut back on the beef, especially when we don't know where it comes from.
    Maybe not that exact example with Starbucks, but just last week bbq was brought it at work and a I saw a teacher who said she was vegetarian eating it all. Turns out she just doesn’t eat red meat, but calls herself vegetarian.
    I do see examples like that a lot, pretty sure I’ve seen vegans eat pizza with cheese and justify why that doesn’t count. Probably more with vegetarians than vegans though, I’ve met him plenty of vegetarians who still eat chicken and fish-all the meat they actually like. It isn’t a big deal, it’s just funny to me and makes me laugh a little inside. I never say anything to them.
    Thanks for sharing that link, I’ll have to read it later.
    the fish eaters would be pescatarians .....
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  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    mace1229 said:
    brianlux said:
    Fact:  Much of the beef produced in South America comes from logged or burned rain forest.
    Fact:  Much of the beef consumed in the U.S. and elsewhere comes from South America.
    Fact:  Many of the fires burning in the Amazon are a result of the above.

    We would be smart to cut back on the beef, especially when we don't know where it comes from.
    Maybe not that exact example with Starbucks, but just last week bbq was brought it at work and a I saw a teacher who said she was vegetarian eating it all. Turns out she just doesn’t eat red meat, but calls herself vegetarian.
    I do see examples like that a lot, pretty sure I’ve seen vegans eat pizza with cheese and justify why that doesn’t count. Probably more with vegetarians than vegans though, I’ve met him plenty of vegetarians who still eat chicken and fish-all the meat they actually like. It isn’t a big deal, it’s just funny to me and makes me laugh a little inside. I never say anything to them.
    Thanks for sharing that link, I’ll have to read it later.
    Kind of like people who listen to Nickleback calling themselves "music fans".

    Haha, sorry, couldn't resist.  :lol:
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,473
    brianlux said:
    mace1229 said:
    brianlux said:
    Fact:  Much of the beef produced in South America comes from logged or burned rain forest.
    Fact:  Much of the beef consumed in the U.S. and elsewhere comes from South America.
    Fact:  Many of the fires burning in the Amazon are a result of the above.

    We would be smart to cut back on the beef, especially when we don't know where it comes from.
    Maybe not that exact example with Starbucks, but just last week bbq was brought it at work and a I saw a teacher who said she was vegetarian eating it all. Turns out she just doesn’t eat red meat, but calls herself vegetarian.
    I do see examples like that a lot, pretty sure I’ve seen vegans eat pizza with cheese and justify why that doesn’t count. Probably more with vegetarians than vegans though, I’ve met him plenty of vegetarians who still eat chicken and fish-all the meat they actually like. It isn’t a big deal, it’s just funny to me and makes me laugh a little inside. I never say anything to them.
    Thanks for sharing that link, I’ll have to read it later.
    Kind of like people who listen to Nickleback calling themselves "music fans".

    Haha, sorry, couldn't resist.  :lol:
    and to think I used to think Bryan Adams was our worst export. Now we have nicklesack and bieber. 
    By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.




  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 9,825
    HughFreakingDillon said:
    mace1229 said:
    brianlux said:
    Fact:  Much of the beef produced in South America comes from logged or burned rain forest.
    Fact:  Much of the beef consumed in the U.S. and elsewhere comes from South America.
    Fact:  Many of the fires burning in the Amazon are a result of the above.

    We would be smart to cut back on the beef, especially when we don't know where it comes from.
    Maybe not that exact example with Starbucks, but just last week bbq was brought it at work and a I saw a teacher who said she was vegetarian eating it all. Turns out she just doesn’t eat red meat, but calls herself vegetarian.
    I do see examples like that a lot, pretty sure I’ve seen vegans eat pizza with cheese and justify why that doesn’t count. Probably more with vegetarians than vegans though, I’ve met him plenty of vegetarians who still eat chicken and fish-all the meat they actually like. It isn’t a big deal, it’s just funny to me and makes me laugh a little inside. I never say anything to them.
    Thanks for sharing that link, I’ll have to read it later.
    there are many different types of vegetarians, some that don't eat meat, some that don't eat red meat, etc, so it's most likely that they are just saying "vegetarian" instead of the full term to avoid the explanation and ensuing conversation and potential debate that would surely follow. 
    I was curious so I Googled it. According to wikipedia, all forms of "true" vegetarians do not eat any meat. The other forms may exclude eggs, dairy products, etc and be a cross between a vegan and vegetarian. Forms of vegetarians that do include meat were called semi or partial-vegetarian. Maybe others use that term more loosely than I do, but when someone says they are vegetarian to me that means they do not eat any meat.  I also know people who don't eat red meat and don't claim to be a vegetarian, they just say "I don't eat red meat."
    I believe I would be in the majority that I find it odd seeing someone eat chicken who claims to be a vegetarian, but maybe not. To mean that seems more confusing. 
  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,473

    By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.




  • hedonist
    hedonist Posts: 24,524
    Oy, these labels.

    I'll just go with, "I eat, therefore I am."
  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,473
    it all comes out looking pretty much the same. LOL
    By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.




  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 9,825
    HughFreakingDillon said:

    All the titles with the label "vegetarian" in it do not consume any meat. I would think using the label "vegetarian" when you just don't eat red meat would create more confusion. I still find it misleading someone would call themselves a vegetarian but still eat chicken or seafood. Like I said, I don't call them out on it, just seems "fishy" to me.
    So is there a label for fish and poultry? seems like they have to pick one or the other to have any label. Most people I know who eat chicken will also eat fish, unless they just don't like the taste.
  • pearljammr78
    pearljammr78 Posts: 1,613
    HughFreakingDillon said:
    it all comes out looking pretty much the same. LOL
    So true. Feels good going in and feels good going out. 
    Peace,Love and Pearl Jam.

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