Jeffrey Epstein and Friends

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  • oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,855
    I meant since, I couldn’t remember if it was the 60’s or 70’s.  Was on break at work and didn’t do all my research. 
    My grandfather supposedly worked on this project back in the day. Even gave us a snow globe looking thing that was supposed to hold a gravel size piece of the moon. 

    Its not that I don’t believe it’s possible. It just seems to time perfectly with the escalating Cold War and the need for America to posture its power. If it happened. Great. Wow. (Not being sarcastic) I just don’t think we were ready then. 

    I dont think we learned in science class anything about the moon landing. I think it was taught history class. 

    And finall, I believe the earth is round and not flat. 
    What is your science training , that you assess that  the US wasn’t  “ready then”? 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • pearljammr78pearljammr78 Posts: 1,613
    edited August 2019
    I have no training. Just what I’ve read and the depths my THC soaked brain goes when thinking. There is no proof of my belief. Just how the skeptic in me thinks. Just think it’s funny how we succeeded on the first try but have quit trying. If your so good you succeed on your first try and times after that why would you just quit (funding seems like a good excuse) and why hasn’t any other country on earth done the same thing. Just  seems weird to me. Sorry. Shouldn’t post when stoned. 
    Post edited by pearljammr78 on
    Peace,Love and Pearl Jam.
  • oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,855
    I have no training. Just what I’ve read and the depths my THC soaked brain goes when thinking. There is no proof of my belief. Just how the skeptic in me thinks. Just think it’s funny how we succeeded on the first try but have quit trying. If your so good you succeed on your first try and times after that why would you just quit (funding seems like a good excuse) and why hasn’t any other country on earth done the same thing. Just  seems weird to me. Sorry. Shouldn’t post when stoned. 

    So, none of that has to do with "not ready". You don't have any way of assessing whether the aerospace industry in the US was "ready" to go to the moon or not. You don't seem to have a lot of knowledge about the history of the space program and the efforts that led up to the first moon landing. Sure, the push to accomplish it came in the context of the cold war; so what? We got a lot of scientific benefits from the "Space Race", because there was a lot of motivation there. A lot of things in life "seem weird" when you don't know much about them, so the better option is to learn more, rather than just going around and saying that they can't possibly exist. 

    I'll turn it around - why would other countries want to go to the moon, when the US has already done it several times? There's no scientific glory there. Sure, there are many experiments that could be run, but space exploration is horrendously expensive and crewed spacecraft are even more so, and it's a hard sell in the US because "been there, done that", and thus we primarily now have uncrewed crafts, several of which have gone much, much further than the moon. 

    Musk and SpaceX are working toward another moon landing, with I believe the goal of going to Mars. Other countries are looking at space exploration with renewed interest as things deteriorate on this planet.
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • rgambsrgambs Posts: 13,576
    mcgruff10 said:
    Not sure how this is a reflection of science education. I asked a few science teachers  I know and all of them confirmed that faking the moon landings and the flat earth theory in modern times is not in the curriculum.  
    Yes, but the curriculum is also usually didactic, dry, and lacking in anything resembling scientific research.  It's a bigger discussion than this thread has room for, but there is nothing in an average high schoolers education that cements the gravity of the scientific method in a student's heart and mind. That doesn't come until college, and even then it comes only to those who seek degrees in sciences.  
    As Oftenreading pointed out, there were hundreds of thousands of extremely intelligent people working on this project, and what basic science education fails to impress upon a student is the importance of a integrity that is built into the fields and the methods.  When you discount that massively important integrity (which is missing from most other fields) then you end up with people who think climate change and the moon landing are hoaxes perpetrated by shadowy figures with obscure motives.
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 40,916
    rgambs said:
    Yes, but the curriculum is also usually didactic, dry, and lacking in anything resembling scientific research.  It's a bigger discussion than this thread has room for, but there is nothing in an average high schoolers education that cements the gravity of the scientific method in a student's heart and mind. That doesn't come until college, and even then it comes only to those who seek degrees in sciences.  
    As Oftenreading pointed out, there were hundreds of thousands of extremely intelligent people working on this project, and what basic science education fails to impress upon a student is the importance of a integrity that is built into the fields and the methods.  When you discount that massively important integrity (which is missing from most other fields) then you end up with people who think climate change and the moon landing are hoaxes perpetrated by shadowy figures with obscure motives.
    Very well said.
  • "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New Jersey Posts: 29,000
    rgambs said:
    Yes, but the curriculum is also usually didactic, dry, and lacking in anything resembling scientific research.  It's a bigger discussion than this thread has room for, but there is nothing in an average high schoolers education that cements the gravity of the scientific method in a student's heart and mind. That doesn't come until college, and even then it comes only to those who seek degrees in sciences.  
    As Oftenreading pointed out, there were hundreds of thousands of extremely intelligent people working on this project, and what basic science education fails to impress upon a student is the importance of a integrity that is built into the fields and the methods.  When you discount that massively important integrity (which is missing from most other fields) then you end up with people who think climate change and the moon landing are hoaxes perpetrated by shadowy figures with obscure motives.
    Definitely different here in Nj, maybe it is an Ohio thing. 

    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • rgambsrgambs Posts: 13,576
    mcgruff10 said:
    Definitely different here in Nj, maybe it is an Ohio thing. 

    I think it's more of a too close to the situation to accept any criticism of it thing.
    I'm not trying to attack your friends who are teachers, I'm criticizing the entire attitude toward science and scientists that is pervasive in our society.
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • Screaming Trees and Smoking Ears is a great read that speaks to the sciences and scientific methods that were freakishly outside the box or accepted methods of inquiry...great fun and admirable dedication of focus of particular human minds in furthering discovery of a wide variety of problems to be solved......
  • BentleyspopBentleyspop Craft Beer Brewery, Colorado Posts: 11,205
    edited August 2019
  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 9,422
    I have no training. Just what I’ve read and the depths my THC soaked brain goes when thinking. There is no proof of my belief. Just how the skeptic in me thinks. Just think it’s funny how we succeeded on the first try but have quit trying. If your so good you succeed on your first try and times after that why would you just quit (funding seems like a good excuse) and why hasn’t any other country on earth done the same thing. Just  seems weird to me. Sorry. Shouldn’t post when stoned. 
    Skepticism is not critical thinking. 
  • pearljammr78pearljammr78 Posts: 1,613
    Skepticism is not critical thinking. 


    Where does my joke joke about being stoned say anything about critical thinking. But I wouldn’t expect anything more from an Oregon State fan. Go Ducks. Lol
    Peace,Love and Pearl Jam.
  • RenfieldRenfield NYC NY Posts: 1,054
    edited August 2019
  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 9,422
    Zzing! I didn’t want you to confuse skepticism of the moon landing with critical thinking. Beav fan, but also a Purdue grad, so don’t make me send the ghost of Neil Armstrong to haunt you. 
  • Ledbetterman10Ledbetterman10 Posts: 16,963
    Epstein had this painting on the wall of his townhouse. Another blue dress defiled by Slick Willie....


    https://nypost.com/2019/08/14/epstein-had-bizarre-painting-of-bill-clinton-in-dress-heels-in-townhouse/
    2000: Camden 1, 2003: Philly, State College, Camden 1, MSG 2, Hershey, 2004: Reading, 2005: Philly, 2006: Camden 1, 2, East Rutherford 1, 2007: Lollapalooza, 2008: Camden 1, Washington D.C., MSG 1, 2, 2009: Philly 1, 2, 3, 4, 2010: Bristol, MSG 2, 2011: PJ20 1, 2, 2012: Made In America, 2013: Brooklyn 2, Philly 2, 2014: Denver, 2015: Global Citizen Festival, 2016: Philly 2, Fenway 1, 2018: Fenway 1, 2, 2021: Sea. Hear. Now. 2022: Camden, 2024Philly 2, 2025: Pittsburgh 1

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  • tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 40,916
    Epstein had this painting on the wall of his townhouse. Another blue dress defiled by Slick Willie....


    https://nypost.com/2019/08/14/epstein-had-bizarre-painting-of-bill-clinton-in-dress-heels-in-townhouse/
    I find this really, really, hard to believe...
  • Ledbetterman10Ledbetterman10 Posts: 16,963
    edited August 2019
    I find this really, really, hard to believe...
    How can anything creepy related to Epstein (or Clinton for that matter) be really, really hard to believe? 

    But I understand. It's reported by the NY Post, and the NY Post is conservative, so it must be just made up out of thin air.

    2000: Camden 1, 2003: Philly, State College, Camden 1, MSG 2, Hershey, 2004: Reading, 2005: Philly, 2006: Camden 1, 2, East Rutherford 1, 2007: Lollapalooza, 2008: Camden 1, Washington D.C., MSG 1, 2, 2009: Philly 1, 2, 3, 4, 2010: Bristol, MSG 2, 2011: PJ20 1, 2, 2012: Made In America, 2013: Brooklyn 2, Philly 2, 2014: Denver, 2015: Global Citizen Festival, 2016: Philly 2, Fenway 1, 2018: Fenway 1, 2, 2021: Sea. Hear. Now. 2022: Camden, 2024Philly 2, 2025: Pittsburgh 1

    Pearl Jam bootlegs:
    http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
  • tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 40,916
    How can anything creepy related to Epstein (or Clinton for that matter) be really, really hard to believe? 

    But I understand. It's reported by the NY Post, and the NY Post is conservative, so it must be just made up out of thin air.

    It's not that.  It's just too disturbing.  It hurts me to look at it, lol.
  • Ledbetterman10Ledbetterman10 Posts: 16,963
    It's not that.  It's just too disturbing.  It hurts me to look at it, lol.
    Oh I hear ya. It is one creepy image. 
    2000: Camden 1, 2003: Philly, State College, Camden 1, MSG 2, Hershey, 2004: Reading, 2005: Philly, 2006: Camden 1, 2, East Rutherford 1, 2007: Lollapalooza, 2008: Camden 1, Washington D.C., MSG 1, 2, 2009: Philly 1, 2, 3, 4, 2010: Bristol, MSG 2, 2011: PJ20 1, 2, 2012: Made In America, 2013: Brooklyn 2, Philly 2, 2014: Denver, 2015: Global Citizen Festival, 2016: Philly 2, Fenway 1, 2018: Fenway 1, 2, 2021: Sea. Hear. Now. 2022: Camden, 2024Philly 2, 2025: Pittsburgh 1

    Pearl Jam bootlegs:
    http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
  • if that is disturbing, creepy and hurts to look at. 

    How do you react to looking at Trump in a suit?
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 40,923
    if that is disturbing, creepy and hurts to look at. 

    How do you react to looking at Trump in a suit?
    With the POTUS seal on the podium he stands behind?
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  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 40,923
    It's not that.  It's just too disturbing.  It hurts me to look at it, lol.
    Same here but the real question is, did Clinton pose for said painting or was it artistic liberty?
     
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • Ledbetterman10Ledbetterman10 Posts: 16,963
    I would guess artistic liberty...but God only knows with those two. 
    2000: Camden 1, 2003: Philly, State College, Camden 1, MSG 2, Hershey, 2004: Reading, 2005: Philly, 2006: Camden 1, 2, East Rutherford 1, 2007: Lollapalooza, 2008: Camden 1, Washington D.C., MSG 1, 2, 2009: Philly 1, 2, 3, 4, 2010: Bristol, MSG 2, 2011: PJ20 1, 2, 2012: Made In America, 2013: Brooklyn 2, Philly 2, 2014: Denver, 2015: Global Citizen Festival, 2016: Philly 2, Fenway 1, 2018: Fenway 1, 2, 2021: Sea. Hear. Now. 2022: Camden, 2024Philly 2, 2025: Pittsburgh 1

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  • tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 40,916
    Same here but the real question is, did Clinton pose for said painting or was it artistic liberty?
     
    U R fucked up, lol.

    When I first saw it I thought it was Hillary's body.

    So maybe I'm fucked up?
  • KInd of surprising they didn't put him in THE blue dress.
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 40,923
    KInd of surprising they didn't put him in THE blue dress.
    I think the Smithsonian has possession of “the” blue dress.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,380
    edited August 2019

    Autopsy finds broken bones in Jeffrey Epstein’s neck, deepening questions around his death

    Experts say a broken hyoid bone happens in suicide by hanging but is more typical in homicide by strangulation


    An autopsy found that financier Jeffrey Epstein suffered multiple breaks in his neck bones, according to two people familiar with the findings, deepening the mystery about the circumstances around his death.

    Among the bones broken in Epstein’s neck was the hyoid bone, which in men is near the Adam’s apple. Such breaks can occur in those who hang themselves, particularly if they are older, according to forensics experts and studies on the subject. But they are more common in victims of homicide by strangulation, the experts said.......... (story continues in article).





    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • pearljammr78pearljammr78 Posts: 1,613
    Zzing! I didn’t want you to confuse skepticism of the moon landing with critical thinking. Beav fan, but also a Purdue grad, so don’t make me send the ghost of Neil Armstrong to haunt you. 
    Lol. All in good fun. 
    Peace,Love and Pearl Jam.
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