2016 and 2018 Fan Club Singles?

H.Chinaski · January 2019

Lost In Ohio said:

H.Chinaski said:

We're all owed a explanation for the negligence of 10C. We have paid year after year with pretty much nothing in return.

We're missing $10 of a $40 package. If that qualifies as "pretty much nothing" then...

Your right. There's the shirts and the concert bootleg downloads but that's all pretty trivial stuff to me...

mace1229 · January 2019

jeffbr said:

I don't think the OP is naive about the 2016/7 single fiasco. In fact, he pretty much tells us he understands the issue, but just doesn't believe 10c's "hogwash" which is more polite than the word I typically use. Bottom line, 10c owes us 2 singles. 10c still has these obligations to fulfill, and it should become more of a priority for them, especially now. No tour. No album. No more new singles to worry about going forward. Vaults have been shipped. Time to step up, 10c. Before the next big merch wave.

Yup, and I have always felt the same as the OP. I also believe somewhere along the line they lost track that they were 2 years behind and that it wasn't just a misprint. That just seems more of a plausible story than to believe they printed the wrong year and no one ever noticed until they were all printed and shipped.

HesCalledDyer · January 2019

Lost In Ohio said:

drummerboy_73 said:

HesCalledDyer said:

The one you think is 2017 is actually 2016.

Nope.

Except that people who paid in 2016, but not 2017 got Alive/Around and Around. People who paid in 2017, but not 2016 get TBA.

Exactly. I mean, I totally agree with OP's view. It's absolutely screwy that a 2016 single would have "2017" printed on it AND have two songs that were performed and recorded in 2017. But on the same token, it was only sent to members who paid for their 2016 Analog membership.

mace1229 said:

jeffbr said:

I don't think the OP is naive about the 2016/7 single fiasco. In fact, he pretty much tells us he understands the issue, but just doesn't believe 10c's "hogwash" which is more polite than the word I typically use. Bottom line, 10c owes us 2 singles. 10c still has these obligations to fulfill, and it should become more of a priority for them, especially now. No tour. No album. No more new singles to worry about going forward. Vaults have been shipped. Time to step up, 10c. Before the next big merch wave.

Yup, and I have always felt the same as the OP. I also believe somewhere along the line they lost track that they were 2 years behind and that it wasn't just a misprint. That just seems more of a plausible story than to believe they printed the wrong year and no one ever noticed until they were all printed and shipped.

You might be onto something here!

Jbarker · January 2019

Starting to feel like the PJ "business" hasn't restructured for growth in a progressive way, but merely continues to plug away organic and whimsical like the old days.

drummerboy_73 · January 2019

HesCalledDyer said:
Exactly. I mean, I totally agree with OP's view. It's absolutely screwy that a 2016 single would have "2017" printed on it AND have two songs that were performed and recorded in 2017. But on the same token, it was only sent to members who paid for their 2016 Analog membership.

Which is why I believe that at the start of production, they really thought they were working on 2017, but prior to shipping realized "Oh sh*t! We never sent out 2016!" OR, to give them the benefit of the doubt, maybe they really DID just get that far behind and thought, well "Let's get something out quick and no matter that it's a current recording and printed with the current year and not the membership year." Either way, an embarrassment really, for an organization of their stature.

HesCalledDyer · January 2019

drummerboy_73 said:

HesCalledDyer said:
Exactly. I mean, I totally agree with OP's view. It's absolutely screwy that a 2016 single would have "2017" printed on it AND have two songs that were performed and recorded in 2017. But on the same token, it was only sent to members who paid for their 2016 Analog membership.

Which is why I believe that at the start of production, they really thought they were working on 2017, but prior to shipping realized "Oh sh*t! We never sent out 2016!" OR, to give them the benefit of the doubt, maybe they really DID just get that far behind and thought, well "Let's get something out quick and no matter that it's a current recording and printed with the current year and not the membership year." Either way, an embarrassment really, for an organization of their stature.

Indeed. I've always been in the mindset that they rushed it out too quickly. Rather than have us wait a couple more weeks to receive "corrected" sleeves they just sent it because we had already waited too long. It wasn't long after that they sent out the Can't Deny Me mp3 saying it was the 2017 single (again, despite being released in 2018). And we still haven't received a physical copy nearly a year later.

Lost In Ohio · January 2019

HesCalledDyer said:

Lost In Ohio said:

drummerboy_73 said:

HesCalledDyer said:

The one you think is 2017 is actually 2016.

Nope.

Except that people who paid in 2016, but not 2017 got Alive/Around and Around. People who paid in 2017, but not 2016 get TBA.

Exactly. I mean, I totally agree with OP's view. It's absolutely screwy that a 2016 single would have "2017" printed on it AND have two songs that were performed and recorded in 2017. But on the same token, it was only sent to members who paid for their 2016 Analog membership.

I totally agree. It's screwy.

I feel like there was a point where they would have offered to send "reprints" out. Various records have arrived warped or damaged or whatever and they've corrected those.

It's almost like if they wanted to retroactively send one for 1990, so they print 1993 on it, but sent it exclusively to members of Earth Bone Love Affair for calendar year 1990.

on2legs · January 2019

I’ll never understand the anger people have over this issue. I get the argument that they “owe” us a single because we paid for it, but it really doesn’t matter to me. And I know people like to harp on a “customer service” argument to make their point. And people like to say that a properly run business wouldn’t flake out on sending two records that people paid for and that’s true.

But a properly run business also wouldn’t allow us to buy the best seats in the house for a fraction of what they could fetch on the secondary market. And a properly run business also doesn’t give us a chance to buy a tour poster here for $35 when it’s going for $600 on eBay (emek Rome among others). That would make no business sense to practically give these items away when their true market value is hundreds of dollars more. But they do it anyway.

So I can easily live with them not being a properly run business.

drummerboy_73 · January 2019

on2legs said:

I’ll never understand the anger people have over this issue. I get the argument that they “owe” us a single because we paid for it, but it really doesn’t matter to me. And I know people like to harp on a “customer service” argument to make their point. And people like to say that a properly run business wouldn’t flake out on sending two records that people paid for and that’s true.

But a properly run business also wouldn’t allow us to buy the best seats in the house for a fraction of what they could fetch on the secondary market. And a properly run business also doesn’t give us a chance to buy a tour poster here for $35 when it’s going for $600 on eBay (emek Rome among others). That would make no business sense to practically give these items away when their true market value is hundreds of dollars more. But they do it anyway.

So I can easily live with them not being a properly run business.

I don't care about the prices of things on the secondary market because I don't buy things from the secondary market. I'm not going to commend a band or their business entity for not ripping us off simply because the means and opportunity for them to do so is there. I made a business transaction with Pearl Jam and 10C, one they haven't made good on, and that's the only thing I'm concerned with right now. I don't care about what tickets can go for on the secondary market when the last time they played my city was 13 years ago. I don't care about posters for shows I never went to. I know they do a lot of good outside of the issue I'm addressing - I'll give you that. But those extenuating circumstances have no bearing on the fact that I haven't received goods I've paid for YEARS ago.

on2legs · February 2019

drummerboy_73 said:

on2legs said:

I’ll never understand the anger people have over this issue. I get the argument that they “owe” us a single because we paid for it, but it really doesn’t matter to me. And I know people like to harp on a “customer service” argument to make their point. And people like to say that a properly run business wouldn’t flake out on sending two records that people paid for and that’s true.

But a properly run business also wouldn’t allow us to buy the best seats in the house for a fraction of what they could fetch on the secondary market. And a properly run business also doesn’t give us a chance to buy a tour poster here for $35 when it’s going for $600 on eBay (emek Rome among others). That would make no business sense to practically give these items away when their true market value is hundreds of dollars more. But they do it anyway.

So I can easily live with them not being a properly run business.

I don't care about the prices of things on the secondary market because I don't buy things from the secondary market. I'm not going to commend a band or their business entity for not ripping us off simply because the means and opportunity for them to do so is there. I made a business transaction with Pearl Jam and 10C, one they haven't made good on, and that's the only thing I'm concerned with right now. I don't care about what tickets can go for on the secondary market when the last time they played my city was 13 years ago. I don't care about posters for shows I never went to. I know they do a lot of good outside of the issue I'm addressing - I'll give you that. But those extenuating circumstances have no bearing on the fact that I haven't received goods I've paid for YEARS ago.

Sounds like the makings of a good lawsuit.

helplessdancer · February 2019

temple ball is legal is WA so i am not surprised the hippies messed it up a tiny bit.

it's happened to me and more than once. being 100% perfect is so over rated

MedozK · February 2019

on2legs said:

I’ll never understand the anger people have over this issue. I get the argument that they “owe” us a single because we paid for it, but it really doesn’t matter to me. And I know people like to harp on a “customer service” argument to make their point. And people like to say that a properly run business wouldn’t flake out on sending two records that people paid for and that’s true.

But a properly run business also wouldn’t allow us to buy the best seats in the house for a fraction of what they could fetch on the secondary market. And a properly run business also doesn’t give us a chance to buy a tour poster here for $35 when it’s going for $600 on eBay (emek Rome among others). That would make no business sense to practically give these items away when their true market value is hundreds of dollars more. But they do it anyway.

So I can easily live with them not being a properly run business.

Nike, gives me the opportunity to buy Off-White UNC AJ1s for $160. They go for about $1000 now... so not sure is Nike a properly run business or not?

on2legs · February 2019

MedozK said:

on2legs said:

I’ll never understand the anger people have over this issue. I get the argument that they “owe” us a single because we paid for it, but it really doesn’t matter to me. And I know people like to harp on a “customer service” argument to make their point. And people like to say that a properly run business wouldn’t flake out on sending two records that people paid for and that’s true.

But a properly run business also wouldn’t allow us to buy the best seats in the house for a fraction of what they could fetch on the secondary market. And a properly run business also doesn’t give us a chance to buy a tour poster here for $35 when it’s going for $600 on eBay (emek Rome among others). That would make no business sense to practically give these items away when their true market value is hundreds of dollars more. But they do it anyway.

So I can easily live with them not being a properly run business.

Nike, gives me the opportunity to buy Off-White UNC AJ1s for $160. They go for about $1000 now... so not sure is Nike a properly run business or not?

I don't know... but if I were you I would zip over to the Nike message board and raise a ruckus like we got going on over here.

MedozK · February 2019

on2legs said:

MedozK said:

on2legs said:

I’ll never understand the anger people have over this issue. I get the argument that they “owe” us a single because we paid for it, but it really doesn’t matter to me. And I know people like to harp on a “customer service” argument to make their point. And people like to say that a properly run business wouldn’t flake out on sending two records that people paid for and that’s true.

But a properly run business also wouldn’t allow us to buy the best seats in the house for a fraction of what they could fetch on the secondary market. And a properly run business also doesn’t give us a chance to buy a tour poster here for $35 when it’s going for $600 on eBay (emek Rome among others). That would make no business sense to practically give these items away when their true market value is hundreds of dollars more. But they do it anyway.

So I can easily live with them not being a properly run business.

Nike, gives me the opportunity to buy Off-White UNC AJ1s for $160. They go for about $1000 now... so not sure is Nike a properly run business or not?

I don't know... but if I were you I would zip over to the Nike message board and raise a ruckus like we got going on over here.

No need, when I purchase stuff from them I get it.

but I get it.. I’m just surprised they haven’t just pressed up some live cuts... and washed their hands of the whole thing.

drummerboy_73 · February 2019

MedozK said:

on2legs said:

I don't know... but if I were you I would zip over to the Nike message board and raise a ruckus like we got going on over here.

No need, when I purchase stuff from them I get it.

Spiritual_Chaos · February 2019

Tim Bierman explaining the fanclub situation in the next newsletter:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXJiSZhA5cg

jeffbr · February 2019

drummerboy_73 said:

MedozK said:

on2legs said:

I don't know... but if I were you I would zip over to the Nike message board and raise a ruckus like we got going on over here.

No need, when I purchase stuff from them I get it.

Yup. Don't know why that is so hard for some to understand.

HesCalledDyer · February 2019

on2legs said:

I’ll never understand the anger people have over this issue. I get the argument that they “owe” us a single because we paid for it, but it really doesn’t matter to me. And I know people like to harp on a “customer service” argument to make their point. And people like to say that a properly run business wouldn’t flake out on sending two records that people paid for and that’s true.

But a properly run business also wouldn’t allow us to buy the best seats in the house for a fraction of what they could fetch on the secondary market. And a properly run business also doesn’t give us a chance to buy a tour poster here for $35 when it’s going for $600 on eBay (emek Rome among others). That would make no business sense to practically give these items away when their true market value is hundreds of dollars more. But they do it anyway.

So I can easily live with them not being a properly run business.

That is fine that your are 100% complacent with 10 Club's poor practices. That's your choice. The problem is that too many people have given them the same pass over the years, so they continue those poor practices. That, however, doesn't excuse them. It really doesn't matter what other perks they give us in the meantime. If that offsets the lack of fulfillment for you, that's great. While access to exclusive items and tickets is a membership benefit, the secondary market comparison is completely irrelevant. When you pay for something, you should receive it within the time frame specified. Not 2 years later, or possibly never at all. I find it hard to believe that you could "never understand the anger people have over" wanting to get what they paid for years ago.

Look, I love the Ten Club as much as everyone here. I've gotten a lot more good from them than bad. A lot. But that doesn't excuse the bad and I don't know why anyone would be satisfied with the bad.

MisterEtake2 · February 2019

on2legs said:

But a properly run business also wouldn’t allow us to buy the best seats in the house for a fraction of what they could fetch on the secondary market. And a properly run business also doesn’t give us a chance to buy a tour poster here for $35 when it’s going for $600 on eBay (emek Rome among others). That would make no business sense to practically give these items away when their true market value is hundreds of dollars more. But they do it anyway.

So I can easily live with them not being a properly run business.

Don't try to rationalize this away. Analog members were promised vinyl singles as part of their membership packages. They have not been delivered. Whether the Ten Club charges the correct price for tickets is a completely different argument. I haven't purchased a ticket through the Ten Club in over two years. Am I now more entitled to my annual single than someone who has?

mace1229 · February 2019

MisterEtake2 said:

on2legs said:

But a properly run business also wouldn’t allow us to buy the best seats in the house for a fraction of what they could fetch on the secondary market. And a properly run business also doesn’t give us a chance to buy a tour poster here for $35 when it’s going for $600 on eBay (emek Rome among others). That would make no business sense to practically give these items away when their true market value is hundreds of dollars more. But they do it anyway.

So I can easily live with them not being a properly run business.

Don't try to rationalize this away. Analog members were promised vinyl singles as part of their membership packages. They have not been delivered. Whether the Ten Club charges the correct price for tickets is a completely different argument. I haven't purchased a ticket through the Ten Club in over two years. Am I now more entitled to my annual single than someone who has?

Not just analog. Even digital members were promised a unique single as well. Just not on vinyl.

2016 and 2018 Fan Club Singles?

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