14 years and counting...

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  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,152
    Personally, I am not in favor of a government that is a tyranny, or despotic, or a dictatorship, or totalitarian  whether it appears to be just like Hitler's Nazi movement or not.
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni











  • tbergstbergs Posts: 10,249
    that "wah wah" about the down syndrome kid made me want to punch my fucking ipad. 
    Empathy. No one in this Admin or prior employees of this Admin have any.
    It's a hopeless situation...
  • tbergstbergs Posts: 10,249
    brianlux said:
    Personally, I am not in favor of a government that is a tyranny, or despotic, or a dictatorship, or totalitarian  whether it appears to be just like Hitler's Nazi movement or not.
    Definitely. We're getting bogged down on the comparison to past regimes instead of focusing on how much this one strives for some of those terrible systems you mentioned. Go back and ask people in 1990 or 2000 if Donald Trump could ever be president to see how good we are at predicting what may happen in the future no matter how unrealistic it seems right now. When the signs are present, act before it's too late.
    It's a hopeless situation...
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,054
    tbergs said:
    Definitely. We're getting bogged down on the comparison to past regimes instead of focusing on how much this one strives for some of those terrible systems you mentioned. Go back and ask people in 1990 or 2000 if Donald Trump could ever be president to see how good we are at predicting what may happen in the future no matter how unrealistic it seems right now. When the signs are present, act before it's too late.
    I didn't even predict he had a chance in hell during the primaries. or even on fucking election night. 
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,697
    tbergs said:
    Well, of course! The sun revolves around our flat planet Earth which is at the center of the universe.
    That was proven false hundreds of years ago.
    But I live in Colorado, I can see the sun rise and it is maybe mid-Kansas. So that means it rises in the West for everyone east of Kansas.
  • Ledbetterman10Ledbetterman10 Posts: 16,960
    tbergs said:
    Empathy. No one in this Admin or prior employees of this Admin have any.
    And it trickles down to their fans. I'm done using the term "Trump supporters" because all they are are delusional fans. Not unlike Kardashian fans or whatever.
    2000: Camden 1, 2003: Philly, State College, Camden 1, MSG 2, Hershey, 2004: Reading, 2005: Philly, 2006: Camden 1, 2, East Rutherford 1, 2007: Lollapalooza, 2008: Camden 1, Washington D.C., MSG 1, 2, 2009: Philly 1, 2, 3, 4, 2010: Bristol, MSG 2, 2011: PJ20 1, 2, 2012: Made In America, 2013: Brooklyn 2, Philly 2, 2014: Denver, 2015: Global Citizen Festival, 2016: Philly 2, Fenway 1, 2018: Fenway 1, 2, 2021: Sea. Hear. Now. 2022: Camden, 2024Philly 2, 2025: Pittsburgh 

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  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,152
    tbergs said:
    Definitely. We're getting bogged down on the comparison to past regimes instead of focusing on how much this one strives for some of those terrible systems you mentioned. Go back and ask people in 1990 or 2000 if Donald Trump could ever be president to see how good we are at predicting what may happen in the future no matter how unrealistic it seems right now. When the signs are present, act before it's too late.
    Exactly.  Americans tend to say things like, "Oh, it's not that bad", or "Oh, we'll never be like that."  But then when you look at history and see how many times the rule of the land has turn to despotism or tyranny, etc. and one cannot rule out the possibility of that happening here. 
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni











  • Cliffy6745Cliffy6745 Posts: 33,996
    edited June 2018
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 49,576
    edited June 2018

    So now he's going to "sign something" to end his policy of separating kids from parents without legislation. Bravo! He could have done this weeks ago but chose to use these kids as hostages. Now he realizes it's not going to work.


    DO YOU SEE HOW RIDICULOUS IT IS TO SUPPORT THIS FUCKING MORON?


    Wake up, people. Wake the fuck up already.

    Post edited by The Juggler on
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  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 49,576
    mcgruff10 said:
    No one is saying it is normal but it isn't Berlin 1938 either.


    Oh that's what I said? Really?


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  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 49,576
    brianlux said:
    Personally, I am not in favor of a government that is a tyranny, or despotic, or a dictatorship, or totalitarian  whether it appears to be just like Hitler's Nazi movement or not.

    ....and this is what people fail to understand.
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  • unsungunsung I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
    my2hands said:

    why you hiding behind a screen, bro? worried about the elimination of the white race?
    Difference:

    I don't single out users and talk shit.
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 49,576
    unsung said:
    Difference:

    I don't single out users and talk shit.

    Rambo....attempting to take the high road
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  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 40,877

    Rambo....attempting to take the high road
    Comical, isn’t it?
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  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,054
    excellent opinion piece on comparing current US actions to Nazi Germany (many of these same points have been made by various posters here):

    https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/19/opinions/immigrant-children-sessions-holocaust-comparisons-miss-point-filipovic-opinion/index.html
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 40,877

    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • tbergstbergs Posts: 10,249
    https://www.politico.com/story/2018/06/20/im-ashamed-of-what-theyre-doing-backlash-grows-for-trump-and-his-aides-655498

    From that article:

    President Donald Trump said he plans to sign an executive action on Wednesday that would end the administration’s policy of separating migrant families crossing the U.S.-Mexico border, abandoning the president’s previous stance that only Congress can fix the problem.

    “The Republicans want security and insist on security for our country. And we will have that,” Trump said during a meeting at the White House with lawmakers and officials. “At the same time we have compassion and want to keep families together. It’s very important. I’ll be signing something in a little while that’s going to do that.”

    He added that he hopes his action will “matched by legislation.”

    And then below that:

    On Tuesday night, shortly before the AP story broke, Trump attended a $100,000-plus-per-person fundraiser at his hotel in Washington, D.C. Before that, he met with House Republicans at the Capitol, where he sounded off on everything from trade to fighter jets, while only briefly acknowledging the outcry over the situation at the U.S.-Mexico border.

    "We have to take care of these separations,” he said, according to a person in the room, encouraging lawmakers to come up with a legislative fix and recounting that his daughter and adviser, Ivanka Trump, had raised concerns about the policy.

    But behind the scenes, Trump has been paying close attention to the fallout, at times doubling down on the policy and complaining that Democrats are using the issue to sabotage him politically, while also signaling to aides that he wants the issue resolved quickly.

    “It’s the Democrats fault, they won’t give us the votes needed to pass good immigration legislation,” Trump tweeted Wednesday. “They want open borders, which breeds horrible crime. Republicans want security. But I am working on something - it never ends!” The president also retweeted by Darrell Scott, a pastor and Trump supporter, that declared: “Once the mid terms are over, liberals won’t talk about detained or separated illegal immigrant children until 2020. #itsallpolitics.”

    The haves, have not a fucking clue.

    It's a hopeless situation...
  • Ledbetterman10Ledbetterman10 Posts: 16,960
    edited June 2018

    Yeah it "began" the moment he came down that escalator.
    Post edited by Ledbetterman10 on
    2000: Camden 1, 2003: Philly, State College, Camden 1, MSG 2, Hershey, 2004: Reading, 2005: Philly, 2006: Camden 1, 2, East Rutherford 1, 2007: Lollapalooza, 2008: Camden 1, Washington D.C., MSG 1, 2, 2009: Philly 1, 2, 3, 4, 2010: Bristol, MSG 2, 2011: PJ20 1, 2, 2012: Made In America, 2013: Brooklyn 2, Philly 2, 2014: Denver, 2015: Global Citizen Festival, 2016: Philly 2, Fenway 1, 2018: Fenway 1, 2, 2021: Sea. Hear. Now. 2022: Camden, 2024Philly 2, 2025: Pittsburgh 

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  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 49,576
    excellent opinion piece on comparing current US actions to Nazi Germany (many of these same points have been made by various posters here):

    https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/19/opinions/immigrant-children-sessions-holocaust-comparisons-miss-point-filipovic-opinion/index.html

    Sadly this is too rational an article for a third of the country to comprehend...
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  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 40,877
    Words, to this administration, are divorced from any real meaning, except when they're being used as not-so-subtle dog whistles to a racist base. Like so many authoritarian regimes before them, they insist that words can be easily redefined, that history must be erased, and that you can't believe your own lyin' eyes.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 40,877
    No one is claiming the Trump administration is marching kids to death camps. And we must always be careful not to overstate the case. But the case here is clear, and it's dire, and it has dangerous historical precedents that we would be foolish and irresponsible to ignore.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,368
    edited June 2018
    mcgruff10 said:

    Imo not at all. Actually I see zero similarities to Nazi germany persecuting their own citizens and the u.s. Arresting illegal immigrants at the border. 
    I meant there are strong similarities between Nazi political tactics and Trump admin tactics in general, including taking children away from their parents, period. That specific thing - removing children from the parents and not telling them when or if they'd ever be reunited, and sometimes doing it by telling the parents they were just taking the kid for a bath - is absolutely similar to what Nazis did, all other differences aside. But the other tactics I'm talking about are things like the propaganda tactics (did you see how they called the immigrants an infestation the other day? Sound familiar?), the anti-media tactics, having what amounts to state-sponsored news media, the double-speak: what's true is false, what's false is true, the ICE community raids taking place across the country, the deliberate fear mongering, the deliberate efforts to pit citizens against one another, the political rallies held by the leader after entering office, etc etc etc etc. There are OBJECTIVE similarities between the two regimes. I know this fact makes a lot of American people very uncomfortable, but that doesn't mean the parallels don't clearly exist.
    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • tbergstbergs Posts: 10,249
    PJ_Soul said:
    I meant there are strong similarities between Nazi political tactics and Trump admin tactics in general, including taking children away from their parents, period. That specific thing - removing children from the parents and not telling them when or if they'd ever be reunited - is absolutely similar to what Nazis did, all other differences aside. But the other tactics I'm talking about are things like the propaganda tactics (did you see how they called the immigrants an infestation the other day? Sound familiar?), the anti-media tactics, having what amounts to state-sponsored news media, the double-speak: what's true is false, what's false is real, the ICE community raids, the deliberate fear mongering, the deliberate efforts to pit citizens against one another, the political rallies held by the leader after entering office, etc etc etc etc. There are OBJECTIVE similarities between the two regimes. I know this fact makes a lot of American people very uncomfortable, but that doesn't mean the parallels don't clearly exist.
    So much truth to all of this and the highlighted especially. These aren't normal political rallies. They're, "praise our great leader" rallies because he is so good and just. Just the other day he made the comment about how his supporters are the smartest people. He continually perpetuates that he and his followers are the more intelligent group. Does that sound familiar to anyone? I don't give a shit if you don't think it compares to Nazism, but it should still be concerning, not awww shucks, he's just saying what he thinks.
    It's a hopeless situation...
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 49,576
    PJ_Soul said:
    I meant there are strong similarities between Nazi political tactics and Trump admin tactics in general, including taking children away from their parents, period. That specific thing - removing children from the parents and not telling them when or if they'd ever be reunited, and sometimes doing it by telling the parents they were just taking the kid for a bath - is absolutely similar to what Nazis did, all other differences aside. But the other tactics I'm talking about are things like the propaganda tactics (did you see how they called the immigrants an infestation the other day? Sound familiar?), the anti-media tactics, having what amounts to state-sponsored news media, the double-speak: what's true is false, what's false is true, the ICE community raids taking place across the country, the deliberate fear mongering, the deliberate efforts to pit citizens against one another, the political rallies held by the leader after entering office, etc etc etc etc. There are OBJECTIVE similarities between the two regimes. I know this fact makes a lot of American people very uncomfortable, but that doesn't mean the parallels don't clearly exist.

    You're wasting your breath. He is a history teacher so he should know all of this already.....
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  • BentleyspopBentleyspop Craft Beer Brewery, Colorado Posts: 11,200
    Well now that his church said what he is doing is wrong I guess he'll  put a stop to it......


  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 49,576
    edited June 2018

    State Run Media

     https://www.politico.com/story/2018/06/19/fox-news-family-separations-border-655464

    The story received some play on FoxNews.com over the weekend, but then, starting on Monday morning, headlines about it were buried beneath stories about Trump’s ambitions in outer-space, the hat Napoleon wore at the battle of Waterloo, and an allegedly spit-in hamburger at a restaurant in Queens.

    Post edited by The Juggler on
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  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 40,877
    But my hatred of others is sad. I wonder what hatred I espoused? Compared to separating innocent children from their parents, I'm a saint. I also don't recall telling everyone to just stop it and to fuck off within a couple of posts in a thread. But yea, I'm full of hatred. Team Trumpian Treason in its accusation. Kind of like, "lock her up!" Where are those Hillary indictments, by the way? Oh, we don't need those anymore. Kind of like facts.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 49,576
    www.myspace.com
  • BentleyspopBentleyspop Craft Beer Brewery, Colorado Posts: 11,200
    American Airlines doing the right thing.....


  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 30,867
    You can bet your bottom dollar that he will make it seem like he swooped in to save the kids by putting a stop to his own polocy , what a disgusting American he is and to think he's the face that the rest of the world knows is representing me or you !!! Not my president he needs to be impeached or resign along with his whole administration ! 
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
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