How should the world deal with the North Korean threat?

Thoughts_Arrive said:

brianlux said:

Thoughts_Arrive said:

Another option, send in Hans Blix.

Not bad, but if you're going for diplomacy, go all the way and send in Binx the Talking Cat

Is that cat from some movie or show?
My reference was to Team America World Police hehe

Hocus Pocus.

brianlux said:

Not meaning to add to the already hyperbolic fear we seem to be bombarded with over NK these days, but this looks to be a true concern: an electromagnetic pulse (EMP) attach by NK:

"Few people outside the world of nuclear warfare military analysis have pondered electromagnetic pulse (EMP) as a strategic weapon.  It’s well understood and mostly dismissed in battle planning because military forces and command systems are specified to be radiation hardened against EMP.   But North Korea is not a conventional or rational foe.  They have telegraphed that they are preparing to engage in an asymmetric attack; not against the US military or government, but against the American people.

Their apparent weapon of choice is a high energy nuclear bomb designed to deliver an EMP burst from high altitude over the United States mainland.

The killing mechanism of such an attack is “elegant”; that’s my Cold War analyst past showing up as an encapsulating term. The EMP burst’s objective is to saturate the US power grid underneath it with energy flowing into the wiring.  The goal is to burn out a portion of the three hundred or so high voltage transformers that link the US together as an industrial age economy.  By burn out, that means causing the melting of the transformer cores rendering them useless.  Repairing such damage is cumbersome. There is only one plant that manufactures these types transformers in the US and it does not even make the biggest ones needed for the US grid backbone.  These have to come from factories in Europe or China and there’s a multi-year backlog for them.

Prior to North Korea’s announcement that they have developed a hydrogen bomb designed for EMP use, most experts dismissed the danger arguing that North Korea’s weapons were too puny.  This premise has been altered. One should never really underestimate the determination of a fanatical foe.

The eastern seaboard of the United States is presently the most vulnerable part of the country to such an attack.  It is our oldest electrical grid.   It is highly dependent on an interconnecting network of power generation sources supplying electricity to densely populated metropolises.  The long-haul lines are AC current based, a transmission method that makes them more susceptible to EMP.  And, despite many theory papers having been written on it, minimal investments have been made to harden this grid against man made EMP attack or the natural disaster version of the threat, solar coronal mass ejection (CME).  In strategic warfare planning terms, we are both vulnerable and susceptible to attack.

Caught unprepared, it may be possible to cut off major sections of the US mainland from electrical service.  This in turn means all utilities infrastructure breaks down as one of the world’s most electricity dependent regions goes dark for up the better part of a decade.  The human survival carrying capacity of these areas will drop dramatically, potentially catastrophically, resulting in suffering and death far beyond what we see in even the worst natural disasters.  Desperation would consume up to one hundred million people scrambling to survive at qualities of life one-tenth of the present.  Entire metropolitan regions and economic centers may/will collapse.  By the time we emerge, the US would not be the same as we know it today.

Take heart.  All is not lost.  The United States is not defenseless if we must “ride out” a nuclear attack.  Ride out; there’s another Cold War term I had hoped to not have to use again in my lifetime.  But here we are."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/understanding-north-koreas-emp-threat_us_59ae115de4b0bef3378cdad9

CM189191 said:

dudeman said:

I've been seeing warnings about EMP attacks and our nation's vulnerability to them for years. (Gun magazines, NRA and outdoors groups.) Until recently, mentioning the possibility of it happening was met with accusations of being a conspiracy nut with a tin foil hat. 

I really hope it never happens. 

Now that news sources other than the right-leaning outlets are covering it, preparations can begin to minimize the possibility of it happening or prevent it altogether. 

I don't know that I've seen any proof of an EMP that works.  I would think the US Military would have developed such a device before North Korea. 

donnaruhl said:

I think there are 9 countries with Nuclear capabilities. Every one of them have a button. Just let North Korea have their nuclear weapons. I can think of other countries that pose a bigger threat than North Korea. Such as China and Russia. Both on each side of North Korea,both in bed with North Korea, And both unwilling to stop North Korea. Because both are supplying North Korea with the technology, and the components. So asking them to do anything, is feudal. And because of the all mighty dollar, We evidently don't have the balls to put sanctions on both China and Russia for their involvement. We all clinch our fists at the president of the Philippines for killing drug addicts, When the United States  is allowing China to do the same thing to our addicts with their legal fentanyl. No different than the Philippines, Just less conspicuous. I say, Roll the fucking dice, and sanction the hell out of both of them. We have a button too.

When Jocko Willink‏, a former US Navy SEAL who is now an author and occasional Business Insider contributor, was asked on Twitter how he would handle the North Korean crisis, he gave an unexpected answer that one expert said just might work.

Willink's proposal didn't involve any covert special operation strikes or military moves of any kind. Instead of bombs, Willink suggested the US drop iPhones. 

"Drop 25 million iPhones on them and put satellites over them with free wifi," Willink tweeted last week.

While the proposal itself is fantastical and far-fetched, Yun Sun, an expert on North Korea at the Stimson Center, says the core concept could work.

"Kim Jong Un understands that as soon as society is open and North Korean people realize what they're missing, Kim's regime is unsustainable, and it's going to be overthrown," Sun told Business Insider.

For this reason, North Korea's government would strongly oppose any measures that mirror Willink's suggestion. 

Sun pointed out that when South Korea had previously flown balloons that dropped pamphlets and DVDs over North Korea, the Kim regime had responded militarily, sensing the frailty of its government relative to those of prosperous liberal democracies.

For this reason, North Korea would turn down even free iPhones for its entire population, thought to be about 25.2 million.

Such a measure, Sun said, would also open the West to criticism "for rewarding a illegitimately nuclear dictatorship" that "we know has committed massive human rights against its people."

And as North Korea puts the Kim regime above all else, any investment or aid would "be exploited first and foremost by the government," Sun said, adding: "We will have to swallow the consequence that of $100 investment, maybe $10 would reach the people."

North Korea harshly punishes ordinary citizens who are found to enjoy South Korean media, so there's good reason to think providing internet access or devices to North Koreans could get people killed. 

But in a purely practical sense, the US has few options. War with North Korea could start a nuclear conflict or otherwise introduce a more long-term proliferation risk.

"They're not going to denuclearize until their regime changes and society changes," Sun said. "This approach may be the longer route, but it has the hope of succeeding."

Go Beavers said:

donnaruhl said:

I think there are 9 countries with Nuclear capabilities. Every one of them have a button. Just let North Korea have their nuclear weapons. I can think of other countries that pose a bigger threat than North Korea. Such as China and Russia. Both on each side of North Korea,both in bed with North Korea, And both unwilling to stop North Korea. Because both are supplying North Korea with the technology, and the components. So asking them to do anything, is feudal. And because of the all mighty dollar, We evidently don't have the balls to put sanctions on both China and Russia for their involvement. We all clinch our fists at the president of the Philippines for killing drug addicts, When the United States  is allowing China to do the same thing to our addicts with their legal fentanyl. No different than the Philippines, Just less conspicuous. I say, Roll the fucking dice, and sanction the hell out of both of them. We have a button too.

China can pretty much shut the US economy down if they wanted to, so that would be like trying to guess each number right from tossing a handful of D & D d

brianlux said:

mcgruff10 said:

greatest idea ever:
http://www.businessinsider.com/former-us-navy-seal-solution-to-north-korea-may-work-2017-9

When Jocko Willink‏, a former US Navy SEAL who is now an author and occasional Business Insider contributor, was asked on Twitter how he would handle the North Korean crisis, he gave an unexpected answer that one expert said just might work.

Willink's proposal didn't involve any covert special operation strikes or military moves of any kind. Instead of bombs, Willink suggested the US drop iPhones. 

"Drop 25 million iPhones on them and put satellites over them with free wifi," Willink tweeted last week.

While the proposal itself is fantastical and far-fetched, Yun Sun, an expert on North Korea at the Stimson Center, says the core concept could work.

"Kim Jong Un understands that as soon as society is open and North Korean people realize what they're missing, Kim's regime is unsustainable, and it's going to be overthrown," Sun told Business Insider.

For this reason, North Korea's government would strongly oppose any measures that mirror Willink's suggestion. 

Sun pointed out that when South Korea had previously flown balloons that dropped pamphlets and DVDs over North Korea, the Kim regime had responded militarily, sensing the frailty of its government relative to those of prosperous liberal democracies.

For this reason, North Korea would turn down even free iPhones for its entire population, thought to be about 25.2 million.

Such a measure, Sun said, would also open the West to criticism "for rewarding a illegitimately nuclear dictatorship" that "we know has committed massive human rights against its people."

And as North Korea puts the Kim regime above all else, any investment or aid would "be exploited first and foremost by the government," Sun said, adding: "We will have to swallow the consequence that of $100 investment, maybe $10 would reach the people."

North Korea harshly punishes ordinary citizens who are found to enjoy South Korean media, so there's good reason to think providing internet access or devices to North Koreans could get people killed. 

But in a purely practical sense, the US has few options. War with North Korea could start a nuclear conflict or otherwise introduce a more long-term proliferation risk.

"They're not going to denuclearize until their regime changes and society changes," Sun said. "This approach may be the longer route, but it has the hope of succeeding."

Brilliant!  I think the risks involved would be worth it.  Yes, some people would be killed or punished for having iPhones and much money would be lost, but compared to the loss of life and money in a war?  No brainer!

mcgruff10 said:

brianlux said:

mcgruff10 said:

greatest idea ever:
http://www.businessinsider.com/former-us-navy-seal-solution-to-north-korea-may-work-2017-9

When Jocko Willink‏, a former US Navy SEAL who is now an author and occasional Business Insider contributor, was asked on Twitter how he would handle the North Korean crisis, he gave an unexpected answer that one expert said just might work.

Willink's proposal didn't involve any covert special operation strikes or military moves of any kind. Instead of bombs, Willink suggested the US drop iPhones. 

"Drop 25 million iPhones on them and put satellites over them with free wifi," Willink tweeted last week.

While the proposal itself is fantastical and far-fetched, Yun Sun, an expert on North Korea at the Stimson Center, says the core concept could work.

"Kim Jong Un understands that as soon as society is open and North Korean people realize what they're missing, Kim's regime is unsustainable, and it's going to be overthrown," Sun told Business Insider.

For this reason, North Korea's government would strongly oppose any measures that mirror Willink's suggestion. 

Sun pointed out that when South Korea had previously flown balloons that dropped pamphlets and DVDs over North Korea, the Kim regime had responded militarily, sensing the frailty of its government relative to those of prosperous liberal democracies.

For this reason, North Korea would turn down even free iPhones for its entire population, thought to be about 25.2 million.

Such a measure, Sun said, would also open the West to criticism "for rewarding a illegitimately nuclear dictatorship" that "we know has committed massive human rights against its people."

And as North Korea puts the Kim regime above all else, any investment or aid would "be exploited first and foremost by the government," Sun said, adding: "We will have to swallow the consequence that of $100 investment, maybe $10 would reach the people."

North Korea harshly punishes ordinary citizens who are found to enjoy South Korean media, so there's good reason to think providing internet access or devices to North Koreans could get people killed. 

But in a purely practical sense, the US has few options. War with North Korea could start a nuclear conflict or otherwise introduce a more long-term proliferation risk.

"They're not going to denuclearize until their regime changes and society changes," Sun said. "This approach may be the longer route, but it has the hope of succeeding."

Brilliant!  I think the risks involved would be worth it.  Yes, some people would be killed or punished for having iPhones and much money would be lost, but compared to the loss of life and money in a war?  No brainer!

agreed bud!!!  I love this idea!