voter id requirements

I really don't see how that matters. People who are totally irresponsible deadbeats (for whatever reason) have a right to vote too.

Sure deadbeats have the right - but most have ID too, no?

Hell, with the fires here recently, people had to provide it to be let back in to their neighborhood.

Just doesn't strike me as something so difficult to obtain, and then use it as needed/warranted. The process, usually, isn't complicated shit.

PJ_Soul said:

I really don't see how that matters. People are are totally irresponsible deadbeats (for whatever reason) have a right to vote too.

So even if you forget to register, like the Trumps did? Go ahead and show up and vote?
I don't see the big deal in asking to do something that takes less time to register. And it proves you are who you say you are

mace1229 said:

PJ_Soul said:

I really don't see how that matters. People are are totally irresponsible deadbeats (for whatever reason) have a right to vote too.

So even if you forget to register, like the Trumps did? Go ahead and show up and vote?
I don't see the big deal in asking to do something that takes less time to register. And it proves you are who you say you are

You clearly don't understand how difficult it can actually be to get an ID when you don't have luxuries like a car, the internet, and a 40 hr work week. People have shitbag parents that don't bother keeping birth certificates, then you are looking at weeks and months of clerical work to get the documentation you need to vote.
It would be one thing to require this if there was any evidence of voting fraud, but there is practically ZERO evidence.
So why, from a position of privilege, would you make a requirement that you know some less fortunate will fail to meet when there is no evidence of necessity for said requirement?

*edit

And how fucking insulting is it that these laws invariably come from the party of less government? What is their goal?
It has been amply demonstrated that there is no legitimate need for voter id laws, and also that they disproportionally effect minority voters...but, no, that surely doesn't have anything to do with it.

rgambs said:

You clearly don't understand how difficult it can actually be to get an ID when you don't have luxuries like a car, the internet, and a 40 hr work week. People have shitbag parents that don't bother keeping birth certificates, then you are looking at weeks and months of clerical work to get the documentation you need to vote.
It would be one thing to require this if there was any evidence of voting fraud, but there is practically ZERO evidence.
So why, from a position of privilege, would you make a requirement that you know some less fortunate will fail to meet when there is no evidence of necessity for said requirement?

*edit

And how fucking insulting is it that these laws invariably come from the party of less government? What is their goal?
It has been amply demonstrated that there is no legitimate need for voter id laws, and also that they disproportionally effect minority voters...but, no, that surely doesn't have anything to do with it.

Of course without requiring ID it is nearly impossible to detect fraud.

As far as some of the other points. States will give you a free ID, if you don't have the money, some will even pick you up and take you there to get it for free.

If you have shitbag parents that lost or din't keep your birth certificate, it doesn't take months to get a copy. My friend lost his, and got a copy of it from the hospital within a week in the mail. He needed his birth certificate, because of the new Real ID Act.

It's 2016, you need an ID to do about anything anymore.

rgambs said:

mace1229 said:

PJ_Soul said:

I really don't see how that matters. People are are totally irresponsible deadbeats (for whatever reason) have a right to vote too.

So even if you forget to register, like the Trumps did? Go ahead and show up and vote?
I don't see the big deal in asking to do something that takes less time to register. And it proves you are who you say you are

You clearly don't understand how difficult it can actually be to get an ID when you don't have luxuries like a car, the internet, and a 40 hr work week. People have shitbag parents that don't bother keeping birth certificates, then you are looking at weeks and months of clerical work to get the documentation you need to vote.
It would be one thing to require this if there was any evidence of voting fraud, but there is practically ZERO evidence.
So why, from a position of privilege, would you make a requirement that you know some less fortunate will fail to meet when there is no evidence of necessity for said requirement?

*edit

And how fucking insulting is it that these laws invariably come from the party of less government? What is their goal?
It has been amply demonstrated that there is no legitimate need for voter id laws, and also that they disproportionally effect minority voters...but, no, that surely doesn't have anything to do with it.

Without the means to go to the post office, DMV or several other places that offer ID, how are they getting the the polls to vote? If they want to do it, they will. It isn't difficult. I had to request a birth certificate the first time I got a passport-not that tough.
If the only thing in life you needed an official IF for was to vote that would be one that, but you need it for every adult responsibility. It's part of being an adult and living life. And I don't know why you make it seem so very difficult to obtain one, it isn't. Not if you're here legally anyway, and even then you can still get a driver's license in most cases. If obtaining an ID is too big of an obstacle in life for someone, then I'm sorry to say they will have a rough road ahead.

mace1229 said:

rgambs said:

mace1229 said:

PJ_Soul said:

I really don't see how that matters. People are are totally irresponsible deadbeats (for whatever reason) have a right to vote too.

So even if you forget to register, like the Trumps did? Go ahead and show up and vote?
I don't see the big deal in asking to do something that takes less time to register. And it proves you are who you say you are

You clearly don't understand how difficult it can actually be to get an ID when you don't have luxuries like a car, the internet, and a 40 hr work week. People have shitbag parents that don't bother keeping birth certificates, then you are looking at weeks and months of clerical work to get the documentation you need to vote.
It would be one thing to require this if there was any evidence of voting fraud, but there is practically ZERO evidence.
So why, from a position of privilege, would you make a requirement that you know some less fortunate will fail to meet when there is no evidence of necessity for said requirement?

*edit

And how fucking insulting is it that these laws invariably come from the party of less government? What is their goal?
It has been amply demonstrated that there is no legitimate need for voter id laws, and also that they disproportionally effect minority voters...but, no, that surely doesn't have anything to do with it.

Without the means to go to the post office, DMV or several other places that offer ID, how are they getting the the polls to vote? If they want to do it, they will. It isn't difficult. I had to request a birth certificate the first time I got a passport-not that tough.
If the only thing in life you needed an official IF for was to vote that would be one that, but you need it for every adult responsibility. It's part of being an adult and living life. And I don't know why you make it seem so very difficult to obtain one, it isn't. Not if you're here legally anyway, and even then you can still get a driver's license in most cases. If obtaining an ID is too big of an obstacle in life for someone, then I'm sorry to say they will have a rough road ahead.

Again, it's easy for you because you can't imagine and empathize with a lower socioeconomic lifestyle.

If there was evidence of voting abuse, the issue would be conpletely different, but there isn't. That begs the question of why you want to impose restrictions on others???

rgambs said:

It's don't know how it works everywhere, but I have to register to vote once (for free), and if I vote regularly I don't have to register again. When I vote, they check my name off the list. If someone else voted using my name, they would know it and have evidence to show it. No ID required.
No ID needed.

Exactly. Voter fraud is NOT a real issue, yet they want to keep 25,000,000 eligible voters from voting, the majority of whom are minorities. There is no real reason for them to do this. In an ideal world yes, everyone should show their ID. But God knows this isn't an ideal world, and trying to solve a problem that doesn't even really exist by keeping millions of people from voting is clearly an initiative of some motive besides preventing voter fraud.

Let us not forget that the people pushing for this also do THIS:

https://youtu.be/SrBLxAt63Ks

Voting integrity clearly has absolutely nothing to do with ID reform. It is all about suppressing votes. I really can't beleive that anyone thinks otherwise.

rgambs said:

mace1229 said:

rgambs said:

mace1229 said:

PJ_Soul said:

I really don't see how that matters. People are are totally irresponsible deadbeats (for whatever reason) have a right to vote too.

So even if you forget to register, like the Trumps did? Go ahead and show up and vote?
I don't see the big deal in asking to do something that takes less time to register. And it proves you are who you say you are

You clearly don't understand how difficult it can actually be to get an ID when you don't have luxuries like a car, the internet, and a 40 hr work week. People have shitbag parents that don't bother keeping birth certificates, then you are looking at weeks and months of clerical work to get the documentation you need to vote.
It would be one thing to require this if there was any evidence of voting fraud, but there is practically ZERO evidence.
So why, from a position of privilege, would you make a requirement that you know some less fortunate will fail to meet when there is no evidence of necessity for said requirement?

*edit

And how fucking insulting is it that these laws invariably come from the party of less government? What is their goal?
It has been amply demonstrated that there is no legitimate need for voter id laws, and also that they disproportionally effect minority voters...but, no, that surely doesn't have anything to do with it.

Without the means to go to the post office, DMV or several other places that offer ID, how are they getting the the polls to vote? If they want to do it, they will. It isn't difficult. I had to request a birth certificate the first time I got a passport-not that tough.
If the only thing in life you needed an official IF for was to vote that would be one that, but you need it for every adult responsibility. It's part of being an adult and living life. And I don't know why you make it seem so very difficult to obtain one, it isn't. Not if you're here legally anyway, and even then you can still get a driver's license in most cases. If obtaining an ID is too big of an obstacle in life for someone, then I'm sorry to say they will have a rough road ahead.

Again, it's easy for you because you can't imagine and empathize with a lower socioeconomic lifestyle.

If there was evidence of voting abuse, the issue would be conpletely different, but there isn't. That begs the question of why you want to impose restrictions on others???

I agree that voter fraud is exaggerated. Just as much as I believe voter repression argument is exaggerated as well. Both sides could have something to gain.
I read several articles on the voter ID issue, and for every article stating 10% don't have IDs, I found one that argued it was much closer to 1%. Here are some of the reasons.
Some studies that quote the 10% were only asking for a valid in-state driver's license. College students were at the top of this list because they had an out of state license from their home town. Elderly people were also near the top because many don't drive. However, most elderly do have other forms of ID, and college students do have a driver's license (just out of state). Others without a valid ID were because they had a revoked or suspended driver's license, so when asked if they had a valid driver's license in the survey, they said "no."
So for every article I saw that quoted 10%, I could easily find one that stated the number of registered voters without a valid ID was close to 1%. A fairly large difference. And again, a large portion of that 1% were new college students who never needed an ID before (but would have little difficulty obtaining one, just never needed to).
I do have empathy for the lower socioeconomic lifestyle. Just not necessarily in this circumstance because I still believe in the vast majority of cases it is not beyond a reasonable difficulty level. Its part of being an adult, we have to face hassles. Jury duty for one. I recently had to take 2 days off of work to fight a traffic ticket (and won) and another half day at the DMV to obtain the paperwork so my insurance wouldn't go up. Huge hassle-deal with it.
You need an ID to cash a check, have a bank account, credit card, have a lease. You even need an ID card to use health insurance, which is required by law to have. Without an ID you cant even use the health insurance that you are required to have. So I just don't get why requiring someone once every 10 years to get an ID card that will last another 10 years, for which they need anyway, is beyond reasonable.