Should police pursue in a high speed chase?

brianlux
brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,671
in A Moving Train
The day before yesterday while working at the book store on Main Street, I heard a small engine winding out loudly (which turned out to be a motorcycle) and looked out the front window to see the flash of a police car (might have been a CHP) fly by in a blur. As is usually the case in most small towns, our Main St. is relatively narrow and it's a fairly busy place with lots of people out walking. The whole scene felt very dangerous, especially because my wife had just left to walk down to check out out mid-week farmer's market (she was not harmed) which meant things were very busy downtown that day.

I briefly thought, "That idiot! I hope they catch him!" but then I thought, "Wait, who is wrong here? If the cop weren't pursuing so fast, no danger would have occurred in this situation."

Another person pointed out that many innocent people are killed as a result of high speed chases (below is the first article I came up with at random that talks about that).

Thoughts?


http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2015/07/30/police-pursuits-fatal-injuries/30187827/
"It's a sad and beautiful world"
-Roberto Benigni

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Comments

  • WhatYouTaughtMe
    WhatYouTaughtMe Posts: 4,957
    I would say, unless the person is on a rampage killing people or an immediate danger to others, catch him later. With the technology and cameras everywhere, it has become easier to track people down.
  • hedonist
    hedonist Posts: 24,524
    There are so many that happen out here, and for the most part, the sheriffs, police, CHP, etc. are pretty good at hanging back when warranted (especially since there's typically a helicopter overhead).

    Guess I'm torn between them wanting to get some dangerous asshole off the road - sometimes they drive erratically even without the string of cars behind them - and concern for the innocents just living their lives.
  • PJfanwillneverleave1
    PJfanwillneverleave1 Posts: 12,885
    Should they?
    At times yes.
    Wouldn't want that serial killer to get away.
    Other times no.
    Either way whatever happens from a high speed chase would be criticized from the general 10c public.
    So maybe the cops should do nothing instead.
    That'll learn em.
  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    Tough call we have to leave to their judgement that you hope they will exercise wisely.

    The getaway can't be as simple as racing away from the cop's knowing they won't chase you.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,671
    Yes (to both above) but the more I look into this the more I read about innocent bystanders who have been injured or killed. What I (mostly) heard and (sort of) saw Wednesday was frightening.

    Here are two views of Main St. , Placerville (the first one looking east, the second one looking west). A few years ago another high speed chase was clocked on this street at almost 100 MPH. The one I saw Wednesday was probably between 65 and 75 MPH. Does that kind of chase on this kind of street make sense?

    image

    image
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • hedonist
    hedonist Posts: 24,524
    No it doesn't, B...that looks like a disaster waiting to happen.
  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    brianlux said:

    Yes (to both above) but the more I look into this the more I read about innocent bystanders who have been injured or killed. What I (mostly) heard and (sort of) saw Wednesday was frightening.

    Here are two views of Main St. , Placerville (the first one looking east, the second one looking west). A few years ago another high speed chase was clocked on this street at almost 100 MPH. The one I saw Wednesday was probably between 65 and 75 MPH. Does that kind of chase on this kind of street make sense?

    image

    image

    No.

    But evading law enforcement where the officer stops pursuing because of speed concerns should carry HEAVY penalties.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • PJfanwillneverleave1
    PJfanwillneverleave1 Posts: 12,885
    brianlux said:

    Yes (to both above) but the more I look into this the more I read about innocent bystanders who have been injured or killed. What I (mostly) heard and (sort of) saw Wednesday was frightening.

    Here are two views of Main St. , Placerville (the first one looking east, the second one looking west). A few years ago another high speed chase was clocked on this street at almost 100 MPH. The one I saw Wednesday was probably between 65 and 75 MPH. Does that kind of chase on this kind of street make sense?

    image

    image

    They chose to pursue so I would assume that they should at least be entitled to the same medium of the pursued.
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,671
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

    brianlux said:

    Yes (to both above) but the more I look into this the more I read about innocent bystanders who have been injured or killed. What I (mostly) heard and (sort of) saw Wednesday was frightening.

    Here are two views of Main St. , Placerville (the first one looking east, the second one looking west). A few years ago another high speed chase was clocked on this street at almost 100 MPH. The one I saw Wednesday was probably between 65 and 75 MPH. Does that kind of chase on this kind of street make sense?

    image

    image

    No.

    But evading law enforcement where the officer stops pursuing because of speed concerns should carry HEAVY penalties.
    Definitely, but if they stop pursuit how do they catch them? With all the technology out there, there has to be a better way.

    I wonder how much of this kind of thing is an adrenaline fix for the pursuing cops. How often is it necessary and how often is it just a big thrill kind of thing. I really don't know.
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    brianlux said:

    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

    brianlux said:

    Yes (to both above) but the more I look into this the more I read about innocent bystanders who have been injured or killed. What I (mostly) heard and (sort of) saw Wednesday was frightening.

    Here are two views of Main St. , Placerville (the first one looking east, the second one looking west). A few years ago another high speed chase was clocked on this street at almost 100 MPH. The one I saw Wednesday was probably between 65 and 75 MPH. Does that kind of chase on this kind of street make sense?

    image

    image

    No.

    But evading law enforcement where the officer stops pursuing because of speed concerns should carry HEAVY penalties.
    Definitely, but if they stop pursuit how do they catch them? With all the technology out there, there has to be a better way.

    I wonder how much of this kind of thing is an adrenaline fix for the pursuing cops. How often is it necessary and how often is it just a big thrill kind of thing. I really don't know.
    I'm pretty sure the overwhelming majority of officers would prefer easy peasy detainments and arrests. I don't think cops are looking forward to high speed chases and gun rights.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,671
    PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

    brianlux said:

    Yes (to both above) but the more I look into this the more I read about innocent bystanders who have been injured or killed. What I (mostly) heard and (sort of) saw Wednesday was frightening.

    Here are two views of Main St. , Placerville (the first one looking east, the second one looking west). A few years ago another high speed chase was clocked on this street at almost 100 MPH. The one I saw Wednesday was probably between 65 and 75 MPH. Does that kind of chase on this kind of street make sense?

    image

    image

    They chose to pursue so I would assume that they should at least be entitled to the same medium of the pursued.
    Not sure what you mean PJF.
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • PJfanwillneverleave1
    PJfanwillneverleave1 Posts: 12,885
    brianlux said:

    PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

    brianlux said:

    Yes (to both above) but the more I look into this the more I read about innocent bystanders who have been injured or killed. What I (mostly) heard and (sort of) saw Wednesday was frightening.

    Here are two views of Main St. , Placerville (the first one looking east, the second one looking west). A few years ago another high speed chase was clocked on this street at almost 100 MPH. The one I saw Wednesday was probably between 65 and 75 MPH. Does that kind of chase on this kind of street make sense?

    image

    image

    They chose to pursue so I would assume that they should at least be entitled to the same medium of the pursued.
    Not sure what you mean PJF.
    Equal footing.
    Footchase vs footchase
    car vs car
    whatever medium the suspect choses the police should at least be given the right to match it
  • hedonist
    hedonist Posts: 24,524
    PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

    brianlux said:

    PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

    brianlux said:

    Yes (to both above) but the more I look into this the more I read about innocent bystanders who have been injured or killed. What I (mostly) heard and (sort of) saw Wednesday was frightening.

    Here are two views of Main St. , Placerville (the first one looking east, the second one looking west). A few years ago another high speed chase was clocked on this street at almost 100 MPH. The one I saw Wednesday was probably between 65 and 75 MPH. Does that kind of chase on this kind of street make sense?

    image

    image

    They chose to pursue so I would assume that they should at least be entitled to the same medium of the pursued.
    Not sure what you mean PJF.
    Equal footing.
    Footchase vs footchase
    car vs car
    whatever medium the suspect choses the police should at least be given the right to match it
    I would pay to see a segway vs segway chase.

    (and now I'm thinking of the George-on-scooter chase from Seinfeld)

    Sorry, Brian. No more derailing on my part =)
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,671
    hedonist said:

    PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

    brianlux said:

    PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

    brianlux said:

    Yes (to both above) but the more I look into this the more I read about innocent bystanders who have been injured or killed. What I (mostly) heard and (sort of) saw Wednesday was frightening.

    Here are two views of Main St. , Placerville (the first one looking east, the second one looking west). A few years ago another high speed chase was clocked on this street at almost 100 MPH. The one I saw Wednesday was probably between 65 and 75 MPH. Does that kind of chase on this kind of street make sense?

    image

    image

    They chose to pursue so I would assume that they should at least be entitled to the same medium of the pursued.
    Not sure what you mean PJF.
    Equal footing.
    Footchase vs footchase
    car vs car
    whatever medium the suspect choses the police should at least be given the right to match it
    I would pay to see a segway vs segway chase.

    (and now I'm thinking of the George-on-scooter chase from Seinfeld)

    Sorry, Brian. No more derailing on my part =)
    Ohhhh yeah, ah hu... :lol:
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 44,766
    edited September 2015
    law of averages says it will happen. thats why THIS particular jusrisdiction ( my county) says when its unreasonable risk to public or deputy to break off. Means shit when the deputy ignores this. wasn't even the primary persuer
    The street this happened on is in a pretty densely populated section of town with a lot of side streets and alleys and is fairly narrow commpared to newer neighborhoods. kids on foot and bikes, moms and dads pushing strollers etc......

    http://www.10tv.com/content/stories/2015/07/30/columbus-ohio-video-shows-franklin-co.-deputy-was-driving-over-100-mph-during-deadly-crash.html
    Post edited by mickeyrat on
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
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  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    mickeyrat said:

    law of averages says it will happen. thats why THIS particular jusrisdiction ( my county) says when its unreasonable risk to public or deputy to break off. Means shit when the deputy ignores this. wasn't even the primary persuer
    The street this happened on is in a pretty densely populated section of town with a lot of side streets and alleys and is fairly narrow commpared to newer neighborhoods. kids on foot and bikes, moms and dads pushing strollers etc......

    http://www.10tv.com/content/stories/2015/07/30/columbus-ohio-video-shows-franklin-co.-deputy-was-driving-over-100-mph-during-deadly-crash.html

    I'm sorry. You're not going to like what I'm going to say:

    F**king stupid people.

    Number 1 stupid person: the idiot in the left lane that almost reluctantly pulls over to the right lane (let alone the curb as you are required to do).

    Number 2 stupid person: the driver of the van. I say this reluctantly because I fear this is the victim. But... why are you pulling out trying to 'beat the police car in pursuit of something'?

    Number 3 stupid person: the cop... 'if' the pursuit was something petty and not even remotely close to being necessary.

    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 44,766
    edited September 2015
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

    mickeyrat said:

    law of averages says it will happen. thats why THIS particular jusrisdiction ( my county) says when its unreasonable risk to public or deputy to break off. Means shit when the deputy ignores this. wasn't even the primary persuer
    The street this happened on is in a pretty densely populated section of town with a lot of side streets and alleys and is fairly narrow commpared to newer neighborhoods. kids on foot and bikes, moms and dads pushing strollers etc......

    http://www.10tv.com/content/stories/2015/07/30/columbus-ohio-video-shows-franklin-co.-deputy-was-driving-over-100-mph-during-deadly-crash.html

    I'm sorry. You're not going to like what I'm going to say:

    F**king stupid people.

    Number 1 stupid person: the idiot in the left lane that almost reluctantly pulls over to the right lane (let alone the curb as you are required to do).

    Number 2 stupid person: the driver of the van. I say this reluctantly because I fear this is the victim. But... why are you pulling out trying to 'beat the police car in pursuit of something'?

    Number 3 stupid person: the cop... 'if' the pursuit was something petty and not even remotely close to being necessary.

    the suspect had bailed from his vehicle and it had become a foot pursuit. He was driving that fast for a FOOT PURSUIT!!!!!!!!! This deputy had ZERO reason to be traveling at such a rate of speed in this area given the nature of the call at that time he was joining in coming to aid of the arresting deputy.

    http://www.10tv.com/content/stories/2015/07/13/columbus-ohio-franklin-county-deputy-responding-to-pursuit-slams-into-van-killing-driver.html
    Post edited by mickeyrat on
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    mickeyrat said:

    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

    mickeyrat said:

    law of averages says it will happen. thats why THIS particular jusrisdiction ( my county) says when its unreasonable risk to public or deputy to break off. Means shit when the deputy ignores this. wasn't even the primary persuer
    The street this happened on is in a pretty densely populated section of town with a lot of side streets and alleys and is fairly narrow commpared to newer neighborhoods. kids on foot and bikes, moms and dads pushing strollers etc......

    http://www.10tv.com/content/stories/2015/07/30/columbus-ohio-video-shows-franklin-co.-deputy-was-driving-over-100-mph-during-deadly-crash.html

    I'm sorry. You're not going to like what I'm going to say:

    F**king stupid people.

    Number 1 stupid person: the idiot in the left lane that almost reluctantly pulls over to the right lane (let alone the curb as you are required to do).

    Number 2 stupid person: the driver of the van. I say this reluctantly because I fear this is the victim. But... why are you pulling out trying to 'beat the police car in pursuit of something'?

    Number 3 stupid person: the cop... 'if' the pursuit was something petty and not even remotely close to being necessary.

    the suspect had bailed from his vehicle and it had become a foot pursuit. He was driving that fast for a FOOT PURSUIT!!!!!!!!! This deputy had ZERO reason to be traveling at such a rate of speed in this area given the nature of the call at that time he was joining in coming to aid of the arresting deputy.

    .
    So the cop is definitively Number 3 stupid person and arguably Number 1 stupid person.

    The other drivers I referenced don't get a pass for ignoring basic and essential rules of the road: we know, through hindsight, that this high speed pursuit was unnecessary, but if it was a different scenario where lives were in danger... these drivers couldn't have discerned- they made themselves hazards for an emergency vehicle.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • chadwick
    chadwick up my ass Posts: 21,157
    mickeyrat said:

    law of averages says it will happen. thats why THIS particular jusrisdiction ( my county) says when its unreasonable risk to public or deputy to break off. Means shit when the deputy ignores this. wasn't even the primary persuer
    The street this happened on is in a pretty densely populated section of town with a lot of side streets and alleys and is fairly narrow commpared to newer neighborhoods. kids on foot and bikes, moms and dads pushing strollers etc......

    http://www.10tv.com/content/stories/2015/07/30/columbus-ohio-video-shows-franklin-co.-deputy-was-driving-over-100-mph-during-deadly-crash.html

    that is terrible. a bit much coming from the cop. dude thinks he's a marvel superhero or something
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."
    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 44,766
    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

    mickeyrat said:

    Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

    mickeyrat said:

    law of averages says it will happen. thats why THIS particular jusrisdiction ( my county) says when its unreasonable risk to public or deputy to break off. Means shit when the deputy ignores this. wasn't even the primary persuer
    The street this happened on is in a pretty densely populated section of town with a lot of side streets and alleys and is fairly narrow commpared to newer neighborhoods. kids on foot and bikes, moms and dads pushing strollers etc......

    http://www.10tv.com/content/stories/2015/07/30/columbus-ohio-video-shows-franklin-co.-deputy-was-driving-over-100-mph-during-deadly-crash.html

    I'm sorry. You're not going to like what I'm going to say:

    F**king stupid people.

    Number 1 stupid person: the idiot in the left lane that almost reluctantly pulls over to the right lane (let alone the curb as you are required to do).

    Number 2 stupid person: the driver of the van. I say this reluctantly because I fear this is the victim. But... why are you pulling out trying to 'beat the police car in pursuit of something'?

    Number 3 stupid person: the cop... 'if' the pursuit was something petty and not even remotely close to being necessary.

    the suspect had bailed from his vehicle and it had become a foot pursuit. He was driving that fast for a FOOT PURSUIT!!!!!!!!! This deputy had ZERO reason to be traveling at such a rate of speed in this area given the nature of the call at that time he was joining in coming to aid of the arresting deputy.

    .
    So the cop is definitively Number 3 stupid person and arguably Number 1 stupid person.

    The other drivers I referenced don't get a pass for ignoring basic and essential rules of the road: we know, through hindsight, that this high speed pursuit was unnecessary, but if it was a different scenario where lives were in danger... these drivers couldn't have discerned- they made themselves hazards for an emergency vehicle.
    From this post I take it you could adequately figure rate of speed and get out of the way in time? Kinda doubt many could really.

    Any number of legal and otherwise distractions behind the wheel gets in the way of full sight and sound attention not to mention human thought is probably the biggest.

    NO reason for that rate of speed EVER in a 35 mph area.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14

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