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Charlie Hebdo Paris shooting: 12 dead after gunmen storm newspaper's HQ

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  • badbrainsbadbrains Posts: 10,255
    I'd say assads been doing a pretty good job in "his" country fighting 2 enemies and having the west arming both enemies. No? Oh and he's also having to walk on egg shells with Israel even though they keep meddling in his affairs.
  • benjsbenjs Toronto, ONPosts: 8,450
    edited February 2015
    Godfather. wrote: »
    "Perhaps Godfathers thoughts on 'wiping them all out' mean wiping out the entire group of IS militants and not the billion plus muslims in the world."

    Godfather,

    I don't think you're a bigot who would call for the annihilation of all Muslims of the world.

    I personally owe you an apology: there was ambiguity in the statement you made about 'wiping them out', and I should have been more analytical before commenting on it, especially because it was an attack on character, which was juvenile and irresponsible of me.

    Looking back, at most, your comment about 'wiping them all out' was naive (but not inhumane) in the sense that, if IS militants could be wiped out in a way without a new wave sprouting up in their place, and if IS militants could be wiped out in a way that civilian casualties could be avoided, clearly this would have already been done. Moving forward, these poor innocent people in the devastated portions of the world at the hands of these monsters have suffered enough: what's left of their quality of life ought to be seen as sacred, and protected at all costs. I believe humanity owes them that: not to indiscriminately or rashly invade and attack, before factoring in the reason for the civil strife, and the results that could come from either intervening or not. AKA, let a cost/benefit analysis be done, consider the possible outcomes, act from there.
    '05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2

    EV
    Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
  • pdalowskypdalowsky Doncaster,UKPosts: 13,920
    badbrains wrote: »
    I'd say assads been doing a pretty good job in "his" country fighting 2 enemies and having the west arming both enemies. No? Oh and he's also having to walk on egg shells with Israel even though they keep meddling in his affairs.

    no not really. I don't agree. But lets move on.
  • badbrainsbadbrains Posts: 10,255
    Everyone's entitled to their own opinion and I'll respect u on that.
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon HeadstoniaPosts: 28,141
    Godfather. wrote: »
    "Perhaps Godfathers thoughts on 'wiping them all out' mean wiping out the entire group of IS militants and not the billion plus muslims in the world."

    Most took it this way.

    he made this comment about all middle easterners before ISIS even was on the radar. but whatever. he can deny it all he wants.

    (Track 10 of The Headstones' Nickels For Your Nightmares)


  • badbrainsbadbrains Posts: 10,255
    Sounds like someone's backtracking
  • benjsbenjs Toronto, ONPosts: 8,450
    paulonious wrote: »
    Godfather. wrote: »
    "Perhaps Godfathers thoughts on 'wiping them all out' mean wiping out the entire group of IS militants and not the billion plus muslims in the world."

    Most took it this way.

    he made this comment about all middle easterners before ISIS even was on the radar. but whatever. he can deny it all he wants.

    At least the one I remember, it was ambiguous and could have been perceived as being about either of extremists or Muslims.

    I don't think it's here nor there though: as was said before, we are all here to discuss a topic. Why let the discussion pivot to the quality or morality of the members discussing, rather than the topic we're all emotionally invested in? I'm guilty of this myself, but I think we should aspire to get back on track.
    '05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2

    EV
    Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon HeadstoniaPosts: 28,141
    benjs wrote: »
    paulonious wrote: »
    Godfather. wrote: »
    "Perhaps Godfathers thoughts on 'wiping them all out' mean wiping out the entire group of IS militants and not the billion plus muslims in the world."

    Most took it this way.

    he made this comment about all middle easterners before ISIS even was on the radar. but whatever. he can deny it all he wants.

    At least the one I remember, it was ambiguous and could have been perceived as being about either of extremists or Muslims.

    I don't think it's here nor there though: as was said before, we are all here to discuss a topic. Why let the discussion pivot to the quality or morality of the members discussing, rather than the topic we're all emotionally invested in? I'm guilty of this myself, but I think we should aspire to get back on track.

    well, when someone makes a statement, and then backtracks on it, and not only that, insults others in the process, I call them out on it. but yes, it is getting redundunt, so let's move on.

    (Track 10 of The Headstones' Nickels For Your Nightmares)


  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 22,712
    Seems the board really can't help itself , making it about a poster rather than the topic at hand.

    12 people are still dead another 5 in the aftermath for a tasteless attack on religion.

    I wonder if ole charlie goes after athiesm with as much seeming glee as it does Islam. It IS a growing belief system.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon HeadstoniaPosts: 28,141
    not believing in something, in my opinion, is not a belief system.
    (Track 10 of The Headstones' Nickels For Your Nightmares)


  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 22,712
    Its humanist is it not?
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon HeadstoniaPosts: 28,141
    mickeyrat wrote: »
    Its humanist is it not?

    depends. not all atheists are humanists. there are apparently quite a few different classifications of people who don't believe in a higher power.

    not trying to split hairs, here, I just thought you meant atheism on its own was a belief system.

    (Track 10 of The Headstones' Nickels For Your Nightmares)


  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 22,712
    Ok. Asked a different way, has Ole Charlie gone after the nonbelievers with the same zeal that they have shown toward Islam and to a lesser extent the other major religious beliefs? You know, the blanket statements etc....
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • pdalowskypdalowsky Doncaster,UKPosts: 13,920
    I'm an aethiest, and I couldn't give a monkeys what that is in terms of a belief system. I prefer to think of it as my own rationality
  • mickeyrat wrote: »
    Ok. Asked a different way, has Ole Charlie gone after the nonbelievers with the same zeal that they have shown toward Islam and to a lesser extent the other major religious beliefs? You know, the blanket statements etc....

    If atheists in the name of atheism start acting like dickheads... I'll go after them. Point me to where they have and I'll begin.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon HeadstoniaPosts: 28,141
    mickeyrat wrote: »
    Ok. Asked a different way, has Ole Charlie gone after the nonbelievers with the same zeal that they have shown toward Islam and to a lesser extent the other major religious beliefs? You know, the blanket statements etc....

    why would they? or better yet, HOW would they? it's difficult to make fun of nothing/science. not sure how you would go after atheists at all. mock them for knowing the earth is millions of years old and that it revolves around the sun and take the bus or walk for an apple instead of driving a humvee down the block for a 2L slurpee?

    (Track 10 of The Headstones' Nickels For Your Nightmares)


  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon HeadstoniaPosts: 28,141
    pdalowsky wrote: »
    I'm an aethiest, and I couldn't give a monkeys what that is in terms of a belief system. I prefer to think of it as my own rationality

    yeah, I think many, or even most, atheists don't really think about it at all, to be honest.

    (Track 10 of The Headstones' Nickels For Your Nightmares)


  • Last-12-ExitLast-12-Exit Charleston, SCPosts: 8,661
    paulonious wrote: »
    not believing in something, in my opinion, is not a belief system.

    This I agree with 10000000000000000000%
  • pdalowskypdalowsky Doncaster,UKPosts: 13,920
    Charlie pretty much ripped the piss out of Islam but never seemed to go anywhere other tham taking the piss out of real issues.. I've seen the same mockery of Christians many a time....
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 22,712
    Charlie Hebdo: Proud to provoke Islamists, despite violence
    By ANGELA CHARLTON and LORI HINNANT
    29 Oct 2020

    PARIS (AP) — It’s been targeted again and again, threatened and firebombed and struck in an attack that killed a dozen staff members, but satirical French newspaper Charlie Hebdo won’t stop poking fun at Islamic extremism.

    The newspaper's many critics worldwide say its editorial staff is attacking Islam itself; the people who work for Charlie Hebdo says they are calling out intolerance, oppression and a political form of Islam that threatens democracy. But with freedom of expression as its credo, the publication routinely pushes the limits of French hate speech laws with often sexually explicit caricatures that take on or offend nearly everyone.

    Its decision to publish new cartoons this week ridiculing its opponents in the Islamic world formed the backdrop for yet another attack Thursday in France, where three people were fatally attacked in a church.

    Charlie Hebdo has lampooned dead child migrants, virus victims, dying drug addicts, world leaders, neo-Nazis, popes, bishops, Jewish leaders, and other religious, political and entertainment figures. This week's issue features a cartoon of the funeral of a beheaded teacher, showing officers carrying two coffins, one for the body, one for the head.

    Since a trial opened last month over the 2015 attack that killed 12 of its cartoonists, the newspaper has chronicled the proceedings daily and devoted nearly half of its weekly covers to mocking Islamic extremism,

    “We need strong actions to stop Islamism but also to condemn the slightest gesture, the slightest intolerant or hateful word toward French people of immigrant backgrounds. Because France isn't divided between Muslims and non-Muslims, between believers and non-believers, between people with French roots and French people of immigrant backgrounds," read this week’s editorial from Charlie Hebdo's editor, who goes by the name Riss. “No, France is divided between democrats and anti-democrats,”

    The paper’s circulation is small, and many French people find it disgusting or extreme, but defend its right to exist.

    The paper drew ire for reprinting caricatures of the Muslim Prophet Muhammad originally published by a Danish magazine in 2005 and republished the following year by Charlie Hebdo . Those cartoons were seen as sacrilegious in Islam, and many Muslims worldwide felt genuinely hurt by them — but condemned the violence that has come in response.

    In 2011, Charlie Hebdo’s offices were firebombed after it published a spoof issue that “invited” the prophet to be its guest editor. His caricature was on the cover.

    A year later, the newspaper published more Muhammad drawings amid an uproar over an anti-Muslim film. The cartoons depicted Muhammad naked and in demeaning or pornographic poses. The French government defended free speech even as it rebuked Charlie Hebdo for fanning tensions.

    Full Coverage:
     

    In January 2015, two French-born al-Qaida extremists angered by the caricatures stormed its newsroom and killed 12 people, including the chief editor and several cartoonists.

    Charlie Hebdo hasn’t backed down. The day the trial into that 2015 attack opened, it reprinted the original prophet caricatures.

    Weeks later, a Pakistani youth stabbed two people outside Charlie Hebdo’s former offices, citing the republished cartoons. On Oct. 16, a Chechen refugee beheaded a teacher outside Paris who had shown the caricatures to his class, for a debate about free expression.

    In response, French President Emmanuel Macron firmly defended Charlie Hebdo’s freedom to print caricatures and spoke out against Islamism, drawing protests and calls for boycotts around the Muslim world, as well as calls for violence against France from some extremist voices.

    Sonia Mejri, the disenchanted French widow of the Islamic State commander who recruited one of the 2015 attackers, testified from prison during the trial. At the end of her testimony, she addressed a message to Charlie Hebdo’s journalists, including those sitting in the courtroom.

    “Don’t stop. It’s important. It’s truly what they detest the most," Mejri said. "You represent liberty. What they want is to create a malaise in society.”



    had missed this when first published..... covid being so dominant and all. plus fuckstick.




    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
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