Global warming

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  • polaris_x
    polaris_x Posts: 13,559
    Last-12-Exit said:

    Nothing proves a point better than a graph. Good job with that. But it's totally irrelevant to my point. Which is the EPA and the president has made it very expensive to burn coal. When Obama took office, my company was thriving, now we are shutting down plants. A direct result of new epa regulations. Obviously, Obama knows he cant eliminate coal fired power plants. He can make them pay. That's what he is doing. That's the crackdown.

    dude ... you said the US HAS cracked down on emissions ... just go back to page 1 ... if you want to say the US has cracked down on coal plants - that's another thing ... ultimately we are talking about emissions as a country and yes china is #1 and growing but the US is #2 and not slowing ... so, why ignore the issue domestically and only focus on china ...
  • polaris_x
    polaris_x Posts: 13,559
    edited January 2014
    mapping of temperature around the world for the past 60 years time lapsed


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=gaJJtS_WDmI
  • Jason P
    Jason P Posts: 19,295
    Polaris, emissions are a huge part of my life. Every decision I make has to be checked by my safety / health / environmental manager to make sure it is within our EPA allowed limits. It's the first question that comes up ... How does it effect emissions? ... a small bump might require a formal report and a six month review before I can do anything. A major bump will take a major cost study that takes six month to collect, followed by a formal report, and then a one year review before the EPA tells me to proceed or 'eff off.

    There may have been a time when companies were free to pollute and do whatever they wanted to do ... those days are over. People go to jail now.

    The EPA and lawyers ... One Ring to rule them all, One Ring to find them, One Ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them
    Be Excellent To Each Other
    Party On, Dudes!
  • riotgrl
    riotgrl LOUISVILLE Posts: 1,895
    EPA regulations might be followed but there are huge gaps in the regulations especially in regards to our knowledge of long term impact upon both humans and the environment. Regulations seem to be a bit piecemeal - are there requirements for how often the EPA and these industries have to revamp/reevaluate regulations? I'm gonna assume probably not since the chemical leak in WV revolved, in part, on inadequate data. NPR did a follow up story about the chemical spill in WV that examined these exact factors.

    npr.org/2014/01/29/268201454/how-industrial-chemical-regulation-failed-west-virginia
    Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?

    Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...

    I AM MINE
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    Scientists have determined that until carbon in the atmosphere is brought down to 350 PPM the global climate will continue to warm. That is why 350.org is an international organization working to do just that. I know, I'm sounding like a promo ad here but if this matters to you, maybe check them out here:

    http://350.org/
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • polaris_x
    polaris_x Posts: 13,559
    Jason P said:

    Polaris, emissions are a huge part of my life. Every decision I make has to be checked by my safety / health / environmental manager to make sure it is within our EPA allowed limits. It's the first question that comes up ... How does it effect emissions? ... a small bump might require a formal report and a six month review before I can do anything. A major bump will take a major cost study that takes six month to collect, followed by a formal report, and then a one year review before the EPA tells me to proceed or 'eff off.

    There may have been a time when companies were free to pollute and do whatever they wanted to do ... those days are over. People go to jail now.

    The EPA and lawyers ... One Ring to rule them all, One Ring to find them, One Ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them

    that is good to hear but at the end of the day ... emissions are still expected to grow and the US is still a major contributor globally ... how can you say that everything's fine in the US and let's just worry about china when that simply is not the case ...
  • Jason P
    Jason P Posts: 19,295
    Everything isn't fine but attitudes are improving. Just trying to provide some insight versus the doom and gloom that America / Corporations is running wild without control.

    Corporations like money. Having poor safety and environmental records cost corporations lots of money. Thus, corporations hire people that drive me nuts to make sure I don't bend the rules (not that I would).

    I have an environmental permit 3-ring binder that is so big that I think I would have to get a custom-made binder if I wanted to make it bigger.
    Be Excellent To Each Other
    Party On, Dudes!
  • polaris_x
    polaris_x Posts: 13,559
    Jason P said:

    Everything isn't fine but attitudes are improving. Just trying to provide some insight versus the doom and gloom that America / Corporations is running wild without control.

    Corporations like money. Having poor safety and environmental records cost corporations lots of money. Thus, corporations hire people that drive me nuts to make sure I don't bend the rules (not that I would).

    I have an environmental permit 3-ring binder that is so big that I think I would have to get a custom-made binder if I wanted to make it bigger.

    first of all - the US continues to be one of the largest populations that still doubt global warming and man's impact ... secondly, we both know that these regulations can be gone in a couple of years if and when a republican administration takes over ... thirdly, if you understand the consequences of global warming - it is in fact doom and gloom ... it is already doom and gloom ... i don't mean to say it in a confrontational way ... but more matter of fact ...

    even if emissions were to level off - the consequences are still bad ... we need a full on reduction not a stabilization or a small decrease ... we need a huge decrease ...

    i understand tho that it gets tiring hearing about all the shitty stuff ... i can't really do anything about it ... i'm just not gonna sit here while people want to pretend things are getting better when they are not ...
  • rgambs
    rgambs Posts: 13,576
    It is cheaper for the mega-corps (ex. Massey, Chesapeake, Exxon) to pay fines for violations than to fix problems. Even if it isn't cheaper over time, the short sight of corps' boards' ensures they will avoid the cost of improvement now even if it is healthier in the long run. this is the reality of the american capital system in general. shareholder profit at the expense of company survivability, hell even planetary survivability.
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    I think the US does need to do it's share but global warming is, after all, a global problem. Maybe it's time to look at global solutions. I would be OK with boycotting every product from any country that is not reducing it's carbon input enough to lower it to 350 PPM. That's the number we must reach if we want to keep on going for more than a few generations. And it can be done, absolutely.
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • backseatLover12
    backseatLover12 Posts: 2,312
    edited January 2014
    For Brianlux. https://www.commondreams.org/headline/2013/11/21-0

    Naming Names: The 90 Companies Destroying Our Planet

    http://www.amazon.com/The-Better-World-Shopping-Guide/dp/0865717249

    The Better World Shopping Guide: Every Dollar Makes a Difference (Better World Shopping Guide: Every Dollar Can Make a Difference)
    Post edited by backseatLover12 on
  • polaris_x
    polaris_x Posts: 13,559
    rgambs said:

    It is cheaper for the mega-corps (ex. Massey, Chesapeake, Exxon) to pay fines for violations than to fix problems. Even if it isn't cheaper over time, the short sight of corps' boards' ensures they will avoid the cost of improvement now even if it is healthier in the long run. this is the reality of the american capital system in general. shareholder profit at the expense of company survivability, hell even planetary survivability.

    exactly ... and backseatlover12's post too ...

    fucking corporations are destroying the planet ... and i'm not talking about all corps ... it's just the 100 or so that fucking own this world ...
  • rgambs
    rgambs Posts: 13,576
    buy co-op whenever possible, Cabot farms cheese is my newest favorite co-op product. The "seriously sharp" cheddar will curl your toes and the habanero cheese will straighten them back out and leave you quite warm!
    Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    rgambs said:

    buy co-op whenever possible, Cabot farms cheese is my newest favorite co-op product. The "seriously sharp" cheddar will curl your toes and the habanero cheese will straighten them back out and leave you quite warm!

    Yes! image We belong to our local co-op and love it. We also shop at our local farmer's market. Nothing beats eating locally grown food that's been fresh picked ripe instead of picked green and ripped off-vine. AND the food is not transported as far- less carbon in the atmosphere! CSA's are great also.

    A little off subject but maybe notice the use of the words "local" (adjective) and "locally" (adverb). Next time you see a billboard that say "Shop Local" get yourself some paint and fix it. image

    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • polaris_x
    polaris_x Posts: 13,559
    Tunisia writes climate change into its constitution ... next step is to get the ICC to recognize the impacts caused by climate change ... then we can start taking countries like the US, Canada and China to court ...

    http://www.rtcc.org/2014/01/27/tunisia-embeds-climate-change-in-constitution/
  • riotgrl
    riotgrl LOUISVILLE Posts: 1,895
    brianlux said:

    rgambs said:

    buy co-op whenever possible, Cabot farms cheese is my newest favorite co-op product. The "seriously sharp" cheddar will curl your toes and the habanero cheese will straighten them back out and leave you quite warm!

    Yes! image We belong to our local co-op and love it. We also shop at our local farmer's market. Nothing beats eating locally grown food that's been fresh picked ripe instead of picked green and ripped off-vine. AND the food is not transported as far- less carbon in the atmosphere! CSA's are great also.

    A little off subject but maybe notice the use of the words "local" (adjective) and "locally" (adverb). Next time you see a billboard that say "Shop Local" get yourself some paint and fix it. image


    Buying co-ops are great and you usually have the power to order in bulk and freeze/can things to last through the winter so you don't have to go outside your 'local' area! I am still enjoying corn and tomatoes from the summer which is a win/win for me and the environment!

    image
    Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?

    Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...

    I AM MINE
  • polaris_x
    polaris_x Posts: 13,559
    You guys hear of streetbank.com? it's like a social network for sharing things ...
  • backseatLover12
    backseatLover12 Posts: 2,312
    polaris_x said:

    You guys hear of streetbank.com? it's like a social network for sharing things ...

    Bummer. It's offline.

  • polaris_x
    polaris_x Posts: 13,559
    backseatLover12 said:

    polaris_x said:

    You guys hear of streetbank.com? it's like a social network for sharing things ...

    Bummer. It's offline.

    yeah ... i was just putting my ice cream maker up and it went offline for maintenance ...
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,662
    riotgrl said:

    brianlux said:

    rgambs said:

    buy co-op whenever possible, Cabot farms cheese is my newest favorite co-op product. The "seriously sharp" cheddar will curl your toes and the habanero cheese will straighten them back out and leave you quite warm!

    Yes! image We belong to our local co-op and love it. We also shop at our local farmer's market. Nothing beats eating locally grown food that's been fresh picked ripe instead of picked green and ripped off-vine. AND the food is not transported as far- less carbon in the atmosphere! CSA's are great also.

    A little off subject but maybe notice the use of the words "local" (adjective) and "locally" (adverb). Next time you see a billboard that say "Shop Local" get yourself some paint and fix it. image


    Buying co-ops are great and you usually have the power to order in bulk and freeze/can things to last through the winter so you don't have to go outside your 'local' area! I am still enjoying corn and tomatoes from the summer which is a win/win for me and the environment!

    image
    Fresh tomatoes and corn are great but I must confess, I've never had "local". Is it a little bit like rutabagas or closer to kohlrabi ?

    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

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