Whats going wrong with the world? More shootings

dimitrispearljam wrote:

i just post it..cos she just drop her kid at 1st day of kindergarten..and for a moment pass my mind this thought,and i freak out. and freeze......

i am with you, friend. i'm scared for everyone too. however, lots of smart and safe people out there keeping an eye on things and most folks are not doing killings

^^^^another idea..yeah i have some. get rid of assault rifles and automatic weapons and hang gang members who terrorize communities. and ban carrying concealed weapons altogether so no one shoots themselves in the ass or balls or another innocent person(s)

pandora wrote:

Guns are here to stay legal or otherwise but mental illness
and crime does not need to be.



Another other positive ideas?

there was crime before there were guns... also it's easier to eradicate guns than it is to eradicate mental illness and crime.

and you dont want your gun laws tighter or stricter but you want to force a doctor to work for free one day a week?

holy fascism batman

pandora wrote:

EmBleve wrote:

comebackgirl wrote:

Pandora - I think the idea of walk-in clinics where people can be immediately assessed and begin treatment would be wonderful. What are your ideas about how to pay for them? And to accommodate clients that are uninsured? There's already a demand for therapists and psychiatrists (the wait lists are long even for those with insurance), so we'd also have to fill that gap. They require advanced degrees, so how would we help people obtain the necessary education and training to fill the demand?

:corn:

that little guy and it always gives me a craving for popcorn
just cute

The awareness of mental illness, the campaign to rid the stigma,
has begun sometime ago. More people realize this is a physical ailment,
that often runs in families. Now is the time to go beyond
that and address how we can help the masses who can not help themselves.

I think doctors should serve pro bono required one day a week,
just as lawyers often do ,
though I don't believe that is required but should be.
That would include anyone in the field, a mandatory for state licensing.
It could also be required for doctors not in that special field,
as physical testing etc is required to diagnose.
Of course tax deductable/ tax break for this.

Landowners with empty space could donate the physical space.
Volunteers of all walks of life could help, everyone knows someone who
needs mental illness care and will respond.
Large corporations could donate product needed to prepare spaces.
The big pharm could donate needed drugs.

As with the forest preservation could the sales of guns help finance this
or is that too much to expect to ask? Seeing that we know mental illness
can be a factor in gun murders and general crime.

Church and other private foundations ...
could they donate to preserve the value of life in general,
unconnected to gun violence?
Peace and happiness is found in a healthy mind.

Well we are already required to work pro bono in the field for 2 years as interns in order to be qualified for state licensure. My center could not run without the help of interns, but it still really isn't enough to fill the need. Clients still have to wait for non-emergency services. Requiring ongoing pro bono work would be punishing an already exhausted system and clinicians who are undervalued and underpaid. Therapists are required to have a minimum of 60 graduate credits (whereas many programs such as engineering only require 30) and therefore pay about twice the amount for their education. In addition, they carry the costs of licensure and malpractice insurance, continuing education credits of 30 per year, and costs of certifications (separate from licensure). Most make about 35k - 45k per year. Many already work 2 jobs and volunteer in other capacities. Therapists and doctors who are already so overburdened and overbooked that they have waiting lists months long, so I'm not sure where they would find another day per week to donate in their already overbooked schedules. It's a nice idea, but I think it would only work if clinicians are paid a salary equivalent to those of lawyers (and if we start being allowed to bill for every phone call, email and letter!)

We do rely on volunteers, but you cannot work with a client in any sort of clinical capacity without specialized education. It's too risky. Most centers have trained access counselors to schedule appointments, because even that takes skill and training when working with population. Due to confidentiality, they would not be able to assist with record maintenance or most of the paperwork we need to do.

I would love to see churches and private foundations donate money to fund services. Some already do. Would this be a requirement? Maybe every company that makes over a certain amount per year could be required to fund programs. I think it would be hard to get buy in since the people we serve are under valued. Pharmaceutical companies do provide some assistance for clients who lack insurance. We access that all the time, but it's not enough to meet the need.

It's a nice thought, having the community share the burden, but unless the government requires it, I don't see it happening at a scale to preserve or strengthen an already burdened system.

pandora wrote:

chadwick wrote:

^^^^another idea..yeah i have some. get rid of assault rifles and automatic weapons and hang gang members who terrorize communities. and ban carrying concealed weapons altogether so no one shoots themselves in the ass or balls or another innocent person(s)

yes take away rights is your choice ...


alrighty then :fp:

nothing to do with rights... it's all to do with safety and I'm sorry but the right to bear arms means less safety for everyone and this is obviously proven int he rate of gun related injuries and deaths in America.

pandora wrote:

dunkman wrote:

pandora wrote:

Guns are here to stay legal or otherwise but mental illness
and crime does not need to be.



Another other positive ideas?

there was crime before there were guns... also it's easier to eradicate guns than it is to eradicate mental illness and crime.

and you dont want your gun laws tighter or stricter but you want to force a doctor to work for free one day a week?



holy fascism batman

But why would someone not want to eradicate mental illness and crime?
At least try to address the cause?

Help people who need help who have none?

I bet that doctor would feel really good at the end of that day...
is that something you can embrace?

can you and your husband afford to work for free to help the homeless? no? well, this is the same premise...

Zoso wrote:

I love the idea of mental health clinics to assist in the effort to stop these incidents but here is the issue:

- most people who commit gun crimes aren't mentally ill in any definition
- mental health is something that is ALWAYS swept under the carper in EVERY country and is ALWAYS the last priority of any government liberal or conservative, dictatorship or socialist.
- the current social welfare, social services industry is an breaking point both here and around the world how would these places be staffed when no one wants to work for $14.00 with masters degree's..
- Pandora you want the workers to work for free? It's unsustainable and naive to think ANYONE in the middle class can work free in this environment

Agreed. Therapists at my last agency are making $30k per year. Licensed therapists with Masters Degrees who have already worked pro bono for two years. This might be feasible if they were earning salaries anywhere close to lawyers. No wonder we're having trouble getting people who want to enter the field. They already don't make much and now we want them to work one day per week for free. Like getting blood from a stone. We're already undervalued. I make a decent salary, but it's still less than my co-workers in other departments who have less experience, less education, no need for licensure and no burden of making suicide and homicide assessments...and I make that salary by working 2 jobs and 15 hour days. Counseling services is just not valued.

pandora wrote:

dunkman wrote:

pandora wrote:

Guns are here to stay legal or otherwise but mental illness
and crime does not need to be.



Another other positive ideas?

there was crime before there were guns... also it's easier to eradicate guns than it is to eradicate mental illness and crime.

and you dont want your gun laws tighter or stricter but you want to force a doctor to work for free one day a week?



holy fascism batman

But why would someone not want to eradicate mental illness and crime?
At least try to address the cause?

Help people who need help who have none?

I bet that doctor would feel really good at the end of that day...
is that something you can embrace?

Mental illness and crime are not one in the same. To post again "According to Columbia University psychiatrist Paul Appelbaum, less than 3—5% of American crimes involve people with mental illness, and the percentages of these crimes that involve guns are actually lower than the national average—"

I assure you - doctors and therapist help people every single day and we feel pretty good about it.

pandora wrote:

But why would someone not want to eradicate mental illness and crime?
At least try to address the cause?

Help people who need help who have none?

I bet that doctor would feel really good at the end of that day...
is that something you can embrace?

But why would someone not want to eradicate guns and innocent deaths?

your right to be alive is more important than your right to own a gun don't you think?

plus it's easier to control guns/gun laws than it is to eradicate mental illness and crime.... what you're asking for is the same as asking for world peace and zero famine.... just never gonna happen.

some people who have a mental illness dont even KNOW they have a mental illness.... how would you solve that?