Whites Five Times Richer Than Blacks In U.S

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  • _
    _ Posts: 6,657
    HeidiJam wrote:
    scb wrote:
    HeidiJam wrote:
    poor people and ethnic minorities don't care about education - There seems to be overwhelming evidence for this.
    Poor children stay out playing on the streets too late - i guess you see nothing wrong with that.

    Please provide the overwhelming evidence that poor people and ethnic minorities don't care about education. Also, did you ever find out what percentage of poor children stay out playing on the streets too late?
    Look at my post at the top of the page. There is your evidence.
    There is no percentage for poor children that stay out late in the streets. But there have been several posters other than me who have commented on that. I don't know why you are trying to debate that.

    Huh?? :? You mean this link?? How on earth does that provide overwhelming evidence that poor people and ethnic minorities don't care about education??? That conclusion makes absolutely no sense whatsoever! It's not even in the same ballpark. :?

    How many times do I have to tell you that I'm not debating that there are some kids that stay out too late?? I know - you've seen them... cincy's seen them... I get that. But you are asserting that what you have seen is generalizable to entire races and income levels of people and you have ABSOLUTELY ZERO proof to back that up.

    My first boyfriend, who was a man, had no testicles. Therefore, since you are a man, I believe that you have no testicles. Must be true. I've seen men without testicles. Other people have seen it to.
  • _
    _ Posts: 6,657
    HeidiJam wrote:
    Its not.

    Huh?? :? :? I have no idea what this is referring to.
  • Blockhead
    Blockhead Posts: 1,538
    This is clearly going no where.
    There is a reason why their education graduation rate is so low. You can continue to blame the system for everyone of thier problems.
    I am going to go with my opinion that since there is no progression being made and welfare and foodstams are on the continual rise as well as prison, that its a personal responsible thing.
    AA GIVES them jobs they are not qualified for. How does that no piss you off.
    I assume you would be all for reperations to right?
    And just because ther are poor with no money or savings and on welfare they should still have the same privliges that i work my ass of for?

    In this thread - people who are afraid to be hard on minorities for not making progress because they don't want to be labled a racist so they create excuses for them and make up unmeasureable things like healing of oppression.
  • _
    _ Posts: 6,657
    HeidiJam wrote:
    This is clearly going no where.
    There is a reason why their education graduation rate is so low. You can continue to blame the system for everyone of thier problems.
    I am going to go with my opinion that since there is no progression being made and welfare and foodstams are on the continual rise as well as prison, that its a personal responsible thing.
    AA GIVES them jobs they are not qualified for. How does that no piss you off.
    I assume you would be all for reperations to right?
    And just because ther are poor with no money or savings and on welfare they should still have the same privliges that i work my ass of for?

    In this thread - people who are afraid to be hard on minorities for not making progress because they don't want to be labled a racist so they create excuses for them and make up unmeasureable things like healing of oppression.

    So what you're saying then is that you're not going to answer any of my questions? You're not going to clarify whether you support the forced removal of babies from poor homes? You're not going to tell me what you're going to do to ensure that poor women have better access to reliable contraception, so as to decrease the incidence of poor women having more babies? You're not going to explain the logic behind any of the conclusions you draw from the national education expenditures data?

    How about this? I'll concede that poor people and minorities need to take more personal responsibility, if you tell me exactly how YOU are going to take personal responsibility to do what you can to help this situation that upsets you so much.
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    scb wrote:
    cincybearcat wrote:
    scb wrote:
    My point is that we shouldn't base prejudices on anecdotal "information". That kind of thinking only creates problems; it doesn't solve them.


    My point is, if you give me the funding, I'll prove to you that young kids in low income areas are out way too late. I'm confident of it.

    Okay, well that gets back to my original question: At what rate are young kids in low income areas out way too late? Is it high enough to suggest that this represents an entire race of people? And what is the relative rate when comparing poor white neighborhoods with poor minority neighborhoods, or poor minority neighborhoods with wealthier minority neighborhoods? Can this phenomenon be (supposedly) "attributed" to race? Or income? And what counts as "young kids" or "out way too late"? And who gets to apply their values to define whether it's a problem (and they are dissenting values disregarded)?

    Are you really defending her overgeneralizations as you seem to be? :?

    ANd I said, give me the funding and I will prove the point. This "overgeneralization" I believe to be true based upon my personal experience.
    hippiemom = goodness
  • JOEJOEJOE
    JOEJOEJOE Posts: 10,822
    HeidiJam wrote:
    This is clearly going no where.
    There is a reason why their education graduation rate is so low. You can continue to blame the system for everyone of thier problems.
    I am going to go with my opinion that since there is no progression being made and welfare and foodstams are on the continual rise as well as prison, that its a personal responsible thing.
    AA GIVES them jobs they are not qualified for. How does that no piss you off.
    I assume you would be all for reperations to right?
    And just because ther are poor with no money or savings and on welfare they should still have the same privliges that i work my ass of for?

    In this thread - people who are afraid to be hard on minorities for not making progress because they don't want to be labled a racist so they create excuses for them and make up unmeasureable things like healing of oppression.

    At what sort of job do you work?
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    edited May 2010
    Racism is still a problem.
    HeidiJam wrote:
    Its not.

    A black family's wealth is on average five times lower than a white family's.
    HeidiJam wrote:
    Its not.


    A burning house is just as likely to be put out by firemen if the firemen are black or white.

    HeidiJam wrote:
    Its not.


    Your ability to see the world through the eyes of a poor member of an ethnic minority group is clearly evident in every one of your posts.
    HeidiJam wrote:
    Its not.


    The Earth is round.

    HeidiJam wrote:
    Its not.
    Post edited by Byrnzie on
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    Also, scb...it is evident by the % of dropouts that education in low income areas is certainly not valued at the same rate as those in high income areas. For a multitude of reasons that I already stated.
    hippiemom = goodness
  • _
    _ Posts: 6,657
    cincybearcat wrote:
    Also, scb...it is evident by the % of dropouts that education in low income areas is certainly not valued at the same rate as those in high income areas. For a multitude of reasons that I already stated.

    And did you read the multitude of reasons that I gave for dropping out of school that have nothing to do with the value placed on education? I don't see how you can say that your generalization is evident when there are a multitude of alternative explanations.
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    scb wrote:
    cincybearcat wrote:
    polaris_x wrote:

    there was a cool story in cnnsi about a girls softball team from a poorer school playing against a top ranked school ... the coach from the top ranked school offered to forfeit the game and instead take the time to teach the girls how to play the game ...

    Question, and maybe you don't know, but how exactly wasn't there anyone from the girls school/families that could "teach them how to play the game"?

    While I agree regarding the funding for equipment, fields, etc....the lack of learning how to play may point to the people int eh community not caring enough about their kids to teach them. So it could show a combination of the 2 factors I mentioned.

    I think we have to be careful to not confuse not having time, money, health, etc. to do things with your kids with not caring.


    I also think you can't assume it because everyone is too busy working.
    hippiemom = goodness
  • _
    _ Posts: 6,657
    cincybearcat wrote:
    scb wrote:
    cincybearcat wrote:
    Question, and maybe you don't know, but how exactly wasn't there anyone from the girls school/families that could "teach them how to play the game"?

    While I agree regarding the funding for equipment, fields, etc....the lack of learning how to play may point to the people int eh community not caring enough about their kids to teach them. So it could show a combination of the 2 factors I mentioned.

    I think we have to be careful to not confuse not having time, money, health, etc. to do things with your kids with not caring.


    I also think you can't assume it because everyone is too busy working.

    I didn't. :roll:
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    scb wrote:
    cincybearcat wrote:
    Also, scb...it is evident by the % of dropouts that education in low income areas is certainly not valued at the same rate as those in high income areas. For a multitude of reasons that I already stated.

    And did you read the multitude of reasons that I gave for dropping out of school that have nothing to do with the value placed on education? I don't see how you can say that your generalization is evident when there are a multitude of alternative explanations.


    You really think that my statement is wrong? That education isn't valued the same in low income areas vs, high income areas? I already said there are a lot of reasins as to why I think this is the case and not all because people/parents just don't care...but you want statistics and a drop out rate > 50% proove the point very easily, yet you still make nothing but excuses.

    I think while you are blaming others of generalization, you are also making your own assumptions and generaltions...
    hippiemom = goodness
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    scb wrote:
    cincybearcat wrote:
    [

    Ok, so you are telling me that you think that the reason kids in a low inclome area don't know how to hold a bat is because of what?

    My daughter is 2...i spent 30 minutes yesterday helping her learn how to hold a tee ball bat the right way...its ridiculous to think people are too busy for that level of instruction.
    hippiemom = goodness
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    For the record, don't assume I agree wih everything being said by Heidijam...


    But I've seen the kids on the street...in fact I've had groups of 10 year olds throw rocks and me and my mother at about 10:30 PM on a weeknight more than once...maybe the same kids.....

    And I think it's a bit crazy and lazy to blame the lack of $ on kids not knowing some very basic things.
    hippiemom = goodness
  • _
    _ Posts: 6,657
    cincybearcat wrote:
    You really think that my statement is wrong? That education isn't valued the same in low income areas vs, high income areas? I already said there are a lot of reasins as to why I think this is the case and not all because people/parents just don't care...but you want statistics and a drop out rate > 50% proove the point very easily, yet you still make nothing but excuses.

    I think while you are blaming others of generalization, you are also making your own assumptions and generaltions...

    What assumptions and generalizations do you think I'm making? I never said all poor people care about education or poor people are more likely to care about education. I said your statement that poor people care less about education is unfounded. And I said high drop out rates do not prove that poor people care less about education, then gave examples of alternative practical reasons why many people who I know personally drop out of school. I never said no one drops out of school because they don't care or that all people drop out of school because of the reasons I provided.
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,836
    scb wrote:
    cincybearcat wrote:
    You really think that my statement is wrong? That education isn't valued the same in low income areas vs, high income areas? I already said there are a lot of reasins as to why I think this is the case and not all because people/parents just don't care...but you want statistics and a drop out rate > 50% proove the point very easily, yet you still make nothing but excuses.

    I think while you are blaming others of generalization, you are also making your own assumptions and generaltions...

    What assumptions and generalizations do you think I'm making? I never said all poor people care about education or poor people are more likely to care about education. I said your statement that poor people care less about education is unfounded. And I said high drop out rates do not prove that poor people care less about education, then gave examples of alternative practical reasons why many people who I know personally drop out of school. I never said no one drops out of school because they don't care or that all people drop out of school because of the reasons I provided.


    Ok, let's setsome things straight. I never said poor people care less about education...I said the dropout rat ein low income areas would support the belief that low income areas care less about education.

    Anyhow, I do really respect your point of view, I just disagree on some of the details.
    hippiemom = goodness
  • _
    _ Posts: 6,657
    cincybearcat wrote:
    scb wrote:
    cincybearcat wrote:
    [

    Ok, so you are telling me that you think that the reason kids in a low inclome area don't know how to hold a bat is because of what?

    My daughter is 2...i spent 30 minutes yesterday helping her learn how to hold a tee ball bat the right way...its ridiculous to think people are too busy for that level of instruction.

    See, I don't think you're getting what I'm saying. I'm not purporting to know why the kids in that article weren't good at softball. (No need to skew the story, by the way.) I'm just saying that you don't really know either, and that you have to be CAREFUL before assigning value attributes to entire groups of people, and that there are a multitude of reasons why a poor kid might be bad at softball.

    I can tell you this, since anecdotal information is so valued around here - I haven't the slightest idea how to play softball. And I'm white, well-educated, wasn't living in poverty in primary school, and have parents who value education more than any parents I know (one of them's a teacher!). You say people don't value education and imply that they don't care about their kids if they don't value "that level of instruction" about sports, but have you ever stopped to think that maybe some people just don't value softball?? I know I was too busy studying when I was in school to have any time for or interest in things like that. It sure as fuck doesn't mean I didn't value education or that my parents didn't care about me. The leaps of logic around here tonight are astounding!
  • Blockhead
    Blockhead Posts: 1,538
    There is no leap in logic. If your kid is involved in aything you should be there to teach them. If YOU didn't play softball then there is no reason for your parents to instruct you on how to play, especially if you didn't have any intrest in it.. But these Kids DID play softball. Your running out of excuses.
    You keep saying i am generalizing, but you are doing the same thing, you are making excuses for why they are not there by saing, Helth, no money, busy working. Iam sorry but those excuses your implying that they are doing everything in their power to succeed but in reality there is no progress being made and the stats don't match your excuses, so you telling me that the over 50% dropout rate is because all the parents are to busy working??? Yet welfare receiptians are increasing. If they are working so much then they would not be on welfare, Its almost impossible to have a decent job and receive welfare, my wifes sister had an issue with this, she worked at Dillars and working more than 30 hours a week making $7 an hour put her over qualified.
    I know i am painting with a broad brush, but I am speaking from experience. Your excuses don't line up with their progress (none) and mine do.
  • dasvidana
    dasvidana Grand Junction CO Posts: 1,356
    HeidiJam wrote:
    There is no leap in logic. If your kid is involved in aything you should be there to teach them. If YOU didn't play softball then there is no reason for your parents to instruct you on how to play, especially if you didn't have any intrest in it.. But these Kids DID play softball. Your running out of excuses.
    You keep saying i am generalizing, but you are doing the same thing, you are making excuses for why they are not there by saing, Helth, no money, busy working. Iam sorry but those excuses your implying that they are doing everything in their power to succeed but in reality there is no progress being made and the stats don't match your excuses, so you telling me that the over 50% dropout rate is because all the parents are to busy working??? Yet welfare receiptians are increasing. If they are working so much then they would not be on welfare, Its almost impossible to have a decent job and receive welfare, my wifes sister had an issue with this, she worked at Dillars and working more than 30 hours a week making $7 an hour put her over qualified.
    I know i am painting with a broad brush, but I am speaking from experience. Your excuses don't line up with their progress (none) and mine do.
    I don't think anyone is denying that some ethnic minorities don't value education, don't accept personal responsibility, etc. You're right. But some white individuals don't either. It IS a leap in logic to extrapolate those atributes to whole populations. How is it that you don't realize that?
    It's nice to be nice to the nice.
  • Blockhead
    Blockhead Posts: 1,538
    dasvidana wrote:
    HeidiJam wrote:
    There is no leap in logic. If your kid is involved in aything you should be there to teach them. If YOU didn't play softball then there is no reason for your parents to instruct you on how to play, especially if you didn't have any intrest in it.. But these Kids DID play softball. Your running out of excuses.
    You keep saying i am generalizing, but you are doing the same thing, you are making excuses for why they are not there by saing, Helth, no money, busy working. Iam sorry but those excuses your implying that they are doing everything in their power to succeed but in reality there is no progress being made and the stats don't match your excuses, so you telling me that the over 50% dropout rate is because all the parents are to busy working??? Yet welfare receiptians are increasing. If they are working so much then they would not be on welfare, Its almost impossible to have a decent job and receive welfare, my wifes sister had an issue with this, she worked at Dillars and working more than 30 hours a week making $7 an hour put her over qualified.
    I know i am painting with a broad brush, but I am speaking from experience. Your excuses don't line up with their progress (none) and mine do.
    I don't think anyone is denying that some ethnic minorities don't value education, don't accept personal responsibility, etc. You're right. But some white individuals don't either. It IS a leap in logic to extrapolate those atributes to whole populations. How is it that you don't realize that?
    I know whites do it to. But Blacks make up 14% of our population and 40% is on welfare. That is a huge number to such a small percent of people that make up the US. how is it that you don't realize that?

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