Why wasn’t Avocado a bigger success?

Sexy2aFault · March 2008

Stone Irons wrote:

It's more in the 600,000-700,000 range. It hasn't sold more than Binaural, and that album sold about 750,000 copies.

A fella used to email me with PJ's Neilsen soundscans, I think it has done 700,000+, defintely maybe going on 800,000. Keep in mind the era we live in and I would unscientfically say that, by the year 2000 standards, that would be roughly equivalent to 1,200,000 million sold. Almost Yield like gang!

hopethatuchoke · March 2008

Sexy2aFault wrote:

Face it, Life Wasted,WWS,Comatose,Severed,MITS is the best album explosion PJ has ever done, certainly up their with the best any straight ahead rock act has done recently.

Nah

Sexy2aFault · March 2008

hopethatuchoke wrote:

Nah

Wanna fight?

ucsb · March 2008

I personally don't think this album is their best at all. To me it's in that same realm as everything post Yield. An ok album. I love the band so obviously I bought it...not really expecting much...and it was good. I don't think that the sound is all that accessible. Lot of my friends who are ex-pearl jam fans (the guys who only bought the first three records) I remember did not like the album at all. And most ended up selling it or returning it or something to that effect. To me the album doesnt really stand out. It's good. It's there. I will listen to it on occasion cuz I am a huge fan....but looking at it from an outside perspective...It's not anything all that special.

Me personally...am listening to it right now!

Them-Bones · March 2008

I became a fan right around when Avocado was released, I bought it and rearviewmirror about a week apart, so it was a big enough success for me

stoneg · March 2008

I know its a business thing.But I think they really made their Money with Ten,Vs. and Vitaolgy.I hope that the albums after that were more for the fans then the money.

Jason P · March 2008

You must remember, we live in a society where 35 million people tune in each week to watch karaoke on Fox.

Avocado was a great album, but if success means marketing and dumbing down to that crowd, then I don't want to see PJ sell millions of records.

thecory · March 2008

i've heard stone say that he hates to do the same thing twice. i bet pj could sell a 'market share equivalent' to ten million albums again. remember creed sold millions of albums because people thought 'higher' was an 'Alive' outtake. for pj, been there done that.

Gremmie95 · March 2008

DriftingByTheStorm wrote:

Well, exactly.
When in history have 15 to 18 year olds (who typicaly don't know shit, anyhow - and yes, you'll have to excuse the generalization) EVER flocked with enthusiasm to a band that began 15-18 years BEFORE their time?

You are asking for a new wave of record buying public ... one that has a very limited knowledge of who pearl jam is or was ... and has ZERO understanding of the climate they arose from ... or just how important they were in the early 90's music scene ...

they have no clue about the mass hysteria that ensued around Pearl Jam, and honestly, most of the ones who do probably scoff at it.

Its the old "hate your parent's music" mentality.
Pearl Jam are old hat.
They are dinosaurs.

Kids want to think they are on to the hip new thing.
Pearl Jam are ANYTHING but trendy.

Why would you even want that?
Ewww.

I like young fans,
i think its fucking great.

The ones that can weed out the crap, and find true creative beauty in bands like Pearl Jam ... i embrace their new inclusion in the Jamily.

That being said, why would you want the unwashed masses of idiot teeny boppers and moron fans fawning over a band that speaks about individualism and purity of spirit?

I hear ya.
It feels great to have the validation of the world,
but be careful what you wish for,
you probably don't really want it.

Well said

nowayimfaithfull · March 2008

marker2727 wrote:

The only thing that matters is that it’s good music. I think it’s a big success . . . because it’s good music. Comatose and WWS are in my top 10 pj songs! There is a heck of a lot of good music out there that doesn’t sell millions of records.

Well I agree, I did not start the post, but I always enjoy a good debate and figured this a good topic.

nowayimfaithfull · March 2008

JWBusher wrote:

I think you're ass backwards. Most PJ fans love Avocado because it's full of generic crap they can relate to. Life Wasted? Severed Hand? WWS? Come Back? Some of the lamest riffs they've ever come up with. Releasing Life Wasted as a video was a horrible idea, because there is nothing interesting about that song at all. It's the most generic Pearl Jam song ever, and it's no suprise that it brought them ZERO new fans. And to think that people wanted Come Back to be a single. Ha! Yeah right. Let's release the weakest song on the album as a single because it's reminds me of my dead grandmother. That oughta bring some new fans out of the woodwork. NOT.

Only two or three songs on Avocado stand out as being truly excellent. Riot Act sounds like like Sgt Pepper in comparison. And we all know how much that "fans" love that one. :rolleyes:

Usually people tend to get over themselselves as they get older, you have been talking trash on here for as long as I remember, I still have pms where you called me an asshole and stupid and an iddiot.
My question is why do you have to be so arrogant, its your opinion but you come off like you are better than everyone including the band members.

Tumblin Brian · March 2008

pearl jam reminds me of th rolling stones.
there albums became less important however there live shows captivate people.

DrEthanPowell · March 2008

1. MTV- Pearl Jam doesn't put near the effort other "commercial" bands do in producing videos- someone was comparing them to the Foo Fighters- they have very entertaining videos.

2. Peer to Peer File Sharing- less people are buying full records.

3. i-tunes, etc., again, less people are buying records.

Pearl Jam will sell more records over the long haul than 99.9% of the musical acts in history. Even if it takes the next fifty to 100 years.

nowayimfaithfull · March 2008

DrEthanPowell wrote:

Pearl Jam will sell more records over the long haul than 99.9% of the musical acts in history. Even if it takes the next fifty to 100 years.

good point

freetibet1 · April 2008

This is my first entry on the Pit, long time reader though. Here's my two cents on why Avocado wasn't a bigger success. I compare PJ to jam bands like the Dead, Widespread, and Phish. They have a loyal following who pack arenas tour after tour, but record sales are not necessarily huge. It's the live experience that matters.

Jer1 · April 2008

JaneNY wrote:

I would agree with this.

The whole music industry has changed since the early 90's. No one act pops up and gets everyone's attention anymore - music tastes are very individualized because the old methods of presenting music have become less significant. You can't count on terrestrial radio to get peoples' attention to your music. Additionally, using the number of Soundscan sales to gauge 'success' is inaccurate IMO, given the number of people that download copies of records. The number of people who *obtained* the album compared to the number of people who *bought* the album might have been somewhat higher.

I loved Avocado, even if it wasn't my favorite of all their work. I like that they move forward and continue to create and I want them to keep doing that. So it was a success to me.

I agree with this almost word for word (the "almost" being that I thought Avocado was the equal of any album they ever put out, especially demonstrating how the fire and passion are just as strong as ever). Bands don't measure success by album sales anymore because almost no one is selling albums. Bands make their money touring now, and that's how it is for every band everywhere. Comparing Pearl Jam's album sales now with their sales in the early 1990s is pointless, because it's a totally changed world.

||Release_Me|| · April 2008

At this point in their career, Pearl Jam is about the live show. As long as they are firing on all cylinders in concert then i'm sticking around. At the same time, i feel lucky that there isn't one album i dislike from the band.

I have to be honest, i've never given two pieces of monkey crap about how much albums sell. If PJ perhaps wanted to increase awareness of themselves with Avocado then more power to them. If they release a new album and the songs fit into the setlists well enough then that is a success if you ask me. I really enjoy Avocado and think the majority of the songs fit into the setlists and sound great live.

So many people download now instead of buying CDs, so that affects most bands. PJ just worked very hard in the mid-90s to become more obscure to the mainstream, and in today's musical climate it's going to be very hard to get out of that situation if they want to.

michaeljamesmccabe · April 2008

Pearl Jam is interested in people buying and listening to an ALBUM. That doesn't work for the main consumers of music these days. Pearl Jam has never been about "playing the game" for the corporations that run the music industry.

Honestly, "Self-Titled" could've been one of the biggest selling records in the past five years, been awarded a ton of acclaim and Grammy’s and everything else. The only problem is that it would’ve cost Pearl Jam their credibility, self-respect, and integrity. You would see the band on every interview show, they would have their own customized iPods and iPhones available to buy, their music would be in the background a bunch of commercials, they would play with the American Idol kids during “Pearl Jam Week”, Ed would be out there endorsing McDonald’s new McWrap, you would see the band all over the iTunes front page, “Parachutes” would be playing the background of episodes of MTV’s “The Hills”, they would do a 24 hour takeover of MTV, and they would basically whore themselves out in any way possible.

If they would’ve done all of that, Pearl Jam “Pearl Jam”, would be one of the highest grossing albums since the digital revolution. They would make a TON of money and sell millions of albums.

Of course, I would no longer be a fan, and I would resent them for selling out.

I love the fact that Pearl Jam has been refusing to play the game since they first figured it out. I prefer that they continue doing what they’ve been doing. I love that they are considered one of the best rock bands on the planet, and that they can tour the globe and be greeted by fans and admirers everywhere they go.

Avocado is a great album filled with some amazing music. People will be “discovering it” years from now.

corduroid · April 2008

Damn, I've gotta get this album.

se7v7en · April 2008

my friend bought avacodo bc it was featured half price at tower records or something and after listening a few times went out and bought their entire catalogue

Why wasn’t Avocado a bigger success?

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