short 9/11 video (includes molten steel columns

niner · April 2007

RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:

Depends on how they arranged to have backup lighting available. they obviously didn't walk around in the dark. How that would have appeared from outside the building is anyone's guess.

that's part of the point, there was power. powering down a computer system and powering down a building are two different things.
i find it VERY hard to believe a financial building with needed security would completely shut down all electrical power, including elevators

MakingWaves · April 2007

RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:

and what of building (3),4,5,6? all suffered structural damage and fire....all burned for hours and remained standing.

The Madrid tower also didn't come down in a blaze of glory once the collapse started either.... :rolleyes: there goes the progressive collapse theory out the window...

Madrid tower collpase timeline:
1:29
East face of the 21st floor collapsed
1:37
South middle section of several floors above the 21st floor gradually collapsed
1:50
Parts of floor slab with curtain walls collapsed
2:02
Parts of floor slab with curtain walls collapsed
2:11
Parts of floor slab with curtain walls collapsed
2:13
Floors above about 25th floor collapsed
Large collapse of middle section at about 20th floor
2:17
Parts of floor slab with curtain walls collapsed
2:47
Southwest corner of 1 ~ 2 floors below about 20th floor collapsed
2:51
Southeast corner of about 18th ~ 20th floors collapsed
3:35
South middle section of about 17th ~ 20th floors collapsed
Fire broke through the Upper Technical Floor
3:48
Fire flame spurted out below the Upper Technical Floor
4:17
Debris on the Upper Technical Floor fell down

Only one section of the Madrid building was made with steel supports. The rest of the building incorporated a cement core with cement reinforced structure. Therefore those sections didn't collapse. What you have shown here proves nothing once again.

MakingWaves · April 2007

RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:

Aside from a few selected parts in it's engines, planes aren't exactly made out of solid steel like a flying wrecking ball. They are essentially hollow soft metal tubes that greatly deform and disintegrate on impact.

What was the mass of those planes?
How fast were they traveling?
I posted the equation earlier. You do the math. That was an impact with a tremendous amount of force and energy.

MakingWaves · April 2007

El_Kabong wrote:

did it break the windows BEFORE it fell? b/c again, the greatest energy showed on the seismagraph BEFORE the towers fell...if the explsoives were attached to the building it would reverberate into the ground

and how could it be the plane???? the planes hit well before the towers collapsed, the biggest energy spike was )read slowly) right before it fell. well after the planes hit and before the building started to fall

Again, read the link i posted earlier. The greatest energy does not show up before. Just more bullshit.

MakingWaves · April 2007

El_Kabong wrote:

some came before it started to sag

and WHAT CAUSED building 7 to fall? where is this 'disproportionate' collapse?

I already posted facts and links about why building 7 fell but i guess you got confused because they were facts. Not someone taking bits and pieces of information to make things sound the way they want them like all the conspiracy nut jobs do.

MakingWaves · April 2007

niner wrote:

i'm sorry, but i usually don't get involved in 9/11 conspiracy bullshit, but i saw the towers on 9/8 from a boat in the harbor that i was working on at night and the lights were on. it was the last time i saw them and they were spectacular that night, so much, that i said it out loud. it left an impression on me even if they were not attacked 3 days later.

The lights were never off. this is another bullshit story that conspiracy nut jobs have made up. There is no proof of this happening and it is ridiculous to even think it did.

69charger · April 2007

RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:

Aside from a few selected parts in it's engines, planes aren't exactly made out of solid steel like a flying wrecking ball. They are essentially hollow soft metal tubes that greatly deform and disintegrate on impact.

At those speeds and energies they act just like a wrecking ball! Have you seen what plain old water can do at high speeds?

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1242723106705248453

MakingWaves · April 2007

sonicreducer wrote:

how many of you have read the comission report?

why did bush fight the investigation, underfund it, refuse to testify under oath and not without cheney by his side?

No President will go under oath to testify if they don't have to. It isn't just this administration. That is just the way it is.

And yes how many people have read all the reports. The NIST reports would be a good place for people like you to start. But again, probably too much fact in these for you to believe it.

MakingWaves · April 2007

RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:

As per Scott Forbes: "Many, many people worked on the power down, both from the IT department and from the business, revalidating systems when they were available again. Other people can validate my information. Some people do not remember the circumstances, some people will not revisit that time ... but others acknowledge the power down freely and can validate my information."

Forbes is a dumbass as seen below.

"There are problems with this account.

#1, it's sourced by one person only, Scott Forbes, and corroboration seems limited. In an interview he said, for instance:

SF: Many, many people have talked to me about the power down and one person was contacted by a journalist as a backup source for my information.
http://killtown.blogspot.com/2005/12/scott-forbes-interview.html

But why only one? And where is this backup? The WTC held the offices of many large, important companies, and to have their central computers turned off would have been extremely inconvenient. To put it mildly. Thousands of people would have known about this, from local employees to staff in other parts of the company. So where are they?

Actually there may be a clue in a subsequent Forbes interview:

GW: How do you know that there was no electricity from floor 50 up, if Fiduciary Trust was on much higher floors -- starting at the 90th floor?

SF: I can't absolutely verify that there was no power on lower floors ... all I can validate is that we were informed of the power down condition, that we had to take down all systems and then the following day had to bring back up all systems ...
http://georgewashington.blogspot.com/2005/11/interview-with-scott-forbes.html

So Forbes doesn’t appear to have any direct knowledge of conditions on floors below his own, and perhaps above (which makes sense, of course). If only one or two companies were affected then this would make the lack of corroboration more noticeable; of course, this also presents fewer opportunities to prepare the building for demolition."

One guy who can't even get his shit straight is not factual evidence. Once again...NO PROOF OF ANYTHING!

MakingWaves · April 2007

RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:

Depends on how they arranged to have backup lighting available. they obviously didn't walk around in the dark. How that would have appeared from outside the building is anyone's guess.

How come you ignore facts such as it took a demolition company 24 days to wire a much smaller building? Ignore the facts and keep coming up with peoples opinions that make things sound suspicious but prove absolutely nothing and distorting the real facts.

69charger · April 2007

MakingWaves wrote:

How come you ignore facts such as it took a demolition company 24 days to wire a much smaller building? Ignore the facts and keep coming up with peoples opinions that make things sound suspicious but prove absolutely nothing and distorting the real facts.

Great article from real experts...

http://www.implosionworld.com/Article-WTC%20STUDY%208-06%20w%20clarif%20as%20of%209-8-06%20.pdf

Doubt any of the 'theorists' will read it or pay any attention to it though.

Sad.

RolandTD20Kdrummer · April 2007

Looking at the events in office from the end of Clinton leading up to 9/11:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ASBuh72Re8

amazing they had no idea at all...lol

RolandTD20Kdrummer · April 2007

69charger wrote:

At those speeds and energies they act just like a wrecking ball! Have you seen what plain old water can do at high speeds?

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1242723106705248453

Water is a terrible comparison, it has a density factor of 1.

Do you know why they design crumple zones into cars and how that scenario works?

MakingWaves · April 2007

RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:

Looking at the events in office from the end of Clinton leading up to 9/11:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ASBuh72Re8

amazing they had no idea at all...lol

It is amazing how everyone was wearing blinders. From your average citizen all the way to the President. 99% of people never thought this could happen to us.

RolandTD20Kdrummer · April 2007

MakingWaves wrote:

How come you ignore facts such as it took a demolition company 24 days to wire a much smaller building? Ignore the facts and keep coming up with peoples opinions that make things sound suspicious but prove absolutely nothing and distorting the real facts.

Where have I promoted or quoted other peoples mere opinions and stated them as facts? I have quoted first hand accounts of people's direct observations and testimonies related to the event. It's up to you to choose to believe they exist, or if they happened or not.

RolandTD20Kdrummer · April 2007

MakingWaves wrote:

It is amazing how everyone was wearing blinders. From your average citizen all the way to the President. 99% of people never thought this could happen to us.

Wow average citizens have access to FBI and CIA intelligence reports?

Bravo....indeed.

Specifics · April 2007

69charger wrote:

At those speeds and energies they act just like a wrecking ball! Have you seen what plain old water can do at high speeds?

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1242723106705248453

What Roland said about water ( speedy fucker ) slap yourself with a feather, or stand on a coke can.

pjs big canuk fan · April 2007

it makes me sad to think that the lives of the innocient victums have been scared by the actions of a leader who only protects himself and not the wonerful lives of his constituents. and now they have to carry the shame of one mans greed on thier shoulders while thier young return to the land of freedom in coffins. shame on you bush the fortunate and rich need the backs of the poor and the under privlagde to stand on

Specifics · April 2007

The BIG question for me is...why did it take Hollywood 51/2 years to make a film of this?;) Did it really take that long for America to become desensitized enough for there to be profit? ?Or was it a revenge issue? ie , we've killed enough innocent muslims to square this now, let the money roll.

MakingWaves · April 2007

RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:

Where have I promoted or quoted other peoples mere opinions and stated them as facts? I have quoted first hand accounts of people's direct observations and testimonies related to the event. It's up to you to choose to believe they exist, or if they happened or not.

A lot of these other people or first hand accounts that you have referred to have been completely false or they have taken facts and left out information to try to prove their point.

short 9/11 video (includes molten steel columns

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