This is why John Edwards sucks

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  • sweetpotato
    sweetpotato Posts: 1,278
    farfromglorified wrote:
    I certainly see many perfectionists and workaholics around me. I also see people who are content with who they are and who don't work much. Yet both operate in the same economic system.

    Once upon a time, people "saw" the sun revolving around the Earth. The opposite was actually true, and it took someone to explain why the sun rises and sets everyday at a level deeper than what they "see". They used science and reason and logic, something the article you used was largely devoid of.



    Why is that "true"? What science supports it? What comprehensive study or unassailable logic demonstrates that "truth"?



    What is "it"? Capitalism? Capitalism doesn't place greed over compassion, by default.
    I find it incredibly ironic that the concept of "greed" is so often raised by people like John Edwards, his own immense wealth notwithstanding. Edwards and his ilk, while invoking the "perils of greed", demand from others free healthcare, free jobs, free retirements, free money, all without committing to provide anything in return. Yet they pretend that the faceless "them" at whom they toss nothing but vitriol hold a monopoly on greed. Is not the definition of greed the demand for something greater than the value you wish to provide in return? Is not the logic of the "greedy CEO" hallmarked by payments greater than his or her worth? Then what is that which Edwards stands for? "Compassion"??? What a mockery people like that make of language and morality.

    If you dislike our "current brand of capitalism", I completely support your right to separate yourself from it. You have no obligation, in my mind, to serve any function of American capitalism, if you do not wish to do so. But to pretend that you dislike the current brand of capitalism in this country, being so marked by coersion and force, when all your really dislike is the position you hold within it and when all you really desire is to apply that same coersion and force on your own chosen targets, is to be contradictory and, in my opinion, no better than those you call your enemy.

    you are assuming a bit too much about me, don;t you think? what makes you think i don't like "the position i hold within it"? that's silly of you, and frankly, not true.

    "Capitalism places some of the values of individuals over others, all based on the standards and virtues of the individuals involved. If your society is comprised of mostly the greedy, then certainly greed will be placed over compassion. Conversely, if your society is comprised of mostly the compassionate, then compassion will be given a higher precedence."

    that's what i said. so basically, you're agreeing with my statement that OUR CURRENT BRAND of capitalism places greed over compassion.
    "Ladies and gentlemen, the President of the United States, Barack Obama."

    "Obama's main opponent in this election on November 4th (was) not John McCain, it (was) ignorance."~Michael Moore

    "i'm feeling kinda righteous right now. with my badass motherfuckin' ukulele!"
    ~ed, 8/7
  • farfromglorified
    farfromglorified Posts: 5,700
    sweetpotato wrote:
    you are assuming a bit too much about me, don;t you think? what makes you think i don't like "the position i hold within it"? that's silly of you, and frankly, not true.

    I certainly might be assuming too much there, though I find it odd that you then attack the statement with questions, instead of counterarguments.
    "Capitalism places some of the values of individuals over others, all based on the standards and virtues of the individuals involved. If your society is comprised of mostly the greedy, then certainly greed will be placed over compassion. Conversely, if your society is comprised of mostly the compassionate, then compassion will be given a higher precedence."

    that's what i said. so basically, you're agreeing with my statement that OUR CURRENT BRAND of capitalism places greed over compassion.

    I would disagree that our current brand of capitalism places greed over compassion. I believe that the individuals who comprise the American capitalistic system are more compassionate than they are greedy, but that's simply my experience and I can certainly understand and relate to counterstatements. Furthermore, your original statement presented capitalism as a gauranteed way to put greed over compassion, a contention that I find highly erroneous.

    If you dislike our "current brand" of capitalism, what is it in particular you wish would be removed from the system? How do you propose to remove it?
  • bootlegger10
    bootlegger10 Posts: 16,260
    mammasan wrote:
    I truely hope that you are just kidding.

    I didn't mean it as a joke. But I didn't mean it to be serious either. If somebody believes they are worth $400 million when they retire, then I do believe those people are delusional and out of touch.
  • jlew24asu
    jlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    farfromglorified wrote:

    If you dislike our "current brand" of capitalism, what is it in particular you wish would be removed from the system? How do you propose to remove it?

    cap peoples pay and force corporations to evenly spread the rest of the money to people who dont want to work. there's enough to go around for everyone.
  • farfromglorified
    farfromglorified Posts: 5,700
    jlew24asu wrote:
    cap peoples pay

    Based on what standard?
    force corporations to evenly spread the rest of the money to people who dont want to work.

    Through what means?
    there's enough to go around for everyone.

    For how long?
  • jlew24asu
    jlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    farfromglorified wrote:
    Based on what standard?
    O I dont know. lets just say 100k thats sounds about right. no one needs more then that.
    farfromglorified wrote:
    Through what means?
    sticks and stones
    farfromglorified wrote:
    For how long?

    forever!




    hehe my last post (and this one) was a complete lie btw :)
  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    yeah, your right...


    fuck the sick...
    fuck the poor...
    fuck the unemployed...
    fuck the homeless...
    fuck the hungry...
    fuck the elderly...
    fuck the children...
    fuck the working class...
    fuck them all...

    as long Bill Gates gets to keep as much as possible
  • jlew24asu
    jlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    my2hands wrote:

    as long Bill Gates gets to keep as much as possible


    you are absolutely right. the more he gets the better. for millions of people. I really hope you take a second to see how much good he has done


    http://www.gatesfoundation.org/default.htm
  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    jlew24asu wrote:
    oopsie I really hope you take a second to see how much good he has done


    http://www.gatesfoundation.org/default.htm

    he was an obvious example to use... maybe that went over your head?

    you get the point
  • farfromglorified
    farfromglorified Posts: 5,700
    my2hands wrote:
    yeah, your right...


    fuck the sick...
    fuck the poor...
    fuck the unemployed...
    fuck the homeless...
    fuck the hungry...
    fuck the elderly...
    fuck the children...
    fuck the working class...
    fuck them all...

    as long Bill Gates gets to keep as much as possible

    yeah, your right

    fuck Bill Gates...
    fuck Bill Gates...
    fuck Bill Gates...
    fuck Bill Gates...
    fuck Bill Gates...
    fuck Bill Gates ...
    fuck Bill Gates...
    fuck Bill Gates...
    fuck them all...

    as long the sick, poor, unemployed, homeless, hungry, elderly, children and working class get to take as much as possible.


    Perhaps you should find an argument that doesn't lend itself to such an obvious contradiction.
  • jlew24asu
    jlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    my2hands wrote:
    he was an obvious example to use... maybe that went over your head?

    you get the point

    yea I guess it did go over my head. why say what you did?
  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    farfromglorified wrote:
    yeah, your right

    fuck Bill Gates...
    fuck Bill Gates...
    fuck Bill Gates...
    fuck Bill Gates...
    fuck Bill Gates...
    fuck Bill Gates ...
    fuck Bill Gates...
    fuck Bill Gates...
    fuck them all...

    as long the sick, poor, unemployed, homeless, hungry, elderly, children and working class get to take as much as possible.


    Perhaps you should find an argument that doesn't lend itself to such an obvious contradiction.

    i think bill gates will be fine...


    i guess you dont believe i helping people whe they are down or need a hand? typical heartless right wing "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" greedy capitalistic attitude
  • bootlegger10
    bootlegger10 Posts: 16,260
    I don't like using song lyrics in postings, but here is one from Bono (doesn't matter who wrote though):

    "What you thought was freedom was just greed"
  • jeffbr
    jeffbr Seattle Posts: 7,177
    my2hands wrote:
    he was an obvious example to use... maybe that went over your head?

    you get the point

    An obvious example of what? Someone who worked hard and became successful? Some one who amassed a fortune through his work and intellect? Someone who is committed to giving away a substantial piece of that fortune to causes throughout the world? Someone who wants to erradicate killer diseases, make technology more accessable to the poor, raise educational standards?

    He is an obvious example of all of the above. He is not an obvious target of your tirade. So I did not get the point.
    "I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    i HATE people that care more about the DOW and NASDAQ and some CEO $300,000,000 bonus package then they do about their fellow human being and the needs of the people...

    profit over people

    fucking disgusting
  • callen
    callen Posts: 6,388
    my2hands wrote:
    i think bill gates will be fine...


    i guess you dont believe i helping people whe they are down or need a hand? typical heartless right wing "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" greedy capitalistic attitude
    well y ou know everyone has the same opportunities as everyone else...if you don't make $100k a year..its your own fault...bastards.
    10-18-2000 Houston, 04-06-2003 Houston, 6-25-2003 Toronto, 10-8-2004 Kissimmee, 9-4-2005 Calgary, 12-3-05 Sao Paulo, 7-2-2006 Denver, 7-22-06 Gorge, 7-23-2006 Gorge, 9-13-2006 Bern, 6-22-2008 DC, 6-24-2008 MSG, 6-25-2008 MSG
  • bootlegger10
    bootlegger10 Posts: 16,260
    Salary caps work in football. A few great teams, lots of parody (sp?), and a few bad teams. Baseball needs a hard cap if it ever wants good competition.
  • bootlegger10
    bootlegger10 Posts: 16,260
    jeffbr wrote:
    An obvious example of what? Someone who worked hard and became successful? Some one who amassed a fortune through his work and intellect? Someone who is committed to giving away a substantial piece of that fortune to causes throughout the world? Someone who wants to erradicate killer diseases, make technology more accessable to the poor, raise educational standards?

    He is an obvious example of all of the above. He is not an obvious target of your tirade. So I did not get the point.

    Come on guys, you're arguments are petty. You know what he meant. The guy just named a rich person. Yeah, there are a lot of rich people who give to charity, and there are a ton who just want more and more money and don't give a shit about anyone. I would say there are less Bill Gates than the other.
  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    jeffbr wrote:
    An obvious example of what? Someone who worked hard and became successful? Some one who amassed a fortune through his work and intellect? Someone who is committed to giving away a substantial piece of that fortune to causes throughout the world? Someone who wants to erradicate killer diseases, make technology more accessable to the poor, raise educational standards?

    He is an obvious example of all of the above. He is not an obvious target of your tirade. So I did not get the point.

    this is what you guys do... ignore the actual topic and focus on some small point made... i used bill gates as an example...

    the greedy society that cheers a system that allows a man to hoard $50 BILLION dollars while people sleep in the streets and starve

    just remember... someone is going to freeze to death on the street tonight... blocks away from wall street...
  • farfromglorified
    farfromglorified Posts: 5,700
    my2hands wrote:
    i think bill gates will be fine...

    Bill Gates' physical status, fine or otherwise, doesn't allow you to make a contradiction true. You can't damn greed and, in the process, demand your right to be greedy.
    i guess you dont believe i helping people whe they are down or need a hand?

    I certainly do. What I don't believe in is forcing my neighbor to do it for me, or letting people drag others down with them in the name of something someone calls "compassion".
    typical heartless right wing "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" greedy capitalistic attitude

    Tell me, what's greedy about it? What's heartless about it? What mention have I made of "bootstraps"?

    You're demanding payment for some from others in exchange for nothing. You're levelling personal attacks on others based only on the sizes of their bank accounts. Who's greedy here? Who's heartless?

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