The Reason behind "Borat"

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Comments

  • MrBrian
    MrBrian Posts: 2,672
    zstillings wrote:
    It is a pretty strange combination in this country with a combination of racism and oversensitivity.

    yeah it is, but I think oversensitivity often wins, which is'nt really a good thing. It's just a form of being a fake. Oversensitive people often turn out to be very fake kinds of people. very empty, that's why they feel that they have to overcompensate with all the sensitivity on the racial front stuff, or any front for that matter.
  • floyd1975
    floyd1975 Posts: 1,350
    MrBrian wrote:
    yeah it is, but I think oversensitivity often wins, which is'nt really a good thing. It's just a form of being a fake. Oversensitive people often turn out to be very fake kinds of people. very empty, that's why they feel that they have to overcompensate with all the sensitivity on the racial front stuff, or any front for that matter.

    I fully agree.
  • Staceb10
    Staceb10 Posts: 675
    I think that the average white rich girl who summers in the Hamptons family would be just as unhappy about her dating a black man as the guy in South Georgia in a trailer park whose daughter dates a black man. I think they would handle it differently but racism is still racism.

    I think racism is definitely linked to class status as well.
  • VictoryGin
    VictoryGin Posts: 1,207
    Staceb10 wrote:
    I think that the average white rich girl who summers in the Hamptons family would be just as unhappy about her dating a black man as the guy in South Georgia in a trailer park whose daughter dates a black man. I think they would handle it differently but racism is still racism.

    I think racism is definitely linked to class status as well.

    honestly i think there would generally be more of a problem in this specific example if the person was poor, white or black. and we know that chances are a black person is more likely to be poor. not that there aren't any racial issues around here, but i think with the summer in hamptons example there would be a bigger class issue.

    don't forget that a lot of people who summer in the hamptons are nyc liberals, and if these recent threads are any indication they're likely to be "vomit-inducing" pc police.
    if you wanna be a friend of mine
    cross the river to the eastside
  • RainDog
    RainDog Posts: 1,824
    zstillings wrote:
    I went to a school in California that prided itself on being open minded and liberal. During orientation, we were told that they were a diverse campus. We were then informed that people can only understand people of their own race and that should be their group of friends to help promote diversity. To me, this idea was effectively trying to keep the races separate.
    I never attended any schools in California. In Ohio, my university was pretty good at encouraging people to mix it up - at least, I think they were pretty good at it. I never did pay much attention during orientation. I much preferred being disoriented.

    In high school, also in Ohio, my school prided itself on being all white. Not officially, mind you, but definately pride. Of course, there was also something of a Confederate Flag fetish going around there at the time, too, curiously enough. I must say, if you're from and live in a Northern State and you adorn yourself, home, or vehicle with Confederate flags, you aren't doing it out of "cultural awareness." So, perhaps there's a bit of a disconnect there. Why do so many Northerners think the South is racist? Maybe it's because so many Northern racists like to wave that old Southern flag.

    In the end, though, I can only speak of my own experiences with certainty. And in my experience, I've come across more people I'd consider prejudiced in the rural South than the rural North - using my own preconcieved regulators and per-capita measurements, of course. But, I do find it everywhere, and without fail.
  • rebornFixer
    rebornFixer Posts: 4,901
    MrBrian wrote:
    yeah it is, but I think oversensitivity often wins, which is'nt really a good thing. It's just a form of being a fake. Oversensitive people often turn out to be very fake kinds of people. very empty, that's why they feel that they have to overcompensate with all the sensitivity on the racial front stuff, or any front for that matter.

    Agreed. I think anyone who has an extreme reaction to racial issues, in either direction, might very well have some problems of their own.
  • rebornFixer
    rebornFixer Posts: 4,901
    RainDog wrote:

    In high school, also in Ohio, my school prided itself on being all white. Not officially, mind you, but definately pride. Of course, there was also something of a Confederate Flag fetish going around there at the time, too, curiously enough. I must say, if you're from and live in a Northern State and you adorn yourself, home, or vehicle with Confederate flags, you aren't doing it out of "cultural awareness." So, perhaps there's a bit of a disconnect there. Why do so many Northerners think the South is racist? Maybe it's because so many Northern racists like to wave that old Southern flag.

    I don't know what to make of this ... I mean, honestly ... The school "prides itself on being all-white"? Maybe it does, but it must be pretty covert pride in this day and age.
  • dg1979us
    dg1979us Posts: 568
    Here is an article about where he is coming from with Borat.

    http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/1121/p20s01-almo.html
  • RainDog
    RainDog Posts: 1,824
    reborncareerist wrote:
    I don't know what to make of this ... I mean, honestly ... The school "prides itself on being all-white"? Maybe it does, but it must be pretty covert pride in this day and age.
    Like I said, it wasn't "official" pride, but it was certainly there. Of course, there are a few things that need to be considered. Namely, my graduating class consisted of all of 60 people, my hometown isn't even big enough to have a stop light, and I attended that school from 1988 to 1992 (is that considered "this day and age?).
  • Pacomc79
    Pacomc79 Posts: 9,404
    RainDog wrote:
    Like I said, it wasn't "official" pride, but it was certainly there. Of course, there are a few things that need to be considered. Namely, my graduating class consisted of all of 60 people, my hometown isn't even big enough to have a stop light, and I attended that school from 1988 to 1992 (is that considered "this day and age?).


    Were you in the movie Hoosiers? :D
    My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
  • musicismylife78
    musicismylife78 Posts: 6,116
    its a critique of american ideals. We so often think of non industrialized or non civilized nations like kazakstan as backward and the people that live there as being savages or non civilized.

    What borat found when he came to america, was homophobia, racism, sexism etc...

    its a social critique of america. There is no question this film is wildly popular, the question though remains,
    will people understand this is a satire, and a political film

    Cheers to borat for sticking it to american audiences. This is our society folks, he didnt show us anything new really new, just made the points and ideas more stark and stunning. This is what we are to the rest of the world folks! The laim that we are free and independent and great falls on deaf ears. Just watch the film

    Then start overthrowing the existing order. Is this really the image we want for our children? Is this what america has come to symbolize? Racism, sexism and homophobia? The answers extremely clear
  • rebornFixer
    rebornFixer Posts: 4,901
    RainDog wrote:
    Like I said, it wasn't "official" pride, but it was certainly there. Of course, there are a few things that need to be considered. Namely, my graduating class consisted of all of 60 people, my hometown isn't even big enough to have a stop light, and I attended that school from 1988 to 1992 (is that considered "this day and age?).

    Maybe people will disagree with me, but I too am from a small town, and I think "provincialism" is perhaps a better term for how these people tend to view others, as opposed to "racism". Maybe provincialism isn't the best word ... Basically, I think that any type of difference, be it racial or whatever, is viewed with some skepticism by really homogenous communities of people.
    Its not just white communities, either. Go to Chinatown here in Calgary. Its a place I happen to love, but I do get treated like an outsider (with a few exceptions). Rather than freak out and view all these folks as hardcore racists, I am inclined to rationalize their behaviors as part and parcel of living in a fairly cloistered community. Incidentally, if anyone wants to know what being treated as an outsider feels like, try going into a very ethnic enclave in a big city, and do some shopping. If you really have guts, go to a place of worship. I have found it to be a bit of a character-building experience, but its something I feel has made me a more tolerant person. If you don't take it too personally, its a good time, very enriching. Of course, I've always kind of loved Asian culture.
  • Pacomc79
    Pacomc79 Posts: 9,404
    dg1979us wrote:
    Here is an article about where he is coming from with Borat.

    http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/1121/p20s01-almo.html



    thanks, that was a good read.
    My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
  • VictoryGin
    VictoryGin Posts: 1,207
    reborncareerist wrote:
    Of course, I've always kind of loved Asian culture.

    yeah i know a lot of guys like you.

    i'm totally kidding.
    if you wanna be a friend of mine
    cross the river to the eastside
  • rebornFixer
    rebornFixer Posts: 4,901
    VictoryGin wrote:
    yeah i know a lot of guys like you.

    i'm totally kidding.

    LOL. There is indeed a term for us White Asian wannebes ... Cannot remember what it is. Its in the urban dictionary, I believe.
  • RainDog
    RainDog Posts: 1,824
    reborncareerist wrote:
    Maybe people will disagree with me, but I too am from a small town, and I think "provincialism" is perhaps a better term for how these people tend to view others, as opposed to "racism". Maybe provincialism isn't the best word ... Basically, I think that any type of difference, be it racial or whatever, is viewed with some skepticism by really homogenous communities of people.
    You're right in that there was very little appreciation for difference. However, when people wave the Confederate flag (in Ohio) on the 4th of July, when the word "nigger" is in their daily vernacular, when black teenagers visiting from a neighboring town are literally chased out by members of the football team, when race fights brake out on the median strip, then the appropriate word is "racism."

    As for the rest of your post, unless I feel like I'm in "danger" of some kind, I actually like going to places where I feel like an outsider. I'm at least assured that I'll see and hear things I wouldn't otherwise.

    Or maybe it makes me nostalgic for the days when I attended that high school.
  • VictoryGin
    VictoryGin Posts: 1,207
    reborncareerist wrote:
    LOL. There is indeed a term for us White Asian wannebes ... Cannot remember what it is. Its in the urban dictionary, I believe.

    wait. maybe you are too, but i was thinking more along the lines of white wannabe with asians. :) but like you said, i'm sure there's a term for that in the urban dictionary as well. ;)
    if you wanna be a friend of mine
    cross the river to the eastside
  • rebornFixer
    rebornFixer Posts: 4,901
    RainDog wrote:
    You're right in that there was very little appreciation for difference. However, when people wave the Confederate flag (in Ohio) on the 4th of July, when the word "nigger" is in their daily vernacular, when black teenagers visiting from a neighboring town are literally chased out by members of the football team, when race fights brake out on the median strip, then the appropriate word is "racism."

    As for the rest of your post, unless I feel like I'm in "danger" of some kind, I actually like going to places where I feel like an outsider. I'm at least assured that I'll see and hear things I wouldn't otherwise.

    Or maybe it makes me nostalgic for the days when I attended that high school.

    Believe it or not, the Confederate flag doesn't have to be a racist symbol ... Granted, it often is used and thought of as such. "Nigger" has become a part of daily vernacular for a lot of white people who listen to hip hop. Does that mean they are all a bunch of raging racists? That word is more or less offensive depending on how its used, IMHO. Not saying that your town wasn't racist, either. Its hard to argue with your other points. Just saying that its not unique to small town America.
  • RainDog
    RainDog Posts: 1,824
    reborncareerist wrote:
    Believe it or not, the Confederate flag doesn't have to be a racist symbol ... Granted, it often is used and thought of as such. "Nigger" has become a part of daily vernacular for a lot of white people who listen to hip hop. Does that mean they are all a bunch of raging racists? That word is more or less offensive depending on how its used, IMHO. Not saying that your town wasn't racist, either. Its hard to argue with your other points. Just saying that its not unique to small town America.
    We also had a restaurant named "The Three Ks" - though I think that's since been changed (if it's even still there). Of course, that one might have been a coincidence.

    I'm not going to completely disagree about the Confederate flag. Remember, though, that I knew these people - and as I said, it has been my experience that people in Northern states who wave Confederate flags are using it as such.

    White people who listen to hip hop and say "what's up, my niggas" aren't necessarily racist. White people who don't listen to hip hop and say things like, "man, they're nothin' but a bunch of fucking niggers" probably are. I am occasionally capable of picking up on context.

    The place has gotten better though (that, or I'm just not seeing the right things anymore when I visit). Modernization, it seems, eventually reaches every corner.
  • rebornFixer
    rebornFixer Posts: 4,901
    RainDog wrote:
    White people who listen to hip hop and say "what's up, my niggas" aren't necessarily racist. White people who don't listen to hip hop and say things like, "man, they're nothin' but a bunch of fucking niggers" probably are. I am occasionally capable of picking up on context.

    Cool, cool ... :)
    Wasn't trying to imply that you're a moron.

    That Three Ks thing made my mouth drop ... Let's hope that was just an unfortunate coincidence.

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