Enjoy Capitalism

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  • kenny olav
    kenny olav Posts: 3,319
    Africa is extremely rich in natural resources, but who controls those resources?

    Read about the angry souls in Nigeria who are powerless to stop the corruption of Chevron (which Condoleeza Rice was Director of before joining the Bush team)... http://www.globalpolicy.org/nations/chevron.htm

    A great deal of farm land is wasted in Africa because the landowners produce "cash crops" that are sold to the West instead of being used to provide food at home... http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Global_Secrets_Lies/Myth_FoodScarcity.html

    And lest we forget the diamond mines...
    http://www.realdiamondfacts.org
    http://www.minesandcommunities.org/Action/press712.htm


    The blame lies on the small percent of people who own the majority of the world's resources and exploit peoples' needs to their advantage.

    I don't think it should be a capitalism vs socialism/communism debate. It's about the decentralization of ownership.
  • SPEEDY MCCREADY
    SPEEDY MCCREADY Posts: 26,821
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    Seriously, I don't know where to begin to address this post.

    I guess they are just starving because they are too lazy to find all these nutrients laying all over the place. :rolleyes:
    so im curious....

    what do you do personally to help the starving people of africa?????
    Take me piece by piece.....
    Till there aint nothing left worth taking away from me.....
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    Kenny Olav wrote:
    The blame lies on the small percent of people who own the majority of the world's resources and exploit peoples' needs to their advantage.

    I don't think it should be a capitalism vs socialism/communism debate. It's about the decentralization of ownership.

    But hasn't the principles of capitalism gotten the owners to where they are today? And wouldn't a more socialist system be about redistributing the wealthin a more equal manner?

    But you're right, it's all about who is in control of the world's resources.
    And I've always thought of privatization as a huge part of capitalism.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:
    so im curious....

    what do you do personally to help the starving people of africa?????

    Give money, boycott products, sign petitions, spread awareness.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • hsewif
    hsewif Posts: 444
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    Of course but they still seem staggering.

    and they are. I hate opening my fridge and not seeing anything. I hate feeling hungry. I couldn't imagine living in those conditions and I'm happy that I was born here and not there.

    I don't understand how capitalism plays a part in all of this. Because McDonalds is a business that hopes to make a profit every day, they are bad? (Or coca-cola, etc.... any business, really).

    I actually read the entire wikipedia entry on capitalism. I don't see why it's THAT bad. People should be accountable for their own actions in a free society... to blame the government for people not being responsible doesn't make sense.
  • VictoryGin
    VictoryGin Posts: 1,207
    hsewif wrote:
    interesting...
    global gag rule. I've never heard of it before tonight.

    Why should the United States be responsibile for teaching family planning to every country on the globe? Shouldn't every country be responsible for their own people?

    are you referring to "family planning" as abortion? There are other ways to not have babies...

    it's not about the u.s. gov teaching family planning and it's not just about abortion. the global gag rule restricts foreign nongovernmental organizations that receive USAID funding from (using their own non-u.s. funds) and mentioning abortion options or providing abortion services. now, when a clinic or NGO refuses to sign on to the rule, they are also forbidden from receiving contraception donations. so, lose-lose for them.

    it's all very messy. going back to your original question of every country being responsible for their own people, i think that's a huge issue. i mean we fund so many things in many places, especially things like weapons. i personally think it's a good thing to help fund health care (here!) and elsewhere, but this policy certainly isn't helping women's health. in fact it's harming it.
    if you wanna be a friend of mine
    cross the river to the eastside
  • SPEEDY MCCREADY
    SPEEDY MCCREADY Posts: 26,821
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    Give money, boycott products, sign petitions, spread awareness.
    which charities to help the starving africans if i may ask do you donate to???
    Take me piece by piece.....
    Till there aint nothing left worth taking away from me.....
  • VictoryGin
    VictoryGin Posts: 1,207
    Kenny Olav wrote:
    Africa is extremely rich in natural resources, but who controls those resources?

    Read about the angry souls in Nigeria who are powerless to stop the corruption of Chevron (which Condoleeza Rice was Director of before joining the Bush team)... http://www.globalpolicy.org/nations/chevron.htm

    A great deal of farm land is wasted in Africa because the landowners produce "cash crops" that are sold to the West instead of being used to provide food at home... http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Global_Secrets_Lies/Myth_FoodScarcity.html

    And lest we forget the diamond mines...
    http://www.realdiamondfacts.org
    http://www.minesandcommunities.org/Action/press712.htm


    The blame lies on the small percent of people who own the majority of the world's resources and exploit peoples' needs to their advantage.

    I don't think it should be a capitalism vs socialism/communism debate. It's about the decentralization of ownership.

    thank you for posting that. i think a lot of people in general don't know a lot about african resources, and who owns them is a huge part of 'the problem'. and before i get started on diamonds, i should just stop posting and go play a little guitar :).
    if you wanna be a friend of mine
    cross the river to the eastside
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:
    which charities to help the starving africans if i may ask do you donate to???

    Doctors without Borders
    Unicef
    Amnesty International
    DoSomething.org
    Orphans of Rwanda

    I help when I can...I'm not well off by any means but I try to do what I can with what I have.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • gue_barium
    gue_barium Posts: 5,515
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    Share your thoughts on this image. Do you think it's fair assessment? Why or why not?

    http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r84/tangowannabe/EnjoyCapitalism.jpg

    I've said it before. I don't think capitalism is the problem. The problem is liberty, misunderstood.

    And the military-industrial complex.
    all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
    except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    gue_barium wrote:
    I've said it before. I don't think capitalism is the problem. The problem is liberty, misunderstood.

    And the military-industrial complex.


    Explain the 'liberty misunderstood'.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • gue_barium
    gue_barium Posts: 5,515
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    Explain the 'liberty misunderstood'.

    I think liberty is a gift, a privilege. I think it is misundertood to be a right.
    all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
    except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    gue_barium wrote:
    I think liberty is a gift, a privilege. I think it is misundertood to be a right.

    so who decides who has liberty?
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • gue_barium
    gue_barium Posts: 5,515
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    so who decides who has liberty?

    Liberty comes and goes. Within. Without.
    How one treats liberty...says much about a person.
    all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
    except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
  • lucylespian
    lucylespian Posts: 2,403
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    But hasn't the principles of capitalism gotten the owners to where they are today? And wouldn't a more socialist system be about redistributing the wealthin a more equal manner?

    But you're right, it's all about who is in control of the world's resources.
    And I've always thought of privatization as a huge part of capitalism.

    The problem is that under socialist systems, there stops being wealth to distribute. Completely socialist/communist countries all wind up dirt poor. Heavily socialised countries wind up very unhappy.
    Capitsalist sountries are not perfect, but there is more opportunity.
    Music is not a competetion.
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    gue_barium wrote:
    Liberty comes and goes. Within. Without.
    How one treats liberty...says much about a person.

    The opportunity to use liberty for one's own gain without consideration of the effects of their actions is the basis of capitalism to me.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    lucylespian wrote:
    The problem is that under socialist systems, there stops being wealth to distribute. Completely socialist/communist countries all wind up dirt poor. Heavily socialised countries wind up very unhappy.
    Capitsalist sountries are not perfect, but there is more opportunity.

    Some socialist countries are doing quite well. I think outside influence and interference also plays a big role in their success.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • gue_barium
    gue_barium Posts: 5,515
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    The opportunity to use liberty for one's own gain without consideration of the effects of their actions is the basis of capitalism to me.

    That's an abuse of liberty, though, I cannot agree "abuse of liberty" = capitalism.

    Pearl Jam are good capitalists. Hell, even Bill and Melinda Gates have become pretty good capitalists. The Nature Conservancy is a good organization dedicated to raising money to preserve nature. And they raise million upons millions for, more or less, capitalist venture real estate deals. Although, the "venture" ends in preservation.
    all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
    except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
  • lucylespian
    lucylespian Posts: 2,403
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    Some socialist countries are doing quite well. I think outside influence and interference also plays a big role in their success.

    Which ones ??

    Sweden etc are "heavily socialised", not socialist. Without being an expert, depression and alcoholism rates are very high, according to folk I have met from there.
    Music is not a competetion.
  • Purple Hawk
    Purple Hawk Posts: 1,300
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    Share your thoughts on this image. Do you think it's fair assessment? Why or why not?

    http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r84/tangowannabe/EnjoyCapitalism.jpg

    it's an obviously unfair, and pathetically simplistic assessment b/c 1. it plays on emotions through sensationalism, but more importantly 2. it implies that capitalism is a zero sum game when it's not...

    the image implies that the child on the right is starving b/c of captialism of the west, which is laughable. he is starving b/c of the corruption of their own government, which hasn't adopted capitalism itself...so I would argue, the child is starving b/c of a lack of capitalism.
    And you ask me what I want this year
    And I try to make this kind and clear
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
    Cuz I don't need boxes wrapped in strings
    And desire and love and empty things
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days

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