And how many people have you ever heard say this: "I want to be a musician, but I dont want to be rich and famous", or "I want to be an actor, but I dont care about being a big deal movie star".
I dont equate success and wealth with happiness. In fact I couldnt disagree more with the idea. Its others who believe this.
Umm... pretty much every musician and actor I know has said that. They'd be happy just to make a living at it.
Sure, there are many others that believe that. The point is that you don't know who they are, but you pretend that you can tell without knowing them based on their lifestyle. It's as bad as making any kind of stereotypical judgment: black dude=criminal. Guy with nice car=shallow evil racist. They're both absurd. But you insist the latter is not... you insist it is FACT.
Susan Lucci grew up in the same town I'm from. We had the same drama teacher. Her daughter was in my grade. Susan still lives in the town she grew up in. A nice house? Sure. Gated? Nope.
VERY true...but what a house! :P
that said, many have presented examples of people who have done stayed close to their roots, close to where they began, etc. it is 'easier' for soap stars, smaller actors and musicians, to maintain a better life of anonimity. thus why they can manage it. susan lucci can....jennifer aniston cannot. i mean, it's not rocket science to realize this. i also think persuing fame on a grand scale pretty much predisposes the person to the idea that they actually DO want fame, celebrity, etc. those who don't...well they work smaller. even amongst stars in hollywood films, say the lili taylors and the like.....i'm sure she lives in a very nice house, but i imagine she finds it far easier to be incognito than angelina jolie. it's a choice. plenty of people do 'choose' just what level of fame they want, how they personally define 'success'.......seems only the OP is under the mistaken impression that he is the only person in the world not entirely wrapped up in material things.
I don't disagree for the sake of disagreeing. I disagree because it gets old to constantly read your threads ranting about "the white man this" and "the white man" that. Not EVERYTHING that happens in the world is some insidious racist plot to keep the black man down. And I'm tired of your posts insinuating that people that don't want to go live on a commune with you are all shallow and greedy racists. Because it simply isn't true.
Buying stuff doesn't make me happy. But you know what does make me happy? A nice hot shower with running water. A tv where I can watch the Detroit Tigers play baseball. Running around the woods naked digging for berries would not make me happy. I don't overdo it, but I do live comfortably. I don't have a house, I have an apartment. But I did grow up in the suburbs, and I was happy to have a nice school and to be able to ride my bike to the park without having to dodge drug dealers. Sue me.
When did I attack your for living in a house? I told you I live in an apartment. I have hot showers and a bed and a computer.
What I am suggesting is, whether you or I want to change or not, society cant endure much more of it. The world cant endure much more of it.
what i am suggesting is that our way of life, mine included, has consequences. And that I am ready to do the hunting and gathering thing when it is comes, and it will come
I believe in survival too. So when it comes, I'll hunt and gather too. And it hasn't come to that just yet, so until then, I'm going to enjoy my hot shower and my tv. I'm going to drive my little Ford Focus. But I will not say anyone in a bmw is some sort of prick for it, or that anyone in a big house is a racist just trying to keep out black people.
Susan Lucci grew up in the same town I'm from. We had the same drama teacher. Her daughter was in my grade. Susan still lives in the town she grew up in. A nice house? Sure. Gated? Nope.
VERY true...but what a house! :P
that said, many have presented examples of people who have done stayed close to their roots, close to where they began, etc. it is 'easier' for soap stars, smaller actors and musicians, to maintain a better life of anonimity. thus why they can manage it. susan lucci can....jennifer aniston cannot. i mean, it's not rocket science to realize this. i also think persuing fame on a grand scale pretty much predisposes the person to the idea that they actually DO want fame, celebrity, etc. those who don't...well they work smaller. even amongst stars in hollywood films, say the lili taylors and the like.....i'm sure she lives in a very nice house, but i imagine she finds it far easier to be incognito than angelina jolie. it's a choice. plenty of people do 'choose' just what level of fame they want, how they personally define 'success'.......seems only the OP is under the mistaken impression that he is the only person in the world not entirely wrapped up in material things.
Gee I wonder why I would think that decide2dream? I started this thread and most of it is made up of people disagreeing with me. Which is fine, but people seem incredulous that I would even ask why people who get wealthy buy things.
So yeah, i dont mind suggesting it seems I am the only person, or seems like I am the only person who isnt wrapped up in material things.
VERY true...but what a house! :P
that said, many have presented examples of people who have done stayed close to their roots, close to where they began, etc. it is 'easier' for soap stars, smaller actors and musicians, to maintain a better life of anonimity. thus why they can manage it. susan lucci can....jennifer aniston cannot. i mean, it's not rocket science to realize this. i also think persuing fame on a grand scale pretty much predisposes the person to the idea that they actually DO want fame, celebrity, etc. those who don't...well they work smaller. even amongst stars in hollywood films, say the lili taylors and the like.....i'm sure she lives in a very nice house, but i imagine she finds it far easier to be incognito than angelina jolie. it's a choice. plenty of people do 'choose' just what level of fame they want, how they personally define 'success'.......seems only the OP is under the mistaken impression that he is the only person in the world not entirely wrapped up in material things.
Gee I wonder why I would think that decide2dream? I started this thread and most of it is made up of people disagreeing with me. Which is fine, but people seem incredulous that I would even ask why people who get wealthy buy things.
So yeah, i dont mind suggesting it seems I am the only person, or seems like I am the only person who isnt wrapped up in material things.
I dunno man, given how much time you spend thinking about what other people are doing with their money, I'd say you are pretty wrapped up in material things.
You didn't just ask why people that get wealthy buy nice things, you claimed to know why and that they were bad people for it. That is what people disagreed with. You weren't interested in hearing why people that got wealthy buy thing. As soon as we are offered our thoughts, you told us all that we were wrong and that they did it because they were greedy or racist or whatever. You refused to acknowledge even the possibility that some people might buy a house in the suburbs for reasons other than the ones you offer. You said they did it to escape blacks and because they were told buying stuff would make them happy and that was that... you wouldn't hear a word otherwise. We all offered a number of examples and reasons drawn from REAL LIFE (not internal ideology), such as wanting more space, better schools, less crime, etc... but you dismissed such reasons without even considering them.
Susan Lucci grew up in the same town I'm from. We had the same drama teacher. Her daughter was in my grade. Susan still lives in the town she grew up in. A nice house? Sure. Gated? Nope.
VERY true...but what a house! :P
that said, many have presented examples of people who have done stayed close to their roots, close to where they began, etc. it is 'easier' for soap stars, smaller actors and musicians, to maintain a better life of anonimity. thus why they can manage it. susan lucci can....jennifer aniston cannot. i mean, it's not rocket science to realize this. i also think persuing fame on a grand scale pretty much predisposes the person to the idea that they actually DO want fame, celebrity, etc. those who don't...well they work smaller. even amongst stars in hollywood films, say the lili taylors and the like.....i'm sure she lives in a very nice house, but i imagine she finds it far easier to be incognito than angelina jolie. it's a choice. plenty of people do 'choose' just what level of fame they want, how they personally define 'success'.......seems only the OP is under the mistaken impression that he is the only person in the world not entirely wrapped up in material things.
Gee I wonder why I would think that decide2dream? I started this thread and most of it is made up of people disagreeing with me. Which is fine, but people seem incredulous that I would even ask why people who get wealthy buy things.
So yeah, i dont mind suggesting it seems I am the only person, or seems like I am the only person who isnt wrapped up in material things.
just because someone is wealthy and lives in a big house, or has nice things...doesn't mean they are 'wrapped up' in materialism, alone. you are the only one who seems to see people as one-dimnesional...except for yourself, in all your three-dimensional glory. :? WHY does one persue fame or wealth? i mean, obviously there is some degree of material comfort desired. we all to some degree seek out material comforts...be them as simple as a comfy bed and a roof over our heads, good food, warm clothes, etc. that is material desire. you could, technically, choose to live your life without any of those things. i think it's a no-brainer that those who persue wealth do want life comforts, and some even more.....but also, can you imagine them wanting to do GREATER GOOD...you know, besides just TALKING about it? those you continually vilify also do a LOT of good for the world, support countless charitable programs, help the less fortunate...and on and on. not all rich people are materialistic evil beings. sadly, you can't seem to see people for ALL they are. seems you are the one most hung up over possessions. one can like and have nice things....and still have it NOT be the focus of their existence. most people do seem to fall within this category......
my post above 'explained' a very reasonable rationale behind it all.....yet you seem hell-bent that you alone know the motivations of others choices and actions. it's funny, you get so defensive....talk how we can't know each other here, how dare anyone judge you from your posts, etc, etc....and yet time and again, i see you do it endlessly here....for people you don't know, at all.......it does work both ways.......
you said yourself, it's a complex issue......humans are complex.....so i don't doubt people's motivations for their choices in this world are quite complex too, not the one-dimensional ideas YOU assign to others' choices......
You go to school, get a job, get married, settle down, retire and die.
HOW the vast majority of people may go about this process, varies greatly. once again, reducing EVERYone else, - except your revolutionary self, who has done what, exactly? - are all drones.
in all honesty tho......that is simply.....LIFE. from the beginnings of time...human beings have gathered together for safety, formed tribes, mated, raised children to continue the species...and then died. almost all animals follow similar patterns. as life/civilization has progressed....we have more TIME to persue things we ENJOY...simply b/c we enjoy them. life has always been about work, family, community, and ultimately death. i don't know what amazing and revolutionary thing you are going to do with your life that is going to be so vastly different. and not everyone goes to school, sadly......not everyone follows standard employment.....PLENTY of people never marry or have children...but sure, we all die. whatever 'meaning' we find in life, is our own.
the whole idea of subdivisions and suburbs. That lets move away from "the others". While I dont necessarily think thats the case here, its an interesting idea.
How about the issue of race. What about the african americans who grow up in squalor and make it out, take Tupac for example. Or Biggie. Its interesting indeed how they came out of a bad situation, a horrific situation and moved away, yet their music was about and for, people in the situations they escaped. You dont find that interesting?
Further, making money, and being a big star like biggie and tupac, you start to get accepted into white culture. How does that mesh with the radical messages both brought to the table? The fact they were living large, while all the while speaking to, and for impoverished people? Would a gated community welcome a Tupac or Biggie? What would be the reaction?
Its a complicated issue. Its more deep than privacy or success or wealth. Thus the reason why I started the thread.
Most don't even look at their neighborhood or childhood as a sad situation. They see it as more of survival so that's why they tend to stay loyal to their friends/family members from their youth.
No matter how rich or famous they become, seems like their childhood friends are always tagging along for the ride and sometimes they bring their past troubled behavior comes along with them too.
By the way, isn't it a common rule of thumb that once something is accepted by white people it becomes uncool and no longer fresh? ....i kid, i kid.
i would love it one time if on a political thread I started you went "i disagree with x and y and z, but I think your ideas about such and such are interesting". But I aint holding my breath. I dont want people saying they agree with me all the time, but again, when as is the case with soulsinging, its I disagree with you 100 percent of the time, its hard not to be disappointed to see their name on a thread you started.
Id love to hear your ideas pal, but thats another thing I find boring. People arguing just for the hell of it.
I would wager you could admit to yourself, maybe not to the board, that i am not just an armchair revolutionary. That I have ideas, and that I am educated. That I studied sociology and am well read. ''
But somehow that all gets lost, when you continually act like I am some madman shouting in the streets. We go way back, we have been talking on this board for years, yet you act like I am some person who doesnt deserve to have their voice heard. THAT to me is the disappointment
When you have an interesting idea that wasn't stolen outright from Ishmael, I will tell you. Why would I "admit" that you're educated and well read? I don't know you and have no clue how educated or read you are. You keep thinking this is personal. It's not. It's just that I find the ideas you continuously advance to be pretty ridiculous. I know you won't believe it, but I used to think and talk the exact same way. I read Ishmael and smoked mountains of pot in high school and college too, and it was damned easy to be a "revolutionary" back then when you don't have bills to pay. You remind me of me about 10 years ago. But the stuff you're talking about now just won't work in real life.
And just so you know it's not just you, talk to Drifting. He and I go at it constantly in the Moving Train. Nothing personal about it. I just think his ideas are nuts. As are yours. Nothing personal man. Sorry.
I think you put almost everything I wanted to say into words here ss, thank you.
I'm a musician and I would be completely satisfied in being able to make a living at it. I'd love for it to give me plenty of money, but not really for materialistic purposes.
What's wrong with people being rich and enjoying themselves? I have a pretty modest income but I spend plenty of money on things that I enjoy. If I was richer I'd do the same and when I was poorer I attempted to do the same.
I dunno what movin to gated neighborhoods has to do with racism. Don't they allow all races in them? I'd move out of a poor neighborhood if I became rich. You'd have to.
I remember Dave Chappelle saying that he lives in a house in Ohio that costs less than a million dollars.
That's the same guy who walked away from $50 million contract.
hence why he bought a lower priced house.
...but can't $1,000,000 buy a lot of house in Ohio?
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I remember Dave Chappelle saying that he lives in a house in Ohio that costs less than a million dollars.
That's the same guy who walked away from $50 million contract.
hence why he bought a lower priced house.
...but can't $1,000,000 buy a lot of house in Ohio?
that could buy the whole state...and you'd have change to buy kentucky as well
I remember Dave Chappelle saying that he lives in a house in Ohio that costs less than a million dollars.
That's the same guy who walked away from $50 million contract.
hence why he bought a lower priced house.
...but can't $1,000,000 buy a lot of house in Ohio?
I was gonna add that... that's probably a $10 mil estate on the east coast
I remember Dave Chappelle saying that he lives in a house in Ohio that costs less than a million dollars.
That's the same guy who walked away from $50 million contract.
hence why he bought a lower priced house.
...but can't $1,000,000 buy a lot of house in Ohio?
I was gonna add that... that's probably a $10 mil estate on the east coast
awesome whoever thought of Dave chappelle. makes my whole point for me. This is a guy who was the biggest thing. I remember many a night during my freshman year in college, hearing drunk kids all hours of the night saying "Im rick james" and "okay!". This guy was huge.
He's offered 50 million, but its obvious to anyone with half a brain the money didnt matter at all to him. He is happy living a modest life on a farm. I have heard his neighbors say he doesnt ham it up, he's just an average guy.
I think there is a balance between being bill gates and being Jd salinger anonymous. Dave Chappelle is that balance or will be when he does the next movie or whatever.
He was the most successful comedian on the planet in 2004-2005 or whenever that was, and he obviously didnt think buying a mansion or whatever was going to do a damn thing. And I dont think it would have. He clearly had stuff to work out, soul searching stuff. Money doesnt help you one bit, in trying to find yourself, in fact from what i can gather, its the opposite, you can easily lose your way once the money comes tumbling in...
I think the general assumption is once you hit the big time everything will be fine. That all the problems you had will be solved. Its a wrong assumption. The girls on The Hills, or Britney or Lindsay or Paris I bet if you asked them, they would say they arent happy. That money doesnt do anything for them.
Yet all live extravagent livestyles. Money hasnt made them better people in fact it seems the case all three have become less since becoming famous
thats all the point i wanted to make
...but can't $1,000,000 buy a lot of house in Ohio?
I was gonna add that... that's probably a $10 mil estate on the east coast
awesome whoever thought of Dave chappelle. makes my whole point for me. This is a guy who was the biggest thing. I remember many a night during my freshman year in college, hearing drunk kids all hours of the night saying "Im rick james" and "okay!". This guy was huge.
He's offered 50 million, but its obvious to anyone with half a brain the money didnt matter at all to him. He is happy living a modest life on a farm. I have heard his neighbors say he doesnt ham it up, he's just an average guy.
I think there is a balance between being bill gates and being Jd salinger anonymous. Dave Chappelle is that balance or will be when he does the next movie or whatever.
He was the most successful comedian on the planet in 2004-2005 or whenever that was, and he obviously didnt think buying a mansion or whatever was going to do a damn thing. And I dont think it would have. He clearly had stuff to work out, soul searching stuff. Money doesnt help you one bit, in trying to find yourself, in fact from what i can gather, its the opposite, you can easily lose your way once the money comes tumbling in...
Please you are using Dave Chappelle for all the wrong reasons. He didn't turn down $50 million because he didn't want it or that it would bring him material things. He turned it down because he was losing control of his show, of the artistic direction which his show was taking. So he decided it was better to give it up and relax and not compromise himself or his vision than to take the money and run. He's not filthy stinking rich (he is fairly wealthy though) because of his convictions about his comedy and viewpoints on the world and society and not compromising NOT because he didn't want to leave his country life or stay true to the inner city or make his family's life and future better.
He lives in Ohio on an expansive farm in a nice rural town because he wants to. He doesn't live in the city, he doesn't run out to the clubs every night, he decide to set up himself and his family on a nice piece of land in Ohio where he can have his privacy and raise his family out of the spotlight.
So what does Dave do now for money??? He tours the country doing comedy shows in large venues such as the Borgata and other such casinos... yeah sounds like turning down the money and living off the land to me.
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I think the general assumption is once you hit the big time everything will be fine. That all the problems you had will be solved. Its a wrong assumption. The girls on The Hills, or Britney or Lindsay or Paris I bet if you asked them, they would say they arent happy. That money doesnt do anything for them.
Yet all live extravagent livestyles. Money hasnt made them better people in fact it seems the case all three have become less since becoming famous
thats all the point i wanted to make
i think the assumption you're making is that the money is the deciding factor, when in fact its the person.
if someone gets clouded up in money and overly focused on it (especially when they have loads) then its their own fault - not the moneys fault. most people just use extra earnings or windfalls to further spend on the things that matter to them - family, security, longterm plans, hobbies. wtf is wrong with that?
What would you do if you inherited millions in the morning? would you just let it sit in a bank account? or would you maybe buy a suit? or a new Ipod, or good quality headsets, or some gifts for loved ones??
Getting to the stage where money dictates your life is a step further than just spending on what you can afford (be that what it may at different incomes). People being elaborate & in your face is only an issue if you respond to it.
like soulsinging, you remind me of me a few years back, especially as i live in a fairly well off area...i was really against it, life seemed to planned & constricted. you need to get whatevers pissing you off out of your system. money isnt the defining issue for people. it's the families, their careers, their friends, their passions. earning good money makes life easier in so many ways. most the people you're thinking about wouldnt like to be described as rich people....theyd probably prefer to be known for what they do, not what they own. you just need to shift your focus in what your looking at in them.
(the "celebrity" element is not normal behaviour, and theres no reason to compare that to real life, so using that as your yardstick is pretty pointless).
I think the general assumption is once you hit the big time everything will be fine. That all the problems you had will be solved. Its a wrong assumption. The girls on The Hills, or Britney or Lindsay or Paris I bet if you asked them, they would say they arent happy. That money doesnt do anything for them.
Yet all live extravagent livestyles. Money hasnt made them better people in fact it seems the case all three have become less since becoming famous
thats all the point i wanted to make
seriously, seems like YOU are making many assumptions about others, and i have no idea on what basis. i know NO ONE who thinks this, at all. i think perhaps you've been living in a bubble, and don't know too many real-life people to truly have a sense of what they think and feel? i don't honestly know what else to think. money can take care of some 'worries' sure...but no one i know thinks it's the end-all be-all..not by a longshot, and it sure as shit doesn't make life happy, YOU make your life happy. anyone i know knows this. seems you work on a lot of assumptions, but not many facts...and on ideas of society that have come and gone...like the whole white flight to the suburbs, etc. there's a whole world out there...embrace it. btw - for someone so anti-establishement, anti-commercialism...you sure to seem well-versed on everything on tv. earlier you said you wouldn't believe someone not ever seeing MTVcribs. *raises hand* never saw it, no interest. same with much on the tube, and i certainly don't sit thru endless advertisements, etc.....so i am not subjected so heavily to all the 'pressures' to want, want, want...tho i watched plenty of tv as a kid, tho probably not as much as kids today...but funny, it in no way shaped my values....my family and friends did that...and most importantly, me. you seem under the delusion that you are the only 'free-thinker' out there. we are many. just b/c we don't follow your free-thinking, doesn't mean we don't do our own free-thought and choice.
yeah but there is always an exception. Fugazi and The Flaming Lips as has been mentioned.
"but I still got love for the streets" anyone heard that line before? how about "my block".
I made the "Jenny From the block" post on the first page. The point of that post was to higlight the absolute & total meaninglessness of it. I remember even seeing documentaries where people from Jennifer Lopez's old street gave out about her lying to the masses....she hadnt been in touch with anyone in the area in years.
I'm sure she sees herself as shaped by her upbringing, as many/most people do. Dre feels the same.
But they sure as shit arent gona live in a dangerous neighbourhood if they can afford to move out.
Ian McKaye (Fugazi) is from a mid-upper class suburb of Washington DC. He never moved to a "better suburb" cos he already lived in one. Theres nothing wrong with that, but im just pointing out that it in no way backs up your argument. The guy is an anti-celebrity, and a genius. But he didnt grow up in a bad area, or an inner city, he grew up in modern, DC suburbia. The possible epitome of White Racist Supremacy by your earlier posts....?
I think the general assumption is once you hit the big time everything will be fine. That all the problems you had will be solved.
Who is making this assumption? You act like it's everywhere... I'm not seeing it. Have you ever met any of the people you're ranting about? Do you know for a fact this is the way they are?
The girls on The Hills, or Britney or Lindsay or Paris **I BET** if you asked them, they would say they arent happy. That money doesnt do anything for them.
Yet all live extravagent livestyles. Money hasnt made them better people in fact it seems the case all three have become less since becoming famous
thats all the point i wanted to make
You bet? So you don't know. That's what I thought. But by all means, keep imagining that everyone with more money than you is miserable inside and desperately trying to buy happiness. Whatever it takes to support your unwarranted sense of superiority to the rest of us pathetic materialist consumers. :roll:
Pretty sure rappers become rappers so they "can get out of the ghetto". Why any rapper would stay there is beyond me. Risk getting robbed,stabbed,killed?
I see what your saying though. My dad is friends with a multi-millionaire and he still lives in the same boring town, only drives a BMW 5 series, and doesnt waste his money. Most of that is because hes naturally cheap, but he isnt a show off. I hate showing off, so if I had alot of money I wouldnt flaunt it. I sure as hell WOULD buy a btter house and nicer cars, and all that cool stuff. But I wouldn't brag about it.
only drives a BMW 5 series, and doesnt waste his money. .
oxywha?
edit: guess you never told us the year
its like a 2005. The guy can afford a new Bentley or Rolls Royce, He chose the middle line BMW. Not even a 7series. its like $45-50k vs $200-300k.
sure, but wasting money and what you can afford are not directly related. Just because he can afford a more costly ride, doesn't mean a $50k car isn't a waste of money. Esp if he bought it new.
Still, I don't begrudge people for nice cars...it's something I'd probably spend money on if I had lots...and buying a bimmer is LESS of a waste of money than buying domestic, so there's something to be said for that
sure, but wasting money and what you can afford are not directly related. Just because he can afford a more costly ride, doesn't mean a $50k car isn't a waste of money. Esp if he bought it new.
Still, I don't begrudge people for nice cars...it's something I'd probably spend money on if I had lots...and buying a bimmer is LESS of a waste of money than buying domestic, so there's something to be said for that
why is it a *waste* tho? truly?
he obviously is living well WITHIN his means, can afford way more. sure, one does not *need* a more expensive car per se......but why is the only other choice that it is a waste? more expensive goods usually require more expensive components, more expensive and skilled labor to produce, etc, etc......see where i am going? those more expensive cars, homes, electronics, clothes, etc.....provide many, many jobs....and many of em higher paying b/c many of the goods require higher skillsets. and even amongst the jobs that don't require higher skillsets, they are still providing jobs by providing the needs for production. hardly seems a *waste* when you see just how many people earn their livilihoods b/c of it. just sayin'......it's not all waste.......and in the discussion of a car, it may not be an actual waste either b/c many expensive cars are more fuel efficient, and/or safer construction, etc, etc. not always the case, but again...just sayin'...bigger picture........
sure, but wasting money and what you can afford are not directly related. Just because he can afford a more costly ride, doesn't mean a $50k car isn't a waste of money. Esp if he bought it new.
Still, I don't begrudge people for nice cars...it's something I'd probably spend money on if I had lots...and buying a bimmer is LESS of a waste of money than buying domestic, so there's something to be said for that
why is it a *waste* tho? truly?
he obviously is living well WITHIN his means, can afford way more. sure, one does not *need* a more expensive car per se......but why is the only other choice that it is a waste? more expensive goods usually require more expensive components, more expensive and skilled labor to produce, etc, etc......see where i am going? those more expensive cars, homes, electronics, clothes, etc.....provide many, many jobs....and many of em higher paying b/c many of the goods require higher skillsets. and even amongst the jobs that don't require higher skillsets, they are still providing jobs by providing the needs for production. hardly seems a *waste* when you see just how many people earn their livilihoods b/c of it. just sayin'......it's not all waste.......and in the discussion of a car, it may not be an actual waste either b/c many expensive cars are more fuel efficient, and/or safer construction, etc, etc. not always the case, but again...just sayin'...bigger picture........
Regardless of your 'means', spending $50k on a car is wasteful. You could buy a car that's just as reliable for much less. In terms of practicality, it's not worth the extra money...so it's wasteful IMO. I know what you're saying about the trickle-down effect, but there is waste there too...the higher wages etc are a result of the higher end cost...so if the manufacturer was building a more cost-effective car with less frills, he probably wouldn't be stuck with the high-cost labour..ya know? It's always interesting to find the balance between an acceptable, wester-world life standard, and the poverty we're turnign our backs on. Sure, people deserve nice things for hard work, and it's not fair to hold success against someone....but where should the line be drawn? I guess I'm vearing into idealism and mass-morality, which doesn't seem very popular in this discussion
And yes, resale, fuel efficiency, safety etc all factor into the decision of what make and how much to spend....but a 5 series BMW, while not the epitomy of greed, is still an ego-based purchase. which is ok with me...just sayin
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Umm... pretty much every musician and actor I know has said that. They'd be happy just to make a living at it.
Sure, there are many others that believe that. The point is that you don't know who they are, but you pretend that you can tell without knowing them based on their lifestyle. It's as bad as making any kind of stereotypical judgment: black dude=criminal. Guy with nice car=shallow evil racist. They're both absurd. But you insist the latter is not... you insist it is FACT.
VERY true...but what a house! :P
that said, many have presented examples of people who have done stayed close to their roots, close to where they began, etc. it is 'easier' for soap stars, smaller actors and musicians, to maintain a better life of anonimity. thus why they can manage it. susan lucci can....jennifer aniston cannot. i mean, it's not rocket science to realize this. i also think persuing fame on a grand scale pretty much predisposes the person to the idea that they actually DO want fame, celebrity, etc. those who don't...well they work smaller. even amongst stars in hollywood films, say the lili taylors and the like.....i'm sure she lives in a very nice house, but i imagine she finds it far easier to be incognito than angelina jolie. it's a choice. plenty of people do 'choose' just what level of fame they want, how they personally define 'success'.......seems only the OP is under the mistaken impression that he is the only person in the world not entirely wrapped up in material things.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
I believe in survival too. So when it comes, I'll hunt and gather too. And it hasn't come to that just yet, so until then, I'm going to enjoy my hot shower and my tv. I'm going to drive my little Ford Focus. But I will not say anyone in a bmw is some sort of prick for it, or that anyone in a big house is a racist just trying to keep out black people.
Gee I wonder why I would think that decide2dream? I started this thread and most of it is made up of people disagreeing with me. Which is fine, but people seem incredulous that I would even ask why people who get wealthy buy things.
So yeah, i dont mind suggesting it seems I am the only person, or seems like I am the only person who isnt wrapped up in material things.
So yeah, I dont know why i would suggest the world is full of greedy, consumerist folk? Why would I dare do such a thing!
do you purchase goods and services with money...? if so, you're a consumer...
http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fusea ... ID=6975726
I dunno man, given how much time you spend thinking about what other people are doing with their money, I'd say you are pretty wrapped up in material things.
You didn't just ask why people that get wealthy buy nice things, you claimed to know why and that they were bad people for it. That is what people disagreed with. You weren't interested in hearing why people that got wealthy buy thing. As soon as we are offered our thoughts, you told us all that we were wrong and that they did it because they were greedy or racist or whatever. You refused to acknowledge even the possibility that some people might buy a house in the suburbs for reasons other than the ones you offer. You said they did it to escape blacks and because they were told buying stuff would make them happy and that was that... you wouldn't hear a word otherwise. We all offered a number of examples and reasons drawn from REAL LIFE (not internal ideology), such as wanting more space, better schools, less crime, etc... but you dismissed such reasons without even considering them.
just because someone is wealthy and lives in a big house, or has nice things...doesn't mean they are 'wrapped up' in materialism, alone. you are the only one who seems to see people as one-dimnesional...except for yourself, in all your three-dimensional glory. :? WHY does one persue fame or wealth? i mean, obviously there is some degree of material comfort desired. we all to some degree seek out material comforts...be them as simple as a comfy bed and a roof over our heads, good food, warm clothes, etc. that is material desire. you could, technically, choose to live your life without any of those things. i think it's a no-brainer that those who persue wealth do want life comforts, and some even more.....but also, can you imagine them wanting to do GREATER GOOD...you know, besides just TALKING about it? those you continually vilify also do a LOT of good for the world, support countless charitable programs, help the less fortunate...and on and on. not all rich people are materialistic evil beings. sadly, you can't seem to see people for ALL they are. seems you are the one most hung up over possessions. one can like and have nice things....and still have it NOT be the focus of their existence. most people do seem to fall within this category......
my post above 'explained' a very reasonable rationale behind it all.....yet you seem hell-bent that you alone know the motivations of others choices and actions. it's funny, you get so defensive....talk how we can't know each other here, how dare anyone judge you from your posts, etc, etc....and yet time and again, i see you do it endlessly here....for people you don't know, at all.......it does work both ways.......
you said yourself, it's a complex issue......humans are complex.....so i don't doubt people's motivations for their choices in this world are quite complex too, not the one-dimensional ideas YOU assign to others' choices......
btw - this interests me........
HOW the vast majority of people may go about this process, varies greatly. once again, reducing EVERYone else, - except your revolutionary self, who has done what, exactly? - are all drones.
in all honesty tho......that is simply.....LIFE. from the beginnings of time...human beings have gathered together for safety, formed tribes, mated, raised children to continue the species...and then died. almost all animals follow similar patterns. as life/civilization has progressed....we have more TIME to persue things we ENJOY...simply b/c we enjoy them. life has always been about work, family, community, and ultimately death. i don't know what amazing and revolutionary thing you are going to do with your life that is going to be so vastly different. and not everyone goes to school, sadly......not everyone follows standard employment.....PLENTY of people never marry or have children...but sure, we all die. whatever 'meaning' we find in life, is our own.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
No matter how rich or famous they become, seems like their childhood friends are always tagging along for the ride and sometimes they bring their past troubled behavior comes along with them too.
By the way, isn't it a common rule of thumb that once something is accepted by white people it becomes uncool and no longer fresh?
EV- 08/09,10/2008.06/08,09/2009
I think you put almost everything I wanted to say into words here ss, thank you.
What's wrong with people being rich and enjoying themselves? I have a pretty modest income but I spend plenty of money on things that I enjoy. If I was richer I'd do the same and when I was poorer I attempted to do the same.
I dunno what movin to gated neighborhoods has to do with racism. Don't they allow all races in them? I'd move out of a poor neighborhood if I became rich. You'd have to.
hence why he bought a lower priced house.
...but can't $1,000,000 buy a lot of house in Ohio?
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that could buy the whole state...and you'd have change to buy kentucky as well
I was gonna add that... that's probably a $10 mil estate on the east coast
awesome whoever thought of Dave chappelle. makes my whole point for me. This is a guy who was the biggest thing. I remember many a night during my freshman year in college, hearing drunk kids all hours of the night saying "Im rick james" and "okay!". This guy was huge.
He's offered 50 million, but its obvious to anyone with half a brain the money didnt matter at all to him. He is happy living a modest life on a farm. I have heard his neighbors say he doesnt ham it up, he's just an average guy.
I think there is a balance between being bill gates and being Jd salinger anonymous. Dave Chappelle is that balance or will be when he does the next movie or whatever.
He was the most successful comedian on the planet in 2004-2005 or whenever that was, and he obviously didnt think buying a mansion or whatever was going to do a damn thing. And I dont think it would have. He clearly had stuff to work out, soul searching stuff. Money doesnt help you one bit, in trying to find yourself, in fact from what i can gather, its the opposite, you can easily lose your way once the money comes tumbling in...
Yet all live extravagent livestyles. Money hasnt made them better people in fact it seems the case all three have become less since becoming famous
thats all the point i wanted to make
Please you are using Dave Chappelle for all the wrong reasons. He didn't turn down $50 million because he didn't want it or that it would bring him material things. He turned it down because he was losing control of his show, of the artistic direction which his show was taking. So he decided it was better to give it up and relax and not compromise himself or his vision than to take the money and run. He's not filthy stinking rich (he is fairly wealthy though) because of his convictions about his comedy and viewpoints on the world and society and not compromising NOT because he didn't want to leave his country life or stay true to the inner city or make his family's life and future better.
He lives in Ohio on an expansive farm in a nice rural town because he wants to. He doesn't live in the city, he doesn't run out to the clubs every night, he decide to set up himself and his family on a nice piece of land in Ohio where he can have his privacy and raise his family out of the spotlight.
So what does Dave do now for money??? He tours the country doing comedy shows in large venues such as the Borgata and other such casinos... yeah sounds like turning down the money and living off the land to me.
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Social awareness does not equal political activism!
5/23/2011- An utter embarrassment... ticketing failures too many to list.
i think the assumption you're making is that the money is the deciding factor, when in fact its the person.
if someone gets clouded up in money and overly focused on it (especially when they have loads) then its their own fault - not the moneys fault. most people just use extra earnings or windfalls to further spend on the things that matter to them - family, security, longterm plans, hobbies. wtf is wrong with that?
What would you do if you inherited millions in the morning? would you just let it sit in a bank account? or would you maybe buy a suit? or a new Ipod, or good quality headsets, or some gifts for loved ones??
Getting to the stage where money dictates your life is a step further than just spending on what you can afford (be that what it may at different incomes). People being elaborate & in your face is only an issue if you respond to it.
like soulsinging, you remind me of me a few years back, especially as i live in a fairly well off area...i was really against it, life seemed to planned & constricted. you need to get whatevers pissing you off out of your system. money isnt the defining issue for people. it's the families, their careers, their friends, their passions. earning good money makes life easier in so many ways. most the people you're thinking about wouldnt like to be described as rich people....theyd probably prefer to be known for what they do, not what they own. you just need to shift your focus in what your looking at in them.
(the "celebrity" element is not normal behaviour, and theres no reason to compare that to real life, so using that as your yardstick is pretty pointless).
I've heard that line. It's from Dr. Dre. The guy who lives in a big Mansion in Riverside CA. http://virtualglobetrotting.com/map/36259/
:roll:
seriously, seems like YOU are making many assumptions about others, and i have no idea on what basis. i know NO ONE who thinks this, at all. i think perhaps you've been living in a bubble, and don't know too many real-life people to truly have a sense of what they think and feel? i don't honestly know what else to think. money can take care of some 'worries' sure...but no one i know thinks it's the end-all be-all..not by a longshot, and it sure as shit doesn't make life happy, YOU make your life happy. anyone i know knows this. seems you work on a lot of assumptions, but not many facts...and on ideas of society that have come and gone...like the whole white flight to the suburbs, etc. there's a whole world out there...embrace it. btw - for someone so anti-establishement, anti-commercialism...you sure to seem well-versed on everything on tv. earlier you said you wouldn't believe someone not ever seeing MTVcribs. *raises hand* never saw it, no interest. same with much on the tube, and i certainly don't sit thru endless advertisements, etc.....so i am not subjected so heavily to all the 'pressures' to want, want, want...tho i watched plenty of tv as a kid, tho probably not as much as kids today...but funny, it in no way shaped my values....my family and friends did that...and most importantly, me. you seem under the delusion that you are the only 'free-thinker' out there. we are many. just b/c we don't follow your free-thinking, doesn't mean we don't do our own free-thought and choice.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
I made the "Jenny From the block" post on the first page. The point of that post was to higlight the absolute & total meaninglessness of it. I remember even seeing documentaries where people from Jennifer Lopez's old street gave out about her lying to the masses....she hadnt been in touch with anyone in the area in years.
I'm sure she sees herself as shaped by her upbringing, as many/most people do. Dre feels the same.
But they sure as shit arent gona live in a dangerous neighbourhood if they can afford to move out.
Ian McKaye (Fugazi) is from a mid-upper class suburb of Washington DC. He never moved to a "better suburb" cos he already lived in one. Theres nothing wrong with that, but im just pointing out that it in no way backs up your argument. The guy is an anti-celebrity, and a genius. But he didnt grow up in a bad area, or an inner city, he grew up in modern, DC suburbia. The possible epitome of White Racist Supremacy by your earlier posts....?
Who is making this assumption? You act like it's everywhere... I'm not seeing it. Have you ever met any of the people you're ranting about? Do you know for a fact this is the way they are?
You bet? So you don't know. That's what I thought. But by all means, keep imagining that everyone with more money than you is miserable inside and desperately trying to buy happiness. Whatever it takes to support your unwarranted sense of superiority to the rest of us pathetic materialist consumers. :roll:
I see what your saying though. My dad is friends with a multi-millionaire and he still lives in the same boring town, only drives a BMW 5 series, and doesnt waste his money. Most of that is because hes naturally cheap, but he isnt a show off. I hate showing off, so if I had alot of money I wouldnt flaunt it. I sure as hell WOULD buy a btter house and nicer cars, and all that cool stuff. But I wouldn't brag about it.
8/7/08, 6/9/09
edit: guess you never told us the year
its like a 2005. The guy can afford a new Bentley or Rolls Royce, He chose the middle line BMW. Not even a 7series. its like $45-50k vs $200-300k.
8/7/08, 6/9/09
Still, I don't begrudge people for nice cars...it's something I'd probably spend money on if I had lots...and buying a bimmer is LESS of a waste of money than buying domestic, so there's something to be said for that
why is it a *waste* tho? truly?
he obviously is living well WITHIN his means, can afford way more. sure, one does not *need* a more expensive car per se......but why is the only other choice that it is a waste? more expensive goods usually require more expensive components, more expensive and skilled labor to produce, etc, etc......see where i am going? those more expensive cars, homes, electronics, clothes, etc.....provide many, many jobs....and many of em higher paying b/c many of the goods require higher skillsets. and even amongst the jobs that don't require higher skillsets, they are still providing jobs by providing the needs for production. hardly seems a *waste* when you see just how many people earn their livilihoods b/c of it. just sayin'......it's not all waste.......and in the discussion of a car, it may not be an actual waste either b/c many expensive cars are more fuel efficient, and/or safer construction, etc, etc. not always the case, but again...just sayin'...bigger picture........
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
And yes, resale, fuel efficiency, safety etc all factor into the decision of what make and how much to spend....but a 5 series BMW, while not the epitomy of greed, is still an ego-based purchase. which is ok with me...just sayin