why doesn't pj just seat general admission floor?

josevolution

It seems to me from reading this whole thread that the people who wan't GA are the one's with higher ###s but isn't the whole purpose of a GA show is to get to the front, who ever want's to get to the front you have to be there once the doors open,so please someone tell me how long do you think you would have to wait to get that spot in line 1hr ,2hrs 3hrs or longer before the doors open no ? ,it's all about being up front folks cause if you walk in once eveyone is at their spot you will be at the back where you can't see shit and the only way to get up front is by pushing & shoving your way up there cause you can't really just walk up there :roll: ..with out someone telling you to back the fuck up :x that makes for an agressive situation ....and i will f'n rock harder than any young buck around these parts up front, you won't find me with my arms crossed at any PJ gig senior here ...

Bugs29

i simply look at it, the way i view all organized institutions.......someone will always have something better.

being pissed about "good tickets" and concerened about "unequal foundation"......i can understand about the "good tickets" but have no understanding about "unequal foundation".

please elaborate on "unequal foundation"?[/quote]

I just edited it to clarify so just scroll up to my previous post. Perhaps we do have a different concept of seniority.....

Bugs29

you're right, someone will always have something better, but then it is not based on a fair system since we will never have an equal opportunity to eventually obtain your position...therefore the system is unfair. Normally, in an institution someone will eventually surrender their position (retirement, death, dementia, etc...) which will then allow the lower positioned people the opportunity to succeed. That's a realistic model of an institution applied to real life. but like i mentioned, the lower people (me) will never get that chance because your superior position has no end, it's infinite, and that's not fair...that's fascism haha
So you can't give benefits in a fan club membership based on a system of seniority...it's just not fair to the other fans in the club.

ajedigecko

RM181658 wrote:

you're right, someone will always have something better, but then it is not based on a fair system since we will never have an equal opportunity to eventually obtain your position...therefore the system is unfair. Normally, in an institution someone will eventually surrender their position (retirement, death, dementia, etc...) which will then allow the lower positioned people the opportunity to succeed. That's a realistic model of an institution applied to real life. but like i mentioned, the lower people (me) will never get that chance because your superior position has no end, it's infinite, and that's not fair...that's fascism haha
So you can't give benefits in a fan club membership based on a system of seniority...it's just not fair to the other fans in the club.

all due respect.............being concerned about fairness within a music band club, seems strange.

check you pm.

iamica

GA sucks for people who are small. I'm a 5'6" female, and I get the crap kicked out of me whenever I venture into the pit (not to mention I have to stand on my tiptoes the whole time to see over all the males around me). The Lollapalooza crowd was horrible. I stood near the front of the stage for 11 1/2 hours so I could be up front, and people were shoving past me hours and hours later. Not fair.
At least with assigned seating, if someone tries to steal your spot you can have them booted out of there. Plus there's not as many injuries. You don't have to be in a mosh pit to have crazy energy at a concert.

benjs

iamica wrote:

GA sucks for people who are small. I'm a 5'6" female, and I get the crap kicked out of me whenever I venture into the pit (not to mention I have to stand on my tiptoes the whole time to see over all the males around me). The Lollapalooza crowd was horrible. I stood near the front of the stage for 11 1/2 hours so I could be up front, and people were shoving past me hours and hours later. Not fair.
At least with assigned seating, if someone tries to steal your spot you can have them booted out of there. Plus there's not as many injuries. You don't have to be in a mosh pit to have crazy energy at a concert.

That's why I think GA seated is ideal - even if no one actually sits in the chairs, it defines an area as "your own".

Drum Machine89

benjs wrote:

iamica wrote:

GA sucks for people who are small. I'm a 5'6" female, and I get the crap kicked out of me whenever I venture into the pit (not to mention I have to stand on my tiptoes the whole time to see over all the males around me). The Lollapalooza crowd was horrible. I stood near the front of the stage for 11 1/2 hours so I could be up front, and people were shoving past me hours and hours later. Not fair.
At least with assigned seating, if someone tries to steal your spot you can have them booted out of there. Plus there's not as many injuries. You don't have to be in a mosh pit to have crazy energy at a concert.

That's why I think GA seated is ideal - even if no one actually sits in the chairs, it defines an area as "your own".

Yeah I agree with you because some people can just get out of hand at shows sometimes.

Gary Carter

I saw the hip last night in nyc and was right on the rail. Great people around me. The most anyone did was bounce around in there spot. The problem with ga is u get the fratboy type that just drink and drink and force there way to the front. If u don't sell liquor people will act fine and respectful.

redrock

RM181658 wrote:

What is seniority, and how can justify such a concept that's laid down on an unequal foundation? !

The fact of getting better seats due to seniority is a way of rewarding the 'customer' for his/her loyalty. Just like other businesses, stores, etc. those these obviously do this in a different manner, for example loyalty cards with special deals, airmiles, etc. Or, closer to home, O2 customers getting a presale on tix when bands play one of their venues. Same concept - different kind of 'business'.

Laid down on an unequal foundation? Not really. Fair? For some yes, for others no.....

strummers

redrock wrote:

RM181658 wrote:

What is seniority, and how can justify such a concept that's laid down on an unequal foundation? !

The fact of getting better seats due to seniority is a way of rewarding the 'customer' for his/her loyalty. Just like other businesses, stores, etc. those these obviously do this in a different manner, for example loyalty cards with special deals, airmiles, etc. Or, closer to home, O2 customers getting a presale on tix when bands play one of their venues. Same concept - different kind of 'business'.

Laid down on an unequal foundation? Not really. Fair? For some yes, for others no.....

Technically not quite the same - you don't get a better chance/better tickets through o2 if you've been their customer for longer. Similarly, you don't get more airmiles etc the longer you've been part of the reward scheme.

Getting a little off topic I know, but the argument of 'I've paid $10-$25 dollars a year for 17 years so deserve a good seat' only means a max of $425 spent on membership fees. I'm sure there are people who have only been a member for a few years who have spent more in total (yearly sub, tickets, merch etc) through 10c than some people who've been members for many more years and only been to the odd show or bought the odd t-shirt. Depends on what criteria 'loyalty' and 'deserving' is judged.

Arguments for and against both views, but fairest way would be completely random lottery for all 10c members. With the possibility (to somewhat satisfy the seniority base) of having say 1 entry into the lottery for every continuous year's membership (obviously still with maximum of one pair of tickets per show).

Anyway, regardless of the bruises don't think I'd want to change GA. I did however like the separate section at the front of some shows in 06 and 07, I think that helped to reduce the crush quite a bit. So maybe have the floor split into 2-3 sections only allowing so many people into each one (first come first served obviously).

benjs

Drum Machine wrote:

benjs wrote:

iamica wrote:

GA sucks for people who are small. I'm a 5'6" female, and I get the crap kicked out of me whenever I venture into the pit (not to mention I have to stand on my tiptoes the whole time to see over all the males around me). The Lollapalooza crowd was horrible. I stood near the front of the stage for 11 1/2 hours so I could be up front, and people were shoving past me hours and hours later. Not fair.
At least with assigned seating, if someone tries to steal your spot you can have them booted out of there. Plus there's not as many injuries. You don't have to be in a mosh pit to have crazy energy at a concert.

That's why I think GA seated is ideal - even if no one actually sits in the chairs, it defines an area as "your own".

Yeah I agree with you because some people can just get out of hand at shows sometimes.

Exactly. I'm not sure I understand the band's thinking doing GA in Europe, but not in North America. Maybe it's just me, but I always thought North American shows are generally more tame than those in Europe - granted, that's a complete assumption. I don't really know why more bands don't do GA seating.. some friends of mine saw Jack Johnson at the Molson Amphitheatre with GA seating and they said it was great.

redrock

strummers wrote:

redrock wrote:

RM181658 wrote:

What is seniority, and how can justify such a concept that's laid down on an unequal foundation? !

The fact of getting better seats due to seniority is a way of rewarding the 'customer' for his/her loyalty. Just like other businesses, stores, etc. those these obviously do this in a different manner, for example loyalty cards with special deals, airmiles, etc. Or, closer to home, O2 customers getting a presale on tix when bands play one of their venues. Same concept - different kind of 'business'.

Laid down on an unequal foundation? Not really. Fair? For some yes, for others no.....

Technically not quite the same - you don't get a better chance/better tickets through o2 if you've been their customer for longer. Similarly, you don't get more airmiles etc the longer you've been part of the reward scheme.

It's a reward scheme, however they want to administer it. 10C choose to base it on seniority, airmiles is based on amounts purchased, etc. So you in a way you are right, TECHNICALLY it is not quite the same because the criteria they base themselves on is different, but overall, a reward scheme is a reward scheme!

Whether you like this reward scheme is personal preference.

JaneNY

Not going to page through the whole thread, but in keeping with what they think is fair and giving everyone, regardless of size or sex, an equal chance, seats allow that to better happen. There's a lot of big dudes that like Pearl Jam. And there's a lot of people that will shove their way to the front, regardless of when they got there, and they are not chivalrous when it comes to smaller women. Having seats means if women got the lower number seat, they get to be there. Essentially, seats give Pearl Jam more control of who is in front or closer, so that it doesn't just turn into the survival of the fittest.

strummers

JaneNY wrote:

And there's a lot of people that will shove their way to the front, regardless of when they got there, and they are not chivalrous when it comes to smaller women.

Even though I prefer GA I have to agree with this, there are always some out there who don't care that people have waited patiently and respectfully in line and in the crowd and just push and elbow their way in front of the people who've waited for hours!