If it becomes an issue, it's going to be one that actually works FOR McCain ... he can spin it, "If Obama would have had his way, Iraq would have been lost."
True or not, that's something that might resonate with millions of Americans.
Also, don't be surprised to see McCain seize on something Obama said in the O'Reilly interview, "the surge worked beyond anyone's wildest dreams."
I think McCain can claim it worked exactly the way he thought it would, and score points on foreign policy experience. He can say something to the effect that maybe Obama lacks imagination.
Another point from the O'Reilly interview: Obama admits the surge worked beyong anyone's wildest expectations, yet says he is STILL against it. McCain's gonna be able to use that against him, too.
I don't get this whole surge thing...
I see it this way, if we had never invaded Iraq, would we even be discussing the merits of the "surge"...?
it's like if a doctor performs unneeded surgery on a person's leg and fucks up which results in having to cut the patient's leg off to save the patients life....and the doctor says "hooray, look at me, I saved his life..."
you dont? why? the surge was an additional amount of troops sent in to restore order and help turn over control of dangerous areas back to Iraqis. or was this a rhetorical question. you dont come across as...
it's like if a doctor performs unneeded surgery on a person's leg and fucks up which results in having to cut the patient's leg off to save the patients life....and the doctor says "hooray, look at me, I saved his life..."
yea! kinda like that. maybe you would rather the person die?
you dont? why? the surge was an additional amount of troops sent in to restore order and help turn over control of dangerous areas back to Iraqis. or was this a rhetorical question. you dont come across as...
yea! kinda like that. maybe you would rather the person die?
of course not, but I would hope the doctor would be held accountable for his actions...don't you...? I would not expect the person who fucked up to expect any positive credit for fixing his/her fuck up...
except maybe Cheney, Wolfowitz and Rumsfield. :mad:
If I had known then what I know now...
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I would not expect the person who fucked up to expect any positive credit for fixing his/her fuck up...
lets say the patient was your mom. would you give the doctor credit for saving her life? (while at the same time holding him accountable for his mistakes)
lets say the patient was your mom. would you give the doctor credit for saving her life? (while at the same time holding him accountable for his mistakes)
I'd kick him in the face and sue the shit out if him....
I had no problem with his speech. I felt like he was talking to me and obama was talking at me. mccain came across as much more real. obama had the rockstar attitude in the big football stadium, very tacky IMO.
I agree about Obama and his rockstar attitude. For his sake, I wish he would tone it down a bit and be more respectful for how he got where he's at, not just the fact that he's there right now.
what is wrong with people? do some people just have extremely shitty memory or something? where the fuck has everyone been the past 8 years? how will you vote for someone who's running on the same platform as the guy who fucked this country?
what is wrong with people? do some people just have extremely shitty memory or something? where the fuck has everyone been the past 8 years? how will you vote for someone who's running on the same platform as the guy who fucked this country?
where have you been? he's not running on the same platform. try to pay attention to whats going on. especially if you plan on voting.
mccain is one of the most bipartiasn republicans ever to hold office. to say different is plain ignorant.
where have you been? he's not running on the same platform. try to pay attention to whats going on. especially if you plan on voting.
mccain is one of the most bipartiasn republicans ever to hold office. to say different is plain ignorant.
so his foreign policy is different?
drilling in ANWR is different?
abortion stance different?
gay marriage different?
civil liberties different?
domestic policy different?
mind telling me how?
I mean, he DID vote on like 95% of Bush's policies...
so his foreign policy is different?
drilling in ANWR is different?
abortion stance different?
gay marriage different?
civil liberties different?
domestic policy different?
mind telling me how?
I mean, he DID vote on like 95% of Bush's policies...
throughout mccains career he has extended his hand across the aisle. which is exactly why the far right hated mccain during the early primary process. you are far too young to understand these types of things. you only see people in the matter of 2 years (if that) that you have be paying attention.
yup, thats what I remember. I also thought he handled it very well.
anyway the point of my thread is to point out the McCain is not PRO WAR, or hoping for war, or going to go to war no matter what, or any of the closed minded opinions/assumptions people have.
no one likes war. its just understood by some that national security is important. I think Obama and McCain both recognize that.
you're either naive or incredibly gullible. pick one, and get back to me.
"Ladies and gentlemen, the President of the United States, Barack Obama."
"Obama's main opponent in this election on November 4th (was) not John McCain, it (was) ignorance."~Michael Moore
"i'm feeling kinda righteous right now. with my badass motherfuckin' ukulele!"
~ed, 8/7
throughout mccains career he has extended his hand across the aisle. which is exactly why the far right hated mccain during the early primary process. you are far too young to understand these types of things. you only see people in the matter of 2 years (if that) that you have be paying attention.
I'm just curious: do you know you're full of shit or do you ACTUALLY think you're making valid points here?
I asked you questions, and you gave me this lame excuse of a response to it...
where have you been? he's not running on the same platform. try to pay attention to whats going on. especially if you plan on voting.
mccain is one of the most bipartiasn republicans ever to hold office. to say different is plain ignorant.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
So McBush is going is stop giving tax exemptions to corporations and tax the rich at a higher level?
Get your head out of your ass. Your "maverick" talking points aren't fooling anyone, except the retards that fuck their kin in that party that wants to go to war with anyone with brown skin.
I'm just curious: do you know you're full of shit or do you ACTUALLY think you're making valid points here?
I asked you questions, and you gave me this lame excuse of a response to it...
I'm not going to debate with an 18 year kid with no sense of history outside of Israel and palastine. anything you dont understand you immediately resort to personal attacks like this post of yours.
Get your head out of your ass. Your "maverick" talking points aren't fooling anyone, except the retards that fuck their kin in that party that wants to go to war with anyone with brown skin.
I'm not going to debate with an 18 year kid with no sense of history outside of Israel and palastine. anything you dont understand you immediately resort to personal attacks like this post of yours.
I'm in my 30's and agree with him 100%
He's got a great head on his shoulders. Way to go kid. I was too busy drinking and chasing girls when I was 18.
I'm not going to debate with an 18 year kid with no sense of history outside of Israel and palastine. anything you dont understand you immediately resort to personal attacks like this post of yours.
see, you have a sense of history ... but that historical McCain is NOT the same McCain that is running now.
He was against drilling in ANWR and is now for it.
He was a maverick, but has now fallen in line with the Republican mantra ... only for the sake of getting nominated ...
now that he is nominated, he's trying to 'change' again, back to the McCain of old, to get swing voters.
He got the nomination, and got Palin for the sole purpose of keeping the base voters on his side and to try and swing some Hillary votes.
And now his message is the the 'change' McCain again
This whole circus was completely politcial move. and hopefully, people will see through it in the next 60 days.
"You're one of the few Red Sox fans I don't mind." - Newch91
"I don't believe in damn curses. Wake up the damn Bambino and have me face him. Maybe I'll drill him in the ass." --- Pedro Martinez
so does anyone (above the age of 18) have anything intelligent to say? or is it personal insults day around here?
You have a point about the personal insults, completely unnecessary, but you are not one to talk.
Do any of you guys leveling personal insults against spyguy think that you are making a valid point by telling him to get his head out of his ass, etc... because you aren't. It is absolutely unnecessary. I'm assuming that we are all adults so why don't we try to act like adults and refrain from such childish antics.
"When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
It's pointless to debate with you when you can't realize that the republicans have completely fucked our economy.
Mr. Maverick used to be against the Bush tax cuts when he had some balls. But he has completely fallen into line with the failures of this administration.
The fact that you would even considering voting for McCain is a joke to me. So no need to debate with me. I guess I'm just an elitist asshole. But I'd rather be an elitist asshole than an inbred racist hick. Not saying that you are. Just sayin.
You have a point about the personal insults, completely unnecessary, but you are not one to talk.
I apologized for what you took as a personal insult. I was attacking the specific comment. you come across as a very rational intelligent guy. I just get annoyed when peeps what to play all Americans as deaf dumb and blind. although I will admit that many are.
so his foreign policy is different?
drilling in ANWR is different?
abortion stance different?
gay marriage different?
civil liberties different?
domestic policy different?
mind telling me how?
I mean, he DID vote on like 95% of Bush's policies...
1) I believe it would be different. I think John McCain would certainly use diplomacy more and I also think that if it came down to military action, he would use it more wisely. I wonder just how quick he would use military action though.
2) I think we should drill on American soil and off-shore as part of a comprehensive plan.
3) I think he's right on abortion, so who cares if it's different. BUt, if W couldn;t change abortion, do you really think any president ever could? At the most, Roe v. Wade would be overturned and left up to the states...the people.
4) He's wrong on gay marriage, but then again, so is Obama.
5) Civil Liberties? I'm going to guess that no matter what I say it won;t matter on this one so let's just pass.
6) Domestic Policy - I believe it would be different...less spending. W was part democrat with all that spending.
Just my thoughts. In reality, it's a good question whether McCain would bring the change even I'd like to see. I don;t want to be duped into voting for him only to be disappointed and miss an opportunity for a semi-outsider (Obama) to make change. BUt then again, it's the same question with Obama...hence my dilema.
It's pointless to debate with you when you can't realize that the republicans have completely fucked our economy.
Mr. Maverick used to be against the Bush tax cuts when he had some balls. But he has completely fallen into line with the failures of this administration.
tax cuts are actually a great thing for the economy. its the over spending of bush that fucked us. something mccain wants to stop.
The fact that you would even considering voting for McCain is a joke to me. So no need to debate with me. I guess I'm just an elitist asshole. But I'd rather be an elitist asshole than an inbred racist hick. Not saying that you are. Just sayin.
you say you are in your 30s? I would never had guessed with comments like these. I really hope you get banned for shit like this.
Comments
I don't get this whole surge thing...
I see it this way, if we had never invaded Iraq, would we even be discussing the merits of the "surge"...?
it's like if a doctor performs unneeded surgery on a person's leg and fucks up which results in having to cut the patient's leg off to save the patients life....and the doctor says "hooray, look at me, I saved his life..."
you dont? why? the surge was an additional amount of troops sent in to restore order and help turn over control of dangerous areas back to Iraqis. or was this a rhetorical question. you dont come across as...
another rhetorical?
yea! kinda like that. maybe you would rather the person die?
as a what..?
nope, just a fact...something you don't seem to be fan of...
of course not, but I would hope the doctor would be held accountable for his actions...don't you...? I would not expect the person who fucked up to expect any positive credit for fixing his/her fuck up...
except maybe Cheney, Wolfowitz and Rumsfield. :mad:
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VIC 07
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hmmm so if there was no war, there would have been no surge. thanks captain obvious.
yep
lets say the patient was your mom. would you give the doctor credit for saving her life? (while at the same time holding him accountable for his mistakes)
good girl, now your getting it...
It's nice to find common ground...
I'd kick him in the face and sue the shit out if him....
I agree about Obama and his rockstar attitude. For his sake, I wish he would tone it down a bit and be more respectful for how he got where he's at, not just the fact that he's there right now.
the only thing I got out of that was how mind numbing it is to debate with you
cool. I probably would to. right after I thanked him for saving her life.
although I dont you wouldnt kick him in the face. you dont have the balls to do something like that, no offense, just a hunch.
where have you been? he's not running on the same platform. try to pay attention to whats going on. especially if you plan on voting.
mccain is one of the most bipartiasn republicans ever to hold office. to say different is plain ignorant.
I do...
trust me...
exactly...
he's going to stop voting with bush 90+% of the time because bush won't be in office anymore...
country first...
drilling in ANWR is different?
abortion stance different?
gay marriage different?
civil liberties different?
domestic policy different?
mind telling me how?
I mean, he DID vote on like 95% of Bush's policies...
throughout mccains career he has extended his hand across the aisle. which is exactly why the far right hated mccain during the early primary process. you are far too young to understand these types of things. you only see people in the matter of 2 years (if that) that you have be paying attention.
you're either naive or incredibly gullible. pick one, and get back to me.
"Obama's main opponent in this election on November 4th (was) not John McCain, it (was) ignorance."~Michael Moore
"i'm feeling kinda righteous right now. with my badass motherfuckin' ukulele!"
~ed, 8/7
I asked you questions, and you gave me this lame excuse of a response to it...
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
So McBush is going is stop giving tax exemptions to corporations and tax the rich at a higher level?
Get your head out of your ass. Your "maverick" talking points aren't fooling anyone, except the retards that fuck their kin in that party that wants to go to war with anyone with brown skin.
you can do better then that. try harder and get back to me.
I'm not going to debate with an 18 year kid with no sense of history outside of Israel and palastine. anything you dont understand you immediately resort to personal attacks like this post of yours.
no, and thats why he might get my vote.
whenever you'd like to debate, I'll be here. k?
so does anyone (above the age of 18) have anything intelligent to say? or is it personal insults day around here?
I'm in my 30's and agree with him 100%
He's got a great head on his shoulders. Way to go kid. I was too busy drinking and chasing girls when I was 18.
see, you have a sense of history ... but that historical McCain is NOT the same McCain that is running now.
He was against drilling in ANWR and is now for it.
He was a maverick, but has now fallen in line with the Republican mantra ... only for the sake of getting nominated ...
now that he is nominated, he's trying to 'change' again, back to the McCain of old, to get swing voters.
He got the nomination, and got Palin for the sole purpose of keeping the base voters on his side and to try and swing some Hillary votes.
And now his message is the the 'change' McCain again
This whole circus was completely politcial move. and hopefully, people will see through it in the next 60 days.
"I don't believe in damn curses. Wake up the damn Bambino and have me face him. Maybe I'll drill him in the ass." --- Pedro Martinez
Let's not get carried away.
He needs a drink AND a girfriend if he doesn't already have both.
You have a point about the personal insults, completely unnecessary, but you are not one to talk.
Do any of you guys leveling personal insults against spyguy think that you are making a valid point by telling him to get his head out of his ass, etc... because you aren't. It is absolutely unnecessary. I'm assuming that we are all adults so why don't we try to act like adults and refrain from such childish antics.
It's pointless to debate with you when you can't realize that the republicans have completely fucked our economy.
Mr. Maverick used to be against the Bush tax cuts when he had some balls. But he has completely fallen into line with the failures of this administration.
The fact that you would even considering voting for McCain is a joke to me. So no need to debate with me. I guess I'm just an elitist asshole. But I'd rather be an elitist asshole than an inbred racist hick. Not saying that you are. Just sayin.
I apologized for what you took as a personal insult. I was attacking the specific comment. you come across as a very rational intelligent guy. I just get annoyed when peeps what to play all Americans as deaf dumb and blind. although I will admit that many are.
1) I believe it would be different. I think John McCain would certainly use diplomacy more and I also think that if it came down to military action, he would use it more wisely. I wonder just how quick he would use military action though.
2) I think we should drill on American soil and off-shore as part of a comprehensive plan.
3) I think he's right on abortion, so who cares if it's different. BUt, if W couldn;t change abortion, do you really think any president ever could? At the most, Roe v. Wade would be overturned and left up to the states...the people.
4) He's wrong on gay marriage, but then again, so is Obama.
5) Civil Liberties? I'm going to guess that no matter what I say it won;t matter on this one so let's just pass.
6) Domestic Policy - I believe it would be different...less spending. W was part democrat with all that spending.
Just my thoughts. In reality, it's a good question whether McCain would bring the change even I'd like to see. I don;t want to be duped into voting for him only to be disappointed and miss an opportunity for a semi-outsider (Obama) to make change. BUt then again, it's the same question with Obama...hence my dilema.
tax cuts are actually a great thing for the economy. its the over spending of bush that fucked us. something mccain wants to stop.
you say you are in your 30s? I would never had guessed with comments like these. I really hope you get banned for shit like this.