the proof is in the science ... do you understand what people are talking about when they say climate change? ... if so - you wouldn't be asking me these questions ...
it's easy to say - oh this storm might have happened even if we didn't do what we are doing ... but how many times are you gonna say that as each subsequent event happens?
right now - inaction in bali is happening because our world leaders are useless ... it isn't because people are in crisis ...
your last point already indicates to me that you don't fully understand what it is our scientists are telling us ... let's raise your body temperature a few degrees constantly and see if your body changes ...
that's my opinon too. he doesn't have the capacity or education to fully understand. weather is caused by winds blowing accross the ice caps. as they change the weather changes. the ice also causes the currents in the ocean. when the ice is gone; the oceans become stagnant. everything reacts with everything else. change one factor and they all change.
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Do you ever stop to wonder... why no one listens to you?
I mean... in a previous discussion, you were the one who adamantly told me the Earth revolves around the Sun every several thousand years, which accounts for the previous mass extinctions... even when I provided information clearly stating it takes one year.
clearly you misunderstood or couldn't understand what i said.
there'll be plenty of warning. i'm warning you now. scientists have been warning you for years. i don't think the water will kill anyone. starvation; lack of medical necessities; poor sewage facilities; the governments inability to act; disease; fighting; and my list goes on.
i should also add that we've been warning people since the 70's. why do you think the first earth day was conceived?
that's my opinon too. he doesn't have the capacity or education to fully understand. weather is caused by winds blowing accross the ice caps. as they change the weather changes. the ice also causes the currents in the ocean. when the ice is gone; the oceans become stagnant. everything reacts with everything else. change one factor and they all change.
i would hope he has the capacity to understand - i would like to know if he's done the basic readings on climate change or not ...
What science? You're attributing a specific storm to global warming. There is no evidence that global warming caused that storm.
do you understand what people are talking about when they say climate change? ... if so - you wouldn't be asking me these questions ...
Do you understand that storms predate global warming?
What am I failing to understand here? What science dictates that man-made climate change is the cause of any storm or weather event that happens?
it's easy to say - oh this storm might have happened even if we didn't do what we are doing ... but how many times are you gonna say that as each subsequent event happens?
As many times as someone tells me that global warming caused the latest weather event, even though that event has been happening for millenia, and that someone offers zero evidence directly attributing that event to global warming.
right now - inaction in bali is happening because our world leaders are useless ... it isn't because people are in crisis ...
These world leaders are useless. But you don't need world leaders to fix this problem. You need nuclear power plants. You need hydrogen cars. You need solar panels. Thankfully, people that aren't wasting time in Bali have already invented those things and are making them available or close to making them available to people who choose to use them.
your last point already indicates to me that you don't fully understand what it is our scientists are telling us ... let's raise your body temperature a few degrees constantly and see if your body changes ...
What a silly analogy...a human body and a planet are not the same thing. The earth has been much warmer than it is today or will be in 100 years, and life survived and thrived. Certainly higher temperatures will mean different conditions for life, but to suggest that higher earth temperatures equate to higher body temperatures is silly. Might I suggest that we heat up the ocean, since your body couldn't possibly survive the average ocean temperatures????
What science? You're attributing a specific storm to global warming. There is no evidence that global warming caused that storm.
Do you understand that storms predate global warming?
What am I failing to understand here? What science dictates that man-made climate change is the cause of any storm or weather event that happens?
As many times as someone tells me that global warming caused the latest weather event, even though that event has been happening for millenia, and that someone offers zero evidence directly attributing that event to global warming.
These world leaders are useless. But you don't need world leaders to fix this problem. You need nuclear power plants. You need hydrogen cars. You need solar panels. Thankfully, people that aren't wasting time in Bali have already invented those things and are making them available or close to making them available to people who choose to use them.
What a silly analogy...a human body and a planet are not the same thing. The earth has been much warmer than it is today or will be in 100 years, and life survived and thrived. Certainly higher temperatures will mean different conditions for life, but to suggest that higher earth temperatures equate to higher body temperatures is silly. Might I suggest that we heat up the ocean, since your body couldn't possibly survive the average ocean temperatures????
ok ... so, the answer is that you haven't taken the time to understand what it is meant by climate change - i respectfully ask you to do so ... it will answer your questions ...
yes ... yer right in that there are many innovations that are already available but yet our leaders still cater to their friends which often puts these options at a disadvantage ... hence the political will ...
it isn't a silly analogy ... the earth works in much the same way ... except conseuquences occur over a larger time frame ... the same thing will apply to the oceans ... if you raise the temperature by a few degrees - there are consequences much like the human body ... any scientist will tell you that ...
ok ... so, the answer is that you haven't taken the time to understand what it is meant by climate change - i respectfully ask you to do so ... it will answer your questions ...
Thanks, that's very helpful.
After reading wikipedia's entry on Climate Change, I do not retract anything I've said here. Where does that leave us?
yes ... yer right in that there are many innovations that are already available but yet our leaders still cater to their friends which often puts these options at a disadvantage ... hence the political will ...
Absolutely...but why do people keep looking to these "leaders" when they need not do so? Remove them, remove the disadvantages.
If these people are in large part the cause of your problem, why do you expect them to be the solution? And why are so many of the solutions simply new schemes with which politicians and corporations can stifle innovation and practice nepotism and greed?
it isn't a silly analogy ... the earth works in much the same way ... except conseuquences occur over a larger time frame ... the same thing will apply to the oceans ... if you raise the temperature by a few degrees - there are consequences much like the human body ... any scientist will tell you that ...
I'm not disagreeing that there are consequences. I'm disagreeing that these consequences are somehow universally fatal, as a similar rise in body temperature would be. During the recent warming period following the Little Ice Age, world populations have skyrocketed and will continue to do so for sometime. During that same period, sea levels have risen and many of the "dire" events attached to climate change have been actively threatening populations. Yet here were are with the largest population of human beings the world has ever known.
They wanted to RELEASE more CO2 into the atmosphere during the first Earth Day to RAISE the temperature of Earth.
i was there. it was to bring cleaning the air and planting more trees to REDUCE CO2 to the publics attention. it was originally called green day before it became popular.
After reading wikipedia's entry on Climate Change, I do not retract anything I've said here. Where does that leave us?
Absolutely...but why do people keep looking to these "leaders" when they need not do so? Remove them, remove the disadvantages.
If these people are in large part the cause of your problem, why do you expect them to be the solution? And why are so many of the solutions simply new schemes with which politicians and corporations can stifle innovation and practice nepotism and greed?
I'm not disagreeing that there are consequences. I'm disagreeing that these consequences are somehow universally fatal, as a similar rise in body temperature would be. During the recent warming period following the Little Ice Age, world populations have skyrocketed and will continue to do so for sometime. During that same period, sea levels have risen and many of the "dire" events attached to climate change have been actively threatening populations. Yet here were are with the largest population of human beings the world has ever known.
well again - just because the fatality doesn't occur over a relative short period of time doesn't mean it's not going to happen ... there are a plethora of things that are happening right now all over the world as a direct result of global climate change - they will in turn cause further changes and so on and so on ... some impacts will happen sooner while some much later but in the end - there will be fatal consequences without a doubt ...
if you aren't prepared to accept some of the extreme weather events we are experiencing is caused by climate change simply because the event had happened before - well, that leaves us at a stand still ...
After reading wikipedia's entry on Climate Change, I do not retract anything I've said here. Where does that leave us?
Absolutely...but why do people keep looking to these "leaders" when they need not do so? Remove them, remove the disadvantages.
If these people are in large part the cause of your problem, why do you expect them to be the solution? And why are so many of the solutions simply new schemes with which politicians and corporations can stifle innovation and practice nepotism and greed?
I'm not disagreeing that there are consequences. I'm disagreeing that these consequences are somehow universally fatal, as a similar rise in body temperature would be. During the recent warming period following the Little Ice Age, world populations have skyrocketed and will continue to do so for sometime. During that same period, sea levels have risen and many of the "dire" events attached to climate change have been actively threatening populations. Yet here were are with the largest population of human beings the world has ever known.
i've researched this for years. wiki isn't going to enlighten you in a few paragraphs.
we told you in the 60's and 70's not to trust the government. people must act on their own. in 1980 or 81; i bought a 10 Kw wind generator; tied to the grid to sell back power. i'm now 100% solar and not tied to the grid. my truck runs on used cooking oil. you listened to the oil companies and ignored us.
if you look at history; the ice melted within a decade when we got this heated. the change comes fast; not over thousands of years like the oil companies tell you.
for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.
well again - just because the fatality doesn't occur over a relative short period of time doesn't mean it's not going to happen ... there are a plethora of things that are happening right now all over the world as a direct result of global climate change - they will in turn cause further changes and so on and so on ... some impacts will happen sooner while some much later but in the end - there will be fatal consequences without a doubt ...
if you aren't prepared to accept some of the extreme weather events we are experiencing is caused by climate change simply because the event had happened before - well, that leaves us at a stand still ...
i really don't think he can see beyond his backyard mate. i think you're wasting your time.
well again - just because the fatality doesn't occur over a relative short period of time doesn't mean it's not going to happen ... there are a plethora of things that are happening right now all over the world as a direct result of global climate change - they will in turn cause further changes and so on and so on ... some impacts will happen sooner while some much later but in the end - there will be fatal consequences without a doubt ...
Absolutely there will be some fatal consequences associated with global warming. But you're already blaming global warming for fatal storms without actually linking the two together. Furthermore, others here are predicting near extinction level events without any sound reasoning to support their claims. 75% of this issue reeks of herd thinking, panic, and pseudo-science.
if you aren't prepared to accept some of the extreme weather events we are experiencing is caused by climate change simply because the event had happened before - well, that leaves us at a stand still ...
I'll certainly accept it when you offer some evidence of some of the specific claims you're making. Just because global warming is happening doesn't mean global warming is causing every weather event that comes along. Is global warming responsible for the Midwest ice storms we're seeing today? Is global warming responsible for below-average hurricane seasons? Is global warming responsible for the fact that it's 80 degrees in NC today? Is global warming responsible for Artic ice levels being at record lows? Is global warming responsible for Antarctic ice levels being at record highs? Show me actual science as opposed to silly conjecture and I'll happily agree with you. Show me panic and irrationality and I'm going to be a bit skeptical.
I'm not suggesting that the fact that these events that happened in the past somehow disproves global warming hypotheses. I'm simply saying that events happening now that have happened in the past can't be immediately linked to global warming and treated as direct results of that warming.
Climate change is certainly happening and mankind certainly plays a role. But the silly conjecture, rampant hypocrisy, the constant utilization of apocalyptic language and the constant irrelevant references to "consensus" make me seriously doubt the sincerity of climate change advocates. People have always loved dire predictions and people rarely notice that the vast majority of dire predictions end up being largely overstated.
clearly you misunderstood or couldn't understand what i said.
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You're right... I clearly didn't understand you because what you were saying was stuff that no one could understand. We made assumptions of what you were trying to get at.. but, they were pure guesses on our part.
To me, it was babbling nonsense that I was unable to comprehend.
#102 the earths orbit around the sun takes thousands of years. i'll get you some links tomorrow. i'm not feeling well.
#126 and any college student knows that that orbit is eliptical. i'm trying to think of a way to simplify the "orbit within the orbit." we may revolve around the sun in 1 year but we have an orbit that we follow.
the hell with it. you look it up.
#153 i didn't know i was addressing second graders so let me try to give you an example. on i believe august 27th; mars was the closest to the earth as it will be until another century (approximately). although we orbit around the sun; our orbit in space in relation to the other planets is something completely different. on august 27th; it appeared like we had 2 moons. if you were correct; that would happen every year. the same can be proven with eclipses. if our orbit is set as you say; why do eclipses occure at different times?
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You appear to have little knowledge of Astronomy, yet, you present yourself as an Astronomer. Perhaps that is why many of us take your opinions as unreliable. Either that... or you do not possess any of the communication skills that convey what you are thinking. Again, those are only guesses on my part.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
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You're right... I clearly didn't understand you because what you were saying was stuff that no one could understand. We made assumptions of what you were trying to get at.. but, they were pure guesses on our part.
To me, it was babbling nonsense that I was unable to comprehend.
#102 the earths orbit around the sun takes thousands of years. i'll get you some links tomorrow. i'm not feeling well.
#126 and any college student knows that that orbit is eliptical. i'm trying to think of a way to simplify the "orbit within the orbit." we may revolve around the sun in 1 year but we have an orbit that we follow.
the hell with it. you look it up.
#153 i didn't know i was addressing second graders so let me try to give you an example. on i believe august 27th; mars was the closest to the earth as it will be until another century (approximately). although we orbit around the sun; our orbit in space in relation to the other planets is something completely different. on august 27th; it appeared like we had 2 moons. if you were correct; that would happen every year. the same can be proven with eclipses. if our orbit is set as you say; why do eclipses occure at different times?
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You appear to have little knowledge of Astronomy, yet, you present yourself as an Astronomer. Perhaps that is why many of us take your opinions as unreliable. Either that... or you do not possess any of the communication skills that convey what you are thinking. Again, those are only guesses on my part.
you seem to think our planets orbit like the model seen in grade school classrooms. it doesn't. we move up and down within the galaxy and that complete orbit takes 62 million years. yes; we have 1 orbit that defines our days; we have another that defines our years; and that is where most education stops. i've been telling you for years that i need better communication skills. the part of my brain that was damaged controls those skills. i believe i've improved those skills over the last months.
i hope i've defined which orbit i was referring to. if not; please give me another chance to explain. and i just realized that i owe you an email. my forced holiday made it completely slip my mind. i'll try my best to find it and get it to you tomorrow.
you seem to think our planets orbit like the model seen in grade school classrooms. it doesn't. we move up and down within the galaxy and that complete orbit takes 62 million years. yes; we have 1 orbit that defines our days; we have another that defines our years; and that is where most education stops. i've been telling you for years that i need better communication skills. the part of my brain that was damaged controls those skills. i believe i've improved those skills over the last months.
i hope i've defined which orbit i was referring to. if not; please give me another chance to explain. and i just realized that i owe you an email. my forced holiday made it completely slip my mind. i'll try my best to find it and get it to you tomorrow.
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Okay...
But just to clarify... From what i understand... the Earth is spinning like a top and each full revolution, not orbit, defines our 24 hour day.
The Earth's orbit around the Sun defines our year (and yes, the orbit is elliptical... meaning not a perfect circle). Elliptical orbit has nothing to do with variations on the plane of the ecliptic.
The tilt of the Earth's axis defines the Four Seasons.
Then there is Precession... which is the wobble of our revolutions. That takes abour 26,000 years. That will change the Earth's climate, but it is a long, slow process.
And what you speak of.. i think you are saying... is the Earth's relative location in the Milky Way Galaxy, which has nothing to do with our climate. We are spinning away from the center of our galaxy... which is a one way trip.. not cyclical. The Sun, Earth and the rest of our Solar System remain in relative distances from each other as the whole thing spins within the arm of our Galaxy.
Finally... our galaxy is spinning (which does not affect or short time climate) and the Galaxies move within the Universe. The Milky Way Galaxy is expected to collide with the Andromeda Galaxy in about 3 billion year. When that happens, all bets are of. but, we will be long gone before that. where 'We' is defined as our Sun, the Earth and the rest of our Solar system.
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All of our past mass extinctions have nothing to do with celestrial occurances... they all have to do with changes to our surface... be it asteroid or comet collision, plate tectonics (including volcanic activity and continental drift). Materials from our planet darkened the planet... the Sun doesn't get hotter and cooler in cycles. It is our atmosphere and what gets dumped into it that affects our climate.
As the Sun cool, it will lose its ability to hold its mass and it will expand... consuming her terrestrial planets... us included. That will be a one time event... not cyclical.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
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Okay...
But just to clarify... From what i understand... the Earth is spinning like a top and each full revolution, not orbit, defines our 24 hour day.
The Earth's orbit around the Sun defines our year (and yes, the orbit is elliptical... meaning not a perfect circle). Elliptical orbit has nothing to do with variations on the plane of the ecliptic.
The tilt of the Earth's axis defines the Four Seasons.
Then there is Precession... which is the wobble of our revolutions. That takes abour 26,000 years. That will change the Earth's climate, but it is a long, slow process.
And what you speak of.. i think you are saying... is the Earth's relative location in the Milky Way Galaxy, which has nothing to do with our climate. We are spinning away from the center of our galaxy... which is a one way trip.. not cyclical. The Sun, Earth and the rest of our Solar System remain in relative distances from each other as the whole thing spins within the arm of our Galaxy.
Finally... our galaxy is spinning (which does not affect or short time climate) and the Galaxies move within the Universe. The Milky Way Galaxy is expected to collide with the Andromeda Galaxy in about 3 billion year. When that happens, all bets are of. but, we will be long gone before that. where 'We' is defined as our Sun, the Earth and the rest of our Solar system.
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All of our past mass extinctions have nothing to do with celestrial occurances... they all have to do with changes to our surface... be it asteroid or comet collision, plate tectonics (including volcanic activity and continental drift). Materials from our planet darkened the planet... the Sun doesn't get hotter and cooler in cycles. It is our atmosphere and what gets dumped into it that affects our climate.
As the Sun cool, it will lose its ability to hold its mass and it will expand... consuming her terrestrial planets... us included. That will be a one time event... not cyclical.
quickly; we are well protected in the center of our galaxy. as we move (i'll say up and down for clairity) up and down; we come closer to the edge of our galaxy which leaves us less protected.
this isn't an astrology thread so i'll leave it at that.
quickly; we are well protected in the center of our galaxy. as we move (i'll say up and down for clairity) up and down; we come closer to the edge of our galaxy which leaves us less protected.
this isn't an astrology thread so i'll leave it at that.
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It certainly isn't an Astronomy thread as long as you are posting.
Protected from what? The Sun?
Correction... we are in one of the arms of the Milky Way Galaxy... not in the center. Look at the constellation Sagittarius... the center of our galaxy is thataway. And the location of our sun (thus, the Earth.. thus, us) in the Milky Way has nothing to do with our climate.
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In simplest terms:
Our climate is based upon events that occur in our atmosphere. What part of that don't you understand?
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
The guy has zero credibility. I would be interested to hear who funded this work.
It doesn't matter if you're male, female, or confused; black, white, brown, red, green, yellow; gay, lesbian; redneck cop, stoned; ugly; military style, doggy style; fat, rich or poor; vegetarian or cannibal; bum, hippie, virgin; famous or drunk-you're either an asshole or you're not!
i've been saying we've past the point of no return. we can't stop it. the last 4 times we weren't around to stop it. decades ago we could have drastically reduced greenhouse gasses and slowed or maybe stopped this. the key is to find the reason this is happening. we don't have drastic volcanic activity so we can't blame it on that. find the source of the current greenhouse gasses. if you can illiminate the source; AT AN EARLY ENOUGH TIME; of cource you can stop it. a string of volcanic eruptions or a nuclear winter is about the only things that will stop it now.
how many issues are really simple enough to get boiled down to one small solution. greenhouses gasses do cause warming to occur...but what about the earths orbit changing, the earths axis changing etc... that big thing called the sun may have an important roll as well and that is something we can't control.
make sure the fortune that you seek...is the fortune that you need
You appear to have little knowledge of Astronomy, yet, you present yourself as an Astronomer. Perhaps that is why many of us take your opinions as unreliable. Either that... or you do not possess any of the communication skills that convey what you are thinking. Again, those are only guesses on my part.
well shit man, why not? i dont doubt it. he's a certified expert on every other discipline. add climatologist and astronomer to his resume.
and people protecting their property will cause a lot of deaths. that's a given.
i want to see those 2/3 of idiots, because if i know my life is under threat i do anything to avoid it at all costs, so yes i would leave my property and happily live in some trailer moving around the country like a hippy
scientists can't predict how people might react, where ever you've taken this stats from.
exactly. the indian islands are preparing to evacuate now because of the 8" rise and those islands contain millions of people. to top that off; they're too poor (the country as a whole) to evacuate these people in a proper fashion. food must be supplied. many have to evacuate on foot. the islands off new guinea are evacuating as we speak. we don't look at the rest of the world. when we refuse to look past our picket fences; we only see what's in our own backyard.
No worries, i'm pretty sure USA and other countries will be able to help
They choose to call it "global warming" because if they called it by the true name "global poisoning" then everybody would be right except the companies doing the poisoning. And you can't argue that fact.
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Okay...
But just to clarify... From what i understand... the Earth is spinning like a top and each full revolution, not orbit, defines our 24 hour day.
The Earth's orbit around the Sun defines our year (and yes, the orbit is elliptical... meaning not a perfect circle). Elliptical orbit has nothing to do with variations on the plane of the ecliptic.
The tilt of the Earth's axis defines the Four Seasons.
Then there is Precession... which is the wobble of our revolutions. That takes abour 26,000 years. That will change the Earth's climate, but it is a long, slow process.
And what you speak of.. i think you are saying... is the Earth's relative location in the Milky Way Galaxy, which has nothing to do with our climate. We are spinning away from the center of our galaxy... which is a one way trip.. not cyclical. The Sun, Earth and the rest of our Solar System remain in relative distances from each other as the whole thing spins within the arm of our Galaxy.
Finally... our galaxy is spinning (which does not affect or short time climate) and the Galaxies move within the Universe. The Milky Way Galaxy is expected to collide with the Andromeda Galaxy in about 3 billion year. When that happens, all bets are of. but, we will be long gone before that. where 'We' is defined as our Sun, the Earth and the rest of our Solar system.
...
All of our past mass extinctions have nothing to do with celestrial occurances... they all have to do with changes to our surface... be it asteroid or comet collision, plate tectonics (including volcanic activity and continental drift). Materials from our planet darkened the planet... the Sun doesn't get hotter and cooler in cycles. It is our atmosphere and what gets dumped into it that affects our climate.
As the Sun cool, it will lose its ability to hold its mass and it will expand... consuming her terrestrial planets... us included. That will be a one time event... not cyclical.
and these are the times when i wish i enrolled myself on Astronomy courses, instead of guitar courses :(
I wish i had ennoying geek friend who would talk about astronomy for hours.
Good post
I also heard that Earth will collide with the Sun in the future. if so one or the other way we are all fucked.
why debate about Global Warming? politicians and the goverment and big companies are selfish cunts they're only started caring about it recently, because they've found out that their own arses ( or their children's areses ) are going to be on the line too.
All this talking about dying.....Jeez, and what if all of you were told that humans would not die, but trees, animals and brids and fish would suffer would they still all care about it? would you care?
I don't know who's right and who's wrong, with science you never know, scientists always say one thing and then discover somthing new and say oh, no forget what we've said before listen to this new information we found.
Bottom line is that it doesn't matter if we are contributing to it or not, we should not shit on our Mother Earth, we should take care of it and respect it, because it gave us life.
Bottom line is that it doesn't matter if we are contributing to it or not, we should not shit on our Mother Earth, we should take care of it and respect it, because it gave us life.
and yes, that's right, i'm telling you all motherfuckers what you should do!
The guy has zero credibility. I would be interested to hear who funded this work.
He's obviously payed to write what they want him to.
Keep on rockin in the free world!!!!
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
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It certainly isn't an Astronomy thread as long as you are posting.
Protected from what? The Sun?
Correction... we are in one of the arms of the Milky Way Galaxy... not in the center. Look at the constellation Sagittarius... the center of our galaxy is thataway. And the location of our sun (thus, the Earth.. thus, us) in the Milky Way has nothing to do with our climate.
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In simplest terms:
Our climate is based upon events that occur in our atmosphere. What part of that don't you understand?
i don't understand why you can't understand. the science channel had a nice explanation of this theory on within the last 2 weeks. months ago i told you of another show which explained this theory. why hound me when you obviously don't want to know the answer?
i want to see those 2/3 of idiots, because if i know my life is under threat i do anything to avoid it at all costs, so yes i would leave my property and happily live in some trailer moving around the country like a hippy
scientists can't predict how people might react, where ever you've taken this stats from.
history predicts how people will react. people are predictable.
you may fancy traveling about in a trailer; but where will your food; petrol; and other necessities come from?
Interesting find and worth the read. I wonder how much cred it gets from leading climatologists. The thing is, you can get a group of four scientists to agree we all descended from aliens, but that doesn't mean you should believe it. Now if Tom Cruise told me I might...
I don't really understand the obsession with disproving global warming is at least influenced by man. It's really quite a simple theory.
+1. I bet if you follow the money trail funding that group it will lead you into the pockets of the conservatives or some kind of industry that is threatened by environmentalists (oil....).
My favorite part of the article was where it said "c02 emission reduction is pointless". Like Global Warming was the only problem it caused. A really sound scientific mind must have written this article. :rolleyes:
Comments
that's my opinon too. he doesn't have the capacity or education to fully understand. weather is caused by winds blowing accross the ice caps. as they change the weather changes. the ice also causes the currents in the ocean. when the ice is gone; the oceans become stagnant. everything reacts with everything else. change one factor and they all change.
clearly you misunderstood or couldn't understand what i said.
i should also add that we've been warning people since the 70's. why do you think the first earth day was conceived?
i would hope he has the capacity to understand - i would like to know if he's done the basic readings on climate change or not ...
What science? You're attributing a specific storm to global warming. There is no evidence that global warming caused that storm.
Do you understand that storms predate global warming?
What am I failing to understand here? What science dictates that man-made climate change is the cause of any storm or weather event that happens?
As many times as someone tells me that global warming caused the latest weather event, even though that event has been happening for millenia, and that someone offers zero evidence directly attributing that event to global warming.
These world leaders are useless. But you don't need world leaders to fix this problem. You need nuclear power plants. You need hydrogen cars. You need solar panels. Thankfully, people that aren't wasting time in Bali have already invented those things and are making them available or close to making them available to people who choose to use them.
What a silly analogy...a human body and a planet are not the same thing. The earth has been much warmer than it is today or will be in 100 years, and life survived and thrived. Certainly higher temperatures will mean different conditions for life, but to suggest that higher earth temperatures equate to higher body temperatures is silly. Might I suggest that we heat up the ocean, since your body couldn't possibly survive the average ocean temperatures????
They wanted to RELEASE more CO2 into the atmosphere during the first Earth Day to RAISE the temperature of Earth.
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Social awareness does not equal political activism!
5/23/2011- An utter embarrassment... ticketing failures too many to list.
ok ... so, the answer is that you haven't taken the time to understand what it is meant by climate change - i respectfully ask you to do so ... it will answer your questions ...
yes ... yer right in that there are many innovations that are already available but yet our leaders still cater to their friends which often puts these options at a disadvantage ... hence the political will ...
it isn't a silly analogy ... the earth works in much the same way ... except conseuquences occur over a larger time frame ... the same thing will apply to the oceans ... if you raise the temperature by a few degrees - there are consequences much like the human body ... any scientist will tell you that ...
Thanks, that's very helpful.
After reading wikipedia's entry on Climate Change, I do not retract anything I've said here. Where does that leave us?
Absolutely...but why do people keep looking to these "leaders" when they need not do so? Remove them, remove the disadvantages.
If these people are in large part the cause of your problem, why do you expect them to be the solution? And why are so many of the solutions simply new schemes with which politicians and corporations can stifle innovation and practice nepotism and greed?
I'm not disagreeing that there are consequences. I'm disagreeing that these consequences are somehow universally fatal, as a similar rise in body temperature would be. During the recent warming period following the Little Ice Age, world populations have skyrocketed and will continue to do so for sometime. During that same period, sea levels have risen and many of the "dire" events attached to climate change have been actively threatening populations. Yet here were are with the largest population of human beings the world has ever known.
i was there. it was to bring cleaning the air and planting more trees to REDUCE CO2 to the publics attention. it was originally called green day before it became popular.
read this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effects_of_global_warming
well again - just because the fatality doesn't occur over a relative short period of time doesn't mean it's not going to happen ... there are a plethora of things that are happening right now all over the world as a direct result of global climate change - they will in turn cause further changes and so on and so on ... some impacts will happen sooner while some much later but in the end - there will be fatal consequences without a doubt ...
if you aren't prepared to accept some of the extreme weather events we are experiencing is caused by climate change simply because the event had happened before - well, that leaves us at a stand still ...
i've researched this for years. wiki isn't going to enlighten you in a few paragraphs.
we told you in the 60's and 70's not to trust the government. people must act on their own. in 1980 or 81; i bought a 10 Kw wind generator; tied to the grid to sell back power. i'm now 100% solar and not tied to the grid. my truck runs on used cooking oil. you listened to the oil companies and ignored us.
if you look at history; the ice melted within a decade when we got this heated. the change comes fast; not over thousands of years like the oil companies tell you.
for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.
i really don't think he can see beyond his backyard mate. i think you're wasting your time.
Absolutely there will be some fatal consequences associated with global warming. But you're already blaming global warming for fatal storms without actually linking the two together. Furthermore, others here are predicting near extinction level events without any sound reasoning to support their claims. 75% of this issue reeks of herd thinking, panic, and pseudo-science.
I'll certainly accept it when you offer some evidence of some of the specific claims you're making. Just because global warming is happening doesn't mean global warming is causing every weather event that comes along. Is global warming responsible for the Midwest ice storms we're seeing today? Is global warming responsible for below-average hurricane seasons? Is global warming responsible for the fact that it's 80 degrees in NC today? Is global warming responsible for Artic ice levels being at record lows? Is global warming responsible for Antarctic ice levels being at record highs? Show me actual science as opposed to silly conjecture and I'll happily agree with you. Show me panic and irrationality and I'm going to be a bit skeptical.
I'm not suggesting that the fact that these events that happened in the past somehow disproves global warming hypotheses. I'm simply saying that events happening now that have happened in the past can't be immediately linked to global warming and treated as direct results of that warming.
Climate change is certainly happening and mankind certainly plays a role. But the silly conjecture, rampant hypocrisy, the constant utilization of apocalyptic language and the constant irrelevant references to "consensus" make me seriously doubt the sincerity of climate change advocates. People have always loved dire predictions and people rarely notice that the vast majority of dire predictions end up being largely overstated.
You're right... I clearly didn't understand you because what you were saying was stuff that no one could understand. We made assumptions of what you were trying to get at.. but, they were pure guesses on our part.
To me, it was babbling nonsense that I was unable to comprehend.
Need facts? Here's your clarification... in YOUR words:
Ref. ( http://forums.pearljam.com/showthread.php?t=261822&highlight=precession )
#102 the earths orbit around the sun takes thousands of years. i'll get you some links tomorrow. i'm not feeling well.
#126 and any college student knows that that orbit is eliptical. i'm trying to think of a way to simplify the "orbit within the orbit." we may revolve around the sun in 1 year but we have an orbit that we follow.
the hell with it. you look it up.
#153 i didn't know i was addressing second graders so let me try to give you an example. on i believe august 27th; mars was the closest to the earth as it will be until another century (approximately). although we orbit around the sun; our orbit in space in relation to the other planets is something completely different. on august 27th; it appeared like we had 2 moons. if you were correct; that would happen every year. the same can be proven with eclipses. if our orbit is set as you say; why do eclipses occure at different times?
...
You appear to have little knowledge of Astronomy, yet, you present yourself as an Astronomer. Perhaps that is why many of us take your opinions as unreliable. Either that... or you do not possess any of the communication skills that convey what you are thinking. Again, those are only guesses on my part.
Hail, Hail!!!
you seem to think our planets orbit like the model seen in grade school classrooms. it doesn't. we move up and down within the galaxy and that complete orbit takes 62 million years. yes; we have 1 orbit that defines our days; we have another that defines our years; and that is where most education stops. i've been telling you for years that i need better communication skills. the part of my brain that was damaged controls those skills. i believe i've improved those skills over the last months.
i hope i've defined which orbit i was referring to. if not; please give me another chance to explain. and i just realized that i owe you an email. my forced holiday made it completely slip my mind. i'll try my best to find it and get it to you tomorrow.
Okay...
But just to clarify... From what i understand... the Earth is spinning like a top and each full revolution, not orbit, defines our 24 hour day.
The Earth's orbit around the Sun defines our year (and yes, the orbit is elliptical... meaning not a perfect circle). Elliptical orbit has nothing to do with variations on the plane of the ecliptic.
The tilt of the Earth's axis defines the Four Seasons.
Then there is Precession... which is the wobble of our revolutions. That takes abour 26,000 years. That will change the Earth's climate, but it is a long, slow process.
And what you speak of.. i think you are saying... is the Earth's relative location in the Milky Way Galaxy, which has nothing to do with our climate. We are spinning away from the center of our galaxy... which is a one way trip.. not cyclical. The Sun, Earth and the rest of our Solar System remain in relative distances from each other as the whole thing spins within the arm of our Galaxy.
Finally... our galaxy is spinning (which does not affect or short time climate) and the Galaxies move within the Universe. The Milky Way Galaxy is expected to collide with the Andromeda Galaxy in about 3 billion year. When that happens, all bets are of. but, we will be long gone before that. where 'We' is defined as our Sun, the Earth and the rest of our Solar system.
...
All of our past mass extinctions have nothing to do with celestrial occurances... they all have to do with changes to our surface... be it asteroid or comet collision, plate tectonics (including volcanic activity and continental drift). Materials from our planet darkened the planet... the Sun doesn't get hotter and cooler in cycles. It is our atmosphere and what gets dumped into it that affects our climate.
As the Sun cool, it will lose its ability to hold its mass and it will expand... consuming her terrestrial planets... us included. That will be a one time event... not cyclical.
Hail, Hail!!!
quickly; we are well protected in the center of our galaxy. as we move (i'll say up and down for clairity) up and down; we come closer to the edge of our galaxy which leaves us less protected.
this isn't an astrology thread so i'll leave it at that.
It certainly isn't an Astronomy thread as long as you are posting.
Protected from what? The Sun?
Correction... we are in one of the arms of the Milky Way Galaxy... not in the center. Look at the constellation Sagittarius... the center of our galaxy is thataway. And the location of our sun (thus, the Earth.. thus, us) in the Milky Way has nothing to do with our climate.
...
In simplest terms:
Our climate is based upon events that occur in our atmosphere. What part of that don't you understand?
Hail, Hail!!!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Singer
The guy has zero credibility. I would be interested to hear who funded this work.
-C Addison
how many issues are really simple enough to get boiled down to one small solution. greenhouses gasses do cause warming to occur...but what about the earths orbit changing, the earths axis changing etc... that big thing called the sun may have an important roll as well and that is something we can't control.
well shit man, why not? i dont doubt it. he's a certified expert on every other discipline. add climatologist and astronomer to his resume.
i want to see those 2/3 of idiots, because if i know my life is under threat i do anything to avoid it at all costs, so yes i would leave my property and happily live in some trailer moving around the country like a hippy
scientists can't predict how people might react, where ever you've taken this stats from.
No worries, i'm pretty sure USA and other countries will be able to help
and these are the times when i wish i enrolled myself on Astronomy courses, instead of guitar courses :(
I wish i had ennoying geek friend who would talk about astronomy for hours.
Good post
I also heard that Earth will collide with the Sun in the future. if so one or the other way we are all fucked.
why debate about Global Warming? politicians and the goverment and big companies are selfish cunts they're only started caring about it recently, because they've found out that their own arses ( or their children's areses
All this talking about dying.....Jeez, and what if all of you were told that humans would not die, but trees, animals and brids and fish would suffer would they still all care about it? would you care?
I don't know who's right and who's wrong, with science you never know, scientists always say one thing and then discover somthing new and say oh, no forget what we've said before listen to this new information we found.
Bottom line is that it doesn't matter if we are contributing to it or not, we should not shit on our Mother Earth, we should take care of it and respect it, because it gave us life.
and yes, that's right, i'm telling you all motherfuckers
He's obviously payed to write what they want him to.
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
i don't understand why you can't understand. the science channel had a nice explanation of this theory on within the last 2 weeks. months ago i told you of another show which explained this theory. why hound me when you obviously don't want to know the answer?
history predicts how people will react. people are predictable.
you may fancy traveling about in a trailer; but where will your food; petrol; and other necessities come from?
My favorite part of the article was where it said "c02 emission reduction is pointless". Like Global Warming was the only problem it caused. A really sound scientific mind must have written this article. :rolleyes:
http://www.wishlistfoundation.org
Oh my, they dropped the leash.
Morgan Freeman/Clint Eastwood 08' for President!
"Make our day"