Interesting thought I had.

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  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    Binaural wrote:
    "He doesn't exist", don't evade the question. Jesus said that entry into Heaven was dependant on worhsip of God through him. No room for argument. CONDITIONAL LOVE.
    it's your way of interpreting it that makes a big difference. but if that's the case then i agree. no argument. you're doing the very thing that the bible says everybody does.
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • Binaural
    Binaural Posts: 1,046
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    it's your way of interpreting it that makes a big difference. but if that's the case then i agree. no argument. you're doing the very thing that the bible says everybody does.
    Is what I said incorrect? And if so is Jesus a liar?
    ~*~*~*~*PROUD EVENFLOW PSYCHO #0026~*~*~*~*

    *^*^*^*^*^*^*^RED MOSQUITO #2^*^*^*^*^*^*^*

    Dublin 08/06
    Katowice 06/07 London 06/07 Dusseldorf 06/07 Nijgemen 06/07
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    Binaural wrote:
    Is what I said incorrect? And if so is Jesus a liar?
    let me ask you this. since when did allowing you to go into heaven equal loving you? God loves you regardless... and heaven is there open to all really. so what's the argument?
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • Binaural
    Binaural Posts: 1,046
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    let me ask you this. since when did allowing you to go into heaven equal loving you? God loves you regardless... and heaven is there open to all really. so what's the argument?
    Love is not allowing one to suffer eternal damnation. If I don't worship god I will go to hell, how is that love?
    ~*~*~*~*PROUD EVENFLOW PSYCHO #0026~*~*~*~*

    *^*^*^*^*^*^*^RED MOSQUITO #2^*^*^*^*^*^*^*

    Dublin 08/06
    Katowice 06/07 London 06/07 Dusseldorf 06/07 Nijgemen 06/07
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    Binaural wrote:
    Love is not allowing one to suffer eternal damnation. If I don't worship god I will go to hell, how is that love?
    well that's the thing... God doesn't want us to suffer eternal damnation.. we're the one's that put ourselves in that damnation. God has given us every opportunity to pull our way out.
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    well that's the thing... God doesn't want us to suffer eternal damnation.. we're the one's that put ourselves in that damnation. God has given us every opportunity to pull our way out.

    How? How does the will determine it's self?
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    Ahnimus wrote:
    How? How does the will determine it's self?
    i really don't understand your question... sorry man. please explain.
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    btw, i am going to watch spurs and mavericks so i will reply later.
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    i really don't understand your question... sorry man. please explain.

    If I will to do something. How is that will determined and how can the will determine it's self?

    If God says do this or go to hell, how can 'I' my 'will' be determined to do so if my 'will' is determined to do otherwise?
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • PJammin'
    PJammin' Posts: 1,913
    Binaural wrote:
    "He doesn't exist", don't evade the question. Jesus said that entry into Heaven was dependant on worhsip of God through him. No room for argument. CONDITIONAL LOVE.

    yes, you are correct:

    I am the way, the truth, and the life. NO ONE comes to the Father except through Me.(John 14:6)

    Jesus HAS unconditional love. just the way He lived proved it. Jesus has perfect love. you don't believe so keep living the way you are. Jesus doesn't want your imperfect love in His kingdom.
    I died. I died and you just stood there. I died and you watched. I died and you walked by and said no. I'm dead.
  • Binaural
    Binaural Posts: 1,046
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    well that's the thing... God doesn't want us to suffer eternal damnation.. we're the one's that put ourselves in that damnation. God has given us every opportunity to pull our way out.
    HOWEVER, an please actually read what Im saying, the fact that he does send us to hell counteracts your arguement. Thats like Hitler saying that he did what he did out of love.
    ~*~*~*~*PROUD EVENFLOW PSYCHO #0026~*~*~*~*

    *^*^*^*^*^*^*^RED MOSQUITO #2^*^*^*^*^*^*^*

    Dublin 08/06
    Katowice 06/07 London 06/07 Dusseldorf 06/07 Nijgemen 06/07
  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    PJammin' wrote:
    yes, you are correct:

    I am the way, the truth, and the life. NO ONE comes to the Father except through Me.(John 14:6)

    Jesus HAS unconditional love. just the way He lived proved it. Jesus has perfect love. you don't belive so keep living the way you are. Jesus doesn't want your imperfect love in His kingdom.

    Sounds like a condition to me
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • Binaural
    Binaural Posts: 1,046
    PJammin' wrote:
    yes, you are correct:

    I am the way, the truth, and the life. NO ONE comes to the Father except through Me.(John 14:6)

    Jesus HAS unconditional love. just the way He lived proved it. Jesus has perfect love. you don't belive so keep living the way you are. Jesus doesn't want your imperfect love in His kingdom.
    If thats the love he offers then he can fuck himself, because I don't need to be intimidated into serivtude to a god and a text that promotes sexist, homophobic hatred. I have tried to be about this but forget it. What you have said SHOWS he offers a conditional love.
    ~*~*~*~*PROUD EVENFLOW PSYCHO #0026~*~*~*~*

    *^*^*^*^*^*^*^RED MOSQUITO #2^*^*^*^*^*^*^*

    Dublin 08/06
    Katowice 06/07 London 06/07 Dusseldorf 06/07 Nijgemen 06/07
  • PJammin'
    PJammin' Posts: 1,913
    Ahnimus wrote:
    Sounds like a condition to me

    you're your own condition. live in sin, you're a slave to sin. Jesus doesn't want bad apples. loving God and other people is such a HARD thing.
    I died. I died and you just stood there. I died and you watched. I died and you walked by and said no. I'm dead.
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    ok, soulsinging, i think i've made my point to you before. God doesn't condition his forgiveness and love. the problem is our unbelief. it's so easy to understand it. it's as if i said if you turn the corner here there you can find a place where you can get your flat tire fixed. but because you say, "ha, he's a nutcase, there's no place around here like that." so your tire never gets fixed because you never turned the corner.

    it's a strange phenomenon but you'll probably never get it, and you'll keep fighting against it. no matter how i put it.

    this explains nothing. you say people cannot get into heaven without accepting jesus, this is the core of your belief system is it not? thus, you are saying god's love and acceptance is conditioned upon your willingness to bow down and worship jesus or god himself. that is not unconditional love. if i offer you a snack but say you have to kiss my ring and swear allegiance first, how is that not a condition? if that is not a condition, then your religion offers nothing except for one path to having a closer relationship with god, one path out of many possibilities.
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    what is condemned and persecuted? homosexuality? it's not persecuted... i'm confused please explain.

    denying them equal rights and equal protection of the laws is persecution. were jim crow laws not persecutory?
  • PJammin'
    PJammin' Posts: 1,913
    Binaural wrote:
    If thats the love he offers then he can fuck himself, because I don't need to be intimidated into serivtude to a god and a text that promotes sexist, homophobic hatred. I have tried to be about this but forget it. What you have said SHOWS he offers a conditional love.

    God doesn't promote hatred, but i can see you do. what do you care, you don't believe. be your own God. i'm sure you'll save yourself. :)
    I died. I died and you just stood there. I died and you watched. I died and you walked by and said no. I'm dead.
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    well that's the thing... God doesn't want us to suffer eternal damnation.. we're the one's that put ourselves in that damnation. God has given us every opportunity to pull our way out.

    that is not love. worship me or burn in hell is petty vanity, not love. it's more like blackmail than love.
  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    PJammin' wrote:
    you're your own condition. live in sin, you're a slave to sin. Jesus doesn't want bad apples. loving God and other people is such a HARD thing.

    I've got no problem loving other people.

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=u9OHyhr9hBU
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    PJammin' wrote:
    you're your own condition. live in sin, you're a slave to sin. Jesus doesn't want bad apples. loving God and other people is such a HARD thing.

    loving god and others is not a hard thing. worshiping a 2000 year old dead man and blind allegiance to an ancient book and church that prescribe sexism, homophobia, slavery, and violence is what is hard.

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