Because he works for the ADL man. Isn't that obvious by now?
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
I read it this morning, I think it was (edit) who maybe caused some offense with his post in it? I'm guessing that's the reason it was deleted. I did'nt reply to it but I remember thinking that what he said was in bad taste and really took away from what could've been a very informative thread.
But I could be wrong and just of imagined this whole thing, (I've been having some serious late nights so my mind could be playing tricks on me
I read it this morning, I think it was 69charger who maybe caused some offense with his post in it? I'm guessing that's the reason it was deleted. I did'nt reply to it but I remember thinking that what he said was in bad taste and really took away from what could've been a very informative thread.
But I could be wrong and just of imagined this whole thing, (I've been having some serious late nights so my mind could be playing tricks on me
Well, I'm pretty sure I posted it. It's unfortunate that it disappeard. I wanted to get a few different perspectives. Hopefully respectful ones.
This is the right-left paradigm. I use this forum as kind of a sounding board. As I'm sure a lot do. I'm not trying to promote any side of a story. But I try to remain objective and sometimes try to balance the sensus of the board. Often that leads me down a road portraying strong support for something I don't really believe in. I think a lot of people get stuck in that position. I want to make clear that I am agnostic, I'm not muslim, nor will I ever be. I do have respect for Islam though, as much as I do for Judaism or any other religion. How do people get so wrapped up and opinionated in religion?
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Yup, originally it was Abraham that smashed all the idols and told people to worship one god. But people started worshipping idols again before the prophet mohammad.
I think you're confusing some things here. Judaism and Christianity were both well established monotheistic religions at the time of Islam's founding. There were indeed idol worshipers, or non-Jews/Christians inhabiting the arabian peninsula when Islam was founded, and perhaps you could call the religions of Persia at the time pagan as well. But certainly the Levant (Israel, Syria, Lebanon) and Turkey, which were the heartland of the Byzantine empire, were pretty solidly Christian.
frankly, i'd say anyone who follows an organized religion is some form of jerk off.
Has anyone mentioned that tenclub might get bombed for this thread?
That is a really terrible, and uninformed, and unthinking thing to say. Religion has to power to add meaning and beauty to people's lives, and frankly I think too many people write off religion to their own detriment, not to mention that today's world, given its political realities, requires that people start engaging with religion more seriously.
That is a really terrible, and uninformed, and unthinking thing to say. Religion has to power to add meaning and beauty to people's lives, and frankly I think too many people write off religion to their own detriment, not to mention that today's world, given its political realities, requires that people start engaging with religion more seriously.
I strongly agree with you.
However, the sense of beauty plays a very little role in the protestant religion, i.e. the main religion in the usa. And seeing the state of today's western world i wonder if we're all culturally becoming protestant (sense for work, etc)
As we have all seen, only nice, praiseful things can be said about Islam.
See Thomas Kloucek, former Professor at DePaul. See Cartoon caricatures in Europe.
See Thailand, where at this very moment a horde of Islam's finest are on a rampage murdering Buddists, by the thousands.
Now, I don't want to start again all the discussions about the cartoons. But that's not against freedom of speech, it's about "you want to insult me? espect to be replied"
beliefs are okay with me as long as they don't hurt other human beings...religion in terms of helping community, helping human beings is wonderful (in theory) however when people start destroying lives because of BELIEFS...that's when i get upset.
the reason the thread disappeared was because of the mention of Mohammed drinking goats spunk... thats why it was deleted i believe
oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
But that's not against freedom of speech, it's about "you want to insult me? espect to be replied"
With violence, murder and manipulation? Meanwhile they insult and denigrate whomever they choose?
Yeah, that seems reasonable and level-headed:rolleyes:
It is against freedom of speech and freedom of expression. When one acts to silence, stifle and oppress any conflicting opinions or criticism through expressive arts; they are manipulating the situation. Especially when physical violence and murder is used as the vehicle.
The threat of violence, the act of violence over expressed opinions and expressive art, is manipulation designed to silence that criticism or opinion.
Wonder how Thomas Kloucek (former professor at DePaul University, is doing?:rolleyes:
Mr Miller, I don't think you are doing a good service to "our side" by making such comments.
He's just an attention whore trying to give relevancy to himself on a message board; "Not for You" was written for people like him:
"can't escape from the common rule
if you hate something, don't you do it too"
As we have all seen, only nice, praiseful things can be said about Islam.
See Thomas Kloucek, former Professor at DePaul. See Cartoon caricatures in Europe.
See Thailand, where at this very moment a horde of Islam's finest are on a rampage murdering Buddists, by the thousands.
While Christianity's finest are killing innocent muslims in Iraq....do you really think there arent people who joined the military after the war simply b/c they thought it was their religious duty? Dont be so naive, people are people, there are just as many psycho's here as in the Middle East. We're just more capable of keeping them in check. Just read through local news briefs througout the country. Go into a church parking lot somewhere in the south, take out a picture of Jesus and burn it; you wouldnt live to see the next day.
With violence, murder and manipulation? Meanwhile they insult and denigrate whomever they choose?
Yeah, that seems reasonable and level-headed:rolleyes:
It is against freedom of speech and freedom of expression. When one acts to silence, stifle and oppress any conflicting opinions or criticism through expressive arts; they are manipulating the situation. Especially when physical violence and murder is used as the vehicle.
The threat of violence, the act of violence over expressed opinions and expressive art, is manipulation designed to silence that criticism or opinion.
Wonder how Thomas Kloucek (former professor at DePaul University, is doing?:rolleyes:
you know, all this thing about the cartoons doesn't fit in here: miller's sentences were just offensive.
I ve meant some of the sweetest and most inspiring people in my life, who practice the Muslim religion. I gotta catch up with some of them. :(......They have taught me a lot about life......and have always been there for me.
Must be a coincidence that they are Muslim- or maybe just human.
While Christianity's finest are killing innocent muslims in Iraq....do you really think there arent people who joined the military after the war simply b/c they thought it was their religious duty? Dont be so naive, people are people, there are just as many psycho's here as in the Middle East. We're just more capable of keeping them in check. Just read through local news briefs througout the country. Go into a church parking lot somewhere in the south, take out a picture of Jesus and burn it; you wouldnt live to see the next day.
You just don't get it and you are missing the point and theme of my comments.
If you were to read my pevious posts on this subject, from the last six months; you would understand my position and perspective here.
My comments are for the people who defend, justify and protect all Muslims and never, ever acknowledge or criticize the mindless, random violence, murder, oppression and descrimination by Muslims- onto others of non-muslim faith-all over the world.
We have more than a few people here who never criticize or acknowledge Mulims actions, regardless how horrific those actions. They turn a blind eye and deaf ear to all negative and violent Muslim behavior. There's never any real accountability and responsibility called upon the Muslim community.
Instead, they paint this charming picture of peaceful, tolerant, accepting Islam/Muslims. Which we know is as far from the truth, as saying George W. Bush Jr. is the reincarnation of Gandhi.
Muslims are exactly the same as any group of people on this planet. There are nice, good, loving, peaceful Muslims. There are bad, violent, hateful, murderous Muslims.
They are not all victims and they are not all innocent. There are plenty of Muslims who are just as guilty of the horrific attrocities everyone blames Americans, Brits and Israelies for. There is an ever growing number of intolerant, unaccepting, manipulative, violent Muslims-all over the world.
For god's sake, these people have a "non-believers Tax" ( Jizyah ) which they bully non-muslims to pay, in Islamic states, for being no-believers. What kind of crap is that?
As for Miller, if you took the time to consider his prose, you'd find Miller operates in a similar manner. While quite a bit more crude and abrasive than I, his message is very similar.
As for Miller, if you took the time to consider his prose, you'd find Miller operates in a similar manner. While quite a bit more crude and abrasive than I, his message is very similar.
.... not to mention that today's world, given its political realities, requires that people start engaging with religion more seriously.
What the people of this world need now, is more spirituality and less religion.
Most people have completely abandoned spirituality for the social politics of thier chosen religion.
This world needs religion to become a personal and private matter, not a public, political and social matter.
Religion has been at the forefront of social, political and financial concerns for thousands of years. Look how well we're doing with this approach?
Whether it's true-believers or manipulaters using religion as a vehical for power, greed and control- the result is the same; descrimination, intolerance, unacceptance, hate, torture, violence and murder.
How long will it take for the people of this planet to realize, accept, acknowledge and admit this is not working? Then take steps to remove religion from the public platform, how long?" After we're all dead or nuked and dying?:rolleyes:
You just don't get it and you are missing the point and theme of my comments.
If you were to read my pevious posts on this subject, from the last six months; you would understand my position and perspective here.
My comments are for the people who defend, justify and protect all Muslims and never, ever acknowledge or criticize the mindless, random violence, murder, oppression and descrimination by Muslims- onto others of non-muslim faith-all over the world.
We have more than a few people here who never criticize or acknowledge Mulims actions, regardless how horrific those actions. They turn a blind eye and deaf ear to all negative and violent Muslim behavior. There's never any real accountability and responsibility called upon the Muslim community.
Instead, they paint this charming picture of peaceful, tolerant, accepting Islam/Muslims. Which we know is as far from the truth, as saying George W. Bush Jr. is the reincarnation of Gandhi.
Muslims are exactly the same as any group of people on this planet. There are nice, good, loving, peaceful Muslims. There are bad, violent, hateful, murderous Muslims.
They are not all victims and they are not all innocent. There are plenty of Muslims who are just as guilty of the horrific attrocities everyone blames Americans, Brits and Israelies for. There is an ever growing number of intolerant, unaccepting, manipulative, violent Muslims-all over the world.
For god's sake, these people have a "non-believers Tax" ( Jizyah ) which they bully non-muslims to pay, in Islamic states, for being no-believers. What kind of crap is that?
As for Miller, if you took the time to consider his prose, you'd find Miller operates in a similar manner. While quite a bit more crude and abrasive than I, his message is very similar.
Actually people bring up the peace and good of muslims b/c what the terrorists do is so obviously horrible. The tendency has been to lump the word terrorist with muslim, rather then just call them terrorists. When the KKK is in the news do you hear them called Christian terrorists, no, b/c it's obvious that those people dont stand for Christianity. Same concept applies to the terrorists in the middle east. What's happening in the middle east is innocent people are being killed to get the terrosts. When this happens you turn those innocent peoples family into terrorist, it's an endless cycle. Look at the OKC bombing, it was retaliation for what happened in Waco (not the best example but you get the idea). As far as miller goes, he's just the shock jock of the board...insignifigant and begging for attention.
so, where is his distinction between bad guys and good guys?
That's what crude and abrasive means.
He won't make a distinction. That's his point and approach.
After years of watching the Islam/Muslim apologists circle the wagons and routinely defend their actions; I doubt you'll see him make any distinctions...any time soon.
He won't make a distinction. That's his point and approach.
After years of watching the Islam/Muslim apologists circle the wagons and routinely defend their actions; I doubt you'll see him make any distinctions...any time soon.
So he's the same as the muslim apologist yet you defend him? Intersting.
I guess mohammed wasnt a bad guy...but the people who follow him are jerkoffs.
You can substitute any prophet for mohammed in that statement and it would be just as accurate, which isn't very, btw. The majority of people who follow mohammed or any other spiritual leader are good people with good intentions. It's the people who twist and turn everything for their own benefit that are the jerkoffs. You're not stupid, right? So you realize how ridiculous it is to make this claim that you've made, right?
While Christianity's finest are killing innocent muslims in Iraq....do you really think there arent people who joined the military after the war simply b/c they thought it was their religious duty? Dont be so naive, people are people, there are just as many psycho's here as in the Middle East. We're just more capable of keeping them in check. Just read through local news briefs througout the country. Go into a church parking lot somewhere in the south, take out a picture of Jesus and burn it; you wouldnt live to see the next day.
Great post...not sure how anyone could argue with it.
Comments
Because he works for the ADL man. Isn't that obvious by now?
Has anyone mentioned that tenclub might get bombed for this thread?
http://www.wishlistfoundation.org
Oh my, they dropped the leash.
Morgan Freeman/Clint Eastwood 08' for President!
"Make our day"
But I could be wrong and just of imagined this whole thing, (I've been having some serious late nights so my mind could be playing tricks on me
Well, I'm pretty sure I posted it. It's unfortunate that it disappeard. I wanted to get a few different perspectives. Hopefully respectful ones.
This is the right-left paradigm. I use this forum as kind of a sounding board. As I'm sure a lot do. I'm not trying to promote any side of a story. But I try to remain objective and sometimes try to balance the sensus of the board. Often that leads me down a road portraying strong support for something I don't really believe in. I think a lot of people get stuck in that position. I want to make clear that I am agnostic, I'm not muslim, nor will I ever be. I do have respect for Islam though, as much as I do for Judaism or any other religion. How do people get so wrapped up and opinionated in religion?
http://www.myspace.com/brain_of_c
I think you're confusing some things here. Judaism and Christianity were both well established monotheistic religions at the time of Islam's founding. There were indeed idol worshipers, or non-Jews/Christians inhabiting the arabian peninsula when Islam was founded, and perhaps you could call the religions of Persia at the time pagan as well. But certainly the Levant (Israel, Syria, Lebanon) and Turkey, which were the heartland of the Byzantine empire, were pretty solidly Christian.
That is a really terrible, and uninformed, and unthinking thing to say. Religion has to power to add meaning and beauty to people's lives, and frankly I think too many people write off religion to their own detriment, not to mention that today's world, given its political realities, requires that people start engaging with religion more seriously.
That's not allowed.
As we have all seen, only nice, praiseful things can be said about Islam.
See Thomas Kloucek, former Professor at DePaul. See Cartoon caricatures in Europe.
See Thailand, where at this very moment a horde of Islam's finest are on a rampage murdering Buddists, by the thousands.
However, the sense of beauty plays a very little role in the protestant religion, i.e. the main religion in the usa. And seeing the state of today's western world i wonder if we're all culturally becoming protestant (sense for work, etc)
www.amnesty.org.uk
www.amnesty.org.uk
It should always be worn on the inside, and it's never nice to show it off... "
With violence, murder and manipulation? Meanwhile they insult and denigrate whomever they choose?
Yeah, that seems reasonable and level-headed:rolleyes:
It is against freedom of speech and freedom of expression. When one acts to silence, stifle and oppress any conflicting opinions or criticism through expressive arts; they are manipulating the situation. Especially when physical violence and murder is used as the vehicle.
The threat of violence, the act of violence over expressed opinions and expressive art, is manipulation designed to silence that criticism or opinion.
Wonder how Thomas Kloucek (former professor at DePaul University, is doing?:rolleyes:
He's just an attention whore trying to give relevancy to himself on a message board; "Not for You" was written for people like him:
"can't escape from the common rule
if you hate something, don't you do it too"
While Christianity's finest are killing innocent muslims in Iraq....do you really think there arent people who joined the military after the war simply b/c they thought it was their religious duty? Dont be so naive, people are people, there are just as many psycho's here as in the Middle East. We're just more capable of keeping them in check. Just read through local news briefs througout the country. Go into a church parking lot somewhere in the south, take out a picture of Jesus and burn it; you wouldnt live to see the next day.
www.amnesty.org.uk
-ed star
I ve meant some of the sweetest and most inspiring people in my life, who practice the Muslim religion. I gotta catch up with some of them. :(......They have taught me a lot about life......and have always been there for me.
Must be a coincidence that they are Muslim- or maybe just human.
-R*
You just don't get it and you are missing the point and theme of my comments.
If you were to read my pevious posts on this subject, from the last six months; you would understand my position and perspective here.
My comments are for the people who defend, justify and protect all Muslims and never, ever acknowledge or criticize the mindless, random violence, murder, oppression and descrimination by Muslims- onto others of non-muslim faith-all over the world.
We have more than a few people here who never criticize or acknowledge Mulims actions, regardless how horrific those actions. They turn a blind eye and deaf ear to all negative and violent Muslim behavior. There's never any real accountability and responsibility called upon the Muslim community.
Instead, they paint this charming picture of peaceful, tolerant, accepting Islam/Muslims. Which we know is as far from the truth, as saying George W. Bush Jr. is the reincarnation of Gandhi.
Muslims are exactly the same as any group of people on this planet. There are nice, good, loving, peaceful Muslims. There are bad, violent, hateful, murderous Muslims.
They are not all victims and they are not all innocent. There are plenty of Muslims who are just as guilty of the horrific attrocities everyone blames Americans, Brits and Israelies for. There is an ever growing number of intolerant, unaccepting, manipulative, violent Muslims-all over the world.
For god's sake, these people have a "non-believers Tax" ( Jizyah ) which they bully non-muslims to pay, in Islamic states, for being no-believers. What kind of crap is that?
As for Miller, if you took the time to consider his prose, you'd find Miller operates in a similar manner. While quite a bit more crude and abrasive than I, his message is very similar.
I don't think you really get what that line in "Not For You" means.
http://forums.pearljam.com/showpost.php?p=3579346&postcount=2
http://forums.pearljam.com/showpost.php?p=3579392&postcount=10
so, where is his distinction between bad guys and good guys?
www.amnesty.org.uk
your sig shows that you cheer and rah-rah war, destruction, and mass slaughter like a high school cheeleader supporting the local basketball team...
there are babies being slaughtered, war is nothing to cheer
What the people of this world need now, is more spirituality and less religion.
Most people have completely abandoned spirituality for the social politics of thier chosen religion.
This world needs religion to become a personal and private matter, not a public, political and social matter.
Religion has been at the forefront of social, political and financial concerns for thousands of years. Look how well we're doing with this approach?
Whether it's true-believers or manipulaters using religion as a vehical for power, greed and control- the result is the same; descrimination, intolerance, unacceptance, hate, torture, violence and murder.
How long will it take for the people of this planet to realize, accept, acknowledge and admit this is not working? Then take steps to remove religion from the public platform, how long?" After we're all dead or nuked and dying?:rolleyes:
Actually people bring up the peace and good of muslims b/c what the terrorists do is so obviously horrible. The tendency has been to lump the word terrorist with muslim, rather then just call them terrorists. When the KKK is in the news do you hear them called Christian terrorists, no, b/c it's obvious that those people dont stand for Christianity. Same concept applies to the terrorists in the middle east. What's happening in the middle east is innocent people are being killed to get the terrosts. When this happens you turn those innocent peoples family into terrorist, it's an endless cycle. Look at the OKC bombing, it was retaliation for what happened in Waco (not the best example but you get the idea). As far as miller goes, he's just the shock jock of the board...insignifigant and begging for attention.
That's what crude and abrasive means.
He won't make a distinction. That's his point and approach.
After years of watching the Islam/Muslim apologists circle the wagons and routinely defend their actions; I doubt you'll see him make any distinctions...any time soon.
So he's the same as the muslim apologist yet you defend him? Intersting.