Our Religious Nuts Versus Theirs

onelongsong

NCfan wrote:

For those that think all zealots are equal, please take a look at this youtube clip.

http://www.towleroad.com/2007/11/pat-robertson-g.html

This is fucking crazy, but it's a far cry from trying to kill infedels. This is something specific to Islam. Sure, ultra right-wing Christians kill abortion doctors becuase they "sin". But I'm not sure I've ever heard of an instance of a Christian killing someone else for not believing.

This is an epidimic in the Islamic world. Please discuss.

the number of abortion doctors killed is minimal. you can't blame christians for that. that's like saying atheists are thieves because an atheist stole my car.
when was the last real christian war? wasn't it constantine?

gue_barium

onelongsong wrote:

the number of abortion doctors killed is minimal. you can't blame christians for that. that's like saying atheists are thieves because an atheist stole my car.
when was the last real christian war? wasn't it constantine?

sheesh OLS, you don't know your history very well.

http://www.nobeliefs.com/speeches.htm

In the 1920s, Hitler's German Workers' Party (pre Nazi term) adopted a "Programme" with twenty-five points (the Nazi version of a constitution). In point twenty-four, their intent clearly demonstrates, from the very beginning, their stand in favor of a "positive" Christianity:

24. We demand liberty for all religious denominations in the State, so far as they are not a danger to it and do not militate against the morality and moral sense of the German race. The Party, as such, stands for positive Christianity, but does not bind itself in the matter of creed to any particular confession. It combats the Jewish-materialist spirit within and without us, and is convinced that our nation can achieve permanent health from within only on the principle: the common interest before self-interest.

Collin

onelongsong wrote:

the number of abortion doctors killed is minimal. you can't blame christians for that. that's like saying atheists are thieves because an atheist stole my car.

You cannot compare christians and atheists at all. But your point remains valid. Although, I'd say you can blame the christians who bombed the abortion clinic, just like you can blame that atheist for stealing your car. The difference is that those christian terrorists committed their crimes because of their interpretation of the bible, whereas the atheist probably didn't do it out of some atheist code or something because it doesn't exist.

gue_barium

My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded only by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was His fight for the world against the Jewish poison. To-day, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before in the fact that it was for this that He had to shed His blood upon the Cross. As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice.... And if there is anything which could demonstrate that we are acting rightly it is the distress that daily grows. For as a Christian I have also a duty to my own people.... When I go out in the morning and see these men standing in their queues and look into their pinched faces, then I believe I would be no Christian, but a very devil if I felt no pity for them, if I did not, as did our Lord two thousand years ago, turn against those by whom to-day this poor people is plundered and exploited.
-Adolf Hitler, in his speech in Munich on 12 April 1922

deadnothingbetter

Collin wrote:

You cannot compare christians and atheists at all. But your point remains valid. Although, I'd say you can blame the christians who bombed the abortion clinic, just like you can blame that atheist for stealing your car. The difference is that those christian terrorists committed their crimes because of their interpretation of the bible, whereas the atheist probably didn't do it out of some atheist code or something because it doesn't exist.

so am i also responsible for what a terrorist "christian" did at an abortion clinic? i don't get it.

Collin

deadnothingbetter wrote:

so am i also responsible for what a terrorist "christian" did at an abortion clinic? i don't get it.

No, you are not, at least I don't think so.

What don't you get?

deadnothingbetter

gue_barium wrote:

My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded only by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was His fight for the world against the Jewish poison. To-day, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before in the fact that it was for this that He had to shed His blood upon the Cross. As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice.... And if there is anything which could demonstrate that we are acting rightly it is the distress that daily grows. For as a Christian I have also a duty to my own people.... When I go out in the morning and see these men standing in their queues and look into their pinched faces, then I believe I would be no Christian, but a very devil if I felt no pity for them, if I did not, as did our Lord two thousand years ago, turn against those by whom to-day this poor people is plundered and exploited.
-Adolf Hitler, in his speech in Munich on 12 April 1922

that dude was some nut.

gue_barium

We are a people of different faiths, but we are one. Which faith conquers the other is not the question; rather, the question is whether Christianity stands or falls.... We tolerate no one in our ranks who attacks the ideas of Christianity... in fact our movement is Christian. We are filled with a desire for Catholics and Protestants to discover one another in the deep distress of our own people.

-Adolf Hitler, in a speech in Passau, 27 October 1928, Bundesarchiv Berlin-Zehlendorf

deadnothingbetter

Collin wrote:

No, you are not, at least I don't think so.

What don't you get?

you say "christians" as a whole are to be blamed. i don't understand. i can see what you're saying and i agree. you know, there are crimes that christians commit. i just don't think that we can blame the entire group for it. just like i wouldn't blame the entire atheist community because of that atheist kid who stole my car.

gue_barium

deadnothingbetter wrote:

that dude was some nut.

He was a politician.

deadnothingbetter

gue_barium wrote:

We are a people of different faiths, but we are one. Which faith conquers the other is not the question; rather, the question is whether Christianity stands or falls.... We tolerate no one in our ranks who attacks the ideas of Christianity... in fact our movement is Christian. We are filled with a desire for Catholics and Protestants to discover one another in the deep distress of our own people.

-Adolf Hitler, in a speech in Passau, 27 October 1928, Bundesarchiv Berlin-Zehlendorf

yeah he was totally out of it. ridding the jews a christian movement? what about the prophecies in the bible that state God's restoration of Israel and Solomon's temple? then to think, Israel, God's chosen people and how he would bless others if they blessed them and curse those who curse them. how does that work in the movement? well, at least, that's what i would've asked him.

deadnothingbetter

gue_barium wrote:

He was a politician.

true.

Collin

deadnothingbetter wrote:

you say "christians" as a whole are to be blamed. i don't understand. i can see what you're saying and i agree. you know, there are crimes that christians commit. i just don't think that we can blame the entire group for it. just like i wouldn't blame the entire atheist community because of that atheist kid who stole my car.

Collin wrote:

Although, I'd say you can blame the christians who bombed the abortion clinic, just like you can blame that atheist for stealing your car.

I never said christians as a whole are to be blamed.

Atheists as a whole doesn't really exist.

deadnothingbetter

Collin wrote:

I never said christians as a whole are to be blamed.

Atheists as a whole doesn't really exist.

oh

chopitdown

Collin wrote:

Atheists as a whole doesn't really exist.

Atheist Alliance International (AAI) is an organization of independent religion-free groups and individuals in the United States and around the world. Our primary goals are to help democratic, atheistic societies become established and grow and to work in coalition with like-minded groups to advance rational thinking through educational processes. Virtually all income goes to these causes. We have little paid staff. Our members make all the decisions and do almost all of the work. http://www.atheistalliance.org/aai/index.php

Collin

chopitdown wrote:

Atheist Alliance International (AAI) is an organization of independent religion-free groups and individuals in the United States and around the world. Our primary goals are to help democratic, atheistic societies become established and grow and to work in coalition with like-minded groups to advance rational thinking through educational processes. Virtually all income goes to these causes. We have little paid staff. Our members make all the decisions and do almost all of the work. http://www.atheistalliance.org/aai/index.php

In my opinion, this isn't comparable with religion at all. If you're a christian, muslim, hindu... you belong to a group. When you're an atheist you don't belong to a group, you don't have anything special in common with other atheists. You do not share a belief, you could but that's not necessarily the case. These atheists want to form groups and societies, but I'm not a part of them and a lot of atheists aren't, I'd say the majority isn't. If you are a christian, you're a christian. That's the difference.

gue_barium

Collin wrote:

In my opinion, this isn't comparable with religion at all. If you're a christian, muslim, hindu... you belong to a group. When you're an atheist you don't belong to a group, you don't have anything special in common with other atheists. You do not share a belief, you could but that's not necessarily the case. These atheists want to form groups and societies, but I'm not a part of them and a lot of atheists aren't, I'd say the majority isn't. If you are a christian, you're a christian. That's the difference.

LMAO

Collin

gue_barium wrote:

LMAO

I didn't realize my post was so funny. What did you find funny about it?

soulsinging

Collin wrote:

In my opinion, this isn't comparable with religion at all. If you're a christian, muslim, hindu... you belong to a group. When you're an atheist you don't belong to a group, you don't have anything special in common with other atheists. You do not share a belief, you could but that's not necessarily the case. These atheists want to form groups and societies, but I'm not a part of them and a lot of atheists aren't, I'd say the majority isn't. If you are a christian, you're a christian. That's the difference.

dude, atheists share the belief that there is no god and cannot be a god and claim they know this for a fact.

Collin

soulsinging wrote:

dude, atheists share the belief that there is no god and cannot be a god and claim they know this for a fact.

I'm sorry, man, but that's ridiculous.

I don't believe in a god. I don't deny god, I just don't believe in god, there's a lack of faith, there's nothing.

Just like I have a lack of faith in blue frogchickens or anything that doesn't exist.

And whether or not someone claims they know this for a fact is also irrelevant. Christians share a common belief, they believe there is a god, Christ was his son and our savior. They believe and follow his teachings. That's what makes them a group.

See the difference? I'm having a hard time explaining myself today. Maybe I'll try again tomorrow, or find a post hippiemom once made that said the same but more eloquently.

edit: couldn't find her post anywhere.