David Hicks forcibly sedated before being informed of terror charges
Scubascott
Posts: 815
This US turd stinks more every day.
http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,21405623-5006009,00.html
DAVID Hicks, the Australian accused of terrorism, was dazed and bewildered for three weeks after US officials gave him a new medicine, his lawyer said today.
US military lawyer Major Michael Mori said he had complained to US authorities about allegations Hicks was forcibly sedated at the US Guantanamo Bay military base last month just before he was informed of new terror charges.
He said Hicks told him he was given a new liquid medicine, ostensibly for a stomach complaint, that knocked him out for 24 hours, and left him bewildered and dazed for three weeks.
"I just raised it, you know," Major Mori said. "Obviously there's nothing I can do about it being done but I can ask 'just please don+t do it in the future'."
But Major Mori said he expected David Hicks' legal appearance on terror offences at Guantanamo Bay will go ahead next week despite two legal challenges.
A Pentagon spokesman said he was looking into the allegation.
"I can say however David Hicks has been treated humanely at Guantanamo, as per our policy. Also, it should be noted that a number of past allegations concerning his treatment were completely unsubstantiated," the spokesman said.
Major Mori and Hicks' US civilian lawyer Joshua Dratel traveled to Guantanamo Bay last week to visit the 31-year-old Adelaide terrorist suspect.
Hicks is charged with providing material support for terrorism.
The defence team has applied in the US District Court in Washington for a stay on Hicks' military commission hearing, pointing out that the US Supreme Court is considering whether to hear an appeal from Guantanamo Bay detainees.
Major Mori said he did not know when the injunction would be heard. "You guys are making much more of thisicipate the (arraignment) hearings will go forwards."
Hicks is also one of 45 detainees seeking an appeal in the US Supreme Court to challenge their detention.
They argue they should be given the same legal rights as others appearing in the US justice system.
A decision on whether the case will be expedited could be delivered this week.
Major Mori would not be drawn on how Hicks was feeling ahead of his arraignment on March 26, or whether he was looking forward to seeing his father, Terry Hicks.
When asked how Hicks was, Major Mori said "much the same as he was a month and a half ago" which is when his legal team saw him last. He said Hicks had been in solitary confinement for a year and it was taking its toll.
Hicks, he said, was struggling to understand why he was still being held at Guantanamo Bay after the British Government had taken its suspects home and Mamdouh Habib had also returned to Australia.
"And yet he's left there and now when I get there all the charges that he's been kept there for five years are gone and yet they are still going to leave him there to another unfair process."
"He sees he is in a political system not a justice system," Major Mori said.
http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,21405623-5006009,00.html
DAVID Hicks, the Australian accused of terrorism, was dazed and bewildered for three weeks after US officials gave him a new medicine, his lawyer said today.
US military lawyer Major Michael Mori said he had complained to US authorities about allegations Hicks was forcibly sedated at the US Guantanamo Bay military base last month just before he was informed of new terror charges.
He said Hicks told him he was given a new liquid medicine, ostensibly for a stomach complaint, that knocked him out for 24 hours, and left him bewildered and dazed for three weeks.
"I just raised it, you know," Major Mori said. "Obviously there's nothing I can do about it being done but I can ask 'just please don+t do it in the future'."
But Major Mori said he expected David Hicks' legal appearance on terror offences at Guantanamo Bay will go ahead next week despite two legal challenges.
A Pentagon spokesman said he was looking into the allegation.
"I can say however David Hicks has been treated humanely at Guantanamo, as per our policy. Also, it should be noted that a number of past allegations concerning his treatment were completely unsubstantiated," the spokesman said.
Major Mori and Hicks' US civilian lawyer Joshua Dratel traveled to Guantanamo Bay last week to visit the 31-year-old Adelaide terrorist suspect.
Hicks is charged with providing material support for terrorism.
The defence team has applied in the US District Court in Washington for a stay on Hicks' military commission hearing, pointing out that the US Supreme Court is considering whether to hear an appeal from Guantanamo Bay detainees.
Major Mori said he did not know when the injunction would be heard. "You guys are making much more of thisicipate the (arraignment) hearings will go forwards."
Hicks is also one of 45 detainees seeking an appeal in the US Supreme Court to challenge their detention.
They argue they should be given the same legal rights as others appearing in the US justice system.
A decision on whether the case will be expedited could be delivered this week.
Major Mori would not be drawn on how Hicks was feeling ahead of his arraignment on March 26, or whether he was looking forward to seeing his father, Terry Hicks.
When asked how Hicks was, Major Mori said "much the same as he was a month and a half ago" which is when his legal team saw him last. He said Hicks had been in solitary confinement for a year and it was taking its toll.
Hicks, he said, was struggling to understand why he was still being held at Guantanamo Bay after the British Government had taken its suspects home and Mamdouh Habib had also returned to Australia.
"And yet he's left there and now when I get there all the charges that he's been kept there for five years are gone and yet they are still going to leave him there to another unfair process."
"He sees he is in a political system not a justice system," Major Mori said.
It doesn't matter if you're male, female, or confused; black, white, brown, red, green, yellow; gay, lesbian; redneck cop, stoned; ugly; military style, doggy style; fat, rich or poor; vegetarian or cannibal; bum, hippie, virgin; famous or drunk-you're either an asshole or you're not!
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talk about fools on the hill.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
While in principal innocence before guilt is preferred, they found this guy in Afganistan, remember? Afganistan. They didn't drag him out of his home in Australia. He was living in Afganistan. there are only two possible explanations for that, he was either a deep cover spy pretending to be a terrorist, or he was trainng and working with and for terorists. The Taliban are the same guys who oppress the crap out of women there and would do that to women everywhere.
No-one thinks the Yanks are nice for the treatment of the detainees at Gitmo, but remember how scared and pissed we all were when those planes flew into the WTC and the Taliban was threatening the world at large, boasting about how many of us hey would kill .
The Taliban started this fight, don't let them complain about the outcome.
Mind you if Russia had not invaded Afganisstan, the political vacuum that allowed the rise of the Taliban would not have existed, so blame them.
i think you have the taliban confused with al qaeda. they do have close links but they are not the same. Also the taliban spent 7 days or so in texas with the american oil company unocal.... so they were not always the bad guys the americans would want you to beleive... not that i am saying they were ever good... just that allies and enemies always change in international releations... look at russia... once reviled now very much embraced. sadam hussian... again a guy funded by the usa...
http://www.myspace.com/thelastreel http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=19604327965
Yes, I am mixing the Taliban with Al qaeda, which may be incorrect, but as I understand it, the Taliban were harbouring al qaeada in Afganistan, so for this propose of this discussion, the distinction is moot. I'm not saying the the Yanks have never done anything daft. Your point about frineds and allies changing is true. Russia again, allies dduring WW2, instant enemies the day after teh Germans were defeated, occupied and oppressed Eastern Europe for another 40 yrs, not really in a position to criticise if you ask me.
I am mainly expressing that I don't have any sympathy for David Hicks. I made a point that terrorists in Palestine would be ordinary criminals in another place, but make martyrs of themselves by indulging in their violent nature in a political war. I think Hicks falls into the same category.
He could have just been living there... I know a number of non afghans living in afghanistan.... They're not terrorists or training to be, or spies....
The taliban's treatment of women is no worse than the rest of the afghans and a lot of fundamentalist countries.
You're confusing the Taliban with Al-Qaeda.
At the end of Soviet occupation, Afghanistan fell into anarchy & civil war. The Taliban were a religious, anti-Communist movement drawn from the Pushtun tribe, fighting Afghan communists (and the northern alliance). They fought against banditry, rape and drug dealing, imposing order based on traditional tribal and religious law. Muslim volunteers from other countries joined the fight as well (they were trained in Afghanistan).
Their leaders were harsh and fanatics and the taliban oppressed minorities but.... up to a few months before 9/11, Washington gave them millions in aid.
Then came 9/11 in all its horror. Bin Laden was accused as the mastermind. Bin Laden is not a Taliban, though the taliban gave him shelter. Also, whilst the taliban refused to hand Bin Laden over to the US, they said they would hand him to an international tribunal once proof of his involvement in 9/11 was given. The US refused, blamed the Taliban for the 9/11, invaded Afghanistan and we know what mess followed.....
All of this is no excuse for the blatant infringements of human rights in Guatanamo....
we all weren't scared and pissed lucy. i knew who the enemy was and i knew the justification behind the 9/11 attacks. never in the apst 6 years have i felt unsafe or a target. i was angry as hell that it happened. and i am equally as mad as hell that the howard government are doing nothing for hicks. the fact remains he is an australian citizen who is facing illegitimate charges. yes he was in afghanistan. so what? so were plenty of other people. the taliban are war lords nothing more. and might i add, were rmed by the united states at one stage. they did not start this fight. it goes much deeper and further back than 2001.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
The fact that the Taliban is no worse than other Afhgan tribes is no excuse for the way they treat their women. It is no excuse anywhere !! Saying it's traditional is no excuse. It's pretty traditional for European races to shoot coloured folk, but that ain't on any more. Pardon me for being a liberal about women's rights, but I think a re-dress of the imbalance between yin and yang would fix a lot of things in the Muslim world.
I feel you re-iterate my point that this mess started with the Russian invasion. America gave aid to the Afghans to fight the Russians because otherwise there was the risk they would overrun the whole region. Hegemony was a stated aim of the USSR for a damn long time. Everyone blames the Yanks for everything wrong there, but the damn Russians started it all. TBH, I don't think anyone can boast about their achievements in that part of the world. There sure is a lot less heroin in Australia now though. Most of it came from Afganistan as a cash crop for the Taliban.
The WTC disaster may not excuse Gitmo, but it goes a long way to explain it.
Hmmmmmmmn, well I was overseas on a surfing holiday in Indonesia when the crap hit the fan, and spent a few hours wondering when I was going to get home. Sure we felt safe here in Oz, but there was a lot less safety to be had elsewhere in the world. I think I have addressed the issue of the US arming the Taliban to fight the Russians. They are damn oppressive warlords.
I was pretty pissed that these guys want to take away our way of life and replace it with theirs.
All of theis in a bit incidental the my refutation of the article about forcible sedation. He may have been tricked into taking something, but sedation is by it's very nature non-violent. I still think it is crap, there is no medication which will last that long, except maybe injected depot anti-psychotics, but there was no mention of injection, and there is no reason to give him anything like that. Even they only really last two weeks.
no they didn't deserve what happened on 9/11. no one does. but what they did to afghanistan and what they continue to do in iraq with the help of their friends is reprehensible.
oh and for the record, i didn't believe the red scare either.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Actually, this all came soon after they sorted out the Balkans war and Kosovo, which no-one seemd to be able to, so they had this kinda momentum with helping out the world, and we aere all pretty grateful at teh time. Have you forgotten "ethnic cleansing " and the rape camps in the Balkans. I'm not totally defending everything they do, just trying to put it into perspective. Sure they make mistakes, but did they create these situations, or did they respond to them ?? I would agree that they pretty much created the Iraq conflict out of not much, and I'm concerned that they are doing a similar thing in Iran right now. But they didn't create teh Russian /Afghani conflict, and as I reecall were not doing anything much when the WTC thing went down.
Hicks' lawyer using misinformation is just as bad as the Yanks doing it though, so for me, it is still crap. The American justice system is so perverted that a fair trial is a laughable concept anyhow. Was there ever any more effort put into finding Nicole Sompson's murderer after OJ was found not guilty ?? Leaving him locked in Gitmo is the only way to keep him off the streets.
Didn't say it was.
It may have started with the russians but the american invasion and occupation resulted in a disastrous renewed civil war. The invasion ousted the regime in power and replaced it with another (remember by foreign force). Also, all this talk again about bringing democracy and rebuilding the war torn country is utter rubbish. Afghanistan is worse off now... The US had decided back in July 2001 to start military action against Afghanistan (talks with Pakistani foreign minister). So 9/11 made it much easier to justify this invasion. Also the US went in this on their own accord - there were no UN resolutions to authorize this.
It doesn't... The US have a president playing with the fears (sometimes misplaced) of his country and taking advantage of it, denying basic human rights to 'prisonners', using torture, etc. Sounds like the treatment of people in one of the countries he says he wants to bring democracy to!
We have absolutely no idea what they are using/trying on these people.
That's why Gitmo should be closed down and these people handed over to the international courts to be tried openly and transparently.
Who believes OJ was not guilty? There was no one else to find. Keeping OJ locked in Gitmo??
What other country doesn't allow women to seek treatment from a male doctor? Which one doesn't allow women to perform any sort of work outside the home? Who has dress restrictions as severe as what existed under the Taliban? Where else is a woman never allowed to leave the house unless escorted by a male relative?
Many Islamic countries are bad, some alarmingly so, but Afghanistan under the Taliban was the worst. These guys are in a league of their own.
Hippiemom... you will find that most fundamentalist islamic countries are just as you described. The Taliban are not on their own with this.... Even in the more 'moderate' islamic states, women are not allowed to work, see a male doctor or have a male teacher (if they are educated). A few years back, a friend of mine in Morocco was not able to get her flat - her brother had to do it for her. And though women in the Maghreb are 'free', it is very much frowned upon a woman out on her own... she can still be spat upon, etc. A male escort (family of course, not any male) is still the best for them....
i won't pile on w/ your blurring of the lines between al qaeda and the taliban (and the taliban said they would hand over bin laden only we offered up proof of his guilt, something even the fbi says they have none of)
but drugs can last for weeks, plz don't just spout things off like they are true if you do not know
http://www.askapatient.com/viewrating.asp?drug=19591&name=LARIAM
'...and I am still feeling the side effects 8 weeks after the last dose.'
'Still experiencing occasional nausea after 2 weeks of being off the drug.'
so, it is possible for drugs to stay in your system for weeks
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
I've had some drunken binges with after effects that have addled my brain for a couple of weeks.
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and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
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( o.O)
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I'd like you to name the med that has CNS ffects that last for weeks. Mt professional training must have missed that one.
You are here to be wrong !!
Even though THC, for example, remains detectable in your system for several months, you don't stay stoned for weeks.
It's all bogus !!
Long-Term Effects of Olanzapine, Risperidone, and Quetiapine on Ionotropic Glutamate Receptor Types: Implications for Antipsychotic Drug Treatment
http://jpet.aspetjournals.org/cgi/content/full/306/3/1145
Now, I'm not saying they gave the guy an anti-psychotic drug, but I am saying that there are drugs out there that can fuck with the brain for a long time.
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I'd wouldn't be too sure. I bet the gov't has developed a more than a few classified slow release substances that stick and coat your insides, or assemble and accumulate or "bind" in the liver or elsewhere for slow release.
I think it's possible.
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
(\__/)
( o.O)
(")_(")
There is a big differnece between long term changes n receptor populations,a nd long term effects from a singel dose. Not the same thing at all. HAven't had time to read that artlicel ye, I'll respond in more detail when I do.
I don't think David Hicks was given a single dose. This was a daily med for his stomach ailment, wasn't it?
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The government doesn't develop anything. Drugs are developed by private corporations, none of whom subscribe to conspiracies, or keep significant developments secret. There is no clinical usefulness i drugs with an action as long as several weeks, as you can't titrate against a response. Long acting anti-psychotic injections would be the closest, but as I said, even they only last two weeks. Thder eis no value for anyone to spend precious resaerch dollars on stuff like that.
Sorry to disappoint you.
Ummm, not to get off topic, but available tax dollars can lead to all kinds of things that are non-profitable.
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OK, rarely you get mental confusion from ranitidine, though I have seen it, which is a likely candidate for this. A drug side-effect like that is majorly different from "forced sedation". People get drug side-effects all yhe time, doesn't mean there is conspiracy to sedate or drug them. Google "ranitiadine" and see if you can see how it could possibly be used for "forced sedation".
Geez, treating the guy for gutzache hardly qualifies for mistreatment or abuse. After all, chronic gutzache was a lot of what drove Kurt Cobain to suicide
lucy, you're blowing my mind.
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I think there's all kinds of people paying other people money to develop all kinds of things that are not published in medical journals or made available to the public.
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
(\__/)
( o.O)
(")_(")