Price of Oil

GreenTeaDisease

polaris wrote:

??

http://straight.com/article-141020/monocrops-bring-food-crisis

no self-respecting environmentalist considers ethanol a good alternative to gas ...

I don't know if it's had as big an impact on the current food crisis as has been claimed. it doesn't quite make sense to me at this point in time (though it's always been a concern as something that definitely has the potential to happen).

the problem with biofuel is that you have to use so much energy to produce and transport it. also the agricultural impact on the land is not good.

when I said "alternatives" I was thinking more along the lines of public transportation, bike paths, side walks, cross walks, different urban design, etc, as well as alternatives in areas other than transportation such as electricity.

I just read an article about a brand new, from scratch city being built in Abu Dahbi (not sure how that's spelled). It will be COMPLETELY CARLESS.

polaris

GreenTeaDisease wrote:

I don't know if it's had as big an impact on the current food crisis as has been claimed. it doesn't quite make sense to me at this point in time (though it's always been a concern as something that definitely has the potential to happen).

the problem with biofuel is that you have to use so much energy to produce and transport it. also the agricultural impact on the land is not good.

when I said "alternatives" I was thinking more along the lines of public transportation, bike paths, side walks, cross walks, different urban design, etc, as well as alternatives in areas other than transportation such as electricity.

I just read an article about a brand new, from scratch city being built in Abu Dahbi (not sure how that's spelled). It will be COMPLETELY CARLESS.

food crisis is due to monoculture and climate change ... increased drought means no food production especially in poor countries like in africa ...

and your point on ethanol is spot on ... i was replying to chromjam's post ...

for sure - our first priority has to be conservation of resources and a reduction of usage ... your alternatives is where it begins ...

and yeah - you can read about that development on treehugger.com ... just do a search ...

MakingWaves

lazymoon13 wrote:

so what? the oil companies do not set the price of oil.

they may not set the market value but they can help control it. Right now oil refineries in the US are running at about 80% capacity. That is close to the same rate they were running after Hurricane Katrina.

Now I wonder why they are running at 80% capacity?? To control the supply which in turn pushes up the future prices of oil and in turn gives them another record quarter profit. These greedy bastards are making obscene amounts of money at the expense of lower income Americans who this hurts the most.

It's bullshit and there is no need for oil to be at the prices they are now at. I think the oil companies are going to keep controlling the supply until they see an actual change in peoples behavior of oil consumption which will result in lower profits. They are just trying to find that point where they can maximize profits.


Just my opinion.

lazymoon13

MakingWaves wrote:

they may not set the market value but they can help control it. Right now oil refineries in the US are running at about 80% capacity. That is close to the same rate they were running after Hurricane Katrina.

Now I wonder why they are running at 80% capacity?? To control the supply which in turn pushes up the future prices of oil and in turn gives them another record quarter profit. These greedy bastards are making obscene amounts of money at the expense of lower income Americans who this hurts the most.

It's bullshit and there is no need for oil to be at the prices they are now at. I think the oil companies are going to keep controlling the supply until they see an actual change in peoples behavior of oil consumption which will result in lower profits. They are just trying to find that point where they can maximize profits.


Just my opinion.

how do you know 80%. I'll take your word for it and that fucking blows.

MakingWaves

lazymoon13 wrote:

how do you know 80%. I'll take your word for it and that fucking blows.

I read an article on it this morning. I will try to find it and post it. and here it is.

"RTT News, NY - Apr 20, 2008
Wednesday

The Energy Department's crude oil inventory report for the week ended April 18th is scheduled to be released at 10:30 AM ET on Wednesday.

U.S. crude oil inventories declined by 2.3 million barrels in the week ended April 11, 2008 to 313.7 million barrels. Gasoline stocks fell by 5.5 million barrels, but they are still above the upper limit of the average range. Meanwhile, distillate inventories edged up by 0.1 million barrels and remain in the lower half of the average range for this time of the year. Refinery capacity utilization averaged 82.2% over the four weeks ended April 11th, down 0.6 percentage points from the previous week."

There is no need for plants to be running at this low of a capacity in my opinion and there is only one obvious reason they are doing it because they know we have to drive and use oil. I can picture the oil companies after hurricane katrina hit and they bumped gas prices to $3 a gallon and people didn't buy less. They are sitting there going, "holy shit..we can charge whatever we want and get away with it. Let's just keep supply down." Until they find that tipping point it will keep going up in prices.

lazymoon13

MakingWaves wrote:

I read an article on it this morning. I will try to find it and post it.

cool. I believe you. is there any explanation from them?

GreenTeaDisease

MakingWaves wrote:

It's bullshit and there is no need for oil to be at the prices they are now at.

I think that's a totally wrong statement.

perhaps you are not happy with where the money is *going* but that doesn't mean the prices are wrong.

oh and I don't think that they are controlling the supply of oil even if the refineries are working at 80% capacity. I don't think that the latter necessarily means the former. there's no cartel, no single company would have incentive to restrict supply and raise prices on their own.

MakingWaves

GreenTeaDisease wrote:

I think that's a totally wrong statement.

perhaps you are not happy with where the money is *going* but that doesn't mean the prices are wrong.

I guess you are right when it comes down to it. I can't stand the thought of people making this much money at the price of lower income families. I'm lucky enough to be able to afford gas but I have met people who are having trouble finding jobs that live in rural counties, can't afford to move and they now can't afford to drive to work. And don't give me the they need to move to the city or they shouldn't live in rural counties, it is part of the circle of poverty. They make more money living off of welfare because the price of gas is taking up a large part of their budget. When things like this start happening then something is very wrong in my opinion.

But you know what sucks..I have no friggin idea what can be done to stop it or fix it. So i come on here and rant.

Number 18

Umm, why has no one talked about the weak dollar being a reason for high gasoline prices? Or did I just glaze over that part?

lazymoon13

Number 18 wrote:

Umm, why has no one talked about the weak dollar being a reason for high gasoline prices? Or did I just glaze over that part?

no thats absolutely true. someone mentioned it but very good point.

GreenTeaDisease

Number 18 wrote:

Umm, why has no one talked about the weak dollar being a reason for high gasoline prices? Or did I just glaze over that part?

hmm I'm trying to work out in my head if that's the way it would work. in any event, it would definitely depend what currency you're comparing it to. the dollar's not weaker than *everything* right now.

Kel Varnsen

Number 18 wrote:

Umm, why has no one talked about the weak dollar being a reason for high gasoline prices? Or did I just glaze over that part?

But how much of a contribution can the weak US dollar be. I mean in Canada gas prices are the equivalent of about $4.60 a gallon. I know a lot of that is taxes, but we are a huge gas producing country and we supposedly have a strong dollar. But seriously, how much would people in the US freak out if they were paying that much for gas?

yellowled24

lazymoon13 wrote:

wtf. $120?!?! how is this effecting you? are you driving less? what can possibly bring this price down? whats goes up must come down. damn this is getting out of hand.

we dont drive as much, ive cut down on visiting my mum in a nearby town. Our weekly shopping has gone up about $50 in the last 6 months....sucks :(

Urban Hiker

lazymoon13 wrote:

you don't get it. are all americans supposed to cram into urban areas so they can ditch their cars? and guess what, carpooling still requires people to buy and use gas.

Without reading the entire thread before responding, I'm going to say that, YES, there are a great number of people who should ditch their cars and live in urban areas. The American Dream is overdue for a re-envisioning.

Urban Hiker

yellowled24 wrote:

we dont drive as much, ive cut down on visiting my mum in a nearby town. Our weekly shopping has gone up about $50 in the last 6 months....sucks :(

A perfect example of how the cost affects things across the board.
-Trucks carry our groceries and pay the cost of fuel.
-Crops are harvested by machinery requiring fuel.
-Packaging is also done by machinery requiring fuel.

-the list goes on....

So, even if you don't drive at all yourself, you will pay for the increase of the cost of oil.

Now, add in the cost of what families are paying in blood and we are, IMO, spending beyond our means. It's not worth it.

Kann

lazymoon13 wrote:

wtf. $120?!?! how is this effecting you? are you driving less? what can possibly bring this price down? whats goes up must come down. damn this is getting out of hand.

It definitely will not come down, well not until we find another type of energy ressource. The demand is definitely not going to go down and the supply will hardly get higher. I wonder how high the prices can rise.

ajedigecko

for me.......i offset the price increase of goods i consume, by riding my bicycle 4 days a week.

lazymoon13

ajedigecko wrote:

for me.......i offset the price increase of goods i consume, by riding my bicycle 4 days a week.

riding it where? to work? how far is your ride?

stuckinline

Urban Hiker wrote:

Without reading the entire thread before responding, I'm going to say that, YES, there are a great number of people who should ditch their cars and live in urban areas. The American Dream is overdue for a re-envisioning.

usa also needs to end this "drive thru" lifestyle

ledvedderman

$3.69 a gallon? Come on!